Spiritual Abuse Verses

Cal · 08-14-2008, 06:12 PM

"Among my people are wicked men who lie in wait like men who snare birds and like those who set traps to catch men. Like cages full of birds, their houses are full of deceit; they have become rich and powerful and have grown fat and sleek. Their evil deeds have no limit; they do not plead the case of the fatherless to win it, they do not defend the rights of the poor. Should I not punish them for this?” declares the Lord. “Should I not avenge myself on such a nation as this?"

[Jeremiah 5:26-29, NIV]

Ohio · 08-14-2008, 08:01 PM

Having just read a political commentary with the above title, a few comments were made that were quite fitting and appropriate for repeating here. I am going to take a few liberties to make this post more readable and hopefully purged of politics. It is my feeling that the comments apply to all in leadership roles. The quotes will be italicized and colored.

After mentioning a story of a politician with one of the hottest tempers around, the writer asks, "Should we care? I think we should. The most important measure of a human being is the way he or she treats other people, especially those under his or her power. By many accounts, Mr. X degrades and demeans them. And there's no excuse for it."

Interestingly, a sidebar to the article lists many "Notable bullies of our times," with nasty stories attached to each one.

The article continues with another politician, "We've all met people like Mr. Y; some of us have worked for folks like him. You don't want a boss who degrades, harangues and humiliates you. So why would you vote for one? Here you might reply that public officials are elected to, well, serve the public. So if their arrogant and domineering style gets staffers to work harder, it's good for all of us.

But let's leave aside the question of whether this style produces better results. Even if it did - and I have my doubts - it still would be wrong. Our lawmakers do more than simply make laws; they're supposed to represent us, in every sense of the word. By electing officials who demean their employees, we also demean ourselves."

Referring to another leader, he asks, "How much does personal virtue matter in public office? ... Presidents - more than anybody else - serve as symbols of us all; they embody our deepest beliefs, values and principles. We would never elect people who did physical harm to those under their charge. But we continue to elect verbal and emotional bullies, who can do just as much damage." -- JZ, professor NYU

Shouldn't we expect as much from LC leaders? Several times I have mentioned that the single most objectionable LC matter for me was the mistreatment of people, i.e. the program transformed beloved brothers into bullies. From the top down, far too many LC leaders have failed us in this regard ... and far too many loving shepherds have departed due to them.

finallyprettyokay · 08-14-2008, 08:17 PM

Quote:

Ohio wrote: Several times I have mentioned that the single most objectionable LC matter for me was the mistreatment of people, i.e. the program transformed beloved brothers into bullies. From the top down, far too many LC leaders have failed us in this regard ... and far too many loving shepherds have departed due to them.

Exactly!!! Couldn't have said it better. People got hurt there.

Nell · 08-17-2008, 06:17 PM

Matthew 23:.. But do not do what they do, for they do not practice what they preach. 4 They tie up heavy loads and put them on men's shoulders, but they themselves are not willing to lift a finger to move them.

Nell · 08-21-2019, 06:21 AM

Bringing this timely topic to the top.

Nell

OBW · 08-27-2019, 12:12 PM

Always a topic worthy of consideration.

But in an off-topic way, I note that some of the verses in Jeremiah seem to speak to some of our political/cultural issues of today as well.

JJ · 01-02-2020, 09:07 PM

2 Corinthians 11:20 (linked here in its context https://biblehub.com/bsb/2_corinthians/11.htm) is a great verse for anyone thinking it is better to “turn the other cheek” to an abusive church leader. It simply isn’t! Turn away! Don’t put up with it.

The apostle Paul is this verse is shaming the Corinthians regarding “many who boast in their flesh” saying “you gladly tolerate fools, since you are so wise. In fact, you even put up with anyone who enslaves you or exploits you or takes advantage of you or exalts himself or strikes you in the face.” And he compares himself and his coworkers who are meek and gentle among them as setting the right example from chapters 11-14 in a long discourse.

