What's going on in OKC?

[Nell]

So has that question been answered?

Albert Lim
Dan Sady
Jerry McGill
Mark Raabe
Phil Delp
Steve Watts
Tym Seay
Benson Phillips
David Koo
Jim Miller
Minoru Chen
Ray Graver
Ron Kangas
Bob Danker
Dennis Higashi
Joe Davis
James Lee
Ricky Acosta
Ted Williamson
Chris Wilde
Ed Marks
Ken Walker
Marty Robert
Rick Scatterday
Tom Goetz

[Trapped]

Originally Posted by Nell

So has that question been answered?

Albert Lim
Dan Sady
Jerry McGill
Mark Raabe
Phil Delp
Steve Watts
Tym Seay
Benson Phillips
David Koo
Jim Miller
Minoru Chen
Ray Graver
Ron Kangas
Bob Danker
Dennis Higashi
Joe Davis
James Lee
Ricky Acosta
Ted Williamson
Chris Wilde
Ed Marks
Ken Walker
Marty Robert
Rick Scatterday
Tom Goetz

It answers the question of who they are in North America at least.

What a loony organization that will post an article that says it's "absurd" and "unbiblical" to ask for a list of names of what they self-appoint as "apostles", who then turn around and list those very names in another part of the same site when they want to throw their weight around.

Originally Posted by Nell

So has that question been answered?....

And
Andrew Yu?

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[UntoHim]

Brother Andrew past away last month.
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Ghana, Ethiopia, Kenya, Wakanda, and South Africa?

Secondly, how come Dick Taylors name is not on the list?

Originally Posted by Nell

So has that question been answered?

Albert Lim
Dan Sady
Jerry McGill
Mark Raabe
Phil Delp
Steve Watts
Tym Seay
Benson Phillips
David Koo
Jim Miller
Minoru Chen
Ray Graver
Ron Kangas
Bob Danker
Dennis Higashi
Joe Davis
James Lee
Ricky Acosta
Ted Williamson
Chris Wilde
Ed Marks
Ken Walker
Marty Robert
Rick Scatterday
Tom Goetz

Is this the same 'Brother Colley' who regularly used to go to Africa to shepherd the saints there during their conferences, particularly in G

[HERn]

Originally Posted by Witless Mee

Ghana, Ethiopia, Kenya, Wakanda, and South Africa? Secondly, how come Dick Taylors name is not on the list?
Is this the same 'Brother Colley' who regularly used to go to Africa to shepherd the saints there during their conferences, particularly in G

I don't know about Africa, but I'm sure Colley has ministered in Belize along with some elders from the OKC area. I wondered why Dick Taylor is not on the coworkers list since he speaks sometimes at the trainings. My impression of Dick was that he may be the only senior brother who still has a sensitive conscience and may not be 100% absolute for the blinded's interpretation of the the Nee/Lee ministry as it pertains to destroying and cursing the saints that leave the restricted confines of LSM.

[HERn]

Bring the hidden things of darkness into the light. Rebuke the elders among you so that the others may learn.

There is much to be learned about what certain elders in the Recovery believe about marriage and other issues from the court records and included emails in this very sad case. Because fellow OKC-area elders and at least one coworker aligned themselves with the out of line husband/elder in Edmond even to the extent of alleging the wife was an adulterous lesbian with no physical evidence the LSM Anaheim coworkers had to throw the OKC-area elders and their coworker under the bus. This was partly because during the court trial evidence was presented by counselors, social service investigators which was agreed to by the children's Guardian ad litem that the children were subjected to religious abuse in the home and sexual molestation by the elder/father. The court has not ruled on the matter, but has restricted the father's visitation with the children.

Information from the emails included in the court documents alleged that the elder/husband attempted to exercise control over the body, soul, and spirit of his wife. She was restricted to sharing only "spiritual enjoyment" with her immediate family and other LC wives. She could not share intimate things with other sisters. This edict was enforced by the husband after he found out his wife asked another LC wife if daily forced intimacy regardless of health or feelings was normal, and that the wife could only say no after one daily occurrence. Both and LC sister and a counselor said that was not normal, and the counselor told the wife to only have intimacy when she wanted and was ready.

