Calling all Saints

[Scribe]

What is a saint? Often I hear Words used in a way that is not the reality of that Word. Saints is one of those Words. The Roman Catholic church speaks it in a way of idolatry. One dies and then the Pope cantonizes you. Idolatry and nonsense. But those who have ever walked in a local church use the Word to mean fellow believer. This also is not the meaning. To be a believer and to be a saint are not the same thing. Surely I greet all the believers. Peace to you who have believed into the name of Jesus Christ. You believe Him and so do I. We are in HIm. To be a saint is more than this. I am always glad to find a fellow believer. But to find a saint is holy. This thread is the call to all saints. So what is a saint?

Scribe

[Suannehill]

Originally Posted by Scribe

What is a saint? Often I hear Words used in a way that is not the reality of that Word. Saints is one of those Words. The Roman Catholic church speaks it in a way of idolatry. One dies and then the Pope cantonizes you. Idolatry and nonsense. But those who have ever walked in a local church use the Word to mean fellow believer. This also is not the meaning. To be a believer and to be a saint are not the same thing. Surely I greet all the believers. Peace to you who have believed into the name of Jesus Christ. You believe Him and so do I. We are in HIm. To be a saint is more than this. I am always glad to find a fellow believer. But to find a saint is holy. This thread is the call to all saints. So what is a saint?

Scribe

I'm thinking you have something in mind...what do you say?

[UntoHim]

Originally Posted by Scribe

...But those who have ever walked in a local church use the Word to mean fellow believer. This also is not the meaning. To be a believer and to be a saint are not the same thing. ..To be a saint is more than this. I am always glad to find a fellow believer. But to find a saint is holy. This thread is the call to all saints. So what is a saint?

Very intriguing Scribe! At first glance I must admit that I agreed with what you wrote. I thought, yes, "saint" does seem to indicate something further or higher then "believer" or "disciple". But, "upon further review" (as they say in the NFL) I think this is a wrong premise. I am more then willing to hear something further from you regarding this. As Suanne says, you seem to have something on your mind. Don't be a tease Scribe, hit us with both barrels! Your revelation is just as good as mine, providing you can back it up with some scripture of course.

One of the most positive things I have taken from my Local Church experience is the use of this term "saint" among the believers. Of course there is always the danger that any term that is used so often can become common, which would be kind of ironic considering the term "saint" denotes something uncommon, something special, something separated unto God. In my thinking, we are not called to be saints anymore then we are called to be a son or a daughter. We get those designations at birth, and in the case of being a saint we get it at our new birth. So to be a believer is to be a disciple, to be a disciple is to be a saint. You can change the order here and it won't hurt my feelings.

Frankly your idea of a "saint" being something more then a "believer" reminds me of the worst of what came from Nee and Lee, especially Lee. Other Christians use this term "saint", albeit sparingly, but few use it in the exclusive manner of the Local Church. When LCers say "I'm going to be with some saints", they invariably mean members of the Local Church of Witness Lee. How this can be viewed any different then some Lutherans saying the exact same thing (when they really mean some members of their local Lutheran fellowship) is beyond me. Maybe you can fill me in on the real difference.

Saints,
I found this to be pretty good:
http://www.gotquestions.org/saints-Christian.html

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Question: "What are Christian saints according to the Bible?"

Answer: The word saint comes from the Greek word "hagios" which means “consecrated to God, holy, sacred, pious." It is almost always used in the plural, “saints.” "…Lord, I have heard from many about this man, how much harm he did to Your saints at Jerusalem" (Acts 9:13). "Now as Peter was traveling through all those regions, he came down also to the saints who lived at Lydda" (Acts 9:32). "And this is just what I did in Jerusalem; not only did I lock up many of the saints in prisons … “(Acts 26:10). There is only one instance of the singular use and that is "Greet every saint in Christ Jesus…" (Philippians 4:21). In Scripture there are 67 uses of the plural “saints” compared to only one use of the singular word “saint.” Even in that one instance, a plurality of saints is in view “…every saint…” (Philippians 4:21).

The idea of the word “saint” is a group of people set apart for the Lord and His kingdom. There are three references referring to godly character of saints; "that you receive her in the Lord in a manner worthy of the saints …" (Romans 16:2). "For the equipping of the saints for the work of service, to the building up of the body of Christ" (Ephesians 4:12). "But immorality or any impurity or greed must not even be named among you, as is proper among saints" (Ephesians 5:3).

