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[Truth]

I have always been curious. Just imagine this. I know it probably will never happen. But just imagine for fun:

What if Brother Lee/Blend Brothers confessed to our past history publicly and apologized? I'm not talking about teaching here. I know there are many teachings in the LC that main-stream christianity disagree with. I'm talking just about history. What do you think will happen to the Recovery?

Short term cause & effect: Chaos? Some will leave the LC? Many will question its teachings?

Long term cause & effect: Will the LC actually gain more members. Will they be more accepted by other christians?

Run wild with your imagination. I like to see what you all think. Don't take this too seriously. This is just for fun. I'm just curious.

[alwayslearning]

Originally Posted by Truth

What if Brother Lee/Blend Brothers confessed to our past history publicly and apologized? I'm not talking about teaching here. I know there are many teachings in the LC that main-stream christianity disagree with. I'm talking just about history. What do you think will happen to the Recovery?

Short term cause & effect: Chaos? Some will leave the LC? Many will question its teachings?

Long term cause & effect: Will the LC actually gain more members. Will they be more accepted by other christians?

I'm not sure what the short or long term effects would be and they shouldn't be worried about it. As a stand-alone action they should apologize for the sake of their own integrity. Speaking for myself I certainly would have more respect for them if they did.

The Bible is full of negative history and we can learn from it and so is 2000+ years of the church's existence. But while not squarely facing their own sordid history they berate "Christianity" for it's negative history. So added to the lack of integrity is hypocrisy. And may I suggest after all the layers are striped away it is these two items that are really fundamentally problematic in the LC system especially among the coworkers and elders.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by Truth

I have always been curious. Just imagine this. I know it probably will never happen. But just imagine for fun:

What if Brother Lee/Blend Brothers confessed to our past history publicly and apologized? I'm not talking about teaching here. I know there are many teachings in the LC that main-stream christianity disagree with. I'm talking just about history. What do you think will happen to the Recovery?

Short term cause & effect: Chaos? Some will leave the LC? Many will question its teachings?

Long term cause & effect: Will the LC actually gain more members. Will they be more accepted by other christians?

Run wild with your imagination. I like to see what you all think. Don't take this too seriously. This is just for fun. I'm just curious.

And what if President Nixon would have come clean right way concerning the Watergate break-in?

Both the Bible and history teach us to confess and come clean immediately. The sooner the better. Something can only be rightly called a "mistake" when it is done accidentally, and without motive. Once a plan is conceived by the authorities to coverup wrongdoing, it can no longer be considered a "mistake." The actual crimes then begin to multiply exponentially. Eventually the point is reached where the lies become the "new truth," because they are repeatedly affirmed.

WL in his twilight did confess to something, but we will never know what it was. We do know that regarding John Ingalls and so many other wronged brothers, WL never "went to his brothers." That public apology may have been tearful and heartfelt, but it accomplished really nothing. His adherents are still debating what he really meant. Unfortunately WL passed on without any reconciliation with the brothers he was in conflict with, neither those on the receiving end of lawsuits, nor of quarantines.

[alwayslearning]

Originally Posted by Ohio

Both the Bible and history teach us to confess and come clean immediately. The sooner the better. Something can only be rightly called a "mistake" when it is done accidentally, and without motive. Once a plan is conceived by the authorities to coverup wrongdoing, it can no longer be considered a "mistake." The actual crimes then begin to multiply exponentially. Eventually the point is reached where the lies become the "new truth," because they are repeatedly affirmed.

(My emphasis above.)

Very true and a point becoming obvious in the RC sex scandal as well. Finally an official in Philly was prosecuted and convicted not for committing the crime of sexual abuse with children but for covering it up for those under his supervision. It was purposeful and willful neglect of the innocent for the sake of an institution.

Until the elders and coworkers in the LC system are willing to squarely face the negative aspects of their own history the "new truth" will be the story inside their system. But because of forums like this their "new truth" will constantly be exposed for the lies that it is. And that is the power of having a communication medium they can't control and why they hate these kind of forums so much.

[Truth]

This is why I love the internet. Depends on how you use it. It is a 2-edged sword. It can tell the truth as well as tell a lie.

Because of the internet, it is difficult for any organization (whether political, religious, or other) to hide their activities. Thus the Chinese communists and the northern koreans ban the parts of the internet to prevent the truth from getting to their people.

If it weren't for the internet, many of us would never have known the truth. Perhaps, we still don't know the whole truth about what happened in the history of the LC. But we are much closer to it now than ever before. Thanks to the internet. Much of my confirmation of what has been written here in this forum is due to the fact that no one has come forward to refute the information. One the one hand it surprises me, on the other it just confirms that much of it is true.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by Truth

If it weren't for the internet, many of us would never have known the truth. Perhaps, we still don't know the whole truth about what happened in the history of the LC. But we are much closer to it now than ever before. Thanks to the internet. Much of my confirmation of what has been written here in this forum is due to the fact that no one has come forward to refute the information. One the one hand it surprises me, on the other it just confirms that much of it is true.

Good points. For me, searching for the truth of our history, the internet is like a courtroom with both sides stating their case. I am just one of the jurors, hashing it out with 11 others, trying to get to the bottom of things. According to the system of law, jurors should be "peers," and having been a member of the LC's for many years, I consider myself a qualified "peer." For years I heard only WL's side of events. I never got to hear the other side of the story. Real courts allow both sides to present their cases, with pointed cross-examinations.

