Bible Answer Man Converts to Eastern Orthodox!

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Drake

Bro awareness,

Not sure what you prayed for exactly concerning being like those in the NT. The living of a Godman is not a life of extraordinary events .....but rather an extraordinary Life lived in the context of human events.

An example of this not in the NT is Blandina, a young slave sister martyred for her faith who never denied the Lord in spite of the situation. There were no miracles performed unless you consider her remaining steadfast under those circumstances a miracle. Hers was a Godman living... and a Godman dying.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blandina

Yet, not every human event entails martyrdom. Work out your own salvation with fear and trembling the Apostle charges us.... a daily salvation from whatever human life presents to us empowered by the indwelling resurrected Life of God. A demonstration that His grace is sufficient. That is the Godman living..

Drake

Wow bro Drake, thanks for further definition of what it means to be a godman. You make it sound like it's not what the word godman is pictured at first glace ; like a God Man image. Your definition sounds like it's a mood lifter, with better life habits.

I'm for that brother. But is that what Athanasius meant? is that what Lee meant?

[Drake]

Originally Posted by awareness

Wow bro Drake, thanks for further definition of what it means to be a godman. You make it sound like it's not what the word godman is pictured at first glace ; like a God Man image. Your definition sounds like it's a mood lifter, with better life habits.

I'm for that brother. But is that what Athanasius meant? is that what Lee meant?

Not mood lifter... God’s life.

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Drake

Not mood lifter... God’s life.

Oh darn! And I thought we were getting there. So we're back at it again. What does God's life mean?

[Drake]

Originally Posted by awareness

Oh darn! And I thought we were getting there. So we're back at it again. What does God's life mean?

The divine uncreated life of God..

Every born again believer has it. At the moment we believe we receive it first into our spirit. That is regeneration. Our spirit experiences union with God.. theosis. Then through the course of our human life, the Lord in our spirit moves into all our heart and soul... our mind. emotion, and will. This happens step by step, daily in all our circumstances and situations providing we cooperate with Him. When Paul says be transformed by the renewing of the mind this is what he is referring to. This life long process is theosis, divination of the soul. Then, in an instant, when the Lord returns , the body of every believer is transfigured into an eternal body like unto His own. This the final step of theosis is the redemption of our body.

The first and last step, regeneration of our spirit and the transfiguration of our body are instantaneous. The transformation of our soul is where the struggle occurs. Since God does not force His will on mans will it is up to each individual to choose God. We love many things but God desires we love Him first and foremost and above all. We think about many things but God desires we set our mind in the things of God and upon His Spirit. In this way, we will experience the salvation of our soul in this life.

Drake

[awareness]

Bro Drake, thanks for this attempt to explain the mechanics of theosis, and how we become godmen. Becoming God sounds important. Let me try to understand?

Originally Posted by Drake

The divine uncreated life of God.. Every born again believer has it. At the moment we believe we receive it first into our spirit. That is regeneration.

No, no. I was told that when I accepted Jesus as my Lord and savior, he came into my heart.

It wasn't until I bumped into the local church that I learned that that was wrong. They showed me the diagram of the tripartite man, so called. That showed, from 1st Thess, spirit, soul, and body, with the spirit at our core. They said that when I accepted Jesus that he came into my spirit. For years I thought he was in my heart.

Originally Posted by Drake

Our spirit experiences union with God.. theosis.

Sounds more like henosis. But I won't quibble.

Originally Posted by Drake

Then through the course of our human life, the Lord in our spirit moves into all our heart and soul... our mind. emotion, and will. This happens step by step, daily in all our circumstances and situations providing we cooperate with Him. When Paul says be transformed by the renewing of the mind this is what he is referring to. This life long process is theosis, divination of the soul. Then, in an instant, when the Lord returns , the body of every believer is transfigured into an eternal body like unto His own. This the final step of theosis is the redemption of our body.

The first and last step, regeneration of our spirit and the transfiguration of our body are instantaneous. The transformation of our soul is where the struggle occurs. Since God does not force His will on mans will it is up to each individual to choose God. We love many things but God desires we love Him first and foremost and above all. We think about many things but God desires we set our mind in the things of God and upon His Spirit. In this way, we will experience the salvation of our soul in this life.

Interesting. With our free will we can accept Jesus and instantly he comes into our spirit. But we can't use the same free will to accept him into our heart, mind, will, and emotions, and have it/him instantly.

