Deceptions on Campus

[Evangelical]

Well I used the search terms "Witness Lee" or "Local Church" because these are the terms which UntoHim suggested college kids might use:

And since college kids are generally fully immersed in this "google age" we live in, when they google "Witness Lee" or "Local Church" they will probably shy away from attending any Christians on Campus event.

It might help if you read a little further down before jumping right in. It would save you some embarrassment.

You also claimed that a search like "Local church controversy" is "much more realistic and focused". I disagree that looking for controversy is the first thing a college kid or any reasonable person would do if they had never heard of the local church or Witness Lee before. UntoHim's search terms are more realistic. Still, if I google "local church controversy", it returns wikipedia links that my searches also returned (students can read about controversies from the wikipedia pages I referred to in my previous post), the contendingforthefaith.org website turns up which refutes much of the negativity, and clicking "next" a few times still does not return a hit for this forum where a college kid might be saved from the "LC cult".

The third top hit for your search term is "Dr. J. Gordon Melton— An Open Letter Concerning the Local Church, Witness Lee and “The God-Men” Controversy" - are you really considering this to be "a lot of not so favorable results"? A college kid might read this by expert Melton "Director of the Institute for the Study of American Religion" and conclude in favor of the local churches.

[ABrotherinFaith]

Originally Posted by Evangelical

Well I used the search terms "Witness Lee" or "Local Church" because these are the terms which UntoHim suggested college kids might use:

And since college kids are generally fully immersed in this "google age" we live in, when they google "Witness Lee" or "Local Church" they will probably shy away from attending any Christians on Campus event.

It might help if you read a little further down before jumping right in. It would save you some embarrassment.

You also claimed that a search like "Local church controversy" is "much more realistic and focused". I disagree that looking for controversy is the first thing a college kid or any reasonable person would do if they had never heard of the local church or Witness Lee before. UntoHim's search terms are more realistic. Still, if I google "local church controversy", it returns wikipedia links that my searches also returned (students can read about controversies from the wikipedia pages I referred to in my previous post), the contendingforthefaith.org website turns up which refutes much of the negativity, and clicking "next" a few times still does not return a hit for this forum where a college kid might be saved from the "LC cult".

The third top hit for your search term is "Dr. J. Gordon Melton— An Open Letter Concerning the Local Church, Witness Lee and “The God-Men” Controversy" - are you really considering this to be "a lot of not so favorable results"? A college kid might read this by expert Melton "Director of the Institute for the Study of American Religion" and conclude in favor of the local churches.

Embarrassment? Do you feel embarrassment when you say things that make sense? I do not, and the false care in your snide remark betrays an insecurity that must be growing within you as you read more here...

Once again, you don't understand how the internet works. I admitted that someone might start with the general search terms that you quoted from UntoHim. But those are just a start, as I said before. Not everyone searches like you do, thankfully. Websites have links to related topics. You don't have to go back to Google and click next (which would just give you more related to your initial search, and the further you go by clicking next the more tenuous the relation is...though I suspect you know this). Links open up worlds that initial/broad Google searches never show.

Your response is a perfect example of the type of deception practiced the the LC and CoC.

Be a little creative in your search. You might actually find things. You don't seem to be too internet savvy, and I'd argue even if people had never heard of Witness Lee or the LC or CoC, negative information is not hard to find.

Your naive reply reminds me of why people (usually older though not always) get caught doing things online. They don't understand how connected things are, how nothing is ever more than a few clicks away. And they can't imagine how anyone would be able to find them.

[clever sister]

I don't really know what Google has to do with the topic on hand

[aron]

Originally Posted by clever sister

I don't really know what Google has to do with the topic on hand

It's the electronic equivalent of throwing dust in the air.

[Evangelical]

Originally Posted by clever sister

I don't really know what Google has to do with the topic on hand

It's about students on campus using Google to find things out about the local churches.

[clever sister]

Originally Posted by Evangelical

It's about students on campus using Google to find things out about the local churches.

If there isn't anything for students to find out about using Google, than why not more honesty?

[Evangelical]

Originally Posted by ABrotherinFaith

Embarrassment? Do you feel embarrassment when you say things that make sense? I do not, and the false care in your snide remark betrays an insecurity that must be growing within you as you read more here...

