The book of James and the LRC

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by ZNPaaneah

James 2:1 My brethren, have not the faith of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Lord of glory, with respect of persons.

In my experience the relationship of WL with WN was key. Whenever I or any other new one wondered who WL was they were told of WN and how WL was his closest coworker. In my opinion the respect of WN was one of the pillars that the entire LRC rested on.

James here addresses serious errors in practice which violate the perfect law of freedom, (1.25) and which should have governed our sights regarding LC ministers. Our faith in the Lord Jesus Christ, the Lord of glory, should never be governed by personal favoritism towards any man. The credentials and reputation of any minister should never elevate him above scrutiny by the church. The Lord's throne is founded on righteousness, and no minister should ever sideswipe the demands of righteousness and holiness in his quest to enjoy the glories reserved solely for our Lord Christ.

[ZNPaaneah]

Originally Posted by Ohio

James here addresses serious errors in practice which violate the perfect law of freedom, (1.25) and which should have governed our sights regarding LC ministers. Our faith in the Lord Jesus Christ, the Lord of glory, should never be governed by personal favoritism towards any man. The credentials and reputation of any minister should never elevate him above scrutiny by the church. The Lord's throne is founded on righteousness, and no minister should ever sideswipe the demands of righteousness and holiness in his quest to enjoy the glories reserved solely for our Lord Christ.

Easier said than done. Did WN add some kind of "Good Housekeeping seal of approval" to the LRC in your mind?

Consider Bernie Madoff. He was once the head of the Nasdaq! That adds credibility, people feel a guy like that is already established financially and is not going to threaten his reputation with shady deals. No doubt it was the "respect of persons" that helped him build his business and rob people.

It is a proven fact that crooks in uniforms have an easier time in deceiving people. People tend to trust the uniform and ignore common sense.

The basic principle is you are tempted by your lust. If your lusts are put to death then you will not be tempted. I was fortunate for a couple of reasons. First, I didn't want to be in the church, as a result I spent a year trying to find fault to justify refusing this call. As a result I could care less about the leaders, I felt if the church was real you would see it in the smallest members. Second, after one year I had come to respect the faith of the brother that persevered, yet he was lowly and despised in the church. Likewise one of the brothers that shepherded me was of no account in the church. This caused me to view the dynamic of the entire caste system in the LRC differently. Finally, the brother that brought me in and with whom I lived for a few months was an evangelist in every sense of the word. You could not spend an hour with him without preaching the gospel and visiting gospel contacts. This kept me out of the snare of "being a hearer only and not a doer deceiving yourself".

They tried to convince me that WL's ministry was "deeper and richer" than WN's (WN is high school, WL is college). But I have plenty of self confidence in that regards so I didn't care if WN was high school since I felt I was getting more out of it. So buying books in the bookroom was also part of the caste system that I didn't buy into, fortunately.

Also I had no interest in becoming an expert in WL's ministry like EM wanted. I had wanted to be able to read the Bible and saw WN's ministry as my opportunity to figure out how to read the Bible. So a lot of the lusts that ensnared others didn't trap me.

Still, during that year in which I was trying to find an excuse not to come into the LRC, if I knew what I know now about WN that would have been sufficient for me to reject them.

[TLFisher]

Originally Posted by ZNPaaneah

Easier said than done. Did WN add some kind of "Good Housekeeping seal of approval" to the LRC in your mind?

No. Actually I sensed the opposite from reading WN's ministry. Whether you're meeting in a LRC assembly, or a non-LRC assembly this is a trap anyone can fall into if we as believers are not consccious of the trap of having an attitude of personal favoritism. As a result this favoritism can turn into the division Paul writes of in 1 Corinthians.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by ZNPaaneah

Easier said than done. Did WN add some kind of "Good Housekeeping seal of approval" to the LRC in your mind?

Consider Bernie Madoff. He was once the head of the Nasdaq! That adds credibility, people feel a guy like that is already established financially and is not going to threaten his reputation with shady deals. No doubt it was the "respect of persons" that helped him build his business and rob people.

