Outer Darkness?

[A little brother]

Originally Posted by Evangelical

It is human psychology to recall bad events or teachings and forget the good...particularly if they are 30 years ago. Whenever I hear about outer darkness it is often tempered with the truth about eternal security and its purpose to correct and reform not destroy. Anyway..a believer should fear displeasing the Lord rather than fear punishment. A doctrine without outer darkness could be considered 'sparing the rod'.

How would someone be corrected and reformed in darkness? Wouldn't he or she need God's light?

[UntoHim]

Good point A little brother!

Of course this is just another indication of the serious problems with Witness Lee's make-it-up-as-you-go-along, wacky "theology". Undoubtedly, he got some of the basics of this "Outer Darkness" stuff from the Brethren, and maybe a few others, but as Lee was apt to do, he took a questionable doctrine/teaching and blasted it to all new heights of absurdity and foolishness. And then, before you know it, you have a bunch of young and gullible people thinking that if they leave some tiny, insignificant sect they are going to get cancer, or get into a horrible car accident, or a grand piano is going to fall on their head.

As has been noted, thankfully this madness is much less of an issue in the movement in recent times. But we can be sure that this kind of mentality is still alive and well within the ranks of the Official Leaders - The Blended Brothers, and probably also with the great majority of elders in the various Local Churches. May God have mercy.

[Evangelical]

Originally Posted by A little brother

How would someone be corrected and reformed in darkness? Wouldn't he or she need God's light?

Your question is equivalent to asking "how would gold be refined through fire, wouldn't it need light?". Obviously for the purification to take place, the impurities need to be burned away.

Salvation is justification, sanctification, and glorification. Outer darkness is for sanctification, and therefore for salvation. Evangelicals/Protestants err by thinking that sanctification and glorification is not part of salvation. That's why they cannot explain the verses about gold refined by fire. They think that believers in whatever carnal condition and any state receive full rewards in heaven without consequence. When this is in direct contradiction to the scriptures about "sparing the rod".

An example of this misunderstanding is when OBW wrote in this thread:

"And it might be about something other than salvation, but rather related to sanctification. "

[Nell]

Originally Posted by Evangelical

An example of this misunderstanding is when OBW wrote in this thread:
"And it might be about something other than salvation, but rather related to sanctification."

You're quoting someone out of context. Please provide the exact reference for OBW's statement so we can judge for ourselves what he was saying, rather than taking your word for it.
.

[Evangelical]

Originally Posted by Nell

You're quoting someone out of context. Please provide the exact reference for OBW's statement so we can judge for ourselves what he was saying, rather than taking your word for it.
.

It's post #6, and the statement I quoted reflects the general misunderstanding in Christianity that salvation means justification and sanctification is not related to salvation.

[A little brother]

Originally Posted by Evangelical

Your question is equivalent to asking "how would gold be refined through fire, wouldn't it need light?". Obviously for the purification to take place, the impurities need to be burned away. Salvation is justification, sanctification, and glorification. Outer darkness is for sanctification, and therefore for salvation. Evangelicals/Protestants err by thinking that sanctification and glorification is not part of salvation.

Where says there is fire in outer darkness? Or any form of God's work to purify? Where says the servant will return from outer darkness to his master?

(BTW, in case you don't know, fire produces light)

[Evangelical]

Originally Posted by A little brother

Where says there is fire in outer darkness? Or any form of God's work to purify? Where says the servant will return from outer darkness to his master?
(BTW, in case you don't know, fire produces light)

I thought the answer to that should be obvious:

1 Cor 3:15
“If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as through fire"

Yes fire does produce light, but that is a byproduct from the use of fire. You were referring to the use of light to reform.

[A little brother]

Did Paul mention anything about outer darkness? How is this verse related?

I am not referrng to the use of light to reform. I was referring to God's presence.

[Evangelical]

Originally Posted by A little brother

Did Paul mention anything about outer darkness? How is this verse related?

I am not referrng to the use of light to reform. I was referring to God's presence.

The verse shows God's punishment for believers is temporary. So we can know that outer darkness as a punishment for believers, is temporary.

If we believe otherwise we cannot believe in eternal security. If the servant does not return from outer darkness, then eternal security is false. Now you could say that such a servant was not a true servant in the first place, but that is harder to prove than proving that outer darkness is temporary, because it would make God's Word a lie if the word servant does not actually mean a true servant.

[A little brother]

Originally Posted by Evangelical

The verse shows God's punishment for believers is temporary. So we can know that outer darkness as a punishment for believers, is temporary.

If we believe otherwise we cannot believe in eternal security. If the servant does not return from outer darkness, then eternal security is false. Now you could say that such a servant was not a true servant in the first place, but that is harder to prove than proving that outer darkness is temporary, because it would make God's Word a lie if the word servant does not actually mean a true servant.

I think your have misread the bible again because of your own preconception. Please check 1 Cor 3:13. The fire is a test, not punishment.

[Kevin]

Originally Posted by Evangelical

Evangelicals/Protestants err by thinking that sanctification and glorification is not part of salvation.

Wow Evangelical, it seems you've never delved into a deeper study or am thinking a hasty generalization or just mere a strawman fallacy.