Jezebel -- why we should know who she is.

[Evangelical]

Originally Posted by ZNPaaneah

Enough already! Produce the quote. The only quote you have produced did not equate the US with Sodom. It is not a misinterpretation if you can't read english. It doesn't matter what you believe I said, what matters is what I did say.

I have not denied a single word that I have written, I have denied your feeble attempt to interpret it. I did not equate Jezebel to the US, I did equate Jezebel to the spirit of the worldly system. I have provided a very clear quote from Witness Lee where he also made this equation. If you don't like it, say so. If you disagree, fine. But quit accusing me of being deceitful. Provide the quote otherwise it is slander.

I have connected Babel to Babylon. You disagree fine. But you have no credibility with me.

Wow, spectacular reasoning. You have a woman in Matthew 13 that hides leaven in meal. It is said that this is like the kingdom of heaven. It doesn't say it is like the material babylon or the religious babylon. But we know it is deceitful. Could it be the deceit and idolatry of a religious system? Sure. Could it be the deceit and idolatry of a worldly, material system? Sure.

But according to your wonderful interpretation we don't need to worry about the material Babylon infecting the church? Where did you get that from? James says that pure religion is to keep yourself unspotted from the world. Is that the religious world or the material world?

Is this really how you teach the Bible? This is unbelievable.

I have already quoted you saying:
"Equating the US with Sodom could only be done if you could argue that in any given city we had less than 10 righteous people."

Then in this thread you said:
"When did I say it was not OK to equate the US with Sodom? I don't think anyone on this forum has denied this connection. "

Well FYI you denied that connection in our previous discussion on the US and Sodom and I don't recall anyone on this forum agreeing with me that the US is Sodom in that discussion. So both of your statements are false.


Re: "I did not equate Jezebel to the US, I did equate Jezebel to the spirit of the worldly system. "

You seemed to be referring to the US government as being part of the worldly system when you said:

I think the 850 prophets that ate at her table signifies the way we govern now. We have two kinds of "prophets", scientists and pollsters.

We bring in all kinds of experts with their charts, and tables, and predictions and prognostications, etc. We also have the political strategists, pollsters, and spin meisters.

What we don't have is a government according to our conscience. This kind of administration has been very convincingly compared to a psychopath.


"I have connected Babel to Babylon. You disagree fine. But you have no credibility with me."

I agree there is a connection between material and mystery Babylon. I disagree with you focusing on material Babylon to divert attention away from the Roman Catholic church and blaming Witness Lee for things that are nothing like what Catholicism is and has done.

[ZNPaaneah]

Originally Posted by Evangelical

I have already quoted you saying:
"Equating the US with Sodom could only be done if you could argue that in any given city we had less than 10 righteous people."

Then in this thread you said:
"When did I say it was not OK to equate the US with Sodom? I don't think anyone on this forum has denied this connection. "

Well FYI you denied that connection in our previous discussion on the US and Sodom.

Fair enough. There is a spirit of Sodom, you can surely see this operating in the US, no doubt. There is also the city of Sodom which God judged. You cannot equate any city in the US to Sodom in the sense of asking for God to judge the city unless there is an overwhelming number of unrighteous people, as described in Genesis. This is why I asked for you to provide the quote that I could look at. The context of my comment was a reference to you calling on God's judgement of the US. You take my comments out of context, then accuse me of saying something I didn't say. I never said that the spirit of Sodom is not operating in the US, instead I said that this is what you should expect in the world. I said that we made this statement when we were baptized that the world is condemned.

Yes you "quoted" me but made it impossible for me to find the quote or deal with it in a clear way looking at the context. How is it that only you are unable to give a clear reference, everyone else is able to give the thread and post so that it is easy to find. You provided a link which did not work.

Does this clear up your misunderstanding? There is a spirit of Sodom and there is a city of Sodom. There is a judgement of God on Sodom. The context of my quote saying "you can only equate the US with Sodom if you can find a city without ten righteous people in it" was a response to your call on God to judge the US as he judged Sodom.