Therefore, Scripturally speaking, the “saints” are the body of Christ, Christians, the church. All Christians are considered saints. All Christian are saints…and at the same time are called to be saints. 1 Corinthians 1:2 states it clearly, “To the church of God in Corinth, to those sanctified in Christ Jesus and called to be holy…” The words “sanctified” and “holy” come from the same Greek root as the word that is commonly translated “saints.” Christians are saints by virtue of their connection with Jesus Christ. Christians are called to be saints, to increasingly allow their daily life to more closely match their position in Christ. This is the Biblical description and calling of the saints.
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[Scribe]

"To all who are in Rome, beloved of God, the called saints" Romans 1:7

Greetings to Suannehill and UntoHim. Thank you for your furtherance of our seeking to sanctify the Word: "saints". I do have something on my mind and I am not trying to tease. I seek fellowship in the revelation of being a saint.
Unto Him, thank you for your thoughtful reply.

Witness Lee spoke forth what he saw. He spoke and we spoke many things before the time that we could enter the reality had come. "Saints" is one of these. As the writer you posted below shows, the Word Saint is related to consecration. Consecration is another Word that we lacked revelation of ,though we spoke it often. Our mouth would say "O Lord, I consecrate myself to Christ and the church". But we never did! I spoke this boldly for years. I SPOKE that I consecrate my life, my family, my new borns, all to Christ. But I merely spoke it. The Word consecration doesn't mean to speak, it means "TO FILLTHE HANDS". To be consecrated is a matter of having our hands filled with the UNSPEAKABLE gift of the Word. Neither I nor my teachers knew this in those days. To be a saint requires consecration. The hands must be filled with the living Word.

The Word saint is from the same root as sanctify, sanctuary, sanction, holy. It means to be set apart as Holy. It means to be made holy. So we come to John 17:17-20.

"Sanctify them in the truth; Your Word is truth." Here we see that it is the Word that sanctifies us. We are made saints by the Words working in us. He comes to us through the writing of others (John in this case. Or Paul, or Luke, or UntoHim or Scribe etc.) and He cuts His way into our heart. And He works His way through our heart to branch into our hand. "As you have sent me into the world, I also have sent them into the world. For their sake I sanctify myself, that they themselves also may be sanctified in truth." That we may also be sanctified in the Word. The Word here is Logos! It is not the Rhema that can be spoken that sanctifies us. It is the Logos that cannot be spoken and must be written that does the work of making us to be saints. We see Jesus sanctifying Himself in John 8. When challenged and tempted to speak, he stoops to write. As He writes He is sanctifying Himself. This rolls back the veil on how a man walks in sanctification. Now at John 17 he opens the way for more saints. V20 "And I do not ask concerning these only, but concerning those also who believe into Me through their Word"! Here we see that each of the saints has a Logos. They have a Word they write. That Word is Christ and is the teaching. UNSPEAKABLE GIFT.

Ponder brothers and sisters, the New Testament is a composition of letters written between the saints. Some letters were written corporately. Some to churches. Some to individuals. All are the Word. It was the daily life of the church that all write. The Bible bears witness to us now of a people whose God was the Word branching hand to hand. That Word has now passed through a long two millennial day baptism but now at the third day He arises. Many believe in Jesus, fewer except the discipline that makes disciples. But all disciples shall come through discipline to be reduced to the revelation of the sanctifying Word at hand and will be a holy scribe. He is in the world, but though they write they know Him not, but the saints know and handle Him daily. Faith and the Word mate at the hand of the saints.

Scribe

[ZNPaaneah]

Originally Posted by Scribe

It is the Logos that cannot be spoken and must be written that does the work of making us to be saints.

I have had wonderful experiences of being sanctified through writing the word. But, I never felt that the word "must be written". In fact there are many charges in the Bible to speak the word, to preach the word, etc. Are there any charges to "write the word"? This is a teaching I have never heard before.

[Scribe]

Originally Posted by ZNPaaneah

I have had wonderful experiences of being sanctified through writing the word. But, I never felt that the word "must be written". In fact there are many charges in the Bible to speak the word, to preach the word, etc. Are there any charges to "write the word"? This is a teaching I have never heard before.

