02-26-2017, 09:24 AM | #501 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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Yes there are verses in the Bible to people who are in slavery. All Nat Turner proved is that if they revolted it would result in twice as many getting killed and mistreated. Blessed are the meek because they will inherit the earth, that applies to those in slavery. It took 100 years but in the end the nation went down that road and came to an unbridgeable divide where both sides needed the "slaves", hence the North "freed" them. It took another 100 years to get meaningful civil rights legislation and voter rights. It then took another 50 years to get a Black president. In the grand scheme of Human history 250 years is like 6 hours of a single day. People confuse verses that tell the individual to submit to the situation in which they are to justifying unrighteousness. They also confuse a world 4,000 years ago that used slave labor (without an underlying racial bigotry) with today where we have replaced slave labor with machines and fossil fuel. Slavery is not a Christian institution, nor is it a Biblical institution. The Bible instructs people who live in this world to live righteously and that includes treatment of slave labor thousands of years ago. The South's treatment was not righteous and required some kind of racial bigotry to force it on the people.
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02-26-2017, 09:24 AM | #502 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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This discussion was never about hate or group hate, but about fear. It was not me who made it about hate. This is a common liberal ploy. If I say that I am afraid of people who act suspiciously and cover their faces with hoodies or masks, then it gets interpreted as racist group hate. It's not hate, it's fear. I remember one so-called public service commercial on TV. It pictured a white man professionally dressed, and asked, "do you have a problem with him?" Then it changed the picture to a black man professionally dressed, and asked, "do you have a problem with him?" I stood and protested, "NO! I have no problem with either of them!" Then I went on to complain about how deceitful the message was. Why don't they show a public service announcement like this: Picture a black man professionally dressed, and asked, "do you have a problem with him?" Next show a white kid in a hoodie, hanging out at the mall, and ask "do you have a problem with him?" This highlights the dishonesty of today's racial narrative.
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02-26-2017, 09:25 AM | #503 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Slavery in the US was accompanied with many who tried to "justify" it with Bible verses. My guess is that Awareness can give many excellent examples to support this claim.
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02-26-2017, 09:55 AM | #504 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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Shall I maintain the same bigoted attitudes towards all Catholics today for what the Pope did in 1487? And concerning slavery, the Bible is basically neutral towards the institution.
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02-26-2017, 11:56 AM | #505 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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Yes, but apparently Awareness and others were raised in an environment where the Bible was presented as not being neutral.
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02-26-2017, 08:58 PM | #506 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Good point. And perhaps that's why I resisted Mel. My dad made group-hate ugly.
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02-26-2017, 09:06 PM | #507 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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But it was because I saw the failures in the SBC that I was attracted to the local church all-in characteristics. They seemed to be more true. It took me time to discover the hypocrisy in the local church. In the end they both failed me. And I guess I'm a little pissed off about it. Sorry if I'm taking it out on you guys. Y'all never done anything to me. Mea culpa.
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02-26-2017, 10:01 PM | #508 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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And that's what has happened. The Bible has been used to support hate and fear. Is it the Bible's fault? Yes and no. The Bible came from people, living in very hard and scary times. Seems everybody was warring with somebody, in the Bible. And in the Bible even God claims to be a God of war (Exo 15:3). And what about all those wars the Israelites had with various other tribes? Doesn't that kind of thinking sink into the Bible reader? In a sense we could claim that racists come to the Bible, but in another sense we could claim the Bible creates racism into the reader. Maybe it's both ways. Still bro Ohio, as a Christian what do we have to fear? I just don't think the New Man is gripped by fear and hate.
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02-26-2017, 10:06 PM | #509 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
That's a mischaracterization. The Bible regulates slavery, providing rules. But it doesn't forbid it anywhere, both Old and New.
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02-26-2017, 10:10 PM | #510 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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Using Ham is not neutral. Using Ishmael is not neutral.
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02-27-2017, 06:03 AM | #511 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
And Satan appearing as an angel of light is not neutral.
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02-27-2017, 04:07 PM | #512 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Here an angel of light, there an angel of light, everywhere an angel of light.
So where did that response come from? And what does it mean, and to what does it apply? What does a shape-shifting Satan have to do with our discussion (does Satan have a shape - can he dance on the head of a pin?)? Inquiring minds want to know???
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02-27-2017, 06:13 PM | #513 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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Just because someone uses a verse from the Bible to justify their position doesn't make it so, anymore than Satan using the Bible to tempt Jesus. The expression of the Christian position is Jesus. This same Jesus made it very clear that He is the fulfillment of the OT, He didn't come to abolish the law but to fulfill it. Trump quotes the Bible that God's love is made complete in us. Hillary Clinton quotes the Bible "Let us not become weary in doing good, for at the proper time we will reap a harvest if we do not give up." Everyone and anyone can read the Bible, quote the Bible, use the Bible to justify their position. That doesn't make it true. And it certainly does mean that their position and agenda are "Biblical".
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02-28-2017, 10:48 AM | #514 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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That should send a strong warning and signal that we shouldn't trust or use the Bible to support group-hate of any kind. I'm with Jesus on this, according to the gospel we call Matthew: Mat 22:36-40: Master, which is the great commandment in the law? Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. This is the first and great commandment. And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.
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02-28-2017, 11:13 AM | #515 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Bro Ohio has been hard on me for being hard on Christians and Jews but soft on Muslims.
But I can be hard on these Christians and Jews: Christians And Jews Team Up To Help Muslims After Texas Mosque Fire http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/...0af07cb6b8929?
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02-28-2017, 11:25 AM | #516 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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The context was of slavery being the main economy of the day. However, unlike Egypt the Bible prohibited "institutionalized" slavery but with the slavery offered a path to freedom. The Bible records slaves praying for deliverance, God hearing them and sending them Moses. He then performed a number of miracles to release them from the grip of Pharaoh culminating with the defeat of Pharaoh at the Red Sea. The Bible then records God commanding the Israelites to not take advantage of others remembering that "they also were slaves in Egypt". You see the suffering that slaves go through, but what about those who are slaves of sin? Donald Trump has given us a window into the tortured lives of billionaires. Sometimes we forget about the pain and suffering that these billionaires go through but Jesus even came to save them as well.
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02-28-2017, 04:30 PM | #517 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
A Pervert, a Con Artist and a Fascist walk into a bar.
The bartender says, "What'll it be Mr. President?"
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02-28-2017, 05:41 PM | #518 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Hitler struck a chord with everyone who wanted to blame someone else for their failures and defeats. After WWI instead of reflecting on what they had done wrong, their mistakes, their errors, many wanted to blame someone else. Hitler fed this desire. In retrospect from our historical vantage point he is a puny, hateful man. But to those who were looking for permission to find a scapegoat Hitler was "charismatic", "spoke from the heart", "impassioned", with "strength of character". It all depends on the glasses you look at him with. What you thought about Hitler revealed what was in your own heart.