You accused me of intentionally being misleading, now I am accusing you. Go back to your quote, look at the context and admit that this quote was in fact a response to your call on God to judge the US. If you don't do this it proves you are intentionally trying to cause misunderstandings.

Originally Posted by Evangelical

Re: "I did not equate Jezebel to the US, I did equate Jezebel to the spirit of the worldly system. "

You seemed to be referring to the US government as being part of the worldly system when you said:

I think the 850 prophets that ate at her table signifies the way we govern now. We have two kinds of "prophets", scientists and pollsters.

We bring in all kinds of experts with their charts, and tables, and predictions and prognostications, etc. We also have the political strategists, pollsters, and spin meisters.

What we don't have is a government according to our conscience. This kind of administration has been very convincingly compared to a psychopath.

Yes, I was referring to human government, it could have been Russia, it could have been China, it could have been the US. I never "equated the US with Jezebel" which is what you accused me of doing.

This is now the second time I am saying this, Jezebel introduces the worldly system into the church. How are you still confused? Is it intentional?

[ZNPaaneah]

Here is the complete quote from Post #546

This is a great point, what really caused God's judgement to fall on Sodom was the lack of any righteous men. God had said that if there had been 10 he wouldn't have destroyed it.

Equating the US with Sodom could only be done if you could argue that in any given city we had less than 10 righteous people.

It was a reply to someone else who pointed out that God's judgement on that city was based on the lack of any righteous men in the city.

[Evangelical]

Originally Posted by ZNPaaneah

Fair enough. There is a spirit of Sodom, you can surely see this operating in the US, no doubt. There is also the city of Sodom which God judged. You cannot equate any city in the US to Sodom in the sense of asking for God to judge the city unless there is an overwhelming number of unrighteous people, as described in Genesis. This is why I asked for you to provide the quote that I could look at. The context of my comment was a reference to you calling on God's judgement of the US. You take my comments out of context, then accuse me of saying something I didn't say. I never said that the spirit of Sodom is not operating in the US, instead I said that this is what you should expect in the world. I said that we made this statement when we were baptized that the world is condemned.

Yes you "quoted" me but made it impossible for me to find the quote or deal with it in a clear way looking at the context. How is it that only you are unable to give a clear reference, everyone else is able to give the thread and post so that it is easy to find. You provided a link which did not work.

Does this clear up your misunderstanding? There is a spirit of Sodom and there is a city of Sodom. There is a judgement of God on Sodom. The context of my quote saying "you can only equate the US with Sodom if you can find a city without ten righteous people in it" was a response to your call on God to judge the US as he judged Sodom.

You accused me of intentionally being misleading, now I am accusing you. Go back to your quote, look at the context and admit that this quote was in fact a response to your call on God to judge the US. If you don't do this it proves you are intentionally trying to cause misunderstandings.



Yes, I was referring to human government, it could have been Russia, it could have been China, it could have been the US. I never "equated the US with Jezebel" which is what you accused me of doing.

This is now the second time I am saying this, Jezebel introduces the worldly system into the church. How are you still confused? Is it intentional?

I never accused you of being intentionally misleading at all.


So the thread in question is: Local Church Discussions > Oh Lord, Where Do We Go From Here?>Merged Thread: Various Themes by Evangelical

This seems to hinge on the interpretation of the word "equate" .

You used the word equate in both threads, there and here.

In one you said we cannot equate the US with Sodom because of the 10 righteous people thing.

Here you said we can equate the US with Sodom because of the spirit of Sodom.

So it is like this:

US equates to Sodom because of the spirit of Sodom.
US does not equate to Sodom because there are more than 10 righteous people in it.

To me this is saying that the US is like Sodom before God's judgement came. That is, there was a period in which God allowed Sodom to exist and do what it wanted until the threshold of 10 righteous men was reached, then judgement came. This is the situation with the US today.