James addresses "the faith of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Lord of glory" as the defining standard of God, His own "Good Housekeeping seal of approval." As soon as brothers begin elevating men over other men, playing favorites among members or leaders in the church, they have left the faith. James warns us that these same ones will one day hurt us. Did not WL, who was proclaimed to be the "richest" of them all, "oppress us and drag us into the courts?" (v 2.6)

James had witnessed failures of all sorts. He is warning us to keep the faith of the Lord Jesus, and not use other criteria whereby we honor or respect men. Even God Himself has no respect of persons. Compared to Him, we are all poor and needy, deserving nothing. We should never overly extol those in the church who appear richer, wiser, or more gifted than we because they are nothing compared to the Lord of glory.

Here the thought of James closely parallels Paul's in I Corinthians 1-3.

[TLFisher]

Originally Posted by Ohio

James here addresses serious errors in practice which violate the perfect law of freedom, (1.25) and which should have governed our sights regarding LC ministers. Our faith in the Lord Jesus Christ, the Lord of glory, should never be governed by personal favoritism towards any man. The credentials and reputation of any minister should never elevate him above scrutiny by the church. The Lord's throne is founded on righteousness, and no minister should ever sideswipe the demands of righteousness and holiness in his quest to enjoy the glories reserved solely for our Lord Christ.

What ZNP refers to in post #14 of this thread happened. A brother was disfellowshipped. Among LSM churches blended brothers (whether they agree or disagree) are respected to the extent their reputations are above scrutiny. So when a brother is banned in Bellevue or when a couple is banned in Vista, it's not so much what they did, but more out of respect by the leading elders for the blended brother who had a word of "fellowship" to tell. In these instances as Ohio posted, "The credentials and reputation of any minister should never elevate him above scrutiny by the church."

[ZNPaaneah]

Originally Posted by Terry

What ZNP refers to in post #14 of this thread happened.

Here is another thing that happened:


James
2:5 Hearken, my beloved brethren, Hath not God chosen the poor of this world rich in faith, and heirs of the kingdom which he hath promised to them that love him?
2:6 But ye have despised the poor. Do not rich men oppress you, and draw you before the judgment seats?

The discussion of being partial to the rich and having them sit in better seats is an analogy, he begins that discussion in verse 2 saying "for", he is explaining, and then verse 5 sums it up that he is talking about faith.

The phrase "the poor of the world" could refer to lacking anything, not merely money. You could walk into the LRC meeting hall lacking "spiritual credentials". In the LRC it makes a big difference if you are "2nd generation" or 3rd generation, etc. This was referred to all the time. They even taught that you are sanctified by your parents being in the LRC, so then if you are 2nd generation you are more sanctified than if you were saved into the LRC and if you are 3rd generation then you were even more sanctified.

Where did this teaching come from? Didn't WL promote this thinking because his close association with WN made him "more sanctified"? Yet in this chapter which describes him more, the one who is "poor of the world yet rich in faith" or the "rich man that oppresses you and draws you before judgment seats"?

In my opinion this was a major flaw in the LRC. They had respect of persons. RG was ga ga over WL, so much so that he was willfully blind to all that PL was even though he would have beat that person down if he wasn't WL's son.

When I was in Houston I knew two men in the church that were "the poor of the world who were rich in faith" that were also despised in the LRC. This is my testimony and the very thing that James warned us of.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by ZNPaaneah

James 2.4 "Have you not made distinctions among yourselves and become judges with evil reasonings?"

The "New Way" promoted by WL and LSM was one of the bleakest periods in our history. All the leaders were "sized up" based on how zealous they were for the ministry. Distinctions were made among the brothers concerning who were absolute for the ministry and who were "lukewarm" towards all the new changes coming down the pike. I heard numerous stories about brothers who just loved the ministry being judged by those who were absolute for the ministry.

