Leaders of the Lord's Recovery

alwayslearning · 09-23-2013, 11:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Terry

"I would just add this: In 1988 certain co-workers
severely criticized Brother Lee, and then they separated themselves, they went their own way. One of these brothers, in particular, his whole situation is tragic. I would like to ask him (Bill Mallon), after you wrote that letter to Brother Lee, and after you began to speak a certain way, what is your spiritual situation? How would you compare it with your situation when you were in Elden Hall? "

More deceptive words courtesy of an LSM employee!

Bill Mallon did not separate himself - he was kicked to the curb. And who said his situation was tragic? He had the same personal challenges while inside and outside the LC system (like everyone else does). But for Kangas to ask him to compare his spiritual situation post LC system with Elden Hall is really beyond the pale in terms of deceit! How about asking a more honest and relevant question: "What is your spiritual situation? How would you compare it with your situation from 1988-1990 in the LC?"

TLFisher · 09-23-2013, 12:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by alwayslearning

More deceptive words courtesy of an LSM employee!

Bill Mallon did not separate himself - he was kicked to the curb. And who said his situation was tragic? He had the same personal challenges while inside and outside the LC system (like everyone else does). But for Kangas to ask him to compare his spiritual situation post LC system with Elden Hall is really beyond the pale in terms of deceit! How about asking a more honest and relevant question: "What is your spiritual situation? How would you compare it with your situation from 1988-1990 in the LC?"

Agreed. What if Ron was just as challenged as Dan Towle, Francis Ball, etc were during this period of 1988-1990? I think where Ron was trying to lead the listener is the brothers who supposedly separated themselves became "bankrupt and unsanctified" because in his mind "the ministry" is the pinnacle of anyone's Christian experience. What you receive through "the ministry" cannot be found anywhere else and you will suffer spiritual loss to meet anywhere else.

alwayslearning · 09-24-2013, 09:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Terry

...I think where Ron was trying to lead the listener is the brothers who supposedly separated themselves became "bankrupt and unsanctified" because in his mind "the ministry" is the pinnacle of anyone's Christian experience. What you receive through "the ministry" cannot be found anywhere else and you will suffer spiritual loss to meet anywhere else.

This is classic Witness Lee and his BB tape recorders. What else can they teach to justify their arrogance and pride and to trap people in their system? Of course only in their church could anyone be sanctified, etc.

But as Bill Mallon indicated he never wanted to leave the LC system. He naively thought he could fellowship his very legit concerns and Witness Lee would take him seriously. After all they had worked together for 25+ years. Instead, true to form, Lee threw him under the bus.

And this is also a constructive example of how Witness Lee controlled the churches contrary to his false statements that he never did. Why would Bill Mallon fellowshipping with Witness Lee about some issues in "the work" cause The Church in Miami to kick him to the curb? What does his relationship with Witness Lee, his son Philip and their publishing company have to do with his relationship with the church locally?

Indiana · 09-24-2013, 11:28 PM

One of the signs of lawlessness with LSM and the LC saints is their strong propensity to speak things they know little about. The “Fermentation” book comes out; people receive the “official” teaching about “rebellious ones” and get frequent-enough reminders from the “pulpit” about “those rebellious ones” and for the last 20 years word just keeps going out, unchecked, from so many mouths. Such lawless speaking is epidemic in the local Churches, and it’s called bearing false witness.

I was at a brother’s home recently (2010) for his 50th birthday and two long-time LC brothers came in, fresh from Ron Kangas’ meetings on the cross from the previous weekend. It is interesting that these two brothers, an elder at that time, now retired, were on the “scene” with me through home meeting involvement when I was cut loose from that home meeting and went into discipline mode in the church. Now after ten years of initiating no contact with me, they appear in a home with me, the same two brothers who “saw me leave”, and within minutes I am charged with being bitter and being proud and that my opinion needs to be dealt with, that I need to get rid of my “slanderous websites”; and references were made to “those rebellious ones”. Goodness, these brothers, loving as they were, they just hear the things and then pass them on. This is how it goes, from one person to another for ten years concerning my case, no one knowing what they are talking about. At least one of the brothers at the party, after I was able to share with him a bit, sat back and stopped his mouth from any more flurry of charges against me, and said, “I don’t know; I just don’t know.” The other brother, the former elder, also was more subdued and both admitted after our hour-long talk and much positive fellowship, that I certainly was not bitter. I was even invited by them to meet in a nearby Local Church outside Bellevue. I have had several encounters similar to this with well-intentioned brothers, who lacked knowledge and understanding.