[ZNPaaneah]

Originally Posted by Evangelical

I never accused you of being intentionally misleading at all.


So the thread in question is: Local Church Discussions > Oh Lord, Where Do We Go From Here?>Merged Thread: Various Themes by Evangelical

This seems to hinge on the interpretation of the word "equate" .

You used the word equate in both threads, there and here.

In one you said we cannot equate the US with Sodom because of the 10 righteous people thing.

Here you said we can equate the US with Sodom because of the spirit of Sodom.

So it is like this:

US equates to Sodom because of the spirit of Sodom.
US does not equate to Sodom because there are more than 10 righteous people in it.

Can you understand that the spirit of Sodom can be likened to the legalization of gay marriage by the Supreme court. The Supreme Court represents the entire US, so by legalizing gay marriage they have legitimized the comparison of the US with the Spirit (the law) of Sodom.

But that the city of Sodom refers to a city of people.

When God rained fire down on Sodom he rained it down on a city with people who were killed, not on a fleshly spirit that permeates the world.

The United States is "the world", not a "Christian country". There may be quite a few Christians in this country, maybe even a majority, the Lord knows, but it is not a Christian country in the sense that Israel was the nation of God.

Because it is the world we should expect that all of the sins of the world are here, and that spirit of disobedience operates in them. But God chooses not to exercise His judgement at this time because his people, like grains of wheat, are growing and are not ready to reaped. If he roots up the tares He might kill some of the wheat as well.

So, yes, He judged Sodom in the OT, but only after determining there weren't 10 righteous people. In the end he only pulled out 3.

Read the quote that you claim is giving you so much confusion, it is talking about the city of Sodom, not the spirit of Sodom.

[Drake]

ZNP) "They "both have their significance and place but are not interchangeable". What does this have to do with anything I have written or quoted? I made my connection to Babel. My quote from Witness Lee was from the Life Study of Daniel on Babel. Do you guys read what I have written?"

ZNP,

Because....

You applied Brother Lee''s quote about the material Babylon in the LS Daniel to the religious Babylon signified by Jezebel in our conversation. You saw the word "Babylon" and it was interchangeable in your argument. By conflating the two you misapply what Brother Lee meant.

Then you accuse Evangelical and yours truly that it is we who do not understand what Brother Lee taught. So I respectfully suggested that you read the footnotes for Revelation 17 & 18. You said you did. Okay, you did but you missed the meaning of the footnote in Revelation 17:5 which states clearly:


51 Mystery here indicates that Babylon the Great in this chapter is not the material Babylon in ch. 18 but the religious one. The religious Babylon, the apostate church, is truly mysterious in what she is, in what she practices, and in what she teaches.

If you want to make a complaint about PL, a lawsuit, MOTA, meany buns Blendeds, etc. you can do that without cutting up the Scriptures like so many puzzle pieces. Sorry ZNP, but the picture puzzle you present does not look right. There are pieces that have been snipped, others pounded into place that clearly belong somewhere else, and for some the colors don't align. I assure you that up to this point I read your notes carefully but i do not see the scriptural support for them. Sometimes I think we might have an understanding but then you repeat the same error.

Drake

[ZNPaaneah]

Originally Posted by Drake

ZNP) "They "both have their significance and place but are not interchangeable". What does this have to do with anything I have written or quoted? I made my connection to Babel. My quote from Witness Lee was from the Life Study of Daniel on Babel. Do you guys read what I have written?"

ZNP,

Because....

You applied Brother Lee''s quote about the material Babylon in the LS Daniel to the religious Babylon signified by Jezebel in our conversation. You saw the word "Babylon" and it was interchangeable in your argument. By conflating the two you misapply what Brother Lee meant.

Then you accuse Evangelical and yours truly that it is we who do not understand what Brother Lee taught. So I respectfully suggested that you read the footnotes for Revelation 17 & 18. You said you did. Okay, you did but you missed the meaning of the footnote in Revelation 17:5 which states clearly:


51 Mystery here indicates that Babylon the Great in this chapter is not the material Babylon in ch. 18 but the religious one. The religious Babylon, the apostate church, is truly mysterious in what she is, in what she practices, and in what she teaches.

