Christ Becoming The Live-Giving Spirit

Sons to Glory! · 01-05-2020, 01:44 PM

I have an interlinear app on my phone and looked at it when citing those verses.

This morning I had the thought that maybe it was Christ in us and the HS upon us. But then saw 1 Cor 6:19 which blew that theory apart! I'm actually happy to not be able to figure it out!

JJ · 01-05-2020, 03:40 PM

Hmm. I’ve been using Bible Hub on-line. https://biblehub.com/text/1_corinthians/15-45.htm and it has lower case. I’ll check my old Nestle’s Greek text and see what it has. Agreed. Mind blowing when the Trinity is involved.

That reminds me of Cor 13:12

https://biblehub.com/1_corinthians/13-12.htm

That was when glass technology had not been perfected to make a mirror with a clear reflection like today. Mirrors were often made of polished metals, and the reflection tended to have distortions and imperfections. https://biblehub.com/str/greek/2072.htm

Sons to Glory! · 01-06-2020, 05:47 AM

I use Bible Hub all the time and really like it! My phone app is the Hebrew/Greek Interlinear Bible by Hagios Tech. And actually, spirit was not capitalized in 1 Cor 15:45, but isn't that just a judgement call on their part? Or is it just because the article "a" is used instead of "the"?

For instance in Romans 8:9 (Gk), "You now not in flesh but in Spirit." They capitalize spirit, but why? Since it appears they are contrasting human flesh with human spirit. And in verse 13 mine inserts the article "the" before spirit, and they capitalize it. But I think translators often do that - an apparent default thinking that any instance of the word pneuma must pertain specifically to God.

JJ · 01-06-2020, 12:21 PM

Yes, that’s what I’ve been trying to get at, many translations sometimes add or take away articles and aren’t consistently following the Greek text for capitalizing and it just adds to the difficulty when it comes to spirit and Spirit! I’m no Greek expert, and wish one who is could weigh in.

Here is a link to another couple relevant verses in the inter linear (look at the one linked and the next verse too: https://biblehub.com/interlinear/1_corinthians/2-11.htm). These certainly suggest The Spirit is for knowing the things of God while the spirit knows the things of man. Recall Witness Lee wanted us to turn to the spirit all the time! When we did were we then getting the things of man rather than the things of God? My experience was yes!

JJ · 01-06-2020, 07:01 PM

In the verses I linked the English translation adds and deletes words too! Aargh!

OBW · 01-08-2020, 10:13 AM

Christ, ion resurrection, took on a new form. A body that was both physical (can be touched) and "spiritual" (more like thinking "ghost"). Yet Christ was always "spirit." (John 4) And Christ is life-giving. So in the context of a discussion on the nature of the body that is received in the resurrection, Christ "became" a life-giving "spirit." He already gave life. Now his body is different (and Paul is calling that body "spiritual").

Whatever it is that Lee said that keeps bringing this subject up is nonsense because Lee is talking about Christ (the Son, the 2nd of the trinity) becoming the Spirit (the 3rd of the trinity). Paul just does not say any such thing.

byHismercy · 01-08-2020, 10:33 AM

Yep!!
1 John 5:7 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.

JJ · 01-10-2020, 07:46 PM

https://biblehub.com/interlinear/john/7-39.htm

This is a good example of how translators add and delete articles to make it read in English, but they got the capital S in Spirit right.

It is interesting to me that:

1: Jesus says “if anyone thirsts, let him come to Me and drink (v37)
2: and “the one believing in me, Rivers of living water out of his belly will flow (not in but out).(v38)
3: He said this of The Spirit, whom those who believe in him were about to receive; not yet for was Spirit, because Jesus was not yet glorified. (v 39)

So those who believe in Him = come to Him and drink, out of their belly (translated innermost being) will flow Rivers of living water.
And, because Jesus was glorified this is “of The Spirit”.

Lee called this Jesus becoming The Spirit, and God being processed.

I’m just glad he calls us to believe in Him. We drink of Him, the Spirit comes out “as a River” out of “our belly.” Praise Him for His call to drink of Him as the living water and The Spirit flowing back out.

If anyone has it figured out they have a better mind than I do.

01-05-2020, 01:44 PM	#1
Sons to Glory! Member Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: Scottsdale, AZ Posts: 2,622	Re: Christ Becoming The Live-Giving Spirit I have an interlinear app on my phone and looked at it when citing those verses. This morning I had the thought that maybe it was Christ in us and the HS upon us. But then saw 1 Cor 6:19 which blew that theory apart! I'm actually happy to not be able to figure it out! __________________ *LC Berkeley 70s; LC Columbus OH 80s; An Ekklesia in Scottsdale 98-now*

