What is God's Economy?

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by Evangelical

The scripture focuses on what people call themselves and names. When Paul wrote to the Corinthians, in 1 Corinthians 1:12 and 3:4 the emphasis was on what they said. Paul was not instructing them not to follow himself, or Peter, or Christ. He was telling them not to say they follow them.

In 1 Corinthians 1:13 Paul says "were you baptised in the name of Paul"?

To the person who says they are Lutheran he would say "were you baptized in the name of Luther"?

The context is divisions, and names and what we call ourselves in relation to that.

RK's context in following a man, I presume are in relation to following the
ministry of the man.

When we read and follow Paul's letter to the Corinthians. Does that mean we are following Paul? Well yes in a sense. Suppose someone reads and follows Matthew, are they following Matthew? Yes in a sense. There is no problem unless one says "I am a Paul-ite" and the other " I am a Matthew-ite".

So no problem if 50, 70 or 100% of a church follows Lee's ministry, unless they call themselves a Lee-ite then it's a problem.

Until they run around in circles carrying a sandwich sign-board proclaiming ""I am of Lee, I am of Lee, I am of Lee, ..." Until then, by your definition, they are not of Lee.

Can you really be that naive?

[Evangelical]

Originally Posted by Ohio

Until they run around in circles carrying a sandwich sign-board proclaiming ""I am of Lee, I am of Lee, I am of Lee, ..." Until then, by your definition, they are not of Lee.

Can you really be that naive?

Well the context of Paul's words in "I follow Paul, I follow Christ etc", was on what people said and how they identified themselves. I note that he did not tell them to stop following those people.

[ZNPaaneah]

Originally Posted by Evangelical

Well the context of Paul's words in "I follow Paul, I follow Christ etc", was on what people said and how they identified themselves. I note that he did not tell them to stop following those people.

You make it sound like they have a few Witness Lee books in their library but otherwise you would have no idea that they were following Lee.

No one on this forum has taken issue with you for having a Witness Lee book.

No, the issue is that if you accept Witness Lee's teaching it includes the doctrine that all other Christians are wrong in their walk. How does one "follow" Witness Lee without judging all other Christians as being "off the mark of God's economy"?

[Evangelical]

Originally Posted by ZNPaaneah

You make it sound like they have a few Witness Lee books in their library but otherwise you would have no idea that they were following Lee.

No one on this forum has taken issue with you for having a Witness Lee book.

No, the issue is that if you accept Witness Lee's teaching it includes the doctrine that all other Christians are wrong in their walk. How does one "follow" Witness Lee without judging all other Christians as being "off the mark of God's economy"?

They are off the mark, I have the bible and experience to tell me that (don't need Lee to know that).

[Koinonia]

Originally Posted by Evangelical

They are off the mark, I have the bible and experience to tell me that (don't need Lee to know that).

That is a pretty crazy statement. Does your conscience not bother you about holding such an arrogant thought?

[Evangelical]

Originally Posted by Koinonia

That is a pretty crazy statement. Does your conscience not bother you about holding such an arrogant thought?

My conscience tells me right from wrong, that's what the conscience is for.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by Koinonia

That is a pretty crazy statement. Does your conscience not bother you about holding such an arrogant thought?

Pride within is often outside of the reach of our conscience.

[OBW]

Originally Posted by Evangelical

They are off the mark, I have the bible and experience to tell me that (don't need Lee to know that).

But you don't have the Bible. Every time we have asked anyone to show how "God's economy" makes anyone wrong, or verses mean different things, they always say it does but cannot utter a single verse to establish that it actually does.

It would be interesting for someone to try. In my 11 years on these forums, I have only heard crickets chirping. It is always going to come soon and never does.

[Evangelical]

Because God's economy is the whole Bible. It is God's will, God's plan, there is no single verse which can describe that, it requires the whole Bible.

[OBW]

Originally Posted by Evangelical

Because God's economy is the whole Bible. It is God's will, God's plan, there is no single verse which can describe that, it requires the whole Bible.

Therefore, as a singular term, it is of no particular meaning. If it means everything, then it means nothing in particular.

I know that sounds harsh, but to the extent that you want it to mean specific things within the whole of the Bible, it then returns to agreements or disagreements as to what particular parts of the Bible means.

But as a yardstick for things within the scripture, it is hard to consider that God's economy would define certain parts of the "all scripture" that is "God-breathed" to be less than profitable for teaching. Parts such as much of James, or significant parts of the Psalms. Since it is the invocation of "God's economy" as a reason to dismiss these as correctly meaning for our living what they say, then there is a problem with the idea that God's economy is the whole Bible if it is to be used as a tool to dismiss part of itself.

The whole idea is circular and ridiculous.

So you actually use the term "God's economy" in all sorts of places to be the reason that your understanding of the scripture there means what you want it to mean. But that starts with a presumption that you (or your group) has insight into what is God's economy that others do not, therefore you wield the term "God's economy" as the end-all of any discussion. You say that God's economy means what you want it to mean, therefore it cannot mean what anyone else would say that is contrary to you.

Therefore, as far as the LCM is concerned, "God's economy" is a term of no meaning outside of a hollow declaration that their interpretation of scripture is right and everyone else's is wrong.

Why not just ignore the overlay terminology and just deal with the passages as they are? Stop treating "God's economy" as if it is the one ring that rules them all. As if it is a talisman that can make words mean whatever the holder wants them to mean regardless of the stretch relative from the bare text.