For all the comparisons between Trump and Hitler one needs to remember that Hitler's brand of hate only resonated with a very small number of people in Germany. He never had anything near to the tens of millions that are responding to Trump. To me that is a very big distinction. I find it difficult to believe that 40+ million would have the kind of hateful heart that Hitler had. With Trump I feel the concern is "are we hearing what we want to hear"? Everyone wants more jobs, less chaos, more law and order, safe borders, no terrorist attacks and lower taxes. I was under the impression that the loss of jobs was due to globalization and massive technological change / advances. He is telling us that they are due to poorly negotiated trade deals. I hope he is right. At the very least I think the ability to negotiate trade deals is a very important skill in a President and we will see if he can deliver what he is boasting about. "The truth is most of us discover where we are heading when we arrive" (Calvin and Hobbes)
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03-01-2017, 05:58 AM | #519 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Last night Trump said the time for trivial fights is over. That should leave him with a lot of free time on his hands.
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03-01-2017, 07:10 AM | #520 | |
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I think the privatization of education is a given, I have been preparing for it for about six years. I was stunned to hear that he is suggesting using the money for home schooling, even though I have homeschooled 3 kids for a several years each I think that is a terrible idea. Are people going to pull kids out of school so their parents can get an extra $10,000 per kid? What happens to the stereotypical welfare mother with five kids? Is she now going to pull kids out so she can get $50,000 a year? Is the trailer trash grandma now going to homeschool 10 grandkids so the hillbilly dynasty can make an extra 100k? I also think his plan for success is to shut down all the regulating agencies to get money for his budget proposals. It seems like the fulfillment of the 7 fires prophecy, he is the one choosing cinders and ash road. So much for one bowl and one spoon. That was well and good while there was plenty, but now that Climate change is starting to cause climate refugees it is batton down the hatches, seal the borders, and "I only represent the US". Spoken like a true Wendigo.
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03-01-2017, 09:00 AM | #521 | |
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03-01-2017, 04:02 PM | #522 | |
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I say this because we now see slavery as wrong, and God's morals and ethics are higher than ours, so He must see it as wrong too. If so, then the writers of the books of the Bible failed to pass on this moral high standard against slavery in their writings. Or maybe God became a lying spirit in the hands of the writers for reasons we don't know, and decided not to put an end to slavery. I guess God maybe works sufferings in mysterious ways.
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03-01-2017, 04:55 PM | #523 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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We now see it is cheaper to pay some kid in Indonesia to make our shoes at a minuscule cost without us being responsible for housing, feeding, and caring for him for the rest of his life. If he wants a raise no problem, we'll move the operation to Vietnam. When they want a raise we can go to Malaysia, etc., etc. How are the labor practices in China any better than slavery? We just don't call it slavery, but it is. We have replaced a whole lot of what slaves used to do with appliances, machines, electrical appliances and those run by fossil fuel. We never got rid of slavery because we thought it was morally wrong. We got rid of it when it was no longer economically advantageous. A washing machine, dryer, dishwasher are a whole lot cheaper than a slave. No doubt there were many people who were bothered by it morally, perhaps even Lincoln, but that isn't what paid for the Civil war, nor is it the reason the North and South went to war. Today in the US we have many slaves. Yes it may be technically illegal, but lets be real, slavery is still practiced around the world, and although in some forms it is technically "illegal" in many forms it is the standard operating procedure. The Bible records real slaves being emancipated from one of the cruelest institutionalized slavery in human history. Revelation from the Bible helped our Civil Rights movement, India's emancipation from Britain, and even started in South Africa with Ghandi.
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03-02-2017, 07:10 AM | #524 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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By your definition anyone that is employed is a slave ; you, for example, are a slave to the school bd. But when I think of slavery I think of buying and selling humans like they are livestock, and the Fugitive Slave Act, and the underground railroad ; humans held in captivity. Even your example, of the slavery of the Hebrews in Egypt (if that even really happened), was an example of slaves in captivity. They weren't paid employees, that could quit and walk away. At any rate, I guess you are saying that slavery is just fine with God, and that's why the Bible doesn't forbid it, and therefore the Bible was directly inspired by God, without any cultural influences having any bearing whatsoever on the text. Now that is laughable.
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03-02-2017, 10:09 AM | #525 | |
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Read the Jungle, those conditions in the meat packing plants were worse than slavery for most. Sweatshops pay a rate that will not allow the person to escape poverty so they are essentially a slave until they get sick, in which case they don't work, they don't get paid and they don't have benefits. Also, they then lose their job. Unlike a slave who might get medical care and who had "a job for life". I am not playing loosey goosey with the definition, I am using your definition. What I am saying is that the reason we stopped using slave labor is because it is more expensive than sweatshops. You have to buy, feed, and care for a slave for life even though 20 years of that time might not be profitable work. With a sweatshop they just pay for those who can work. You don't raise them as children prior to when they can work and you don't care for them when they are elderly. There are no health benefits and no vacation time. The average slave had it much better than the average sweatshop worker does today. My point was that you think it was some kind of moral enlightenment that did away with slavery. It was simple economics and greed.
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03-03-2017, 04:51 AM | #526 | |
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03-03-2017, 09:17 AM | #527 | |
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The problem is that it never forbids it. If it had, the West, being of the Bible, wouldn't have participated in the slave trade. And even more important to me, my cradle religion wouldn't have had any Biblical ground to stand on in their support for slavery. Then maybe the states wouldn't have been divided enough for a civil war to happen, and our first republican president wouldn't have killed the republic. If only the Bible, Jesus, and followers thereafter, had forbidden slavery. They didn't. ". . . the idea of human rights, that is, the notion that a human being has a set of inviolable rights simply on grounds of being human, began during the era of renaissance humanism in the early modern period."* It took renaissance humanism, not the Bible, to recognize that slavery was/is wrong. * Reference = "History of human rights" - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_human_rights
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03-03-2017, 02:52 PM | #528 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
I am responding to this on the new thread I started specifically about slavery in the Bible. I would prefer if you (or the moderator) move this question to that thread.
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03-05-2017, 03:37 PM | #529 | |
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The tactic is the same, blame someone else (muslims, Hillary, China, the media, Obama etc), and get people to follow you by making big promises. Like Germany, people followed these dictators because they gave them renewed hope for a better country, a better life, better economy. Trump is unlike these men in the sense that he is perhaps the first Commander in Chief who needs his hand held while walking down the stairs in a bath robe. He has no military experience nor committed any great acts of violence himself. Also, unlike Hitler he does not come from the "grass roots" movement he came to support. He cannot empathize with the people that voted for him or know what they are suffering unless he somehow relates it to his failed business or construction ventures. |
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03-06-2017, 06:53 PM | #530 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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Does anyone know what is going on?