Perhaps we disagree on what the Bible says.

I understand that there is a worldly system that began with Cain. This was manifested in Babel. This city was full of idols. Ultimately we see this as "the great Babylon" in Rev 17 and 18 as a counterfeit for the New Jerusalem.

The spirit that operates is the spirit of disobedience. We can see this operation in the story of Jezebel. She is the personification of this evil system.

I agree with WL that she can be seen in the woman that hid the leaven in the meal. I also agree with WL that she can be seen in the harlot that sits on the beast and that this same spirit operates in her daughters.

So, when someone says "what is the spirit of the worldly system", what does that mean? I would say that you can see what that means by looking at Jezebel.

You want to say that Jezebel does not refer to the material world.

Once again I would refer you to the key criteria.

1. Teach idolatry -- Christmas is an example. Is Christmas part of the religious world or the material world? I say both. If you don't agree, fine, but don't accuse me of being misleading.

2. Eat things sacrificed to idols -- Christmas is a good example. Is the "eating things sacrificed to this idol" part of the religious world or the material world? I say it is both. If you don't agree fine, but don't accuse me of being misleading.

3. Do they claim that Santa Claus is a saint, a prophet, a magical being? I say they do. Both the worldly system as well as the religious system. If you don't agree, fine, but don't accuse me of being misleading.

4. I feel they substitute Santa for Jesus. I feel this is true of both the worldly Babylon and the Religious Babylon. If you don' agree, fine, but don't accuse me of being misleading.

5. I feel they seduce the Lord's servants to commit fornication in their worship. I feel this is true of both the worldly Babylon and the Religious Babylon. If you don't agree, fine, but don't accuse me of being misleading.

I do not disagree with any of the correlation made with the Roman Catholic church. It is all valid. What I do disagree with is your assertion that Jezebel must be limited to that historical example.

Originally Posted by Drake

If you want to make a complaint about PL, a lawsuit, MOTA, meany buns Blendeds, etc. you can do that without cutting up the Scriptures like so many puzzle pieces.

You are making a mock of sin.

Originally Posted by Drake

Sorry ZNP, but the picture puzzle you present does not look right. There are pieces that have been snipped, others pounded into place that clearly belong somewhere else, and for some the colors don't match. I assure you that up to this point I read your notes carefully but i do not see the scriptural support for them. Sometimes I think we might have an understanding but then you repeat the same error.

Drake

Well perhaps we'll be able to get things into focus. I am very clear that you have accused me of error, but do not see any error that you have identified.

[Evangelical]

Originally Posted by ZNPaaneah

Perhaps we disagree on what the Bible says.

I understand that there is a worldly system that began with Cain. This was manifested in Babel. This city was full of idols. Ultimately we see this as "the great Babylon" in Rev 17 and 18 as a counterfeit for the New Jerusalem.

The spirit that operates is the spirit of disobedience. We can see this operation in the story of Jezebel. She is the personification of this evil system.

I agree with WL that she can be seen in the woman that hid the leaven in the meal. I also agree with WL that she can be seen in the harlot that sits on the beast and that this same spirit operates in her daughters.

So, when someone says "what is the spirit of the worldly system", what does that mean? I would say that you can see what that means by looking at Jezebel.

You want to say that Jezebel does not refer to the material world.

Once again I would refer you to the key criteria.

1. Teach idolatry -- Christmas is an example. Is Christmas part of the religious world or the material world? I say both. If you don't agree, fine, but don't accuse me of being misleading.

2. Eat things sacrificed to idols -- Christmas is a good example. Is the "eating things sacrificed to this idol" part of the religious world or the material world? I say it is both. If you don't agree fine, but don't accuse me of being misleading.

