Jezebel -- why we should know who she is.

ZNPaaneah · 12-09-2016, 08:46 PM

ZNP,

Revelation provides a direct charaterization of the woman Jezebel. She leads people into spiritual fornication as the real Jezebel did with the nation of Israel.

Was she Israeli, a member of the beloved people of God? What does spiritual fornication mean as applied to the church?

Drake

Jezebel has been coming up more and more in the posts. It seems that this is becoming far too important to just give a brief answer to. I have come to realize that this is not referring to some obscure experience that only a few Christians in "degraded Christianity" experience, but rather something that all Christians need to overcome.

ZNPaaneah · 12-09-2016, 09:04 PM

1Kings 16:31 And it came to pass, as if it had been a light thing for him to walk in the sins of Jeroboam the son of Nebat, that he took to wife Jezebel the daughter of Ethbaal king of the Sidonians, and went and served Baal, and worshipped him.

You can't understand who Jezebel is unless you first understand the sins of Jeroboam, because Jezebel essentially takes the sins of Jeroboam to another level.

After King Solomon died his son was a poor heir and made a major blunder with the people. This opened the door for Jeroboam to set up another kingdom with the ten tribes of Israel, dividing Israel into two kingdoms. This division appears to be of God. However, it might have turned out as a temporary rebuke with the nation reconciling after a few months had it not been for Jeroboam setting up golden calves as idols and commanding the nation to ignore God's word. This is referred to as "the sins of Jeroboam".

So Jeroboam told the Israelites that it was the two golden calves that brought them out of Egypt, Ahab takes this to the next level, ditching God altogether, taking a heathen wife and serving Baal and worshipping Baal.

This is how we are first introduced to Jezebel. She takes the sins of Jeroboam to a new level, and she is fully associated with serving and worshipping Baal.

Evangelical · 12-10-2016, 12:06 AM

Jezebel represents the corruptive influences within the denominations or the local church, things of a idolatrous and sometimes sexual nature. It is something for every believer to overcome no matter what denomination or not-denomination they attend.

I read that here:

http://amazingdiscoveries.org/S-dece..._pagan-temples

ZNPaaneah · 12-10-2016, 07:49 AM

1Kings 18:19 Now therefore send, and gather to me all Israel unto mount Carmel, and the prophets of Baal four hundred and fifty, and the prophets of the Asherah four hundred, that eat at Jezebel’s table.

Jezebel fed (hired) 450 prophets of Baal and 400 prophets of Asherah. This was not because she was generous or charitable, there is no evidence of this. What she did is exactly what our leaders do today.

They will hire a cabinet, experts, consultants, data specialists, pollsters, prognosticators, people to give them security briefings, economic briefings, with charts and tables predicting future outcomes (that is prophecy)

They advise leaders on how to speak to the public (that is prophecy). They get focus groups and determine what words to speak, how to spin it, how to sell it.

They spy on enemies and advise how to destroy them.

Jezebel made ruling without God a science.

Drake · 12-10-2016, 07:59 AM

The basic sin of Jeroboam is that he established a worship center that was not in the place appointed by God. This opened the door to all the other sins.

God prescribed the place, time, and methods for worshipping God. Jeroboam set up a his own place and method. God said in this way, and Jeroboam said, that way will do just as well. He disregarded God's prescription of worship for one of his own preference.

Drake

Cal · 12-10-2016, 09:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drake

The basic sin of Jeroboam is that he established a worship center that was not in the place appointed by God. This opened the door to all the other sins.

God prescribed the place, time, and methods for worshipping God. Jeroboam set up a his own place and method. God said in this way, and Jeroboam said, that way will do just as well. He disregarded God's prescription of worship for one of his own preference.

Drake

God's prescription for worship in the NT is "in spirit and in truth." Nothing more, nothing less.

Worship in spirit and truth is thus the proper NT "place," and thus corresponds to the OT temple. The temple is the house of God, which is now the church. Thus, worshiping in spirit and truth implies the church is there, especially when two or three are gathered. Thus no need for "the local ground" to have church.

Since Jesus made it clear the proper place of worship is only "in spirit and truth," insisting on the local ground could be viewed as actually setting up a different place of worship than Jesus prescribed, and thus could be viewed as a sin like Jeroboam's. But clearly the temple was not the only place of worship. The Jews established synagogues, which Jesus attended reverently. Thus the strict idea that the temple was the only proper place of worship is an error.

So leveraging the "proper place of worship" as a pretext to pushing the local ground is both invalid and self-nullifying.

If you insist the temple was the only proper place of worship, then it must be that "in spirit and truth" implies that the temple, thus the church, is present and the local ground is unneeded.

If you don't insist the temple was the only proper place of worship then that weakens the local ground argument as well.

ZNPaaneah · 12-10-2016, 09:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drake

The basic sin of Jeroboam is that he established a worship center that was not in the place appointed by God. This opened the door to all the other sins.