These brothers had encouraged me to listen to Ron’s tapes and I did over the next couple of days. I heard his strong word on the need for everyone to take the cross to their self and have their mouths stopped, except for him: He had spoken lawlessly in Ecuador, announcing that “Steve Isitt is one of the most evil speakers on the internet. He is a man of death.” He has not retracted this false and defamatory statement. Sherman Robertson, Bellevue elder, passes on to others that I have “slanderous websites”, among other things. Both of these men need to have their mouths stopped. They are quite foolish and in great error to talk about me in this way and never back up what they say with sound documentation to show that I am an “evil speaker, a slanderous speaker, and a lawless speaker on the internet.

By contrast, I have gone through three books by prominent Local Church leaders point by point to show their own evil, slander, and lawless speaking in their reckless abandon to an agenda and movement away from the truth.

I hope that Ron, as the chief editor at LSM, will seriously consider these three evil, slanderous, and lawless books at LSM and tend to their destruction.

Found in www.HidingHistoryintheLordsRecovery.us under Books.

Cal · 09-25-2013, 06:30 AM

LSM's doctrine of "taking the cross" is unscriptural. The Bible teaches us to be obedient to God's commandments and to live according to the Holy Spirit. It doesn't emphasize "taking the cross" in the way LSM means it. In one place Jesus did tell us to "take up our cross and follow him." But this was his telling us that true obedience would sometimes lead us to discomfort and even pain and death.

LSM's version of "taking the cross" is simply one more tool they use to keep people's mouths shut and maintain order. The fact is true obedience and walking in the Spirit sometimes demand that we speak and not be silent. But in LSM's twisted, tightly-spinning world, "taking the cross" always means shutting up.

Jesus was silent going to the cross because the time had come for him to suffer for redemption. At that point there was nothing for him to say, the cup had being given to him, and the Jews and Romans couldn't do anything for him, and wouldn't listen anyway. But before that, Jesus often rebuked the halls of power with fervor, as did many prophets before him, as Steve is doing now.

Kangas is trying to shut people up with his "taking the cross" teaching. One might think he would apply the teaching to himself and shut himself up occasionally. But, alas, apparently he and his cohorts get to speak out when they see what they consider "unrighteousness" or "death," but no one else does. Neat trick.

These guys have gotten so far out in the weeds it has become silly.

awareness · 09-25-2013, 11:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Igzy

LSM's doctrine of "taking the cross" is unscriptural. ...

"All in all you're just another brick in the wall."

aron · 09-25-2013, 02:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by awareness

"All in all you're just another brick in the wall."

I was going to correct you and say, "No; we are living stones", but then I remembered WL saying that we all had to be "absolutely identical, with no differences whatsoever", and so I decided that maybe your comment is pretty accurate.

TLFisher · 09-25-2013, 08:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Indiana

These brothers had encouraged me to listen to Ron’s tapes and I did over the next couple of days. I heard his strong word on the need for everyone to take the cross to their self and have their mouths stopped, except for him: He had spoken lawlessly in Ecuador, announcing that “Steve Isitt is one of the most evil speakers on the internet. He is a man of death.” He has not retracted this false and defamatory statement.

Why is it brother Ron was so free to announce Steve Isitt as a man of death at an International conference in Ecuador, but every year when Ron comes to Seattle/Bellevue, not a word is spoken regarding Steve Isitt?

Indiana · 09-25-2013, 11:56 PM

Ron Kangas in Ecuador

"Well, we don’t have to go in the direction of chaos. We can move in the direction of economy. Regarding discernment, now that we have the internet as everybody knows, emails go out day and night. And, usually the negative persons and the evil persons are more active than the positive ones. One of the most evil of these persons, his name is Steve Isitt. He is a man of death. And, he is very active in a negative way. And there are many others".

Ron Kangas regarding brother Dong "control", and now the "chaos" created by independent workers and on-line posters

"...What is going to be the future in this part of S. America. Will we go from control to chaos? Or from control to normality?" R. K.

What is Normality, Ron? Has LSM ever behaved in a normal way?

PROOF OF DIVISION?
http://www.leadersofthelordsrecovery...ofDivision.pdf

Steve Isitt speaking: "Leaders who remained in the recovery thought the leaders who “left the recovery” caused division by forsaking the proper ground of meeting and establishing their own meetings apart from the fellowship of the local churches. (FPR, p. 72-73)

"The former leading ones, however, thought that the Scriptural ground of meeting had been usurped and replaced by Witness Lee, his ministry, and his ministry office, and that since this was the case, the local churches were no longer on the proper ground of oneness and were responsible for causing division themselves.

