I'm confused.....

um.... not sure what to say besides i believe in Christ. I thought this was a site where people could talk about the local church with LC members, the more threads i read i'm beginning to think it was designed to bash it in a way.

The first time I was revealed that the grounds for gathering together as the body of Christ was on the grounds of locality was in 2010 while incarcerated in Prison. I found a book in the library by watchman Nee called The Normal Christian Church Life. It was during a deep spiritual revival in my life that i read this book and after a thorough search of scripture I found brother Nee's observation of the scripture to be very sound and biblical.

Since 2010 i have tried to locate a local church in my but so far have been unable to locate any real local church or members, i was hoping this would be a place for that but obviously i see it is exactly the opposite! I have yet to personally experience the local church to say whether i agree or disagree with what people on here are saying, but one thing i'm almost sure of is that if these members are true believers abiding in the spirit of God, they are going to seem detached.... I had a, what some would call, a spiritual awakening where the Spirit of God opened my eyes to understand and know the teachings contained in Romans. I first read this in a Watchman Nee book and had read it several times in the Bible but as my eyes were blinded i never noticed what was truely contained in Romans 6. One Day as I was reading Romans it just came alive and i could see clearly what was being explained concerning our Co-Death in Christ. For 3 months after that I experienced a walk that was like nothing i had before, it was as if I HAD DIED TO SIN and it no longer had dominion over ME.

As i continued my walk in the light of this new found truth i began to become attacked from christians and non chritians alike as I revealed what God had revealed in his Word. Well.... needless to say, after months of attacks and not having a single soul around who understood me I fell victim to the Lies perpetrated by Satan and thus actually fell to the wayside completely.... Not until recently has God drawn me back to Him and Its is my hopes to contact a local church near me so i can see if they are what i truely believe they are: The True Gathering of the Church based on its Biblical grounds... Locality.

I do agree with Peter when he writes about Pauls teachings in the Spirit: even as our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given unto him hath written unto you; As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction. (2 Pet 3:16) Some things in scripture ARE hard to understand, and thats because spiritual things are discerned by THE SPIRIT.

My hopes is that i can locate members of the local church so i can find where they gather in my city or close by. If you can be a help to that then please respond
Thank you
Z

[aron]

Z,

The local churches of Witness Lee are not local. They are ministry franchises. They are no more local than a McDonalds restaurant.

How can they be local and be "exactly identical", with "no differences whatsoever"? It is outward, enforced uniformity, the same as Babel, bricks built with slime. (Gen 11:3, KJV).

And if you consider this comment an attack, then I daresay you're being a tad subjective here.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by zr0w69

The first time I was revealed that the grounds for gathering together as the body of Christ was on the grounds of locality was in 2010 while incarcerated in Prison. I found a book in the library by watchman Nee called The Normal Christian Church Life. It was during a deep spiritual revival in my life that i read this book and after a thorough search of scripture I found brother Nee's observation of the scripture to be very sound and biblical.

Welcome Z!

Praise the Lord for the deep spiritual revival in your life.

I encourage you to pray and seek the Lord where you should meet with Christians. Back in the '60s many came to the LCs because they thought Nee's book was being practiced, and initially it was. My how things have changed. I did a thorough study of that book again in 2003 and could not believe how far off the book's publisher Living Stream Ministry had taken the LC's. Not only that, those who have attempted to adhere to those early principles have been excommunicated by LSM.

I believe your revival was solely due to the moving of the Spirit of God in your heart. The Lord can use any book to do this. What He has begun, He longs to complete. Eventually, through further study, many of us have learned that the principle of "Locality" is not necessary for a true church life.

Adhering to the principle of "locality" actually has a negative effect, as you have learned. What joins us as believers is not geography, but the Lord Himself. He is our foundation and ground of oneness, we are "rooted" in Him. (Colossians 2.7)

[Koinonia]

Z, thank you for sharing your story. It may be helpful to you to visit an LC meeting, if there is one near you. On my way out and since leaving the LC, I have been very enlightened (and also encouraged by the Lord) to visit various Christian groups. We should be able to talk about these experiences in a calm and mutually beneficial way. One thing that has touched me over and over again is that there are very many brothers and sisters--from many different backgrounds, in many different places, in many different contexts--who are truly seeking the Lord. I have come to accept that each of us is on some kind of "journey" in this Christian walk "until we all arrive at the oneness of the faith" (Ephesians 4:13), and that journey will necessarily look very different for each one of us.