3. Do they claim that Santa Claus is a saint, a prophet, a magical being? I say they do. Both the worldly system as well as the religious system. If you don't agree, fine, but don't accuse me of being misleading.

4. I feel they substitute Santa for Jesus. I feel this is true of both the worldly Babylon and the Religious Babylon. If you don' agree, fine, but don't accuse me of being misleading.

5. I feel they seduce the Lord's servants to commit fornication in their worship. I feel this is true of both the worldly Babylon and the Religious Babylon. If you don't agree, fine, but don't accuse me of being misleading.

I do not disagree with any of the correlation made with the Roman Catholic church. It is all valid. What I do disagree with is your assertion that Jezebel must be limited to that historical example.



You are making a mock of sin.



Well perhaps we'll be able to get things into focus. I am very clear that you have accused me of error, but do not see any error that you have identified.

Generally in the world there is a "spirit of lawlessness" that the Bible speaks of. Jezebel is possibly one form of that. The spirit of lawlessness manifests as the Jezebel spirit, Balaam etc. But in Revelation Jesus attributes Jezebel to the church at Thyatira and does not mention the worldly system at all. Jezebel is thought to be applied to a faction within the church.

Ellicot's commentary says

A large number of respectable critics regard Jezebel as a name applied to a faction, not as belonging to an individual. It seems best to view the name as symbolical, always remembering that the Jezebel spirit of proud, self-constituted authority, vaunting claims of superior holiness, or higher knowledge, linked with a disregard of—and perhaps a proud contempt for—“legalism,” and followed by open immorality, has again and again run riot in the churches of God.

[Evangelical]

For an example of Jezebel...

Hear the testimony of an Ex-Roman Catholic Nun, Sister Charletta and the atrocities she experienced at the hands of the wicked and barbaric priests of the Roman Catholic Whore of Babylon.

https://www.spreaker.com/user/overcomingthedragon/the-vatican-its-dark-dark-dark-secret

"And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues." - Revelation 18:4

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by Evangelical

For an example of Jezebel...

Hear the testimony of an Ex-Roman Catholic Nun, Sister Charletta and the atrocities she experienced at the hands of the wicked and barbaric priests of the Roman Catholic Whore of Babylon.

https://www.spreaker.com/user/overcomingthedragon/the-vatican-its-dark-dark-dark-secret

"And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues." - Revelation 18:4

Is that any worse than the carnage inflicted by Phillip Lee while running LSM?

"Come out of her My people!"

Does that make the LCM part of the Whore of Babylon?

[Evangelical]

Originally Posted by Ohio

Is that any worse than the carnage inflicted by Phillip Lee while running LSM?

"Come out of her My people!"

Does that make the LCM part of the Whore of Babylon?

I do believe the local churches can be affected by Jezebel , I said that in one of my earlier posts on this topic. Was not Thyatira a genuine local church? (not a denomination).

However I cannot say whether or not these matters you referred to are or are not worse, because I came into the Recovery after all this happened. Probably I should read some more threads on here to accurately assess what actually happened.

[ZNPaaneah]

Originally Posted by Evangelical

Generally in the world there is a "spirit of lawlessness" that the Bible speaks of. Jezebel is possibly one form of that. The spirit of lawlessness manifests as the Jezebel spirit, Balaam etc. But in Revelation Jesus attributes Jezebel to the church at Thyatira and does not mention the worldly system at all. Jezebel is thought to be applied to a faction within the church.

Ellicot's commentary says

A large number of respectable critics regard Jezebel as a name applied to a faction, not as belonging to an individual. It seems best to view the name as symbolical, always remembering that the Jezebel spirit of proud, self-constituted authority, vaunting claims of superior holiness, or higher knowledge, linked with a disregard of—and perhaps a proud contempt for—“legalism,” and followed by open immorality, has again and again run riot in the churches of God.

Wow, if I read this post I would think that you support this interpretation.

yet when I read this post of yours (107):

It is not WL's interpretation alone, the connection between Catholicism and Baal/Sun worship has long been recognized in Protestantism.