01-05-2020, 03:40 PM	#2
JJ Member Join Date: Jan 2016 Posts: 1,006	Re: Christ Becoming The Live-Giving Spirit Hmm. I’ve been using Bible Hub on-line. https://biblehub.com/text/1_corinthians/15-45.htm and it has lower case. I’ll check my old Nestle’s Greek text and see what it has. Agreed. Mind blowing when the Trinity is involved. That reminds me of Cor 13:12 https://biblehub.com/1_corinthians/13-12.htm That was when glass technology had not been perfected to make a mirror with a clear reflection like today. Mirrors were often made of polished metals, and the reflection tended to have distortions and imperfections. https://biblehub.com/str/greek/2072.htm __________________ And the Word became flesh, and dwelt among us, and we saw His glory, glory as of the only begotten from the Father, full of grace and truth. (John 1:14 NASB)

01-06-2020, 05:47 AM	#3
Sons to Glory! Member Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: Scottsdale, AZ Posts: 2,622	Re: Christ Becoming The Live-Giving Spirit I use Bible Hub all the time and really like it! My phone app is the Hebrew/Greek Interlinear Bible by Hagios Tech. And actually, spirit was not capitalized in 1 Cor 15:45, but isn't that just a judgement call on their part? Or is it just because the article "a" is used instead of "the"? For instance in Romans 8:9 (Gk), "You now not in flesh but in Spirit." They capitalize spirit, but why? Since it appears they are contrasting human flesh with human spirit. And in verse 13 mine inserts the article "the" before spirit, and they capitalize it. But I think translators often do that - an apparent default thinking that any instance of the word pneuma must pertain specifically to God. __________________ *LC Berkeley 70s; LC Columbus OH 80s; An Ekklesia in Scottsdale 98-now*

01-06-2020, 12:21 PM	#4
JJ Member Join Date: Jan 2016 Posts: 1,006	Re: Christ Becoming The Live-Giving Spirit Yes, that’s what I’ve been trying to get at, many translations sometimes add or take away articles and aren’t consistently following the Greek text for capitalizing and it just adds to the difficulty when it comes to spirit and Spirit! I’m no Greek expert, and wish one who is could weigh in. Here is a link to another couple relevant verses in the inter linear (look at the one linked and the next verse too: https://biblehub.com/interlinear/1_corinthians/2-11.htm). These certainly suggest The Spirit is for knowing the things of God while the spirit knows the things of man. Recall Witness Lee wanted us to turn to the spirit all the time! When we did were we then getting the things of man rather than the things of God? My experience was yes! __________________ And the Word became flesh, and dwelt among us, and we saw His glory, glory as of the only begotten from the Father, full of grace and truth. (John 1:14 NASB)

01-06-2020, 07:01 PM	#5
JJ Member Join Date: Jan 2016 Posts: 1,006	Re: Christ Becoming The Live-Giving Spirit In the verses I linked the English translation adds and deletes words too! Aargh! __________________ And the Word became flesh, and dwelt among us, and we saw His glory, glory as of the only begotten from the Father, full of grace and truth. (John 1:14 NASB)

01-08-2020, 10:13 AM	#6
OBW Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: DFW area Posts: 4,384	Re: Christ Becoming The Live-Giving Spirit Christ, ion resurrection, took on a new form. A body that was both physical (can be touched) and "spiritual" (more like thinking "ghost"). Yet Christ was always "spirit." (John 4) And Christ is life-giving. So in the context of a discussion on the nature of the body that is received in the resurrection, Christ "became" a life-giving "spirit." He already gave life. Now his body is different (and Paul is calling that body "spiritual"). Whatever it is that Lee said that keeps bringing this subject up is nonsense because Lee is talking about Christ (the Son, the 2nd of the trinity) becoming the Spirit (the 3rd of the trinity). Paul just does not say any such thing. __________________ Mike I think . . . . I think I am . . . . therefore I am, I think — Edge OR . . . . You may be right, I may be crazy — Joel

01-08-2020, 10:33 AM	#7
byHismercy Member Join Date: Apr 2018 Location: Pacific Northwest Posts: 439	Re: Christ Becoming The Live-Giving Spirit Yep!! 1 John 5:7 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.

01-10-2020, 07:46 PM	#8
JJ Member Join Date: Jan 2016 Posts: 1,006	Re: Christ Becoming The Live-Giving Spirit https://biblehub.com/interlinear/john/7-39.htm This is a good example of how translators add and delete articles to make it read in English, but they got the capital S in Spirit right. It is interesting to me that: 1: Jesus says “if anyone thirsts, let him come to Me and drink (v37) 2: and “the one believing in me, Rivers of living water out of his belly will flow (not in but out).(v38) 3: He said this of The Spirit, whom those who believe in him were about to receive; not yet for was Spirit, because Jesus was not yet glorified. (v 39) So those who believe in Him = come to Him and drink, out of their belly (translated innermost being) will flow Rivers of living water. And, because Jesus was glorified this is “of The Spirit”. Lee called this Jesus becoming The Spirit, and God being processed. I’m just glad he calls us to believe in Him. We drink of Him, the Spirit comes out “as a River” out of “our belly.” Praise Him for His call to drink of Him as the living water and The Spirit flowing back out. If anyone has it figured out they have a better mind than I do. __________________ And the Word became flesh, and dwelt among us, and we saw His glory, glory as of the only begotten from the Father, full of grace and truth. (John 1:14 NASB)