09-24-2013, 11:28 PM	#4
Indiana Member Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 718	Re: An Epidemic of Lawless speaking One of the signs of lawlessness with LSM and the LC saints is their strong propensity to speak things they know little about. The “Fermentation” book comes out; people receive the “official” teaching about “rebellious ones” and get frequent-enough reminders from the “pulpit” about “those rebellious ones” and for the last 20 years word just keeps going out, unchecked, from so many mouths. Such lawless speaking is epidemic in the local Churches, and it’s called bearing false witness. I was at a brother’s home recently (2010) for his 50th birthday and two long-time LC brothers came in, fresh from Ron Kangas’ meetings on the cross from the previous weekend. It is interesting that these two brothers, an elder at that time, now retired, were on the “scene” with me through home meeting involvement when I was cut loose from that home meeting and went into discipline mode in the church. Now after ten years of initiating no contact with me, they appear in a home with me, the same two brothers who “saw me leave”, and within minutes I am charged with being bitter and being proud and that my opinion needs to be dealt with, that I need to get rid of my “slanderous websites”; and references were made to “those rebellious ones”. Goodness, these brothers, loving as they were, they just hear the things and then pass them on. This is how it goes, from one person to another for ten years concerning my case, no one knowing what they are talking about. At least one of the brothers at the party, after I was able to share with him a bit, sat back and stopped his mouth from any more flurry of charges against me, and said, “I don’t know; I just don’t know.” The other brother, the former elder, also was more subdued and both admitted after our hour-long talk and much positive fellowship, that I certainly was not bitter. I was even invited by them to meet in a nearby Local Church outside Bellevue. I have had several encounters similar to this with well-intentioned brothers, who lacked knowledge and understanding. These brothers had encouraged me to listen to Ron’s tapes and I did over the next couple of days. I heard his strong word on the need for everyone to take the cross to their self and have their mouths stopped, except for him: He had spoken lawlessly in Ecuador, announcing that “Steve Isitt is one of the most evil speakers on the internet. He is a man of death.” He has not retracted this false and defamatory statement. Sherman Robertson, Bellevue elder, passes on to others that I have “slanderous websites”, among other things. Both of these men need to have their mouths stopped. They are quite foolish and in great error to talk about me in this way and never back up what they say with sound documentation to show that I am an “evil speaker, a slanderous speaker, and a lawless speaker on the internet. By contrast, I have gone through three books by prominent Local Church leaders point by point to show their own evil, slander, and lawless speaking in their reckless abandon to an agenda and movement away from the truth. I hope that Ron, as the chief editor at LSM, will seriously consider these three evil, slanderous, and lawless books at LSM and tend to their destruction. Found in www.HidingHistoryintheLordsRecovery.us under Books.

09-25-2013, 06:30 AM	#5
Cal Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: USA Posts: 4,333	Re: An Epidemic of Lawless speaking LSM's doctrine of "taking the cross" is unscriptural. The Bible teaches us to be obedient to God's commandments and to live according to the Holy Spirit. It doesn't emphasize "taking the cross" in the way LSM means it. In one place Jesus did tell us to "take up our cross and follow him." But this was his telling us that true obedience would sometimes lead us to discomfort and even pain and death. LSM's version of "taking the cross" is simply one more tool they use to keep people's mouths shut and maintain order. The fact is true obedience and walking in the Spirit sometimes demand that we speak and not be silent. But in LSM's twisted, tightly-spinning world, "taking the cross" always means shutting up. Jesus was silent going to the cross because the time had come for him to suffer for redemption. At that point there was nothing for him to say, the cup had being given to him, and the Jews and Romans couldn't do anything for him, and wouldn't listen anyway. But before that, Jesus often rebuked the halls of power with fervor, as did many prophets before him, as Steve is doing now. Kangas is trying to shut people up with his "taking the cross" teaching. One might think he would apply the teaching to himself and shut himself up occasionally. But, alas, apparently he and his cohorts get to speak out when they see what they consider "unrighteousness" or "death," but no one else does. Neat trick. These guys have gotten so far out in the weeds it has become silly.

09-25-2013, 11:56 PM	#9
Indiana Member Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 718	Re: What is Normality, Ron? Ron Kangas in Ecuador "Well, we don’t have to go in the direction of chaos. We can move in the direction of economy. Regarding discernment, now that we have the internet as everybody knows, emails go out day and night. And, usually the negative persons and the evil persons are more active than the positive ones. One of the most evil of these persons, his name is Steve Isitt. He is a man of death. And, he is very active in a negative way. And there are many others". Ron Kangas regarding brother Dong "control", and now the "chaos" created by independent workers and on-line posters "...What is going to be the future in this part of S. America. Will we go from control to chaos? Or from control to normality?" R. K. What is Normality, Ron? Has LSM ever behaved in a normal way? PROOF OF DIVISION? http://www.leadersofthelordsrecovery...ofDivision.pdf Steve Isitt speaking: "Leaders who remained in the recovery thought the leaders who “left the recovery” caused division by forsaking the proper ground of meeting and establishing their own meetings apart from the fellowship of the local churches. (FPR, p. 72-73) "The former leading ones, however, thought that the Scriptural ground of meeting had been usurped and replaced by Witness Lee, his ministry, and his ministry office, and that since this was the case, the local churches were no longer on the proper ground of oneness and were responsible for causing division themselves.