Is the Processed, Four-in-One God a sound doctrine?

[aron]

Originally Posted by Bible-believer

My families and friends are in the group. I realize I can't say anything against Lee's teaching before them, or I will be in trouble.

I’d rephrase that. You aren’t saying anything at all against Lee’s teaching, but rather you want to pursue truth in the Bible, as it unfolds before you. If you share this seeking, lovingly and respectfully, yet firmly and consistently, they’ll hear. I repeat: we’re not against Lee, the “church life” or “the recovery”. Rather, as Bible believers, we’re trying to understand the things that God’s word says. All of us are in the same boat. Some of us have been in it longer, but it’s still the same boat: “Seek, and ye shall find”. This is our hope, our way, our faith.

Bob: “Hey Uncle Joe, how’s it going?”

Joe: “Hey Bob, good, praise the Lord!”

Bob: “Amen, praise the Lord! Hey, I’ve got a question: in reading the recovery version, in one place in Psalms the footnote says that the writer was in his natural, fallen concepts, when he was cursing his enemy. It says, as people of God, we’re called to bless, not curse. Yet in another Psalm, the same antagonistic language is labeled as a type of Christ defeating Satan? How can one footnote interpret a verse one way, and elsewhere has an opposite interpretation? Why the lack of consistency?”

Joe: “Little nephew, maybe that’s just how it is! Praise the Lord!”
---[later]
---
Bob: “We see in the epistle of Paul that women aren’t allowed to teach, right?”

Joe: “Yep - that’s God’s command, through the apostle.”

Bob: “But look at this: I’m here on the LSM book sales, and in section “G” it has “God’s Plan of Redemption” by Mary McDonough. How come they sell a book by a woman who’s a contemporary of Nee? I don’t see anything else on the page but Nee, Lee, McDonough.”

Joe: “You see, she must have gotten a special dispensation from God. Once the revelation was complete, no more women prophets.”

Bob: “But Paul doesn’t teach that. Why are we?”

Joe: “Maybe that’s just the way it is.”

Bob: “They even started a website: https://marymcdonough.ccws.org and if you click on the links it takes you to “Christ and the Church” website which links back to LSM. https://ccws.org

Joe: “Well, little nephew, those brothers must know something that we don’t know. Praise the Lord”
---[later]
---
Bob: “Joe, you believe that God was processed in his divine economy, right?”

Joe: “Yessir, that’s the revelation of the Bible. ‘Incarnation, inclusion, intensification’” (starts humming the memory song)

Bob: “But I got to thinking. Where does Paul include ‘intensification’ as part of the ‘God’s economy’ that he wants Timothy to stay in Ephesus and teach? How do we know that Paul and Timothy included ‘intensification’ as part of the God’s economy they were presenting to the church?”

Joe: “Well we can clearly see in the Bible the sevenfold intensified Spirit to overcome the degradation of the Church. Revelation shows us the degraded churches and the sevenfold Spirit to address the needs of the Church. So surely this was God’s process in His divine economy.”

Bob: “But Paul didn’t write the book of Revelation on Patmos. John did. So how do we presume that Paul was telling Timothy to remain in Ephesus and teach something from a book that wasn’t yet written?”

Joe: “All I know is that the complete revelation of the Bible shows us the intensified Spirit, and Paul said that “The Last Adam became a Life-Giving Spirit.” So this naturally follows.”

Bob: “I understand the thinking, and don’t say that it’s wrong. But it’s worth pointing out that Paul never taught ‘intensification’ as a step of God’s New Testament economy. Nor did John the apostle. This is merely one person’s idea. We should be very clear: Paul never taught this.”

Joe: "Even if Paul didn't teach it, it's part of the complete revelation in the Bible. Other people wrote books, too."

Bob: "But if Paul didn't tell Timothy to teach 'intensification' as part of the divine economy, what basis do we have? What Bible writer says that "intensification is the third step of the divine economy?"

Joe: "I repeat, it's the complete revelation of the Bible"

Bob: "In other words, Witness Lee's interpretation, right?"

Joe: "That's right - WL was the apostle of the age, with the vision of the age."

Bob: "So Peter didn't teach intensification as part of God's economy, Paul didn't teach it, Jesus didn't teach it, John didn't teach it. But Witness Lee got the vision of the age."

Joe: "Yes, that's right. In the fulness of times, God raised up faithful brothers who put the vision together."

As long as you are respectful, and keep the topic on the Bible, most of them will engage you. But you have to seek the light. If you just want to contend, then we are all in the darkness, and your contention will not bring light. Only the Word conveys the Spirit which conveys Light.