Elder/husband allegedly flipped out and threatened suicide and that he would need to obtain his intimacy needs from the children. Because the wife asked an intimate question of another LC wife the husband accused her of adultery and the coworker and some of the other elders apparently agreed, and the word lesbian was thrown about.

I have know several LC elders and can say that I'm pretty sure the above is not typical for most LC elders. But, the fact that the elder was supported by other elders and at least one coworker suggest that all is not right with the vetting of LC elders and review of allegations of improprieties.

Would you want to be associated with a religious group like this?

This story of neglect and abuse happens one too many times in the LC. I actually would love to write up the story of a dear sister who actually was brave enough to speak on her testimony of being in the LC for 10 years and dealing with abuse from all sides of the church. She took down the video most likely cause of DCP and hate attacks from recovery hate bots . It will take me a good while to write a detailed synopsis of this dear sisters story. I would love to write it but for some reason their is no consistency on what the admins/mods allow for posts to past their wall/filter of permission. I love dear sister Nell and brother untohim but if my communication is cut off for no detailed reason, I'm not gonna pain my heart writing this story for everyone to see and remember this dear sister story, free from the prosecution of DCP, just for it to be shutdown from the getgo . Honestly the people at DCP must be hired from who knows what dark corner of the world. Like how the heck do you go to sleep at night if you are somewhat human? Probably the the wicked doctrine of "Be a God man not a good/ethical man".

[UntoHim]

Hey Z9, if you will just take a couple of minutes and register for the forum your posts will not have to go through the moderation que.

I have no idea what you mean by your "communication being cut off"

Thanks for your consideration.

Your brother who is unto Him.
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[gr8ful]

Originally Posted by Z9

...Honestly the people at DCP must be hired from who knows what dark corner of the world. Like how the heck do you go to sleep at night if you are somewhat human? Probably the the wicked doctrine of "Be a God man not a good/ethical man".

We don't need to make anyone out to be a monster to point out the result of their work is monstrous.

When I was in the LR (some family still is faithfully there), I got to know DCP principals personally. Themselves, their families. I got to know their heart for saints and sinners and saw many evidences of grace on many occasions. The ones I knew were the kinds of people you'd want as neighbors and would rejoice if they were personally looking after a loved one.

But there's something that happens when one has what I call "Cause Blindness." When one's devotion to a cause (of any kind) is so absolute it causes one to put aside personal convictions and character in service to The Cause, people do things, say things, and write things to "protect" The Cause that they would not even allow themselves to do to protect themselves from critique. And when The Cause is "God's Move on Earth Today," well... Good luck seeing through that!

Rather than demonize the individuals, I think it is more helpful to shine the light of truth on the work the group does. One doesn't have to be evil to err; just human.

[Nell]

Originally Posted by gr8ful

We don't need to make anyone out to be a monster to point out the result of their work is monstrous.
...
Rather than demonize the individuals, I think it is more helpful to shine the light of truth on the work the group does. One doesn't have to be evil to err; just human.

What??? If someone IS a monster, they need to be exposed as a monster. Pointing out the results of monstrous behavior, after the fact, means there are victims who should have been protected. What about them?

You can't protect yourself, or someone else, from the "work" of monsters if you don't know who the monsters are. Women in "the office" could have protected themselves from Philip Lee if they had known he was a monster.

So, poor Philip Lee wasn't evil. He just err'd. He's just human.

This elder in OKC wasn't evil for abusing his wife and child, he just made a mistake...oops...he's just human...poor fella'.

So which is it? They behaved like monsters, or they're "just human"?

1 Timothy 5:19-21
19 Against an elder receive not an accusation, but before two or three witnesses.
20 Them that sin rebuke before all, that others also may fear.

Nell