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03-06-2017, 07:17 PM | #531 | |
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03-06-2017, 07:31 PM | #532 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
I'll try to get to it tomorrow, it is 1 1/2 hours and it is too late for me tonight.
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03-13-2017, 03:11 PM | #533 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
President Trump must be held accountable for what he said concerning President Obama.
If he shrugs off these comments he will be an international joke, no credibility. This will cause irreparable damage to the office of the President if he is not held accountable.
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03-13-2017, 06:39 PM | #534 | |
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Have you seen the interview with former congressman Dennis Kucinich? He btw was my mayor when I left Cleveland, and later was congressman for my family home, and whose policies I NEVER agreed with. Obviously NOT a Trump surrogate, and now a huge embarrassment for Obama and Deep State. Two years after DK left congress, journalists played for him his own taped conversations which were illegally obtained under the Obama administration intelligence related to the pending attack on Libya to take out Gaddafi. Just unbelievable! Where are your calls to hold Obama accountable? Where is your feigned outrage about "irreparable damage to the office of the President if Obama is not held accountable?" Obviously Obama was not the one tapping wires and listening to conversations at Trump Tower during the presidential campaign. But he and his people knew! Someone directed them to eavesdrop. That's why he signed that executive order 17 days before leaving office essentially declassifying illegal recordings. That's why he twice applied to FISA court for Trump and Company. Obviously no proof is available because all this covert political action is protected.
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03-13-2017, 06:55 PM | #535 | |
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But if you, as President of the US, are going to accuse the President of the US of committing a felony, then yes, I am serious, you must be accountable. Telling the US citizens that this is the case while at the same time pretending that you have no evidence that this is the case is reprehensible, it is childish, and it is an embarrassment to the US. What this does is destroy the credibility of the US president. I am disgusted with the immature and irresponsible way in which these accusations have been made. It should have been done with the release of an investigation that was conducted at the orders of the president and that issued a report with the same conclusion. Tweeting about this when it is only hearsay, that is utterly shameful for a President. Giving everyone the stiff arm when they ask for the evidence, dancing around this, practicing all manner of deceit instead of answering requests for evidence honestly is shameful.
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03-13-2017, 07:13 PM | #536 | |
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JFK took on the intelligence community. How did it go for him?
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03-13-2017, 08:47 PM | #537 | |
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That's right, ZNP. Don't you realize we have one among us right here on Alt Views who KNOWS what is going on inside the DEEEP STATE? He can't tell us HOW he KNOWS because of course it's TOP SECRET INFORMATION that only he is privy to. So, DROP YOUR CONCEPTS. Don't try to figure out what is going on yourself. Just pay close attention to what he says. His political opinions aren't just opinions like the rest of us peons here. He has the inside track to WHAT IS REALLY GOING ON.
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03-14-2017, 07:42 AM | #538 | |
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Let's suppose for the sake of the argument that Obama did wire tap Trump, yet Trump is completely unable to prove it. This could result in Trump being impeached, adding insult to injury. Now let's look closer at this idea that Trump was wire tapped but is unable to prove it. What would be the purpose of wire tapping Trump's campaign if you are not going to share that information with the DNC and Clinton to help their campaign. All of their emails have been hacked and leaked. Surely the tell tale evidence would be in those emails as they communicate with each other the information. Therefore all Trump needs to do is hire a few graduate students to go through the emails looking for evidence that they had advance knowledge of his campaigns inner discussions. Who is really being naive?
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03-14-2017, 07:44 AM | #539 | |
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03-14-2017, 07:59 AM | #540 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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03-14-2017, 09:47 AM | #541 | |
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Did you see Hannity's March 8, 2017 interview with Lt. Col. Tony Shaffer, a retired intelligence officer, and Bill Binney, a former NSA officer? Shaffer was privately told, apparently by former colleagues, that it was US officials which hacked the DNC. Our intelligence community has also long had the technical ability to leave Russian "fingerprints" on these cyber crimes. Classical frame up. Any idea how powerful these guys are? Do you understand "false flags?" We already have members of Congress, both Democrat (Senator Jeanne Shaheen) and Republican (i.e. Senators John McCain and Lindsey Graham) claiming what Russia did (actually done by US operatives framing Russia) was an act of war. .................................................. ........................ Here's another source that shows how intel really works in the 21st century.
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03-14-2017, 09:48 AM | #542 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Interesting. Should I now think more highly of zeek than I ought to think?
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03-14-2017, 10:52 AM | #543 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Perhaps zeek only wants it to appear like his account was hacked by a 12 year old Russian girl, when actually his own artificial cyber intelligence directed the hack. One can only wonder.
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03-14-2017, 08:34 PM | #544 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
In hell nobody laughs at themself.
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03-14-2017, 08:42 PM | #545 |
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I thought you disproved hell for lack of scientific evidence.
Isn't hell contrary to your progressive liberal value system?
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03-15-2017, 01:30 PM | #546 | |
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She discovered hackers with government IP addresses turning her computer on and off during the night, doing computer searches on both her work and personal computers, uploading, downloading, and her deleting her files. Eventually she had the DOJ (Department of Justice, under Eric Holder) Inspector General’s office sent investigators to look at her computers. Their "official" investigation concluded that her "backspace key was stuck." Yup, that will turn your computer on and off in the middle of the night every time. For Trump to say that Obama wire-tapped Trump's communications, is like saying Putin invaded Ukraine. Did Putin really enter Ukraine? No, of course not, his people did.
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03-15-2017, 01:45 PM | #547 | |
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Making this accusation without proof is a crime (slander, libel) that could lead to impeachment. If Nixon can be forced to resign over watergate then falsely accusing someone of Watergate like crimes should also rise to the level of high crimes and misdemeanors. As I have already said, if a crime was committed it would have been used to assist Clinton in her campaign. Since all of those emails have been leaked they should be able to provide evidence of the Democrats getting inside information on the Trump campaign. I have been carefully following this new administration from day 1 and I have seen much more evidence presented indicative of collusion between the Russians and Trump's campaign than I have seen concerning Obama wire tapping Trump. I also consider it ridiculous to think that Obama would violate so many laws in doing a "watergate" scandal without using the information to assist Clinton's campaign. If He did assist Clinton I think the smoking gun would have to be there in the emails. On the other hand if it turns out that Trump's campaign is in fact found to have colluded with the Russians I also want Trump to be charged with obstruction of justice with this baseless claim put forth as a smokescreen and distraction.
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03-15-2017, 05:15 PM | #548 | ||
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Then every politician and journalist needs to be locked up! Just for starters. Quote:
It just all depends where you get your news.