[Bible-believer]

Originally Posted by aron

I’d rephrase that. You aren’t saying anything at all against Lee’s teaching, but rather you want to pursue truth in the Bible, as it unfolds before you. If you share this seeking, lovingly and respectfully, yet firmly and consistently, they’ll hear. I repeat: we’re not against Lee, the “church life” or “the recovery”. Rather, as Bible believers, we’re trying to understand the things that God’s word says. All of us are in the same boat. Some of us have been in it longer, but it’s still the same boat: “Seek, and ye shall find”. This is our hope, our way, our faith.

I did, and I got into trouble. That's why I realized I'd better not bring it up again.
I tried the way you sampled in the post. I am being labeled as a trouble maker.
I study the Bible daily and seek the truth. Yet I feel so alone in the group, esp. when during the Bible study meeting. As one brother said one person against a system is kind of hopeless.

[aron]

Originally Posted by Bible-believer

I did, and I got into trouble. That's why I realized I'd better not bring it up again. I tried the way you sampled in the post. I am being labeled as a trouble maker. I study the Bible daily and seek the truth. Yet I feel so alone in the group, esp. when during the Bible study meeting. As one brother said one person against a system is kind of hopeless.

I appreciate the severity of your situation, and don't presume to know what you can say or do. Yet as Trapped notes, we have the internet, and are neither alone nor hopeless. A lot of people agree with you. Some may be close by, but they can't speak up as you found out. I also agree with studying the Bible. I'd say, study Jesus and look at him carefully, what he did, what he said, how he viewed himself and those around him. You can spend a lifetime studying him. If you do, his Spirit will be with you.

Here's a recent example. He got touched by a sick woman. He said, "I felt power flow out of me". ~Luke 8:46 Can you imagine that? If a politician says to a poor person, jobless and hungry, "I feel your pain" and then gets back in his limo and returns to the State Capital, does he really feel the pain?

Yet when Jesus felt the woman's sickness, she got healed. For Jesus, to feel is not an emotion, it's a precursor of action: feed the hungry, clothe those who are shivering with cold, heal the sick. Listen to those who want to try and find their voice. Comfort the broken-hearted. And you'll feel that same power flow. If you feel others in their weakness and shame, where they really are, you can reach them. His Spirit will be with you.

Your situation, though difficult, is temporary. Don't be discouraged - you're not alone.

[aron]

21 Wherefore lay apart all filthiness and superfluity of naughtiness, and receive with meekness the engrafted word, which is able to save your souls.

22 But be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves.

23 For if any be a hearer of the word, and not a doer, he is like unto a man beholding his natural face in a glass:

24 For he beholdeth himself, and goeth his way, and straightway forgetteth what manner of man he was.

25 But whoso looketh into the perfect law of liberty, and continueth therein, he being not a forgetful hearer, but a doer of the work, this man shall be blessed in his deed.

26 If any man among you seem to be religious, and bridleth not his tongue, but deceiveth his own heart, this man's religion is vain.

27 Pure religion and undefiled before God and the Father is this, To visit the fatherless and widows in their affliction, and to keep himself unspotted from the world.

Then in James 2:8 he calls it the "royal law of scripture" If ye fulfil the royal law according to the scripture, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself, ye do well:

This "perfect law of liberty", this "royal law of scripture" is to love one another as our King commands, and not merely in lip service but in action. Our circumstance, and our perceived ability to love, are temporal. The command is eternal. If we break free from the prison of self, we realize our circumstances and even our abilities are nothing. The King has commanded us to love. We believe, and by faith we obey.

And obedience requires endurance. But the prize awaits. See e.g., James 1:12 Our prison is not circumstance. It is our inability to see past self, in the present circumstance. That's why James calls it "the perfect law of liberty". We see, we believe, we obey, we are set free.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by Bible-believer

I did, and I got into trouble. That's why I realized I'd better not bring it up again.
I tried the way you sampled in the post. I am being labeled as a trouble maker.
I study the Bible daily and seek the truth. Yet I feel so alone in the group, esp. when during the Bible study meeting. As one brother said one person against a system is kind of hopeless.

Bible-believer, actually you are sowing seeds, looking for "good soil."

Jesus said, "be wise as serpents, gentle as doves." Learn from Him.

All of the Lord's true followers were, from the little one to the great, "one person against a system."

It may seem "hopeless" to man, but being faithful to the Lord will always be rewarded by Him. Never allow yourself to be discouraged by others' reactions when you are speaking for Him.