Nigel Tomes - LSM's Unorthodox Satanology

UntoHim · 08-04-2008, 06:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Miletus

I have listed a lot that includes the phrase "sinful nature" but was deleted

Paul, what you did was simply cut-n-paste a whole boatload of verses taken out of the NIV version (the only one that uses "sinful nature" instead of flesh), and you did this with little comment about the text itself. Simply posting a bunch of verses or a long quote of Lee or Nee is NOT dialog...it is not discussion...it is simply using valuable time and bandwidth to promote a man's personal ministry or maybe a particular translation.

Here are a couple of the dozen or so verses you cut-n-pasted:
Rom 7:5
For when we were controlled by the sinful nature,* the sinful passions aroused by the law were at work in our bodies, so that we bore fruit for death.
Rom 7:18
I know that nothing good lives in me, that is, in my sinful nature.* For I have the desire to do what is good, but I cannot carry it out.

KSA posted this reasonable response/contention

Quote:

Originally Posted by KSA

No, I am not saying this. Every human is born with inborn perversion of human nature. Sin is a defect in human nature, not some kind of satanic foreign nature.

Your response was to simply post a whole boatload of verses that all apparently back up a point we already agree upon...to wit: that we as humans have a sinful nature. Nobody is disputing this. The point at hand is whether or not Satan himself actually dwells in us. This is what Lee said, or at least strongly implied. And no, we do NOT want to hear more of Lee's explanation and interpretation regarding this...What does the BIBLE say? What do YOU say? What have Christian teachers been saying about this matter for about 2000 years? Let's compare and contrast.

Paul Miletus · 08-04-2008, 11:21 PM

My apologies...

What you have quoted from KSA was not the one I responded to show the phrase "sinful nature" was all over the New Testament scriptures. In fact, what you have quoted was KSA's response to Speaker's comment. I was responding to KSA's earlier post where he said that the phrase "sinful nature" was not biblical nor can be found in any scriptures. To list the appropriate scriptures are proofs that KSA's denial of the scripturality of the phrase "sinful nature" was highlighted. (I was looking for that post of KSA but it seems it vanished from this thread. Please correct me if I am wrong.)

Cheers!

KSA · 08-06-2008, 12:26 AM

Paul, as I understand, you quoted from NIV, see my earlier comment regarding this translation.

Paul Miletus · 08-06-2008, 02:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KSA

Paul, as I understand, you quoted from NIV, see my earlier comment regarding this translation.

Thanks KSA. Perhaps, Steward will come now this time...

KSA · 08-06-2008, 05:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Miletus

Thanks KSA. Perhaps, Steward will come now this time...

So do you agree there is now "sinful nature" in the Bible?

KSA · 08-10-2008, 01:44 PM

Dear Arizona, thank you so much for your good questions. You asked about the origin of evil. How was it possible for a creature created by God to find sin in itself? I gave a lot of thought to this matter, and I believe that I have some light from the Lord regarding this. I will share it with you, and let's see if it satisfies you.

I have come to conclusion that sin was possible because God's creation was not perfect. Only God is absolutely perfect. Everything that is not God does not have absolute perfectness. There are some verses that show us this: He charges His angels with error (Job 4:18), and the heavens are not pure in His sight (Job. 15:15). God's creation was good, but not perfect, and in this imperfection the possibility of sin was hidden. This is how Satan fell. And this is imperfectness Satan appealed to in man, when tempting him.

God is not a creator of evil as His creation is good. But because the creation is not perfect, sin is possible, but this possibility lies in the freedom of will. Therefore, the responsibility is on the moral agent who used his free will to activate this possibility.

Why God's new creation is His masterpiece? Because the new creation partakes of God's life and nature - and in this way partakes of His absolute perfectness - be perfect as your heavenly Father is perfect! None of the old creation, even faithful angels, is as perfect as God. Only the church, the Body of Christ, has access to God's full perfection. This is why there will be no danger of sin anymore for us in eternity.

I hope it helps. God bless you!

08-10-2008, 01:44 PM	#6
KSA Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Russia Posts: 173	Dear Arizona, thank you so much for your good questions. You asked about the origin of evil. How was it possible for a creature created by God to find sin in itself? I gave a lot of thought to this matter, and I believe that I have some light from the Lord regarding this. I will share it with you, and let's see if it satisfies you. I have come to conclusion that sin was possible because God's creation was not perfect. Only God is absolutely perfect. Everything that is not God does not have absolute perfectness. There are some verses that show us this: He charges His angels with error (Job 4:18), and the heavens are not pure in His sight (Job. 15:15). God's creation was good, but not perfect, and in this imperfection the possibility of sin was hidden. This is how Satan fell. And this is imperfectness Satan appealed to in man, when tempting him. God is not a creator of evil as His creation is good. But because the creation is not perfect, sin is possible, but this possibility lies in the freedom of will. Therefore, the responsibility is on the moral agent who used his free will to activate this possibility. Why God's new creation is His masterpiece? Because the new creation partakes of God's life and nature - and in this way partakes of His absolute perfectness - be perfect as your heavenly Father is perfect! None of the old creation, even faithful angels, is as perfect as God. Only the church, the Body of Christ, has access to God's full perfection. This is why there will be no danger of sin anymore for us in eternity. I hope it helps. God bless you! __________________ Most men pursue pleasure with such breathless haste that they hurry past it. Soren Kierkegaard Last edited by KSA; 08-10-2008 at 01:52 PM.

08-04-2008, 11:21 PM	#2
Paul Miletus Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 106	My apologies... What you have quoted from KSA was not the one I responded to show the phrase "sinful nature" was all over the New Testament scriptures. In fact, what you have quoted was KSA's response to Speaker's comment. I was responding to KSA's earlier post where he said that the phrase "sinful nature" was not biblical nor can be found in any scriptures. To list the appropriate scriptures are proofs that KSA's denial of the scripturality of the phrase "sinful nature" was highlighted. (I was looking for that post of KSA but it seems it vanished from this thread. Please correct me if I am wrong.) Cheers!

08-06-2008, 12:26 AM	#3
KSA Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Russia Posts: 173	Paul, as I understand, you quoted from NIV, see my earlier comment regarding this translation.