immuno_oncology

[UntoHim]

Originally Posted by Immuno_oncology

I told my wife that I probably need to have a long fellowship with the Lord before joining any "churches," because even though I've only been in the LC for 9 months, I received an intense dose of it as a new and zealous young believer. I was so drawn to the ministry at first because they seemingly had a higher truth and teachings that no other churches had.

Welcome Immuno_oncology! Congrats, you are in the running for one of the longest UserNames on the Forum, not to mention one of the most interesting! Seriously though, your first post has to be one of the most thoughtful and insightful opening posts of any new member in recent memory. And as you have probably gathered by now, this place is in pretty desperate need of some new thoughtful and insightful posters. We all mean well, but some of us are kind of like the Tin Man in the Wizard of Oz – we need somebody to come along every once in a while and squirt some oil on us. (I could say something here about the brainless Scare Crow at this point as well, but I think I'll just go on and address the rest of your post)

I would like to list a few of them here and ask you all for advice on what to throw out.

1. Should I throw out the recovery version (with footnotes) of the OT and NT? What version of the bible did you use before the recovery version was introduced? What do you use now?

The actual RecVer translation is a fairly good one in my opinion. I have some 3 years of biblical Greek and have had some of my profs in the past review it and as far as they were concerned it was very similar to the NASB, which is almost universally accepted as a good translation. Of course I can't speak with strong confidence regarding the Old Testament translation, but in my comparison over the years, it seems to be mostly in alignment in some of the universally accepted translations. Now the footnotes...well that's another matter altogether. You've probably already noticed that most of the main teachings are encapsulated in many of the voluminous RecVer footenotes. Also, some of the more caustic overall religious worldviews of Witness Lee are stuffed within the pages and pages of footenotes, and the one that sticks out the most is probably the one found in Revelation: “Judaism is satanic, Catholicism is demonic and Protestantism is christless”. I'm not sure how much this audacious statement is still repeated in the LC anymore, but I highly suspect that most of the leadership and longtime members still hold to this kind of attitude towards Judaism, Catholicism and Protestantism.

For what it's worth, I use the ESV as my mainstay version, but I also use the online multi-versions such as Blue Letter Bible, Unbound https://unbound.biola.edu/), BibleGateway, Bible Hub, YouVersion (great phone app!) and many, many others.

2. I have to admit that I was so drawn to the footnotes/interpretations of the pictures in the Bible, such as Adam and Eve (Adam being Christ and Eve being the church), Noah's ark being the Body of Christ so that all believers are saved, being perfected and becoming overcomers in the millennial kingdom while non-perfected Christians will be in outer darkness, etcetc. Do you all still see the truth in this?

Yes, I see truth in these things, however you must realize that these teachings were picked up by Watchman Nee, and later Witness Lee, from a number of Christian teachers before them, most being of the Brethren persuasion. Some of these have been picked up by a fair majority of current evangelical/orthodox teachers as well, but some, such as the “overcomers in the millennial kingdom” teaching have been strongly rejected by the same. We have gotten into some of this on the Forum, but I look forward to getting into these matters in the near future. You are welcome to join in!

3. The concept of "God's eternal economy is for the building of his dwelling place which will consummate in the New Jerusalem" has been wrought into my soul. For the past few months, all I think about everyday is Christ and His Body and nothing else. Are you still under the rulership of this particular heavenly vision of God's economy?

Wow, it got wrought into your soul after only 9 months! The current elders in your LC must be really going double-time these days. Just razzin you io! Actually, for me, back in the mid-1970s (I know, I know, practically the dark ages for you) it was more “The Vision of The Church” that got wrought into my soul, but in reality “God's eternal economy” and “the Vision of The Church” are really so closely tied together in Witness Lee's teachings that they are virtually the same thing. Interesting term you use: “under the rulership of this particular heavenly vision” - It's very similar to the phraseology we used back in the day, and I'm wondering if they are using this exact term, or is it maybe your interpretation of what you have been hearing? No big deal ether way, I'm just a little curious if they are using the term “rulership” these days.

4. Tripartite man - I was taught that understanding the spirit is the key to everything. Do you guys still "turn to your spirits" and reject the self in order to express Christ, Christ and Christ only? As an example, I was frequently taught that human improvements don't matter because only Christ fulfills the highest standard of morality, so all we need to do is "call on the name of the Lord and turn to our spirits!" I was also told that before we were saved, the soul is our person and the spirit is an organ. But after we're saved, the spirit is our person and the soul is our organ, for the purpose of expressing the spirit (Christ).

Some others here on the Forum (most notably OBW & Igzy) have addressed this issue much better than I can. I now tend to understand the human spirit in the same way that most orthodox/evangelical teachers have over the course of Church history – to wit – the human soul and human spirit are so intrinsically linked as to be virtually and practically indistinguishable one from the other. That being said, I have no problem with the Nee-Lee teachings about the human spirit, other than the fact that I don't believe that it is actually possible to “exercise your spirit”, at least not in the mechanical sense that they seem to imply in their teachings. Of course Christ fulfills the highest standard of morality (for He is the holy, righteous, moral Son of God in the flesh), but I don't see anywhere in the Word of God where we can obtain this holiness, righteousness or morality by verbally calling “oh Lord Jesus” or by “turning to our spirits”.

5. How do you guys pray after leaving the LC? Do you pray to the Lord Jesus or the Father in Heaven? Do you amen after every phrase when someone else is praying?

I've heard it said that “The Bible is God talking to us and prayer is us talking to God”. (and for all the truth that is in this statement, it seems to me that there is really something to “pray-reading” after all!) I don't practice pray-reading anymore, at least not in the same way as in the Local Church. I do mix reading with praying though. I think the way pray-reading is practiced in the Local Church is best done alone, or maybe with one other person (your wife, husband or close family member). The “amen” after every verse read or prayer is just plain annoying and distracting. I don't know what else to say about it!