ETERNAL TORMENT IS FALSE TEACHING WHAT SAY YE'?

[manna-man]

LOL! Ken...

The same could be said about you or me.

IMHO, it can be difficult to discredit eye witnesses.

I'm perplexed by your vague statement but it does have me now wondering if there were blue skies or overcast skies on the days they may not have known what they were talking about...I really wonder if they were intellectual enough to comprehend anything. :-)

[zeek]

Originally Posted by manna-man

LOL! Ken...

The same could be said about you or me.

IMHO, it can be difficult to discredit eye witnesses.

I'm perplexed by your vague statement but it does have me now wondering if there were blue skies or overcast skies on the days they may not have known what they were talking about...I really wonder if they were intellectual enough to comprehend anything. :-)

How could they be eye witnesses to eternal torment or hell?

[manna-man]

Ken,

Your efforts would be better served making a case against those who perpetuated the myth/false doctrine of eternal torment. Not trying to debunk me for making the case. Anyone that has put any thought into it knows God couldn't be so evil.
I will remain cautious to enter into a deep discussion with you or Harold because it is quite evident that you two go way beyond reasonable efforts to twist the truths with your contorted narratives.

[zeek]

Originally Posted by manna-man

Ken,

Your efforts would be better served making a case against those who perpetuated the myth/false doctrine of eternal torment. Not trying to debunk me for making the case. Anyone that has put any thought into it knows God couldn't be so evil.
I will remain cautious to enter into a deep discussion with you or Harold because it is quite evident that you two go way beyond reasonable efforts to twist the truths with your contorted narratives.

Not at all. I try to practice the philosophical principle of charity toward them and toward you. That includes putting the best possible construction on your opponent's views. What I usually see on Internet forums is the opposite practice of putting the worst possible construction on the opponent's views. Furthermore, I assume that you and they are persons of good will unless I see evidence to the contrary. In times of conflict such as we are living in today, don't you find that refreshing?

Deluded or not, I actually believe I am seeking the Truth. I would like to believe a universalist view not unlike that of the early church father Origen wherein everyone is eventually saved. But, alas, I have found the metaphysical skepticism of commentators like David Hume and Immanuel Kant to be persuasive. Sooo, my days of metaphysical dogma appear to be over, or at least on a long sabbatical.

[Evangelical]

Originally Posted by zeek

Not at all. I try to practice the philosophical principle of charity toward them and toward you. That includes putting the best possible construction on your opponent's views. What I usually see on Internet forums is the opposite practice of putting the worst possible construction on the opponent's views. Furthermore, I assume that you and they are persons of good will unless I see evidence to the contrary. In times like of conflict such as we are living in today, don't you find that refreshing?

Deluded or not, I actually believe I am seeking the Truth. I would like to believe a universalist view not unlike that of the early church father Origen wherein everyone is eventually saved. But, alas, I have found the metaphysical skepticism of commentators like David Hume and Immanuel Kant to be persuasive. Sooo, my days of metaphysical dogma appear to be over, or at least on a long sabbatical.

Searching for the Truth is more about learning to listen and know our heart/spirit, than an outward search for knowledge. I don't think you will find it on this forum or any other place that is not your own heart. Because the Truth is in our heart/spirit. Once we find that, then we can figure out all the doctrine in our mind later on. So I think the Truth is something you already have, you just need to tap into it to convince your mind.

[zeek]

Originally Posted by Evangelical

Searching for the Truth is more about learning to listen and know our heart/spirit, than an outward search for knowledge. I don't think you will find it on this forum or any other place that is not your own heart. Because the Truth is in our heart/spirit. Once we find that, then we can figure out all the doctrine in our mind later on. So I think the Truth is something you already have, you just need to tap into it to convince your mind.

I agree with the notion that the truth is in us. But the idea that we are going to tap into it now and use our minds later is wrong according to my experience. That reminds me of Witness Lee's "turn from your mind to your spirit" formula. I tried it for 13 years. It didn't work.

[Evangelical]

Originally Posted by zeek

I agree with the notion that the truth is in us. But the idea that we are going to tap into it now and use our minds later is wrong according to my experience. That reminds me of Witness Lee's "turn from your mind to your spirit" formula. I tried it for 13 years. It didn't work.

It would only be proved wrong if you have found the Truth by not tapping into it. When you find the Truth by not tapping into it, then you can say it is wrong according to your experience.

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Evangelical

Searching for the Truth is more about learning to listen and know our heart/spirit, than an outward search for knowledge. I don't think you will find it on this forum or any other place that is not your own heart. Because the Truth is in our heart/spirit. Once we find that, then we can figure out all the doctrine in our mind later on. So I think the Truth is something you already have, you just need to tap into it to convince your mind.

Like they say in the Eastern religions : You are what you seek.

And by the way, they don't have this hell problem over there. They didn't have the pleasure of meeting Jesus ; that's responsible for our present day conception of hell. To them, the soul lives on eternally, but reincarnates, around and around, until enough lessons are learned to earn 'em heaven. But I guess that's a kind of hell. This life kinda proves that. More of them would be a real and living hell. Maybe worse than fire. I don't know, cuz I've never burned and burned forever and ever, without being cremated.

But according to the person that offered the OP of this thread, I guess I might have an opportunity to find out. Maybe not, cuz he don't believe in hell. He's like a JW.

[awareness]

Ecc 9:5 For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not any thing, neither have they any more a reward; for the memory of them is forgotten.

[manna-man]

Originally Posted by awareness

Like they say in the Eastern religions : You are what you seek.

And by the way, they don't have this hell problem over there. They didn't have the pleasure of meeting Jesus ; that's responsible for our present day conception of hell. To them, the soul lives on eternally, but reincarnates, around and around, until enough lessons are learned to earn 'em heaven. But I guess that's a kind of hell. This life kinda proves that. More of them would be a real and living hell. Maybe worse than fire. I don't know, cuz I've never burned and burned forever and ever, without being cremated.

But according to the person that offered the OP of this thread, I guess I might have an opportunity to find out. Maybe not, cuz he don't believe in hell. He's like a JW.

We all will have the oppertunity to find out if we don't open our earlids and listen.

I don't wish any evil on you Awareness. In fact you are on the top of my daily prayer list.

Enjoy.....

https://m.youtube.com/watch?feature=...&v=8fXFIqHS9Ho

[Evangelical]

Originally Posted by awareness

Like they say in the Eastern religions : You are what you seek.

And by the way, they don't have this hell problem over there. They didn't have the pleasure of meeting Jesus ; that's responsible for our present day conception of hell. To them, the soul lives on eternally, but reincarnates, around and around, until enough lessons are learned to earn 'em heaven. But I guess that's a kind of hell. This life kinda proves that. More of them would be a real and living hell. Maybe worse than fire. I don't know, cuz I've never burned and burned forever and ever, without being cremated.

But according to the person that offered the OP of this thread, I guess I might have an opportunity to find out. Maybe not, cuz he don't believe in hell. He's like a JW.

The article is not about the existence of hell but whether or not the soul is indestructible.

Actually there's two main aspects. One is the imprecise translation of the word hell in the English bible. The other is whether the soul is indestructible or not. I think most Christians nowadays know that hell can refer to Hades or Gehenna, I mean I used to hear it sometimes in non-JW denominational churches.