Once again, you don't understand how the internet works. I admitted that someone might start with the general search terms that you quoted from UntoHim. But those are just a start, as I said before. Not everyone searches like you do, thankfully. Websites have links to related topics. You don't have to go back to Google and click next (which would just give you more related to your initial search, and the further you go by clicking next the more tenuous the relation is...though I suspect you know this). Links open up worlds that initial/broad Google searches never show.

Your response is a perfect example of the type of deception practiced the the LC and CoC.

Be a little creative in your search. You might actually find things. You don't seem to be too internet savvy, and I'd argue even if people had never heard of Witness Lee or the LC or CoC, negative information is not hard to find.

Your naive reply reminds me of why people (usually older though not always) get caught doing things online. They don't understand how connected things are, how nothing is ever more than a few clicks away. And they can't imagine how anyone would be able to find them.

FYI I was not trying to find specific and more detailed things, I was only inputting the search terms that UntoHim suggested and seeing what resulted.
Basically you have explained that if you add more search terms to Google (such as the word "controversy") you get more specific results. This is obvious and not exactly a ground-breaking discovery.

I disagree that it is easy to find negative information. Even if I type in more specific terms such as Local Church Cult, I get hits to some websites such as "Why do some people accuse you of being a cult?" on localchurchesfaq.org. Clearly the articles which are positive and refute the negativity are in the top of the Google searches (so maybe their algorithms work afterall).

Your failure to realize this which you could have if you read the post below mine (to which I was replying to) shows you lack the ability to comprehend what you are reading and synthesize, which is typical of the younger generation.

By the way the use of the "next" button is a valid way to use Google (why do they provide a next button?) - sometimes what you want is not in the first page but in the second or third - the younger generation lacks the patient to be able to trawl through a lot of data - they rarely read to the end of the page and end up twittering their friends instead for the solution.

I demonstrated that if someone used the search terms that UntoHim suggested, they would not find this website which might "save" them from the "LC cult". Apparently Google is not smart enough to know that. Or maybe it is? Maybe Google's complex algorithm with 200 variables knows that the LC is not a cult.

[ABrotherinFaith]

Originally Posted by Evangelical

FYI I was not trying to find specific and more detailed things, I was only inputting the search terms that UntoHim suggested and seeing what resulted....

I should take my own advice from another thread and ignore you in the future. You're intentionally obfuscating. Like I said, your posts are perfect example of the kind of deception practiced by the LC/ CoC.

[Evangelical]

Originally Posted by ABrotherinFaith

I should take my own advice from another thread and ignore you in the future. You're intentionally obfuscating. Like I said, your posts are perfect example of the kind of deception practiced by the LC/ CoC.

Quitting so easily?

There's no deception. Every one of my statements are factual, I can name the Google links returned by name, proving their positive feeling towards the local churches.

For example, one of the top links for a search on "is the local church a cult" is this one:

Are the Local Churches a Cult? - Christian Research Institute

which says "To begin with, the local churches are not a cult..."

I think what happened is that you thought you'd make fun of my technical abilities instead of reading the post to which I was responding to and why I only used relevant search terms. Now you are embarrassed because you can't think of any counter-argument to my facts so decide to quit. If you did have anything of substance to refute my claims, you would have posted them in your first post instead of making fun of my Googling methods.

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Evangelical

Quitting so easily? There's no deception. Every one of my statements are factual, I can name the Google links returned by name, proving their positive feeling towards the local churches. For example, one of the top links for a search on "is the local church a cult" is this one:
Are the Local Churches a Cult? - Christian Research Institute which says "To begin with, the local churches are not a cult..."

I searched "is the local church a cult" and found :
https://www.google.com/search?q=is+t...hrome&ie=UTF-8

[aron]

Originally Posted by Evangelical

I disagree that it is easy to find negative information....

But a few have been helped. See below.

Originally Posted by BlueOrchid

Hi!

I guess I have been a "lurker" for 2 years now.
December 2015 was when I first visited your site.
Went through a depression but I knew what I was reading was true.
I have not been active in the church for a few years, but still know a few people and have gone to a couple of meetings in the last couple of years.