All these distinctions between the brothers, and the evil reasonings which precipitated numerous conflicts, came directly from LSM headquarters. LSM operatives used ministry zealots, longing for advancement within the program, to undermine many local elderships. Many of these ambitious ones became judges with evil reasonings, looking with suspicion at the brothers they one served with and considered them as enemies of the gospel and God's "move" on earth.

LSM did little to minimize these disturbances; rather they seized upon opportunities to fuel the conflicts and drive wedges between the saints, especially in those regions like the GLA where their influence was limited. Oftentimes, all manner of evil was justified for the greater good, defined narrowly as "WL's burden."

[ZNPaaneah]

Originally Posted by Ohio

The "New Way" promoted by WL and LSM was one of the bleakest periods in our history. All the leaders were "sized up" based on how zealous they were for the ministry. Distinctions were made among the brothers concerning who were absolute for the ministry and who were "lukewarm" towards all the new changes coming down the pike. I heard numerous stories about brothers who just loved the ministry being judged by those who were absolute for the ministry.

All these distinctions between the brothers, and the evil reasonings which precipitated numerous conflicts, came directly from LSM headquarters. LSM operatives used ministry zealots, longing for advancement within the program, to undermine many local elderships. Many of these ambitious ones became judges with evil reasonings, looking with suspicion at the brothers they one served with and considered them as enemies of the gospel and God's "move" on earth.

LSM did little to minimize these disturbances; rather they seized upon opportunities to fuel the conflicts and drive wedges between the saints, especially in those regions like the GLA where their influence was limited. Oftentimes, all manner of evil was justified for the greater good, defined narrowly as "WL's burden."

"Evil reasonings", "numerous conflicts", "Many of these ambitious ones became judges", etc.

I would like to quote Steve's testimony as an example:

I acknowledge that these references are on record now concerning me and that the charges and implications are most serious. You, brother Sherman Robertson, elder, have written these words May 3rd and 4th, 2004 in two letters. In addition, in a phone conversation with you on April 11, 2004, you claimed not only that I was “divisive” but also that “we brothers feel you are the embodiment of the Accuser of the brethren”.

[TLFisher]

Originally Posted by Ohio

The "New Way" promoted by WL and LSM was one of the bleakest periods in our history. All the leaders were "sized up" based on how zealous they were for the ministry. Distinctions were made among the brothers concerning who were absolute for the ministry and who were "lukewarm" towards all the new changes coming down the pike. I heard numerous stories about brothers who just loved the ministry being judged by those who were absolute for the ministry.

All these distinctions between the brothers, and the evil reasonings which precipitated numerous conflicts, came directly from LSM headquarters. LSM operatives used ministry zealots, longing for advancement within the program, to undermine many local elderships. Many of these ambitious ones became judges with evil reasonings, looking with suspicion at the brothers they one served with and considered them as enemies of the gospel and God's "move" on earth.

LSM did little to minimize these disturbances; rather they seized upon opportunities to fuel the conflicts and drive wedges between the saints, especially in those regions like the GLA where their influence was limited. Oftentimes, all manner of evil was justified for the greater good, defined narrowly as "WL's burden."

Ohio, your post reminds me of a passage I read tonight in Proverbs chapter 6.

There are six things which the Lord hates, Yes, seven which are an abomination to Him: Haughty eyes, a lying tongue, And hands that shed innocent blood, A heart that devises wicked plans, Feet that run rapidly to evil, A false witness who utters lies, And one who spreads strife among brothers.

These verses are equally appropriate to what happened in the New Way and what happened in the GLA within the last decade. In each turmoil there are those who spread the strife and there are those who react to the strife. In each instance LSM had brothers quarantined for reacting to strife.

[ZNPaaneah]

Originally Posted by Terry

Ohio, your post reminds me of a passage I read tonight in Proverbs chapter 6.