Approximately 20 years ago the "prosecutors" at LSM presented their case. They had open meetings, brought forth numerous witnesses with the accused tried in absentia. Their public proceedings were recorded and distributed throughout the Recovery. Here in the Great Lakes area, we were informed that Titus Chu had "examined the evidence," and agreed with Witness Lee that all the accused (especially John Ingalls, the apparent ringleader) were guilty of conspiracy and rebellion against God's deputy authority. The "Letter of Eight" signed by Titus Chu, which severely reprimanded John Ingalls, was also circulated to all the churches.

Then in late 2005 / early 2006 I finally came across various writings of some of the "accused," namely John Ingalls, Bill Mallon, Albert Zehr, John So, Godfred, Al Knoch, etc. The defense of the accused was finally made known to this "juror." I had to weigh all the evidence based on my limited knowledge of each of the accused. I examined all the evidence I could find. I was also able to watch the "prosecutors" in action once again (except for WL) as they held their "kangaroo court" in Whistler, BC and prompted further lawsuits in Toronto, Mansfield, and Columbus.

Sorry to say, but I held John Ingalls and company in contempt for 15 years. I judged these brothers in my heart as "lepers" based solely on the reputations of Witness Lee and Titus Chu. Once I heard the whole story, my respect for these two ministers shrunk. It is just shameful what they did to John Ingalls and the other brothers.

If the Lord Jesus Himself exposed all the lies that were told to us 20 years ago, the Recovery would collapse like a house of cards, LSM would totally dissolve, and all those Blended brothers would hide their faces in shame.

[Truth]

I love the LCs individually, meaning I love meeting with the saints in the LCs and even WN and WL's ministry very much. That is why I am still a member. I would not want the LCs to collapse

I have so many friends who are genuine lovers of Christ in the LC, but they have no idea about its history. I would never bring up what is on this forum to them unless they were desirous to know. It would just spark a bad feeling in our relationship. They are enjoying and going on with the Lord in an innocent and pure way. I would not want to be the one to put stumbling block in their path by making known to them what they don't need to know. But if they are being abused by the leaders or are seeking a way out because of issues they are facing, then it would be a different story.

However, as much as I love the LCs individually, I hate the lies that is hiding behind the organization as a whole. And I don't agree that LSM has a lot of *hidden* control among the churches. And I don't like the way WL was elevated, and now the BB somewhat too.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by Truth

However, as much as I love the LCs individually, I hate the lies that is hiding behind the organization as a whole. And I don't agree that LSM has a lot of *hidden* control among the churches. And I don't like the way WL was elevated, and now the BB somewhat too.

I understand your love for the LC's and the many precious saints in them. I agree with you that knowing our history is not every member's urgent need.

As for LSM's "hidden" control of the LC's, however, it is intricately intertwined with that history. In other words, what has happened in the past has set the stage for today's "puppet show." It appears like all the actors are moving of their own volition, when actually their movements have all been choreographed by past "training." For example, every single leader in the Recovery today has witnessed first hand what has happened to the likes of the John Ingalls' and Titus Chu's in the Recovery. No one would forget that. The boundaries of their teachings and leadership directions are thus clearly defined. There are enough "spies" in the Recovery to keep each and every "adventurous" new leader in line. Mandatory attendance at the "Feasts" ensures that.

Just as Israel killed all the prophets the Lord sent to them, there is no way for the Recovery to receive "course correction." Every single brother in the past who attempted reform, speaking his heart as a prophet for the Lord, was branded a rebel and banished.

Let me use a bad example to explain. Years ago I worked side-by-side with a Russian engineer, nominally Jewish, who was able to leave that communistic country during the Carter administration. He took advantage of a political opportunity to "volunteer" to emigrate, knowing that if it backfired, his life was basically over. He chose Columbus, Ohio because he read that Christopher Columbus discovered America. We spent much time discussing life in Russia. He relayed to me a very happy home life -- but, of course, he and his wife knew all the "rules." They never discussed problems in Russia, rather took advantage of "opportunities" to bad-mouth capitalism. They would never speak in front of their children a whole host of subjects, since, of course, the children were regularly "questioned" by their teachers at the state schools.

Such is a picture of life in a little "society" which requires fear to keep their members in line. A snapshot of every home appears blissful indeed, as long as the members behave. Watch what happens, however, when someone begins to talk about those "forbidden" subjects. One of those "forbidden" topics is why do we have to use the HWFMR on a regular basis.

[TLFisher]

Originally Posted by Truth

I have always been curious. Just imagine this. I know it probably will never happen. But just imagine for fun:

What if Brother Lee/Blend Brothers confessed to our past history publicly and apologized? I'm not talking about teaching here. I know there are many teachings in the LC that main-stream christianity disagree with. I'm talking just about history. What do you think will happen to the Recovery?

Short term cause & effect: Chaos? Some will leave the LC? Many will question its teachings?

Long term cause & effect: Will the LC actually gain more members. Will they be more accepted by other christians?

I would liken in to the steroid scandal in baseball. Players who came clean about using steroids were embraced and able to continue their careers (Jason Giambi, Andy Pettite). While others who continued to deny any involvment with steroids where viewed with suspicion, mistrust, and found it difficult to continue their baseball careers (Barry Bonds).
The same applies to the recovery. The blended brothers had an excellent opportunity to come clean in 1997 over the Phillip Lee era, but as Chris Wilde indicated in a ten year old email, it would just open up too many wounds.
As you indicated in your post, what if?
I think many saints who had left the recovery are waiting for such a confession. There would be a short term increase in numbers among the local churches for those who had left.
As for the long term effect, it would be difficult to maintain based on the current format. Many who had left are accustomed to prophesying based upon their daily walk with Christ throughout the week. The Holy Word for Morning Revival would be too restricting to sustain returning former members of the local churches.
While some former members just want an assurance of being able to visit without any contempt towards them and their spouses.