08-14-2008, 08:01 PM	#2
Ohio Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Greater Ohio Posts: 13,693	Bullies in High Places Having just read a political commentary with the above title, a few comments were made that were quite fitting and appropriate for repeating here. I am going to take a few liberties to make this post more readable and hopefully purged of politics. It is my feeling that the comments apply to all in leadership roles. The quotes will be italicized and colored. After mentioning a story of a politician with one of the hottest tempers around, the writer asks, "Should we care? I think we should. The most important measure of a human being is the way he or she treats other people, especially those under his or her power. By many accounts, Mr. X degrades and demeans them. And there's no excuse for it." Interestingly, a sidebar to the article lists many "Notable bullies of our times," with nasty stories attached to each one. The article continues with another politician, "We've all met people like Mr. Y; some of us have worked for folks like him. You don't want a boss who degrades, harangues and humiliates you. So why would you vote for one? Here you might reply that public officials are elected to, well, serve the public. So if their arrogant and domineering style gets staffers to work harder, it's good for all of us. But let's leave aside the question of whether this style produces better results. Even if it did - and I have my doubts - it still would be wrong. Our lawmakers do more than simply make laws; they're supposed to represent us, in every sense of the word. By electing officials who demean their employees, we also demean ourselves." Referring to another leader, he asks, "How much does personal virtue matter in public office? ... Presidents - more than anybody else - serve as symbols of us all; they embody our deepest beliefs, values and principles. We would never elect people who did physical harm to those under their charge. But we continue to elect verbal and emotional bullies, who can do just as much damage." -- JZ, professor NYU Shouldn't we expect as much from LC leaders? Several times I have mentioned that the single most objectionable LC matter for me was the mistreatment of people, i.e. the program transformed beloved brothers into bullies. From the top down, far too many LC leaders have failed us in this regard ... and far too many loving shepherds have departed due to them. __________________ Ohio's motto is: With God all things are possible!. Keeping all my posts short, quick, living, and to the point!

08-17-2008, 06:17 PM	#4
Nell Admin/Moderator Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Texas Posts: 2,107	More from Matthew 23 Matthew 23:.. But do not do what they do, for they do not practice what they preach. 4 They tie up heavy loads and put them on men's shoulders, but they themselves are not willing to lift a finger to move them.

08-21-2019, 06:21 AM	#5
Nell Admin/Moderator Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Texas Posts: 2,107	Re: Spiritual Abuse Verses Bringing this timely topic to the top. Nell

08-27-2019, 12:12 PM	#6
OBW Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: DFW area Posts: 4,384	Re: Spiritual Abuse Verses Always a topic worthy of consideration. But in an off-topic way, I note that some of the verses in Jeremiah seem to speak to some of our political/cultural issues of today as well. __________________ Mike I think . . . . I think I am . . . . therefore I am, I think — Edge OR . . . . You may be right, I may be crazy — Joel

01-02-2020, 09:07 PM	#7
JJ Member Join Date: Jan 2016 Posts: 1,006	Re: Spiritual Abuse Verses 2 Corinthians 11:20 (linked here in its context https://biblehub.com/bsb/2_corinthians/11.htm) is a great verse for anyone thinking it is better to “turn the other cheek” to an abusive church leader. It simply isn’t! Turn away! Don’t put up with it. The apostle Paul is this verse is shaming the Corinthians regarding “many who boast in their flesh” saying “you gladly tolerate fools, since you are so wise. In fact, you even put up with anyone who enslaves you or exploits you or takes advantage of you or exalts himself or strikes you in the face.” And he compares himself and his coworkers who are meek and gentle among them as setting the right example from chapters 11-14 in a long discourse. __________________ And the Word became flesh, and dwelt among us, and we saw His glory, glory as of the only begotten from the Father, full of grace and truth. (John 1:14 NASB)

08-14-2008, 06:12 PM	#1
Cal Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: USA Posts: 4,333	"Among my people are wicked men who lie in wait like men who snare birds and like those who set traps to catch men. Like cages full of birds, their houses are full of deceit; they have become rich and powerful and have grown fat and sleek. Their evil deeds have no limit; they do not plead the case of the fatherless to win it, they do not defend the rights of the poor. Should I not punish them for this?” declares the Lord. “Should I not avenge myself on such a nation as this?" [Jeremiah 5:26-29, NIV]