There are six things which the Lord hates, Yes, seven which are an abomination to Him: Haughty eyes, a lying tongue, And hands that shed innocent blood, A heart that devises wicked plans, Feet that run rapidly to evil, A false witness who utters lies, And one who spreads strife among brothers.

These verses are equally appropriate to what happened in the New Way and what happened in the GLA within the last decade. In each turmoil there are those who spread the strife and there are those who react to the strife. In each instance LSM had brothers quarantined for reacting to strife.

James 2:13 For he shall have judgment without mercy, that hath shewed no mercy; and mercy rejoiceth against judgment.

I think this last expression is very interesting "mercy rejoiceth against judgment"

The way to react to seeing the merciless judgments and abuse in the LRC or anywhere is with mercy. This mercy causes rejoicing and it conquers the merciless judgments that are spewn about.

[aron]

Originally Posted by ZNPaaneah

The way to react to seeing the merciless judgments and abuse in the LRC or anywhere is with mercy.

If you ever go on a farmer's property, likely the "house dog" comes out in an antagonistic posture, attempting to warn his owner with loud barks, and signalling you to stay away via raised hackles, bared teeth, growling, and an "attack posture". I always found that the most successful strategy was to show no fear, but to continually say, "Nice doggie", etc.

The dog was saying, in effect, "You are alien; you are enemy, and I will not receive you", and I was signalling, "You are friend, you are nice doggie, and even if you growl I will receive you." In almost every case, mercy would triumph using this strategy. Peace would conquer antagonism.

The word "dominion" is much underappreciated, I think. When we see "Have dominion over the earth and subdue it", we think of bulldozers and strip mines and parking lots. But when you go back to the "Alpha male" posturing scenario with the farmer's dog, maybe dominion is when you show unrelenting tranquility and love. You are saying, "In spite of everything you may try to do to me, I still have enough power to love you". This is, I believe, the power of Christ, and the foundation of His kingdom. In spite of the grief, and the wounds we caused Him to suffer, He still loved us so much that eventually we were subdued. The power of His peace overcame our strife. I love that Jerusalem can mean "foundation of peace".

[TLFisher]

Originally Posted by ZNPaaneah

Here is another thing that happened:


James
2:5 Hearken, my beloved brethren, Hath not God chosen the poor of this world rich in faith, and heirs of the kingdom which he hath promised to them that love him?
2:6 But ye have despised the poor. Do not rich men oppress you, and draw you before the judgment seats?

The discussion of being partial to the rich and having them sit in better seats is an analogy, he begins that discussion in verse 2 saying "for", he is explaining, and then verse 5 sums it up that he is talking about faith.

The phrase "the poor of the world" could refer to lacking anything, not merely money. You could walk into the LRC meeting hall lacking "spiritual credentials". In the LRC it makes a big difference if you are "2nd generation" or 3rd generation, etc. This was referred to all the time. They even taught that you are sanctified by your parents being in the LRC, so then if you are 2nd generation you are more sanctified than if you were saved into the LRC and if you are 3rd generation then you were even more sanctified.

Where did this teaching come from? Didn't WL promote this thinking because his close association with WN made him "more sanctified"? Yet in this chapter which describes him more, the one who is "poor of the world yet rich in faith" or the "rich man that oppresses you and draws you before judgment seats"?

In my opinion this was a major flaw in the LRC. They had respect of persons. RG was ga ga over WL, so much so that he was willfully blind to all that PL was even though he would have beat that person down if he wasn't WL's son.

When I was in Houston I knew two men in the church that were "the poor of the world who were rich in faith" that were also despised in the LRC. This is my testimony and the very thing that James warned us of.

Until you mentioned this concept of 2nd and 3rd LC generations being sanctified, I had never heard of it. Not in California and not in Washington. However touching on the respect of persons. I definitely saw it. While he was living it was WL and even before Lee died it was select FTTA trainers (later known as blended brothers). If you were a brother or sister one who was not "ga ga" with respect of persons, or immersing youself in ministry publications, you were generally referred to as "lukewarm", "cold", etc.