My situation with the Local Church

[OGOP]

Theres a couple things I think I need to address.

Firstly, I wanted to clarify that YES I have many grievances with how the LC handles relationships. Many of you have shared similar experiences and it is clear to me, whatever anybody else may be saying here, that it is a systematic aspect of the LC.

Originally Posted by Drake

True that there was a flurry that occurred of quick introductions and then vows in the early days in Elden Hall.. However, it did not become and is not a practice in the local churches. If that week true in this situation we are discussing then the sister would not have ever shown interest in the brother who opened this thread or else she would gave hid it from everyone.

My girlfriend is the exception (dating outside the LC), and the way our relationship has progressed (being without involvement from the elders) has been under attack from church elders from the beginning.

Nevertheless, my issues with the "church life" after my 18 month involvement reach FAR beyond the issue of dating. The "exclusiveness" of the culture, the biblical interpretations, all the controversies surrounding LSM, the FTTA, etc.
I do not want to raise my family in the LC.

I really need advice on where to go from here, and I'm not sure if anybody else here as found themselves in a situation in any way similar to mine. Even if you haven't, knowing what you know about the local church, how would you go about explaining to somebody who was born and raised in the "church life" about my concerns.

Here's what I'm leaning towards doing right now...

Rather than coming out and laying out all the facts about LC controversies and sharing some of the horror testimonies out there online about LC experiences, Im just going to ask her to check out a new church with me one sunday (after finding one), and then just take it slow and slowly expose her to mainstream Christianity.

Thoughts?

[Drake]

Originally Posted by OGOP

My girlfriend is the exception (dating outside the LC)

No, she is not and you could not possibly know differently given your limited experience. And "dating" probably happens more outside than it does inside since dating is not encouraged,

Originally Posted by OGOP

I do not want to raise my family in the LC.

Okay, tell her that.

Originally Posted by OGOP

I really need advice on where to go from here, and I'm not sure if anybody else here as found themselves in a situation in any way similar to mine.

Yes, similar.

Originally Posted by OGOP

Even if you haven't, knowing what you know about the local church, how would you go about explaining to somebody who was born and raised in the "church life" about my concerns.

You do not appear unable to express yourself here so what is the issue doing so with her?

Originally Posted by OGOP

Here's what I'm leaning towards doing right now... Thoughts?

Brother, you have heard a lot of sound advice about prayer, waiting on the Lord, honesty with yourself and her, letting the Lord unfold the matter, and yet you talk about laying out plans and schemes. There is love, then there is love. There is love that makes a man desperate, then there is love that puts her first, shares the heart, that can wait for things to be right, that relies on the Lord and His timing. You've heard as much here already and it won't get any better than that.

Drake

[OGOP]

Originally Posted by Drake

You do not appear unable to express yourself here so what is the issue doing so with her?

The problem is when you're born and raised in a life, and know absolutely nothing else, you're not going to take well to somebody telling you its time to leave it all behind. All your friends, your entire social life, some of your beliefs, etc.
I've expressed my views to my girlfriend many times before about problems I have had with how certain things have done. It's different now because I'm not just sharing with her my distastes with certain aspects of the LC, I would be sharing that I want to leave, period.

It is different this time because I've started reading about all the cult-accusations online and controversies regarding Witness Lee and LSM. Up until a few days ago, yeah I had grievances with the LC and felt uncomfortable with some of the practices. BUT I chalked it up as being new to religion in general and that is was just a few bad people involved with my locality.

I've now been researching the "denomination" online and its not JUST church in general and its not just my locality. I've read testimonies all over the web, not just this site, about people leaving the LC for MANY reasons. Maybe I'm wrong, but you can't just sit down somebody and tell them in one sitting that their entire life has been lived in such a flawed organization.

I've been praying a lot these past couple days and appreciate all the prayers and advice I've had on this thread.

Maybe I'm overcomplicating this, but I'm really worried about going from 0-100.

OGOP

[Cal]

If this girl really cares about you then she's going to care what you think.

I would say the worst approach would be for you to suggest she should leave the LCM so that you two can be together.

Probably what you should tell her is that you care a lot about her (love her) but you just cannot see yourself in the LCM. You can go on to tell her why but do it in a way to show you care about her and her future. In other words, be selfless.

Then you just have to wait to see how she responds, and live with it.

But I'm afraid the practical lesson of this situation is don't fall in love with people in groups like the LCM.

[OGOP]

Originally Posted by Igzy

I would say the worst approach would be for you to suggest she should leave the LCM so that you two can be together.

Agreed.

Then you just have to wait to see how she responds, and live with it.

This is where I disagree. When somebody you love and care about is in an organization like the LCM, in my opinion a borderline cult, you don't just speak your mind and leave it at that.

I don't agree with: "If they agree then great, if not go your separate ways and move on."

Whether it be a friend, bf, gf, etc. If you care about somebody you should give it your all to help that person find a "healthier church", if you will.

[Nell]

Originally Posted by OGOP

...Whether it be a friend, bf, gf, etc. If you care about somebody you should give it your all to help that person find a "healthier church", if you will.

OGOP,

You're not wrong. However, you've stumbled onto a forum of believers who have spent 25+ years, in some cases, trying to help those we love find a "healthier church" and failing miserably.

You can't help someone who doesn't want help, or someone who believes they don't need help and that they are right and you are wrong. You already know this.

Giving it your all to help someone means that "help" takes many forms, one of which is walking away.

One amazing and frustrating thing about the God we love and serve is that he has given each of us a free will. Not even God will violate our right to choose...the right He gave us, the right he gave you and the right he gave the woman you love.

For 15 years as an LC member I heard all the stuff about the LC being a cult. I saw the mistreatment of the saints by the leadership. I went through their abuse myself and it was horrible. Yet I stayed. I heard teachings that I questioned. Some things I couldn't and didn't believe...yet I stayed. One day I picked up a handout about one of the lawsuits that outlined all the accusations against "us". Then I had a thought that was clear as a bell: "everything they are saying about us is true." This was light from God Himself and I will never forget those words. This was God's mercy to me. No one was pounding on me to "see". No one was talking to me to see the wrongs of the LC, but one day God opened my eyes. I could never "unsee" the truth God had shown me. At that point, in my heart, I was no longer in the LC. I began planning my exit and when the time was right, I attended my last meeting and never looked back.

You can't make anyone "see" anything. Only God gives light. By God's mercy He rescued me. He alone opened my eyes to the truth. Everyone is different, but until your friend is ready and prepared by God to "see and hear", you can only follow Him and pray for her.

I pray that your path will be full of light, full of God's mercy and His wisdom and that the "help" you provide will be His help.

Nell

[Cal]

Originally Posted by OGOP

I don't agree with: "If they agree then great, if not go your separate ways and move on."

Whether it be a friend, bf, gf, etc. If you care about somebody you should give it your all to help that person find a "healthier church", if you will.

What I meant was don't get contentious with her or try to push her. One thing all men need to learn about women is we can't make them do anything. Trying to just makes things worse.

Part of my point is that if she doesn't want to leave the LCM and you don't want to join you probably should put the "couple" side of your relationship on the back burner until you are on the same stove. Does that make sense?

[TLFisher]

I was meeting with a NW locality in the 90's where it appeared normal for non-LC/LC relationships even to the point of marriage. Quite the contrast from where I lived in California as Freedom had indicated in his post.
Having known and observed various couples it really comes down to ones orientation with "the ministry". Some are absolute for the ministry while others the local churches is the only Christian fellowship they've had though not being absolute for the ministry.