Church in Cincinnati

[leastofthese]

Frequent poster - "Ohio" shared, "There are two churches (Grandview Christian and Cincinnati) which no longer adhere to either." Referring to the churches no longer adhering to the LSM/TC way of doing things.

Does anyone have more information about the timing of this or reasons the elders (I assume) broke away from Witness Lee's ministry?

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by leastofthese

Frequent poster - "Ohio" shared, "There are two churches (Grandview Christian and Cincinnati) which no longer adhere to either." Referring to the churches no longer adhering to the LSM/TC way of doing things.

Does anyone have more information about the timing of this or reasons the elders (I assume) broke away from Witness Lee's ministry?

The info is on this forum ... prolly somewhere on this thread.

Cincinnati actually joined together with another non-LC church.

Grandview Christian elder is John Myer who wrote Future and Hope.

[Freedom]

Originally Posted by Ohio

The info is on this forum ... prolly somewhere on this thread.

Cincinnati actually joined together with another non-LC church.

Grandview Christian elder is John Myer who wrote Future and Hope.

I spent some time reading through that linked thread and one thing that caught my attention was a list of all the midwest LC's that were removed from the church directory. Looks like at the time of the quarantine there were at least 20 churches that parted ways with LSM. That is a significant amount. It leaves me wondering what percentage of overall U.S. LC membership that represented. That percentage had to have been in the double digits.

It also makes me wonder how many of those churches that split off remain reminiscent of the LC vs those who have moved on completely.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by Freedom

I spent some time reading through that linked thread and one thing that caught my attention was a list of all the midwest LC's that were removed from the church directory. Looks like at the time of the quarantine there were at least 20 churches that parted ways with LSM. That is a significant amount. It leaves me wondering what percentage of overall U.S. LC membership that represented. That percentage had to have been in the double digits.

It also makes me wonder how many of those churches that split off remain reminiscent of the LC vs those who have moved on completely.

The Midwest LC's never were as extreme as other regions. I doubt they have really changed much from what they were. When I left, many told me that things under TC were improving for the better. I was skeptical, because as a rule, unless the actual leaders at HQ change, there will by definition be little change. I was right. When TC expelled John Myer in Columbus, it was confirmed.

Btw, the story about Bill Barker of Chicago is key to understanding LSM's plot to knock off TC.

The quarantines actually caused many Midwest elders to rethink their mission. TC had prepped us all for many years that basically "WL good, BB bad." The simple paradigm worked until it was carefully thought thru. But how can you differentiate the leadership of WL and the Blendeds? If the Blendeds were "bad," how did they get that way? The "tract wars" between the Blended B's and the Concerned B's and these public forums caused many to understand the problems were inherent to WL, the Blendeds, and TC himself.

One by one, some of the LC elders which initially stood against the quarantines, siding with TC, eventually distanced themselves from him too. The issue with the BB's was control and legalism, but the issue with TC was control and abuse. I realize these are generalizations, but perhaps they will help.

Here is an old post I wrote when I was more familiar with the situation.

[leastofthese]

Originally Posted by Ohio

The Midwest LC's never were as extreme as other regions. I doubt they have really changed much from what they were.

What exactly do you mean by this?

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by leastofthese

What exactly do you mean by this?

To a certain extent, we kept LSM at arm's length, we adhered more closely to scripture, we did not jump on every new fad coming out of Anaheim, e.g. we did not invest in Daystar or Linko, we tried PSRP and then discarded it, we did not promote "high peak" teachings, we stopped sending young people to the FTTA, we did not use LSM materials for every meeting and conference, etc. We really were LC-Lite, and hence were continually accused of not being "one with the ministry" since way back in the early-70's.

We had a good number of spiritual brothers who would "keep it real," eg we would never all stand up and "call on the Lord 5 times," as they did at the Whistler Kangaroo Court.

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by Freedom

It also makes me wonder how many of those churches that split off remain reminiscent of the LC vs those who have moved on completely.

I spent time in the west coast and Ohio LCs. I think what Ohio is saying is probably true - the Ohio churches were not as doggedly accepting all things coming out of LSM.

The last time I was around a west coast LC was in Tacoma about 7 years ago. I couldn't believe how rigid they were for LSM and Lee then. The first part of the one meeting I attended was very good, with lots of robust singing from all the members. But the 2nd half, after a refreshment break, was exclusively WL and the prescribed reading for the week. There were zero testimonies that were apart from this narrow prescribed reading. No one stood up to convey some simple experience of Christ they may have had recently.

At least in Columbus in the 1980s, there were plenty of fresh testimonies of the experience of Christ. So I don't know if that was just a Tacoma thing or if was something that happened later on to all the LC.

In Scottsdale, the ones who formed the gathering here broke from the LC before the mid-1980s. We used to get their monthly newsletter in Columbus while they were still in Seattle (they didn't relocate to Scottsdale until very late 1980s). It was called "The Christian." Several in Columbus read it back then. So, Columbus certainly was not completely aligned with all things LSM back then.

I wonder how other groups meet that left the LC, that is, what gathering format they practice. Scottsdale continues to practice the "open meeting" format where members are free to function, call songs, testify, ask for prayer, etc. Several bros rotate giving the Sunday messages. This functioning is so very rich, and I do miss it when I visit other groups.