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03-15-2017, 05:41 PM | #549 | |
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Do you remember when the 60 minutes interview with the Tobacco executive aired? Big Tobacco tried to smear him with a 500 pages of lies, misinformation, distortion, etc. Real journalists tracked down every source, verified every accusation and concluded that it was a smear campaign. Big Tobacco was trying to discredit this key witness before his testimony could be heard, instead they got caught in their lies, and I assume you know the rest. Liars must be held accountable for every word. I am completely disgusted with Trump, Conway, Spicer and the rest of them trying to walk back what they said. Trump's words were very clear, an illegal surveillance (a la Watergate) at the order of Obama on Trump tower. Trying to spin what was said into anything else is a lie. For a president to do this is not only disgraceful but irresponsible and unbefitting the post. To make this claim and then not support it with evidence is childish and despicable. The Wall Street Journal called the attack on Wigand as the "lowest form of smear campaign". This is what I see from Trump and his minions. I am not listening to a 3rd party interpret the quotes for me, I can hear it from their own mouths.
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03-15-2017, 06:10 PM | #550 | |
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Can you prove that no one in the Obama administration tapped Trump's phones? Of course not, because we now know, via Snowden, that not just Trump's lines were tapped but yours and mine too! Not just metadata, but the whole conversation, sitting in cyber space ready to be mined for evil. We know it, but can never prove it. But I have already provided plenty of evidence to prove my point. Unfortunately, you don't agree, but that's OK. To be honest, I did not like Trump initially, and did not vote for him in the primary. To me he was the rude and crude school yard bully. The same goes for many of my friends and family. But the more the media hates on him, spewing their daily bias, spinning everything, the more I like the guy, and the more I like his decisions and his selection of people around him.
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03-15-2017, 06:58 PM | #551 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
No, I think the lack of evidence falls on the Bible. It, not science, invented hell. Yet the Bible is so confusing on the matter that it's hard to draw indisputable conclusions about it. Maybe we need to discuss it on a different thread.
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Is it so they can say, "Liberals go to hell?"
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03-15-2017, 07:12 PM | #552 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Hell is an evocative symbol.
Eternal punishment does seem kind of pointless now that you mention it.
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03-15-2017, 07:29 PM | #553 |
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Microsoft does this day and night. World round. Face it, everyone is listening. Want to say something to The Donald, say it here. He's reading it right now. And if it's good he'll maybe twitter-twat about it (he admits to liking twats and grabbing them). Just a ready-made Candidate for evangelical Christians. What would Jesus think?
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03-15-2017, 07:37 PM | #554 | |
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03-15-2017, 07:40 PM | #555 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
You mean from anywhere but Fox, right? Well maybe Breitbart too.
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03-15-2017, 07:44 PM | #556 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Do you really like Bannon?
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03-15-2017, 07:51 PM | #557 |
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03-15-2017, 08:12 PM | #558 | |
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And, btw, your disdain for Christians is getting the best of you.
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03-15-2017, 08:38 PM | #559 | |
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03-16-2017, 01:22 AM | #560 | |
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But what's that got to do with obama's people hacking reporters' computers?
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03-16-2017, 04:40 AM | #561 | ||
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Quote:
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03-16-2017, 04:44 AM | #562 | ||
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Quote:
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03-16-2017, 04:57 AM | #563 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
The thing that bothers me the most about that tweet is Trump's use of the word "sacred". I feel he has no business handling things that are "sacred" and the idea that his campaign was "sacred" is just a slap in the face to all things that truly are sacred.
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03-16-2017, 06:24 AM | #564 | |
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The time is coming when democratic elections will be a sacred relic from the past. Look at Israel. The only democracy in the region, yet the UN is so biased against them. Unelected mooslim dictators slaughter millions and don't get the condemnations Israel gets for building houses. I think Trump is right to refer to them as "sacred," not in a spiritual sense, but in a human one -- something revered as untouchable because of its great value to civilization. That's why rampant voter fraud by the Democratic party is so troubling. When I heard that one major city had 100% voter turnout, and 100% Democratic vote -- that by definition is voter fraud. It's no wonder that they see legitimate voter ID's as prohibitive, racist, xenophobic, etc.
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03-16-2017, 06:26 AM | #565 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
You don't know any of those you claim to like that Trump has gathered around him ... yet said you like them. And of course you know Bannon ; the founder of Breitbart ... and notorious white nationalist, and prolly supremacist ; the KKK love him. He's Trump's brain. These are the types Trump has gathered, and you said you like them.
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03-16-2017, 06:30 AM | #566 | |
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No one in the intelligentcia simply "comes forward" to talk.
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03-16-2017, 06:40 AM | #567 | |
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I prefer Bannon to Valerie Jarrett, the brains of the last prez. Let's talk about her. For starters: the father, maternal grandfather, and father-in-law of President Barack Obama's closest adviser, Valerie Jarrett, "were hardcore Communists under investigation by the U.S. government." She is also Iranian. Do you see the connections to Obama's treaty with Iran? Go read about her.
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03-16-2017, 06:43 AM | #568 |
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03-16-2017, 06:49 AM | #569 | |
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Righto. But did more than 80% of evangelical's support them? Did Jerry Falwell and Billy Graham support them. like their Jr.'s?
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Or maybe I'm still infused with Witness Lee's disdain for Christianity (did you not get that memo?): If so, let me remind you of how Christianity has failed you. He didn't call the Southern Baptist's demonic: "Judaism is Satanic Catholicism is demonic and Christianity is christless." - Witness Lee
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03-16-2017, 07:28 AM | #570 | |
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No matter how bad you think things were for you, someone else was far worse off. No matter how bad the Christian system around you had become, within that rotten shell was the loving Savior Jesus, Who loves you, and gave His life for your sins.
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03-16-2017, 08:06 AM | #571 |
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03-16-2017, 10:19 AM | #572 | |
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03-16-2017, 10:31 AM | #573 | |
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03-16-2017, 10:42 AM | #574 | |
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For example, with me personally, I will always be thankful that the LC's helped me to speak publicly. I was a self-conscious kid with serious stage-fright when I first stood up in a meeting. But I was encouraged by others, and given lots of opportunity in small churches to practice. I will always treasure those times I was able to speak for the Lord publicly.
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03-16-2017, 10:45 AM | #575 | |
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Meet your new mayor!
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03-16-2017, 11:05 AM | #576 |
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To the degree that Trump and his cabinet succeed enacting his agenda, the US will have a government of the billionaires, by the billionaires, for the billionaires.