[TLFisher]

Originally Posted by aron

The local churches of Witness Lee are not local. They are ministry franchises. They are no more local than a McDonalds restaurant.
How can they be local and be "exactly identical", with "no differences whatsoever"? It is outward, enforced uniformity, the same as Babel, bricks built with slime. (Gen 11:3, KJV).
And if you consider this comment an attack, then I daresay you're being a tad subjective here.

I seem to recall DCP being reactive to the suggestion LSM affiliated churches are not local churches, but ministry churches. WELL! If walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, it must be a duck.
You're exactly on. Point to me a so-called local church that doesn't received LSM publications, yet is regarded as a local church by Living Stream Ministry or other LSM-affiliated churches . Ron Kangas would characterize such churches as "meeting independently of the Body". Y'all, don't get reactive. That's just what the attitude is towards non-LSM churches. It only proves Aron's statement as being truthful.

[JJ]

Originally Posted by zr0w69

um.... not sure what to say besides i believe in Christ. I thought this was a site where people could talk about the local church with LC members, the more threads i read i'm beginning to think it was designed to bash it in a way.

Sorry you are confused Z.

I am excited that the Lord has begun a wonderful revival in your heart for Him. That's great! I agree with the advise of others here. Keep seeking Him, and you will find Him. He is all, and in all who believe in Him. And there are many others like you, who love and seek him to fellowship with in your city, who are truly part of the church in your city.

If there is a "local church" associated with the Living Stream Ministry in or near you they will likely (but not always) have a web site with the information you are looking for that has a name "churchinmycity.org", where "my city" is the name of the city like "churchinlosangeles.org".

However, I must warn you that what you have been reading in Watchman Née books is not entirely what you will find.

Most of those who frequent these boards, including me, are former "local church" members of churches that used Living Stream Ministry materials who left dissappointed in what we found there in teaching and practice.

Some who frequent these boards are current members, so they will beg to differ

What is cool about this site is we can actually discuss what is or was good or bad about "the local churches", and thereby learn from it.

I wish you well in Christ,

JJ

[aron]

Originally Posted by zr0w69

Since 2010 i have tried to locate a local church in my but so far have been unable to locate any real local church or members,

The reason you can't find any real local church or its members is because it doesn't exist. It is just an idea, which was useful to separate the Chinese Christians from the Western yoke (the dreaded Denominations). But shortly after they all came crowding into Nee's Little Flock assembly, he "recovered" the Jerusalem Principle. Lo and behold, the churches weren't local at all, but part of a larger Body! And that Body, lo and behold, needed an extra-local apostle! How convenient! Nee knew just the man for the job. "Centralization" followed "locality" like a tail following a dog. They were part and parcel.

Locality never was real. It was merely an idea, a lever, an engine to bring people from someone else's delusion, into Nee's. Out of the frying pan, into the fire.

[Koinonia]

This morning I shared this thread with my wife, and she asked me to contribute the following:

The real experience of "local church life" is in having a heart of expansiveness toward all believers. So, if you feel like you need a congregation, you can attach yourself to some group of believers, but the question is--are you looking for the perfect group, or do you have a heart for all your brothers and sisters wherever they are? The Lord transcends all borders of city and nationality and sect and name and practice and so-called biblical doctrine; we are all sons of God our beloved Father.

So, after years in the LC my realization and experience is--when I have this kind of heart in fellowship toward other believers, there is blessing, and i truly feel the Lord is happy. And I believe that is a taste of the Lord's heart and what we will enjoy for eternity. But I want to take the advantage of the time I have now to experience it in my lifetime.

[UntoHim]

Wow Koinonia,
This is probably the best post in quite a while. Maybe you could just let your wife post and maybe you could pop in every once in awhile if she lets you. (just kiddin bro)

Seriously, I always love a short post that gets to the heart of the matter.

do you have a heart for all your brothers and sisters wherever they are?

Some of the scribes inquired of the Lord Jesus as to what is the most important of the commandments:

Jesus answered, “The most important is, ‘Hear, O Israel: The Lord our God, the Lord is one. And you shall love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind and with all your strength.’ The second is this: ‘You shall love your neighbor as yourself.’ There is no other commandment greater than these.

"wherever they are". If we cannot love the brothers and sisters the Lord has surrounded us with, it may say something about whether we are truly keeping the most basic, essential of commandments. The test may be our neighbor. The test may be our brothers and sisters God has put us with. The test may even be our spouse or family member in our own home. May God have mercy.
-

[OnHisPath]

Originally Posted by Koinonia

This morning I shared this thread with my wife, and she asked me to contribute the following:

Koinonia, tell your wife, "thank you". This is so beautiful and put perfectly into words a truth that I hold in my heart.