Revelation 1:11. "What you see WRITE in a book and send to the seven churches..."

[ZNPaaneah]

Originally Posted by Scribe

Revelation 1:11. "What you see WRITE in a book and send to the seven churches..."

“I was in the Spirit on the Lord’s day, and heard behind me a great voice, as of a trumpet, saying, I am Alpha and Omega, the first and the last: and, What thou seest, write in a book” (Revelation 1:10-11a). The way I read these verses, this is a word to John, not a charge to every Christian.

[Scribe]

Originally Posted by ZNPaaneah

“I was in the Spirit on the Lord’s day, and heard behind me a great voice, as of a trumpet, saying, I am Alpha and Omega, the first and the last: and, What thou seest, write in a book” (Revelation 1:10-11a). The way I read these verses, this is a word to John, not a charge to every Christian.

John cannot even answer the command unless another has been faithfully writing in the local churches and brings what is in his hand to Johns hand. You must remember this is a book of signs and we of the gentiles, who have the right hand of fellowship, are players in it with the Jews who kept the left. Both are seen in Chapter one.

[ZNPaaneah]

Originally Posted by Scribe

John cannot even answer the command unless another has been faithfully writing in the local churches and brings what is in his hand to Johns hand. You must remember this is a book of signs and we of the gentiles, who have the right hand of fellowship, are players in it with the Jews who kept the left. Both are seen in Chapter one.

I don't question the value of writing the word. What I don't understand is the point about sanctification is a result of writing the word. "It is the logos that cannot be spoken and must be written that does the work of making us to be saints".

[Scribe]

Amen ZNPnaaneah, I do not believe this can be seen apart from revelation. I pray that He who is the Word would open your eyes to this, and open mine greater day by day as the sanctification advances. Ponder the son of man, when he comes through a local church, he picks up an angel in hand. A man that can appear in the center of the sign to John and that with seven stars in his hand. Witness declared that these seven were the sevenfold intensified Spirit. He never explained to us why these seven appear in the son of man's hand, not his mouth. Witness was in the time of the mouth speaking before the Word was in the hand of the saints. When a saint writes, he binds and looses angels. The angel of the city serves his right hand.

So lets go back to the beginning. God spoke and there was. God said let there be light and there was light. God said let there be earth and there was earth. God said let the dry land appear and the sun, moon, and stars, and they were. But when it came to man, the covenant God made a proposal. "Let us make man in our image and after our likeness". God didn't just speak "Let there be man and there was man." No. God spoke a proposal...."Let us make". Then Jehovah answered by touching what God had spoken into being. Jehovah God's hands went forth and touched what the mouth hand spoken. This is to sanctify.

The hand of Jehovah God made man out of the earth that God had spoken into being. And man was made with hands so that God, the Word could dwell in man and branch from man's hand to all the holy angels eagerly waiting.Man was made with hands so that Jehovahs hand could be upon him. We know the story because it is written. Then Jehovah God spoke to man and said not to eat of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. This was a speaking of the mouth. The serpent could also speak. So the serpent spoke to the woman. The serpent spoke, adding to and taking away from Jehovah God's speaking. Then the woman spoke to the man. All these speakings were before man reached out his hand to the tree of life. And the serpents unsanctified speaking resulted in flaming swords going all directions to gaurd the way of the tree of life that man could not stretch forth his HAND to it. Genesis 3:22. Man was cut off by the tongues that speak beyond what the hand has written.

Now only faith can overcome to reach out to the tree of life and handle the Word. We must follow the lamb out of the garden, through the blood of Abel into the family of Seth, where by the hearing of the blood they begin to handle the Word. Through the hearing of the blood of Abel, the Word developed father to son from Seth down to Enoch, the seventh from Adam. The Word so matured in the seventh that death bowed. Enoch, the righteous scribe, handled the Word in such a way that death was no more. God took Him because his hand attended to God. Now come the days that the church; the body of Christ shall prevail over death by holy writing.


Let us love the Word. O Word, cut through our heart and find your way to our hand where we mingle in our faith at each writing. For we have a better blood speaking than that of Abel and we have the Word tabernacling among the saints.

It is wonderful to speak the praises of the Lord. It is glorious to bless Him with our mouth. But it is most holy intimacy to touch Him with our hands. Blessed be the Word which my mouth glorifies and my hand handles.

Scribe