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03-16-2017, 11:40 AM | #577 | |
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Far better to have successful men and women, in the peak of their career, already quite accomplished in industry, who desire to give back to their country, than it is to have power hungry community organizers, those who never had a job, who hate what America stands for, to use their positions to abuse their power, gather billions for themselves, attempt to destroy the character of our republic, and the constitution it was build on.
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03-16-2017, 11:56 AM | #578 |
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Oh boy. No wonder Obama was so lousy. He spent all his time hacking and tapping. I hear he can even hack and make it look like the Russians did it. He weren't no good at presidenting, but he sure could hack up a storm. Listen to Fox. They aren't fake news. haha
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03-16-2017, 12:05 PM | #579 | |
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Did you read any of the stories? You remind me of that LSM brother who preferred to be an ostrich with his head in the sand. Time for you to leave the LC my friend!
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03-16-2017, 12:06 PM | #580 | |
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03-16-2017, 12:22 PM | #581 | |
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Not to mention how well Obama did for Wall St. At the expense of Main St. of course.
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03-16-2017, 04:51 PM | #582 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
I'm trying. How 'bout you?
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03-16-2017, 05:11 PM | #583 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
It was Wall St. that Broke Main St. Obama is gone, but not Wall St. In fact Wall St. is in the Trump admin. But keep blaming Obama, while letting Wall St. off the hook. So they can do it all again. They're blowing the bubble right now. But not to worry. Main St. can bail them out again.
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03-16-2017, 07:19 PM | #584 | |
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Let's be realistic, neither Trump nor Clinton are the messiah. Neither one is responsible for the situation we are in and neither one is capable of getting us out of this situation. If you are looking for a savior His name is Jesus.
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03-17-2017, 06:23 AM | #585 |
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The Senate Intelligence Committee says they see no indication that President Obama ordered wiretapping or surveillance of Trump Tower. Trump says he learned Obama tapped his phones from the New York Times. Why is Trump standing by his slanderous allegation?
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03-17-2017, 06:50 AM | #586 | |
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They don't care if everybody burns, as long as they get their Jesus. That's why evangelicals went for Trump. That and the fact that he'll ban all Muslims. The courts are interfering with Armageddon.
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03-17-2017, 06:57 AM | #587 | |
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Most working class Christians I know just wanted a Prez that would protect their jobs and their families, and stop giving freebies to illegal aliens.
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03-17-2017, 08:02 AM | #588 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
I knew you'd love it. I wrote it just for you.
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03-17-2017, 10:12 AM | #589 | |
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3d printing will eliminate much of the manufacturing. They even recently used a 3d printer to make a house in less than a week. Most people are opting for ordering online rather than going to the mall, as a result clerks and cashiers will be put out of business. Some Restaurants are experimenting with taking your order via a smartphone app, eliminating the waitress. Soon you will log online, order what you want, it will be pulled from the shelf with a robot or printed out with a 3d printer, packed in a box and shipped by a robot, driven to your town with a self driving vehicle and flown to your house via a drone. If you wanted to "protect jobs" you should have voted for the candidate that was offering free college tuition.
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03-17-2017, 11:31 AM | #590 | |
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The Trump budget contradicts the populism he campaigned on. It eliminates or cuts organizations like the Appalachian Regional Commission and the Great Lakes Restoration Initiative that are important to people from Tennessee and West Virginia up through Ohio and Michigan. It cuts job-training and road-building programs. It does almost nothing to help expand opportunity for the working class and almost everything to serve defense contractors and the national security state. Scapegoating immigrants was Trump's fascist appeal to the baser instincts of the working class in order to get himself elected. He will continue to blame them and the liberals for the woes of working class folks. That should appeal to you very much.
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03-17-2017, 06:54 PM | #591 | |||
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Quote:
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Look, it is going to get very ugly, just look at what has happened to Britain since their Brexit. Therefore he is going to have to blame someone, news media and immigrants and don't forget teachers. That is the best way to privatize education and turn all those inner city kids into a profit making machine.
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03-18-2017, 06:16 AM | #592 | |
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03-18-2017, 07:34 AM | #593 |
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Trump supporters put your blinders on when reading the last three posts.
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03-18-2017, 09:40 AM | #594 |
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Please say something accurate and intelligent so I can respond to it.
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03-18-2017, 07:13 PM | #595 | |
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After all, this is the Politics and the Church thread. Politics is not allowed to interfere in religious matters, so our constitution dictates. But really, should the church interlope into politics? Is that what Jesus would advise his church to do? Methinks politics is too dirty for Jesus. Is this intelligent enough for you? or is it not accurate enough to warrant a response?
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03-19-2017, 04:18 AM | #596 | |
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03-19-2017, 05:44 AM | #597 | |
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And even before the WWW, or Silicon Valley, computers said to be made in America, were put together with Chinese parts inside. Cheap labor is cheap labor. But yes, I guess you can say Apple is part of Silicon Valley.
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03-19-2017, 01:11 PM | #598 | |
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03-19-2017, 01:15 PM | #599 | |
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The Washing machine, dishwasher, refrigerator, and stove have all made the job of "homemaking" much simpler, allowing women to work in the workforce. Yes, these appliances did "take away jobs from women" but open your eyes, that opened the door for better jobs.
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03-19-2017, 05:25 PM | #600 | |
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03-19-2017, 05:34 PM | #601 | |
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Before the washing machine etc, women did not have to work in the workforce. A one person income was sufficient. I think some women would prefer to stay at home and raise children then be forced to work for a living, in any job. Yes the jobs that machines replace can open the door for better jobs however with every machine comes a net loss in the number of jobs available. It is not a one machine to one person ratio. Machines can do it much faster and better. Also, some might argue that replacing a physical job with a sitting behind a desk job is not a better job (if you are a physically active person, that is, and overall computer work is not good for health). That is why companies now can run with only 10 staff whereas 20 years ago they needed 100 staff. Better jobs can result but also fewer jobs. A job which used to take 10 people to do, can be replaced by 1 machine and 1 machine supervisor/operator. So there is a net loss in the number of jobs available. At the same time, with population growth, there is more people who need jobs. So less jobs available and more people who need them means more unemployment. It is not just machines part of this problem but also software. Better software can replace jobs that people had to do by hand. The job of the person who would transcribe interviews and notes etc has been replaced by automatic speech to text software and things like this. Extrapolate to the future when machines will do everything and everyone will need to depend upon a minimum wage. There will be lots of people with not much to do. So governments will need to pay everyone a base salary whether they work or not, so that people can survive. They tried this idea already in some country in Europe I think. |
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03-19-2017, 07:58 PM | #602 | |
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03-20-2017, 05:17 AM | #603 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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The reason married women work in the workforce is because the ground has been cursed, man has to work by the sweat of his brow for his sin. When some women entered the workforce married women were afraid that their husbands would leave the frumpy housewife with two kids for the secretary, so they were afraid, shipped kids off to day care, went to work and spent their paychecks on clothes, cars and hair salon. In addition to that you have a bunch of broken families, single mothers, again a curse as a result of sin. Abortion (close to 100 million in the US since legalization) is not due to rape or incest. It is due to women who want to advance their career and feel a child at this point is inconvenient. It is the real "inconvenient truth". Who suffers? The kids. Just as the Bible says, God will visit the sins of the fathers on the children. It is well documented that a healthy diet is much better for a developing child than a high carb junk food diet the kid is going to get with the working mother juggling family, career and day care. It is also well documented that children raised in the home by the mother are much better developed psychologically. These are obviously averages with the worst nightmare for a mother being worse than the best day care, but let's be real, the worst nightmare for daycare is pretty horrific.