God prescribed the place, time, and methods for worshipping God. Jeroboam set up a his own place and method. God said in this way, and Jeroboam said, that way will do just as well. He disregarded God's prescription of worship for one of his own preference.

Drake

Yes, but the Bible never refers to the "basic sin" or the "sin of Jeroboam" but to the sins of Jeroboam.

1. Establishing a worship center is one

2. Causing the division to be permanent is a second.

The second is very difficult because it was God that told Jeroboam to initiate the process and it was prophesied that he would get the ten tribes to follow him. But God never told him to make this permanent or set up his own worship center. God's intention may have been to rebuke the nation of Israel but then to have them repent. Jeroboam did everything in his power to prevent them from being reconciled.

This brings to mind Jonah who didn't want to see his enemy reconciled to God.

Very often those that talk the most about oneness and the importance of oneness are actually the ones that don't want God's children to be reconciled. Oneness becomes a golden idol they make sacrifices to. Hence obedience is better than sacrifice.

The sins of Jeroboam are similar to the sins of Saul. Disobedience, envy, jealousy, idolatry, witchcraft.

12-09-2016, 08:46 PM	#1
ZNPaaneah Member Join Date: Oct 2010 Posts: 7,105	Jezebel -- why we should know who she is. ZNP, Revelation provides a direct charaterization of the woman Jezebel. She leads people into spiritual fornication as the real Jezebel did with the nation of Israel. Was she Israeli, a member of the beloved people of God? What does spiritual fornication mean as applied to the church? Drake Jezebel has been coming up more and more in the posts. It seems that this is becoming far too important to just give a brief answer to. I have come to realize that this is not referring to some obscure experience that only a few Christians in "degraded Christianity" experience, but rather something that all Christians need to overcome.

12-09-2016, 09:04 PM	#2
ZNPaaneah Member Join Date: Oct 2010 Posts: 7,105	Re: Jezebel -- taking the sins of Jeroboam to a new level 1Kings 16:31 And it came to pass, as if it had been a light thing for him to walk in the sins of Jeroboam the son of Nebat, that he took to wife Jezebel the daughter of Ethbaal king of the Sidonians, and went and served Baal, and worshipped him. You can't understand who Jezebel is unless you first understand the sins of Jeroboam, because Jezebel essentially takes the sins of Jeroboam to another level. After King Solomon died his son was a poor heir and made a major blunder with the people. This opened the door for Jeroboam to set up another kingdom with the ten tribes of Israel, dividing Israel into two kingdoms. This division appears to be of God. However, it might have turned out as a temporary rebuke with the nation reconciling after a few months had it not been for Jeroboam setting up golden calves as idols and commanding the nation to ignore God's word. This is referred to as "the sins of Jeroboam". So Jeroboam told the Israelites that it was the two golden calves that brought them out of Egypt, Ahab takes this to the next level, ditching God altogether, taking a heathen wife and serving Baal and worshipping Baal. This is how we are first introduced to Jezebel. She takes the sins of Jeroboam to a new level, and she is fully associated with serving and worshipping Baal.

12-10-2016, 12:06 AM	#3
Evangelical Member Join Date: Aug 2016 Posts: 3,965	Re: Jezebel -- why we should know who she is. Jezebel represents the corruptive influences within the denominations or the local church, things of a idolatrous and sometimes sexual nature. It is something for every believer to overcome no matter what denomination or not-denomination they attend. I read that here: http://amazingdiscoveries.org/S-dece..._pagan-temples

12-10-2016, 07:49 AM	#4
ZNPaaneah Member Join Date: Oct 2010 Posts: 7,105	Re: Jezebel -- why we should know who she is. 1Kings 18:19 Now therefore send, and gather to me all Israel unto mount Carmel, and the prophets of Baal four hundred and fifty, and the prophets of the Asherah four hundred, that eat at Jezebel’s table. Jezebel fed (hired) 450 prophets of Baal and 400 prophets of Asherah. This was not because she was generous or charitable, there is no evidence of this. What she did is exactly what our leaders do today. They will hire a cabinet, experts, consultants, data specialists, pollsters, prognosticators, people to give them security briefings, economic briefings, with charts and tables predicting future outcomes (that is prophecy) They advise leaders on how to speak to the public (that is prophecy). They get focus groups and determine what words to speak, how to spin it, how to sell it. They spy on enemies and advise how to destroy them. Jezebel made ruling without God a science.

12-10-2016, 07:59 AM	#5
Drake Member Join Date: Nov 2016 Posts: 2,075	Re: Jezebel -- why we should know who she is. The basic sin of Jeroboam is that he established a worship center that was not in the place appointed by God. This opened the door to all the other sins. God prescribed the place, time, and methods for worshipping God. Jeroboam set up a his own place and method. God said in this way, and Jeroboam said, that way will do just as well. He disregarded God's prescription of worship for one of his own preference. Drake