Why is it OK for you to equate the US government with Jezebel but it is not OK if I say the US is Sodom? Don't you know that homosexuality was part of Baal worship? So when you say the US government is Jezebel you are really saying it is Sodom plus other things. Yet you tried your best to argue that US was not Sodom when we had that discussion. I now realize it was because you thought it was Jezebel and not Sodom ,and not because you are ignorant of what is going on in the world.

you can only conclude that you feel the US government is Sodom (which you have stated) and therefore Jezebel.

So let's address what you have said.

1. Jezebel is definitely a manifestation of the spirit of lawlessness, not "possibly".

2. Your quote from Ellicot does not support your assertion that Jezebel does not mention the worldly system at all.

It seems best to view the name as symbolical, always remembering that the Jezebel spirit of proud, self-constituted authority, vaunting claims of superior holiness, or higher knowledge, linked with a disregard of—and perhaps a proud contempt for—“legalism,” and followed by open immorality, has again and again run riot in the churches of God.

Is not the authority which legalized gay marriage in the US despite this being contrary to majority opinion, using the Supreme court to override a democratically elected congress, isn't that a "proud, self-constituted authority, vaunting claims of superior holiness, or higher knowledge, linked with a disregard of -- and perhaps a proud contempt for -- legalism and followed by open immorality."?

3. Regarding your question "why is it ok for you to equate the US government with Jezebel" has been answered twice before. I never equated the US government with Jezebel, what I said was that Jezebel uses worldly methods to rule the church. Now a spirit of disobedience does pervade the US as it is the world, and this spirit does manifest itself very often as a spirit of Jezebel.

For example, during WWII 1% of California farmland was owned by Japanese farmers, but these farms produced 40% of California crops. One of the motivations behind the internment camps in California was that people coveted those farms.

We’re charged with wanting to get rid of the Japs for selfish reasons. We might as well be honest. We do. It’s a question of whether the white man lives on the Pacific Coast or the brown men. They came to this valley to work, and they stayed to take over. They offer higher land prices and higher rents than the white man can pay for land. They undersell the white man in the markets. They can do this because they raise their own labor. They work their women and children while the white farmer has to pay wages for his help. If all the Japs were removed tomorrow, we’d never miss them in two weeks, because the white farmers can take over and produce everything the Jap grows. And we don’t want them back when the war ends, either. (Morton Grodzins, Americans Betrayed Chicago: University of Chicago Press, 1949)

[Evangelical]

Originally Posted by ZNPaaneah

Wow, if I read this post I would think that you support this interpretation.

yet when I read this post of yours (107):

It is not WL's interpretation alone, the connection between Catholicism and Baal/Sun worship has long been recognized in Protestantism.

Why is it OK for you to equate the US government with Jezebel but it is not OK if I say the US is Sodom? Don't you know that homosexuality was part of Baal worship? So when you say the US government is Jezebel you are really saying it is Sodom plus other things. Yet you tried your best to argue that US was not Sodom when we had that discussion. I now realize it was because you thought it was Jezebel and not Sodom ,and not because you are ignorant of what is going on in the world.

you can only conclude that you feel the US government is Sodom (which you have stated) and therefore Jezebel.

So let's address what you have said.

1. Jezebel is definitely a manifestation of the spirit of lawlessness, not "possibly".

2. Your quote from Ellicot does not support your assertion that Jezebel does not mention the worldly system at all.

It seems best to view the name as symbolical, always remembering that the Jezebel spirit of proud, self-constituted authority, vaunting claims of superior holiness, or higher knowledge, linked with a disregard of—and perhaps a proud contempt for—“legalism,” and followed by open immorality, has again and again run riot in the churches of God.

Is not the authority which legalized gay marriage in the US despite this being contrary to majority opinion, using the Supreme court to override a democratically elected congress, isn't that a "proud, self-constituted authority, vaunting claims of superior holiness, or higher knowledge, linked with a disregard of -- and perhaps a proud contempt for -- legalism and followed by open immorality."?