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03-20-2017, 05:23 AM | #604 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Life is like riding a bicycle, the minute you stop pedaling you fall over.
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03-20-2017, 08:00 AM | #605 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
You got me thinking, so I read this article about Bannon by Bloomberg News couple years ago.
What it really explained to me was why crooked Hillary lost.
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03-20-2017, 08:58 AM | #606 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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But you didn't answer my question. Do you really like Bannon?
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03-20-2017, 09:21 AM | #607 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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I mean you seem to have issues with me even liking the Bible.
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03-20-2017, 09:24 AM | #608 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
You have to learn how to coast. Same goes for driving cars.
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03-20-2017, 09:34 AM | #609 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Just don't make a sharp turn in gravel. You might break something.
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03-20-2017, 10:08 AM | #610 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Good advice.
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03-20-2017, 02:36 PM | #611 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Neil deGrasse Tyson (tweet):
"The very best way to support and feed your delusions: Surround yourself with people whose world views match yours exactly." Sounds like the local church to me ... and a lot of other cults too ... and Trump & Co.
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03-20-2017, 04:43 PM | #612 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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Since I am the only conservative here, it sure doesn't apply to me. Can't apply to Trump since the entire media is against him. Anyways, I been thinking about giving up something for Lent. Perhaps Alt-Views would be perfect thing to give up, more difficult than sweets. See you later.
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03-20-2017, 05:20 PM | #613 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Trump is building his reputation around the world as the "Liar in Chief", particularly with his nonsense about wiretapping and Germany "owing NATO". Whatever credibility he had (if any) when coming to power, is being eroded away with every tweet.
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03-20-2017, 05:32 PM | #614 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
I came miraculously close to being killed that way.
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03-20-2017, 06:52 PM | #615 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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03-20-2017, 08:21 PM | #616 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
I'm sad that bro Ohio is leaving AltV's. But then I'm a mugwump, and it's hard for me to surround myself with other mugwumps that hold my world view.
But that allows me to love those that don't hold my world view, and I like to surround myself with those that don't hold my world view. I guess I don't get it. Jesus said love your neighbor and even your enemies. But Christians, typically but not always conservative, can't love those that don't hold their world view. Why? Aren't they followers of Jesus first an foremost? I guess not. So I repeat. Politics is too dirty for Jesus.
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03-20-2017, 08:27 PM | #617 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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03-21-2017, 05:30 AM | #618 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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03-21-2017, 06:02 AM | #619 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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I remember trying a few times to get you to come back to LCD. Now it's your turn to call bro Ohio back to AltVs.
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03-21-2017, 05:30 PM | #620 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
As Ohio goes to celebrate the Feast of Tammuz, from the Catholic point of view giving up things for Lent is supposed to replicate Jesus's 40 days in the desert being tempted by Satan. So there is precedent for one staying in the "desert" of Alt. views. to be "tempted by Satan" to deny Trump, God's chosen President.
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03-22-2017, 04:26 AM | #621 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Maybe if his posts are not referred to as "delusions" but given the respect he has earned he would take my call.
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03-22-2017, 04:56 AM | #622 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
On Monday, James Comey, Director of the FBI revealed that since July 2016 the Trump administration has been under investigation for ties to Russia. Why didn't he reveal that in October when he revealed that the FBI was resuming investigation of Hilary Clinton's email server?
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03-22-2017, 05:02 AM | #623 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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Trump has told you repeatedly the system is rigged. Does anybody even look at this from his point of view? He was bankrupt, couldn't get a loan so he went to the only place where he could get the money to save his business, Russian loan sharks. He got in bed with them literally, and they have it on video tape. The poor guy is trapped by these Russian mobsters. He can't see them in the Whitehouse, can't talk to them on the phone, the only way to communicate is on the golf course, and after how he condemned others for doing just that. He sent Spicer out with the upside down flag to let us know and does anyone care? No, too busy making jokes and insults.
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03-23-2017, 07:18 AM | #624 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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The most despicable thing about this story is that no one stood up to refute this allegation using the Bible. Awareness is living in la la land. References to religion, culture and the Bible cannot be outlawed or forbidden. That would be censorship of the worst kind. He would respond to one idiot by turning the US into a censorship of the most draconian kind. Say goodbye to the first amendment, this is not freedom or religion, it is outlawing all references to religion. It seems Awareness is getting his inspiration from Karl Marx, Vladimir Lenin and Stalin. What is next, pushing people out of windows who don't comply to your censorship a la Putin? Therefore, just like refuting a trump tweet, people in politics need to know the Bible well enough to hold this guy accountable and shut him down.
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03-24-2017, 01:47 PM | #625 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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03-25-2017, 05:28 PM | #626 | |
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03-26-2017, 05:09 PM | #627 |
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The Hypocrite in Chief
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03-26-2017, 05:42 PM | #628 | |
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03-27-2017, 07:39 AM | #629 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Winning for who?
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03-27-2017, 11:49 AM | #630 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
I think at this point I have to agree with Trump. I do not think he has "won" on a single point, although the final judgement has yet to come down I think on numerous points we are seeing him lose, lose, lose. Which of course means that the American people are winning, democracy is winning and the free press is winning. We are winning so much it is becoming boring.
But even more stunning I am growing bored of this. At first his rants were riveting TV, now they are becoming more and more obviously the delusions of a pitiful embarrassment to both the US and his family. He is now going after Paul Ryan, is there anyone left in the Republican party he is not going after? He is clueless when it comes to consensus and coalitions. What happens when they have to vote on impeachment, will he have any friends at all? Like he said this last vote has taught us about loyalty. He has none. So I am not enjoying this, it is like an NFL team beating up on a sub par HS team with the "star quarterback" who is nothing but a loudmouth egotistical jerk. This loss on healthcare is truly stunning. He doesn't want to call it Trump care, or Ryancare, or Republicancare, so I guess "I don't care" is the best name for it. That was basically his response. Sure they were all elected based on this one issue, and sure the Republicans have the majority and should be able to pass something based solely on Republican votes. They are all trumpeting the fact that Obamacare is "blowing up". They are the ones in power. Yet they do not seem to care. They did this prior to the budget, how hard would it have been to negotiate with those against the health care by offering something in the budget? But again, he is right. It is boring watching someone who is truly incompetent. What is interesting is watching a genius at work or a master of their craft. In the collective wisdom of the people they have put someone completely incompetent in power, like pouring sugar into the gas tank of the car. This is what happens when the government is overrun by lobbyists and no longer cares about the people, the best thing to do is junk the car so it doesn't run at all.
