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#1 | |
Member
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Renton, Washington
Posts: 3,562
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Is it to add to the local churches or is it bring people to the Lord? It's relatively easier to bring people to the Lord, but to the local churches there have been Northwest elders that have said:
I have heard the criticism of Billy Graham over the years. Why is he such a successful evangelist for generations? On one hand you can say he's not going beyond his measure. On the other hand he's not telling people where he thinks their home church should be. |
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#2 | |
Member
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 1,636
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What really gets me is given all the failures, it is still promoted as they only way. WL's projections and statistics still seem to get everyone excited and hyped up. It's like no one can stop for a minute and realize that the new way didn't and doesn't work like it's supposed to. |
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#3 | |
Member
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Renton, Washington
Posts: 3,562
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No new flow or new cart is going to be a resolution. |
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#4 | |
Member
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Renton, Washington
Posts: 3,562
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Freedom, maybe the brothers missed when Witness Lee changed his tune regarding the new way and the emphasis on numbers and rapid growth? |
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#5 | |
Member
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Greater Ohio
Posts: 13,693
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__________________
Ohio's motto is: With God all things are possible!. Keeping all my posts short, quick, living, and to the point! |
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#6 | |
Member
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 1,636
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Before the new way started, I think Lee was correct in identifying that there wasn't a good increase. His problem is that he didn't take into consideration the real reasons the LC was lacking in increase. Thus the new way was something developed in the absence of reason and meaningful feedback. The result was something that might have sounded good on paper, but didn't work as promised. I think the reason brothers still try to implement the new way is because they realize the increase is lacking. So they go read things that Lee said and get all excited about his projections. The reason they never see past Lee's projections is because the failures are blamed on LC members rather than flaws in Lee's teachings. Multiple times I have heard the old "if everyone brings one person to the Lord within the next year, the church will double in a year". It sounds reasonable, but in actuality it is simply not feasible. Even Christian groups with the best rates of increase don't double every year. I used to think that people were just waiting to be introduced to the LC, that it would be exactly what they needed. This is indeed the view that LC leaders push, that we have exactly what everyone else needs. Imagine how surprised I was when I first read the words of Sherman Robertson to Steve Isitt: "Not everyone belongs in the Lord's Recovery." That is a completely different view of what "the Recovery" really is. On the one hand you have LC leaders who talk about "conquering the whole earth", and on the other hand, you have those who talk about the LC being "narrow" and not for everyone. Well, you can't have it both ways. That's what it really comes down to. If the LC is really something for everyone, then there shouldn't be any exclusivity or sectarian attitudes. Those attitudes just prove there will never be any significant increase within the LC. |
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#7 | |
Member
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Renton, Washington
Posts: 3,562
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From what I've seen and in my experience it's community churches that are for everyone. |
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#8 | |
Member
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 1,636
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It wasn't that I didn't want to invite people to meetings. The issue was that no matter how hard I tried, however hard we all tried, efforts at gaining people were futile. The LC that I'm from has put a lot of effort into trying to implement things like what WL said about shepherding, "vital groups", etc. It would seem that if we were doing everything that Lee said, then we could get the expected results. Not so. I eventually got to the point where I realized the "new way" or "God ordained way" was a bunch of baloney. I accepted that it wasn't going to work. At the same time, I didn't intend to create any issue out of it, I would just go along with what they wanted. That was all fine until I noticed that leaders (both local and the BB's) liked to put blame on the saints for failure to get an increase and failure to implement things. I felt it wasn't fair and it was an attempt to ignore the larger problem at hand. When I consider that there is also this attitude of "the recovery" not being for everyone or it being "narrow", it leads me to the conclusion that LC leadership is particularly dishonest. On the one hand, they still have these grandiose ideas that are put forth about an increase, on the other hand, they know every well that it's not going to happen. |
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#9 | |
Member
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Renton, Washington
Posts: 3,562
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On the LC burden of shepherding, you need to focus on shepherding the ones already present. If the current members aren't being shepherded, the LC is at risk losing them to another fellowship as what happened with my family. |
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