3. Regarding your question "why is it ok for you to equate the US government with Jezebel" has been answered twice before. I never equated the US government with Jezebel, what I said was that Jezebel uses worldly methods to rule the church. Now a spirit of disobedience does pervade the US as it is the world, and this spirit does manifest itself very often as a spirit of Jezebel.

For example, during WWII 1% of California farmland was owned by Japanese farmers, but these farms produced 40% of California crops. One of the motivations behind the internment camps in California was that people coveted those farms.

We’re charged with wanting to get rid of the Japs for selfish reasons. We might as well be honest. We do. It’s a question of whether the white man lives on the Pacific Coast or the brown men. They came to this valley to work, and they stayed to take over. They offer higher land prices and higher rents than the white man can pay for land. They undersell the white man in the markets. They can do this because they raise their own labor. They work their women and children while the white farmer has to pay wages for his help. If all the Japs were removed tomorrow, we’d never miss them in two weeks, because the white farmers can take over and produce everything the Jap grows. And we don’t want them back when the war ends, either. (Morton Grodzins, Americans Betrayed Chicago: University of Chicago Press, 1949)

Drake and I have been making the distinction that the Bible (and WL) use the term Jezebel in a specific way. That being, the term Jezebel is used in reference to that which affects the people of God from within, not from without. The church is mainly concerned with religious Jezebel as opposed to "worldly Jezebel". Actually the term "worldly Jezebel" does not make sense, because the story of Jezebel only applies to God's people, not the surrounding nations.

Just so we are clear - I believe there is no such thing as an actual spirit of Jezebel going around doing all these things. It is just a manifestation of Satan. Jezebel is a metaphor for a particular set of vices or manifestations of Satan. Just as Sodom is. We all believe Satan is behind it and that is the important thing.

[ZNPaaneah]

Originally Posted by Evangelical

Drake and I have been making the distinction that the Bible (and WL) use the term Jezebel in a specific way. That being, the term Jezebel is used in reference to that which affects the people of God from within, not from without. The church is mainly concerned with religious Jezebel as opposed to "worldly Jezebel". Actually the term "worldly Jezebel" does not make sense, because the story of Jezebel only applies to God's people, not the surrounding nations.

Evangelical and Drake,

So Jezebel feeding 850 pagan prophets at her table "affected God's people from within" hence it is different from the worldly Babylon depicted in Rev 18.

Typical gobbledygook from you.

How about Christmas, does this affect God's people from within? How about a heathen song writer who writes a Christmas song, or a fleshly rock and roll group that performs the Christmas song, or the hollywood studio that makes a Christmas movie, or the actors and actresses, sacred prostitutes, who perform the movie? Do they affect the church from within? Do they seduce God's servants to eat things sacrificed to idols?

If they do affect the church from within are they somehow distinct from the Hollywood industry and Music industry that are part of the worldly Babylon?

How about tele-evangelists. How are they not part of and affected by the television industry?

There is an Episcopal church in NYC that runs a billion dollar fund. How is the running of that fund, which invests in the stocks and bonds that trade on the NYSE, NASDAQ, Chicago mercantile, etc. not affected by the world?

Please answer. Thanks.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by Evangelical

A large number of respectable critics regard Jezebel as a name applied to a faction, not as belonging to an individual. It seems best to view the name as symbolical, always remembering that the Jezebel spirit of proud, self-constituted authority, vaunting claims of superior holiness, or higher knowledge, linked with a disregard of—and perhaps a proud contempt for—“legalism,” and followed by open immorality, has again and again run riot in the churches of God.

Great quote!

I saw this occur before, during, and after the GLA quarantines.

LSM exhibited the Jezebel spirit in full display -- proud, self-constituted authority, vaunting claims of superior holiness, or higher knowledge, linked with a disregard of—and perhaps a proud contempt for—“legalism,” and followed by open immorality, has again and again run riot in the churches of God.