I remember certain instances starting from when I was around 15, where I started realizing something wasn't right. But I was so scared to even type something into google. We were taught that it was "damaging" to look up anything online. We were strictly advised against it.
We were fear mongered into staying into the church life "no matter what."
I didn't like the whole not hearing the other people's side. And the control and disdain for those who wanted to know. It was like a toddler clamping their hands over their ears and saying "lalalalala" (or the church life version "oh Lord Jesus") So annoying and sooooo FAKE!!! drove me nutso. haha.

[kumbaya]

Originally Posted by Evangelical

I disagree that it is easy to find negative information. Even if I type in more specific terms such as Local Church Cult, I get hits to some websites such as "Why do some people accuse you of being a cult?" on localchurchesfaq.org. Clearly the articles which are positive and refute the negativity are in the top of the Google searches (so maybe their algorithms work afterall).
Your failure to realize this which you could have if you read the post below mine (to which I was replying to) shows you lack the ability to comprehend what you are reading and synthesize, which is typical of the younger generation.
. . . the younger generation lacks the patient to be able to trawl through a lot of data - they rarely read to the end of the page and end up twittering their friends instead for the solution. .

Evangelical, could your statements be more contradictory to your username? You're clearly trying to instigate people and your generalizations about the youth are just demeaning. I respect others opinions and even opposing ones on this page but you're just rude. While you're at it, next time you google search results on the local church, why don't you look up the definition of a troll.

Peace.

[Evangelical]

Your arguments essentially reduce to :

"cults don't reveal their "true" identity"
"The local churches don't reveal their true identity" (I have stated over and over, there is no true identity necessary to be revealed other than "Christian" - this was good enough for the early church).
"therefore the local churches are a cult"

This is refuted by the CRI's articles and others such as Gotquestions.org which temper any claims they are a cult.

As I have shown in my previous posts, few para- or inter church organizations accurately and precisely states their denominational affiliations and resources that they use. Yet the leadership are often from a one or a few denominations such as EVANGELICAL denominations ONLY (no Catholics, please).

This is really no different to the practice of the Christians on Campus so I think we can dispel with the idea of cult-like practice if we consider these facts about what the other groups are doing.

[kumbaya]

Originally Posted by Evangelical

This is refuted by the CRI's articles and others such as Gotquestions.org which temper any claims they are a cult.

You don’t want to bring up CRI’s credibility on this site. There’s a lot of discussion about the credibility of that organization. Actually, the DCP is currently trying to sue Harvest House bc they do include the local church in their recent book of cults. I’m assuming you didn’t know that.

Also, no- I did not say that because CoC don’t reveal their true identity- that it makes them a cult. Really? Absolutely not. There is a long list of reasons and that reason is almost in a category of “things cults do”, not “reasons it’s a cult.” And I disagree with your argument that few churches reveal their affiliations with their campus work! At least not at the college campus I live by! If you have a good reputation- it’s good advertising! If you don’t- it can scare people off. Normal churches have nothing to lose by including their name. Cults do.

[kumbaya]

Originally Posted by Evangelical

This is refuted by the CRI's articles and others such as Gotquestions.org which temper any claims they are a cult.

Aside from CRI not addressing the real issues in their article and LSM wining and dining Hank Hanegraff and that whole debacle...even got questions.org says because there are so many Christians that DO believe it’s a cult to “use the upmost caution and discernment when choosing to attend the local church.” If you can find a better source for credibility- please tell us! Also, it’s important to know the different between a Christian and non Christian cult. I don’t know about the LC being doctrinally a cult but it definitely uses all the cult practices- or most of them!

[clever sister]

Originally Posted by Evangelical

Your arguments essentially reduce to :
"cults don't reveal their "true" identity"
"The local churches don't reveal their true identity" (I have stated over and over, there is no true identity necessary to be revealed other than "Christian" - this was good enough for the early church).

Christian Fellowship

CF is the [local] branch of TSCF (Tertiary Students Christian Fellowship), which in turn is affiliated with IFES (International Fellowship of Evangelical Students) – connecting us with a national and international Christian community.

From the local university's website. They aren't hiding their link to Evangelicalism.