Titus Chu Conference at "Chicago Gospel Hall" (April 9-10, 2016)

[TLFisher]

Originally Posted by aron

In Witness Lee's case, he told us that people who didn't affiliate with others, or take another name, were useless "free groups" who did nothing to build the Body of Christ; he also said that those who did affiliate with others were divisive and sectarian. So the "recovered truth" of the LC was, essentially, that whatever WL did was right, and whatever anyone else did was wrong. Ultimately, this became the basis of LC identification and segregation: affiliation (and abject submission) to the ministry of WL. For example, if you see the "splash pages" of the group websites created in the 1990s under LSM oversight, the headers at the top say, "Lovers of Jesus affiliated with the ministries of Watchman Nee and Witness Lee."

Ultimately, this affiliation became the group's self-identification, and the basis of its segregation. The "present [LC] truth" was stated as, "Witness Lee: even when he's wrong, he's right." Anyone who didn't get this were "out" of the group, and those who grasped this ''present truth'' were "in".

Self-identification we've seen in the LSM/LC fellowship can also be regarded as "making distinctions among yourselves" (James 2:4). Of course the pattern and means to make distinctions is not much different than we see in political advertisements. Putting down your competition in order to make yourself appear a preferred alternative. No difference from what has been uttered by LSM leadership and local elders. It's gone unchecked and unhindered that it's become normal in local church Lord's Day meetings to put down Christians outside LSM fellowship in order to make themselves appear better. It becomes popular to put down Billy Graham, Greg Laurie, Rick Warren, etc.

The practice of segregation is essentially the local churches cutting themselves off from the rest of the Body of Christ. This is contrary to the apostle's teaching in 1 Corinthians 12:14-21.

[aron]

Originally Posted by Terry

Self-identification we've seen in the LSM/LC fellowship can also be regarded as "making distinctions among yourselves" (James 2:4). Of course the pattern and means to make distinctions is not much different than we see in political advertisements. Putting down your competition in order to make yourself appear a preferred alternative...

The practice of segregation is essentially the local churches cutting themselves off from the rest of the Body of Christ. This is contrary to the apostle's teaching in 1 Corinthians 12:14-21.

Nigel Tomes in his "Witness Lee sanitized" post talks about how Lee essentially put all other Christians under a curse. Denominations were children of the Whore of Babylon, and free & independent groups were "incestuous children of Lot". So if you weren't in the LC of Lee, you were at best on the fringes of God's will.

Lee's self-identification tactics brought in condemnation of all who weren't identified with (i.e. subject to) his ministry. I find this to be reprehensible coming from a supposedly Christian minister. It's the opposite of the Spirit of Christ: Christ died for all, and brought all the scattered people together in His name (John 11:52; cf 10:16). Why presume that all but you and your acolytes have missed the boat entirely? What kind of self-identification process creates this mind-set of self exaltation?

http://www.ministrybooks.org/books.c...=HDJCUEBH5ATBZ

Lee had hard words for Christianity, calling them "lawless" and "drugged", "improper" and "not approved". He'd have done well to look in the mirror, once or twice. It might have done him and his followers some good.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by aron

Nigel Tomes in his "Witness Lee sanitized" post talks about how Lee essentially put all other Christians under a curse. Denominations were children of the Whore of Babylon, and free & independent groups were "incestuous children of Lot". So if you weren't in the LC of Lee, you were at best on the fringes of God's will.

Lee's self-identification tactics brought in condemnation of all who weren't identified with (i.e. subject to) his ministry. I find this to be reprehensible coming from a supposedly Christian minister. It's the opposite of the Spirit of Christ: Christ died for all, and brought all the scattered people together in His name (John 11:52; cf 10:16). Why presume that all but you and your acolytes have missed the boat entirely? What kind of self-identification process creates this mind-set of self exaltation?

http://www.ministrybooks.org/books.c...=HDJCUEBH5ATBZ

Lee had hard words for Christianity, calling them "lawless" and "drugged", "improper" and "not approved". He'd have done well to look in the mirror, once or twice. It might have done him and his followers some good.

This is absolutely pathetic.

In the ears of his faithful followers, Lee basically twists the Lord's words in the Gospel of Matthew 18.20 into something like this, "For where two or three are gathered together in My name, they are Moabites and Ammonites, the incestuous kids of Lot."

If you think I am exaggerating, or made this up, then read what Lee said in that Life-Study link, and think about the implications.

[aron]

I remember RK telling us he'd never build bridges to Christianity. It was worldly, fallen, and corrupt. The church was supposed to be pure and spotless.

Okay; then if that's so, I've met with groups that had a much stronger collective expression. They didn't take names, didn't incorporate and register a name with the government, met in the homes absent a professional clergy, etc.

"Oh, we don't look at the condition of the church. God sees no iniquity in Israel."

Huh?

[HERn]

Originally Posted by aron

"Oh, we don't look at the condition of the church. God sees no iniquity in Israel."

Huh?

Which is why God never sent Israel into the wilderness or into exile, right?