Doesn't this hermeneutic, of slow drip deification, coming as far as I know, from Nee and Lee, make salvation based upon works?

Hey, I feel like I've been slowly deified, over the years. But it might just be age, and the loss of youthful vigor.

As long as those that have spent more time being deified don't claim that it means they wield God's authority, and that they speak for God, theosis is fine with me. In fact, I think it's pretty cool. If only ... I could use my free will to asked the Lord to instantly deify this lousy body, I'd be peachy keen with it.

Obviously I'm just as disappointed as Paul, concerning seeing the deification of living bodies. But also, I don't see real convincing evidence of slow moving deification.

As I've stated, none of those Evangelical has cited as evidence of theosis, ever became any different than any other human primate.

Moreover, how well we know the Bible, tho a good thing, and know about it, nor how much we know the history of Christianity, and knowing about things like theosis, does any of it constitute deification.

[Sons to Glory!]

Here are some verses from Daily Light July 27th (somehow I got a little ahead in my daily reading):

"He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation." "Whom He foreknew, He also predestinated us to be conformed to the image of His Son, that He might be the firstborn among many brothers." (Colossians 1:14-15; Romans 8:29)

And I would also add:

"Truly, truly, I say to you, unless a grain of wheat falls into the earth and dies, it remains alone; but if it dies, it bears much fruit." (John 12:24)

And this:

"The glory which You have given Me I have given to them . . . " " . . . having brought many sons to glory . . ." (John 17:22; Hebrews 2:10)

Call me dense (it's OK if you do), but I guess I miss the point of this whole discussion. These verses show that God's intention and work toward us (His "masterpiece" as per Ephesians 2:10) is higher than any of us could know. ("Eye has not seen nor ear heard nor has is come up in the heart of man, what God has in store for them that love Him." 1st Cor. 2:9)

So again, what is the point of the discussion? You think one way about our destiny and I think another way - WHAT DIFFERENCE DOES IT MAKE!? It's a little like children on the playground arguing about who can make the best mud pie, when a vacation on the beach awaits them (shades of CS Lewis).
Yes, like this -->

THE BOTTOM_LINE IS: Our inheritance in Christ is "Joy unspeakable and full of glory and the half has never yet been told!" Let's celebrate!!!

[UntoHim]

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

So again, what is the point of the discussion? You think one way about our destiny and I think another way - WHAT DIFFERENCE DOES IT MAKE!?

Actually most of the discussion lately on this thread has little to do with our destiny per se, but more on the here and now, and how the teachings and practices we imbibe and practice have great effect on ourselves and those around us.

And then there is this:

Originally Posted by UntoHim

So why do I bring all this up (again)? I bring it up because Witness Lee and his teachings and the practices he established and/or promoted are still being extolled as "God's move on earth" and "THE Lord's Recovery". Lee, to this very day, is still being extolled and promoted as "The One Minister with the One Ministry for The Age". To this very day, Lee is being extolled and promoted as the only person on earth who spoke as God's oracle. And the worse thing is that these are not "optional" beliefs for LC members. Those who disagree are shunned at best, and usually made so uncomfortable they simply disappear. Again, your experience, my experience is not relevant to the facts.

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

THE BOTTOM_LINE IS: Our inheritance in Christ is "Joy unspeakable and full of glory and the half has never yet been told!" Let's celebrate!!!

Well my brother, the only reason you know that our inheritance is in Christ is that someone taught you about this truth. Yes, you may have read that for yourself in the Bible, but for the truth to become "reality" to you (reality being a secondary meaning of ἀλήθεια Aletheia) there needs to be some expounding and expanding upon this simple yet profound truth.

And speaking of truth...the simple truth is that there are many preachers and teachers, prophets and apostles, out there telling us that they have a word of truth for us, for the church, for the Body of Christ. Some are legitimate, some of only partially legitimate, and others are frauds- imposters-charlatans. The Bible refers to these people as false prophets, false apostles and sheep in wolves clothing.

If every one of us were merely "celebrating" 24X7 (and we will be one day) and there was nobody watching out for the false teachings of the false prophets and the false apostles, then we would not be celebrating for very long - or at the least our celebration would not be in the truth.

So let us celebrate! Let us also be men and women of discernment. We can do both at the same time, I believe.
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