The LCS Factor

[Peter Debelak]

Originally Posted by Nell

Roger's answer was an unqualified "yes". I still say "no" because, Roger, you didn't say how they remain and still follow the program. Peter has come up with the only possibility I can think of.



Peter,

You changed the parameters of the program!

If I read you correctly, you all were having a good time until the FTTA shepherds came along. Then you "lost a taste for meeting 'formally'" and "continued to care for one another in non-meeting settings...". So you changed the standard operating procedure.

When the FTTA shepherds came in and began replacing the leading of the Holy Spirit, you turned from this idol and began to fly under the radar. Is that accurate?

I'll rephrase: How can you remain in the LC without worshipping the idol unless you change the SOP? I'll concede that this may be possible.

Nell

Nell:

Yes, we did change the parameters. But we didn't leave (at least not then, and there are many who still haven't). We found a way to seek Christ first, even while fully connected and in the LC, even if not governed by LC norms and system.

And I am hestitant to say that when the full-timers or others came in to shepherd, they replaced the Holy Spirit. Their motives were undoubtedly out of love and nurturing. But there was something so subtlely present that I felt took away the freshness and purity of just seeking Christ in His word.

In fact, at the time, I was upset. Bitter. I made a lot of the strong claims about idolatry. In the subsequent years, As I met less and less in any formal way, I made many pronouncements (to myself and others) concerning what I saw as a subtle usurpation of individual accountability to the Lord and a subtle demotion of Christ alone.

Believe me, I am not denying these things. I have just come full cycle in some respects. I believe there are some, perhaps many, when are "in" the system, but don't operate based on it. They are exposed to Witness Lee, appreciate Witness Lee, but do not rely on Witness Lee instead of God. I do believe these were "the rest" who did not worship Baal, despite being in a group of folks who did.

I can't say that I had a lot of the experience that Jane describes in her recollection of her idolatry, at least not at the time I was in the LC. From the time I returned to the Lord, I was vigalent not to hand over my accountability to others, vigalent to follow my conscience (even though I often faultered) and vigalent ot study the Word itself.

However, after I stopped meeting, there was a lot of fear, such as Jane describes:

"I was terribly afraid that I would offend God if I left the LC. I was controlled by my loyalty to the vision of the LC and WL’s ministry—a false belief controlled my behavior and bound me there (evidence of idolatry). If I had been serving the Lord alone, His love would have cast out fear and I would have had the freedom to stay or go as I chose."

I guess I was not afraid to leave - since I didn't go back and forth about leaving - but I was fearful once I already left. I did not see the truth of deputy authority in the Word. I was clear about that. But I also had the ingrained thought in my head that sometimes there are some things you submit to whether you understand them or not. I feared that I had violated God's government. But the thing was, the Lord never made it clear to me that I had. I could not see it in the Word and He did not convict me of this. Eventually, I had to rebuke Satan for his lies. If I had apparently done something so aggregious - had asked and plead with the Lord to reveal it to me in His word and in my heart - and I still couldn't see it - then my fears were unhealthy and lies.

Well, I've carried on again. I have to learn to be more cogent. SC, and tips on concise writing?

Peter

[SpeakersCorner]

Originally Posted by Peter Debelak

Well, I've carried on again. I have to learn to be more cogent. SC, and tips on concise writing?

Peter,

Here's how I do it. I write till I'm done then go back and cut out all the stupid stuff, all the offensive stuff, and all the dumb illustrations and ponderous metaphors. That cuts out about 80%.

This post, to illustrate, was originally 5,000 words in length.


SC

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by SpeakersCorner

Peter,

Here's how I do it. I write till I'm done then go back and cut out all the stupid stuff, all the offensive stuff, and all the dumb illustrations and ponderous metaphors. That cuts out about 80%.

This post, to illustrate, was originally 5,000 words in length.


SC

Now here's a man after my own heart ... short, quick, and to the point! ... the way postin's s'posed to be.