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03-27-2017, 09:26 PM | #631 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Yes Trump has risen to a job which is beyond his level of competence. But, can anything prevent him from having his Reichstag fire?
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03-28-2017, 05:11 AM | #632 | |
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Trump does not compare very well with Hitler, the best comparison to Hitler today is Putin. Taking the Ukraine can be viewed as Hitler rolling into Austria. Coming into the fray in Syria, maybe Poland. Putin has taken a country devastated by the cold war, economic ruin, headed by a buffoon, and completely turned it around so that they have become very nationalistic and very scary. I would not want to be Eastern Europe today. I think a better analogy for Trump is Neville Chamberlain.
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03-28-2017, 08:28 AM | #633 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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03-28-2017, 09:28 AM | #634 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Trump needs it and has the wherewithal to create it. I hope not, but wouldn't be surprised if it happened.
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03-28-2017, 11:54 AM | #635 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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03-28-2017, 11:58 AM | #636 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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He has abysmally low popularity ratings. The only ally he had, Paul Ryan, he is now throwing under the bus. The conservatives have rejected him. Who has Trump not alienated? He has acted like someone completely incompetent. This is very different from Hitler who was underestimated. By comparison Trump is overestimated. We have a crucial superpower being led by a complete incompetent at a time when both Russia and China are unnervingly scary and making very aggressive moves. Trump is our chump, he is our Neville Chamberlain. Will North Korea, or Pakistan or ISIS be the trigger that sets off the crisis? Take your pick, the world is soon going to realize we have a power vacuum in the US and they will fill that vacuum.
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03-28-2017, 05:37 PM | #637 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Wow, I was not aware that this was treasonous. Today I mixed mayo and ketchup together on a sandwich. It wasn't technically Russian dressing, but is it treasonous? I don't know? Should we ask Shawn Spicer? Will he yell at us? Has anyone seen anything like this before?
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03-29-2017, 04:53 AM | #638 | |
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03-29-2017, 07:04 AM | #639 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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The Reichstag fire is a prime example of a "false flag" event. That makes it special, unique. Hitler didn't benefit as a result of coincidence but as a result of deceit, manipulation and evil. Comparing 911 to the Reichstag fire will obviously be interpreted by many as you saying they are both false flag events. If you are not saying that then it definitely matters, it is clearly going to cause confusion and misunderstanding. There are many, myself included, who feel that 911 was a false flag event. If there wasn't any suggestion that 911 was a false flag event then maybe you would be right, but since there are many that do believe it was a false flag event and compare it to the Reichstag fire for exactly that reason, Hitler used the fire to bring in certain laws opening the door for his dictatorship, 911 was used to pass the Patriot act, which has many similarities to the laws Hitler passed in Germany.
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03-29-2017, 05:53 PM | #640 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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Oh the irony. |
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03-30-2017, 07:23 AM | #641 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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03-30-2017, 07:52 AM | #642 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Don't you care? It was a trillion dollar war paid for with US tax dollars. It caused the rise of ISIS. You might argue that we had Al Qaeda, but what if that was a smoke screen and Al Qaeda was actually a front, similar to the "communist" accused of burning down the Reichstag? In that case we substituted a false enemy with a real one.
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03-31-2017, 04:39 PM | #643 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Trump recently threatened certain politicians with payback for the defeat of his healthcare bill. Some in the media have characterized this behavior as childish. However, when one of those threatened was asked if this behavior from the President was appropriate he responded "if you are in fifth grade". Now although it might be technically correct to characterize 5th grade behavior as childish, I think the more appropriate term is juvenile.
I really hope the media can put a stop to this obvious bias, the president is not acting childish, he is acting juvenile.
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03-31-2017, 06:55 PM | #644 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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03-31-2017, 07:12 PM | #645 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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04-01-2017, 11:29 AM | #646 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Being likened to Trump?
Reminds me of the guy who went into a bar in Montana and started griping about the "current" president, calling him a horse's behind, and promptly got decked. So he picked himself up and went down to the other end of the bar and asked a guy there, "What's with this place. Is this Clinton country?" "No. It's horse country."
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04-02-2017, 10:11 AM | #647 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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Here's an example: Newspaper publisher threatens to sue state lawmaker over ‘fake news’ claim http://www.theblaze.com/news/2017/02...ke-news-claim/
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04-02-2017, 11:43 AM | #648 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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04-02-2017, 12:25 PM | #649 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Honest people don't go around saying "believe me" constantly ... unless they are unbelievable ... and that he is indeed.
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04-02-2017, 01:27 PM | #650 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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What about his comments that asking for immunity indicates that you have committed a crime and then encouraging Flynn to seek immunity? Do you believe that?
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04-05-2017, 10:11 AM | #651 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
I see some eery comparisons between the period prior to WWI and today.
1. There were four major powers: Britain, France, Russia and Germany. Today I would equate those four with US, Nato, China and Russia. 2. Britain felt that the bigger threat was Russia, hence their foreign policy was designed to favor Russia and disadvantage Germany. Today the US sees China as the bigger threat and we favor China and disadvantage Russia. 3. France had an active policy of containment towards Germany. Today Nato has an active policy of containment towards Russia. 4. France insulted Germany when they seized Morocco. I see Hillary Clinton’s treatment of Russia as also insulting and analogous. The French error led to the resignation of a seasoned and experienced man (Declasse) in charge of foreign policy who was replaced with a novice (Rouvier). Clinton’s insults to Russia have led to her loss of the election and being replaced with a novice. We are now sending Kushner around handling our foreign policy. 5. Germany was forced to attempt to break up the alliances of Britain and France, and also of France and Russia. Today Russia is forced to break up the alliances of the US and Nato and the West with China. This is what is so concerning about the allegations concerning Trump, not just that he has colluded with Russia, but that he is also undermining the alliance with Nato. Taking the phone call from Taiwan was a major slap in the face to China. We will soon see what he does with China. He clearly signaled earlier this week that it would be OK for Syria to do as they wish without US interference. He has thrown three very big wrenches into our alliances with Nato and China, not to mention many little insults as well.
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04-06-2017, 07:48 AM | #652 | |
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04-06-2017, 12:12 PM | #653 | |
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Terrorists in Serbia were no worse than today's ISIS, North Korea and Syria. Whatever happened to the evolution of man? Last night I heard one of these Trump apologists trying to compare Trump's foreign policy with Russia to that of Nixon with China. Comparing Trump and Kushner with Nixon and Kissinger, That is how idiotic these people are. Nixon may have been a crook, but when it came to foreign policy and geopolitics he was in a master league. Teddy Roosevelt, FDR, Eisenhower, or even Nixon. We used to have world class leaders and that is what we need. My point is that in the historical sense we are in "treacherous" waters. We need a very capable captain to guide this ship through these waters. Trump is not that person. How do we know? Syria. ISIS is calling him an idiot. You cannot allow these terrorists to think the US is being led by a buffoon. China called his bluff about "currency manipulator". They can't have any respect for him and they must view him as a very serious enemy after his little stunt with Taiwan. I think they gave North Korea the green light to start shooting off these missiles to blackmail Trump. Instead of adding a point I would greatly prefer removing Trump. I can't see how we avoid catastrophe on a historic scale with him as president. Russia is so isolated and has so few allies how can they afford to give up their foothold in Syria and hence the Mid East? China will calculate South Korea is a fair trade for Taiwan, so we see this mess in North Korea as insane, they see Trump as insane. ISIS views the US as an evil empire that uses Muslims as the "boogey man" to justify their undo influence and manipulation of leaders in the Middle East. In every case I see Trump as making things worse, not better.
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04-06-2017, 01:16 PM | #654 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
I do not know where the statement came from, but one of those banners under the CCN or Fox News talking heads yesterday indicated that someone had suggested that before the term is up, there is a decent chance that Trump could be in jail.
Not sure I buy it, but it would be a definite first. (Don't ask for specifics. I just saw it in passing walking through our building at work.)
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04-07-2017, 04:57 AM | #655 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
It was Ukraine's interest in joining NATO that prompted Russia's invasion, and that invasion has put Montenegro on notice, who was also invited to join NATO.
If you liken the Austro-Hungarian empire at the turn of the last century to the UN with a bunch of different ethnicities stitched together in a patchwork quilt, it was clear then that Russia had a vested interest in seeing that arrangement fail. So then, what is the purpose of Syria using Sarin gas in direct violation of the UN laws except to tell these people that it is a waste of time to appeal to the UN. These are the same civilians who have been pouring into Europe and are a humanitarian crisis that the UN is supposed to reconcile. If we look at both the Ukraine invasion and this recent action by Syria we can see very clearly what Russia's "red line" is. When that line is crossed they don't give a press conference, they act. They will not willingly cede power and authority to either NATO or the UN. Russia is acting like a cornered animal. When you have an animal that is cornered you want to open up a way of escape for them. You could view the melting arctic and the huge oil field as that "way of escape". When Clinton seemingly stood in the way of that once again Russia acted to get rid of her.
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04-07-2017, 10:40 AM | #656 | |
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04-07-2017, 11:45 AM | #657 | |
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His strike was appropriate, decisive, timely, and measured. He attacked the airbase which launched the chemical weapons. He sent a message to Obama, Assad, Putin, Kim Jong-un, and the Ayatollah Khamenei. ....... Just passing by, wanted to say hi to all my Trump-hating friends!
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04-07-2017, 04:34 PM | #658 | |
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04-07-2017, 05:18 PM | #659 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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Liberalism is a mental disorder -- Michael Savage.
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04-07-2017, 05:33 PM | #660 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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04-07-2017, 05:35 PM | #661 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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04-07-2017, 06:59 PM | #662 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
I hate to break it to you Ohio, but Hillary said that the US should attack the airfields before Trump decided to do it:
https://qz.com/952656/hours-before-t...ads-airfields/ Hillary has been the the one who thought airstrikes against Assad was a good idea. Trump has always opposed it, until now. I can imagine, that while he was in his bathrobe sitting in bed using the inter net, he probably heard or read about Hillary's thoughts and decided it was a good idea. He's just backflipped on "not being the world's policeman" in a big way. It's got me thinking that Hillary & co. has him on a proverbial leash. There may be something else at play here - Trump sides with Hillary, secures his presidency, meanwhile distances himself from Russia by attacking Russian interests. |
04-07-2017, 07:43 PM | #663 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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Now Trump is great again. And the world knows he has expensive weapons (1 million per Tomahawk) and will use them. Trump needs to look great. He's obsessed with it, it's a compulsion, a fetish of some kind. He needs it so bad that he might even make World War's great again.
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04-08-2017, 06:14 AM | #664 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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He claimed to be shocked by the killing of innocent babies by chemical weapons. But he was against taking action when Assad struck innocent babies with toxic chemicals in the past and he has been unwilling to offer asylum to the innocent babies of Syria in the past. Trump is nothing if not duplicitous and self-contradictory. Now he has put the world on alert. Still, that plus approval of his pick Gorsuch for the SCOTUS makes this his best week so far. Heaven help us all.
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04-08-2017, 06:56 AM | #665 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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04-08-2017, 07:33 AM | #666 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Hey, hey!!! Lent isn't over. But glad yer back.
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04-08-2017, 01:21 PM | #667 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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I have to admit that I tended to agree with his underlying politics (or at least what was said to be his politics on the show). But I despised his demeanor and rancor. And I would say that his gross disdain for anyone not generally in agreement with him suggested that he might have a mental disorder. One in which he was able to basically hate anyone not agreeing with him and call it righteous. Michael Savage is not someone I would want to mention in the context of politics and the CHURCH. He is the antithesis of what kind of politics the people of God should have. And as far as the church is concerned: Conservatism is not Christian Liberalism is not Christian Socialism is not Christian Capitalism is not Christian Love God and your neighbor as yourself is Christian I just couldn't get much love for anyone out of listening to Michael Savage.
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04-08-2017, 02:40 PM | #668 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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04-08-2017, 02:50 PM | #669 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
To Trump everything he does is great. Even if it's not great, or not as great as Obama, he'll say and believe that it is great. Cuz he's great. He'll tell you, and back it up with plenty of "believe me's."
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04-09-2017, 01:50 AM | #670 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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04-09-2017, 05:16 AM | #671 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Trump's ineffectual missle strike was an attempt to avert attention from his collusion with Russia. The US is still mired in Syrian proxy war with no end in sight.
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04-09-2017, 06:25 AM | #672 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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Still, it only took 59 Tomahawk missiles, costing a pittance of only 59 million (plus expenses), to make Trump great again. Go Trump. Keep on being great ... even if it takes WWIII.
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04-09-2017, 09:46 AM | #673 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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Syria's use of Sarin gas is a very clear violation of the UN rules and the world needed someone to take the lead. If the US hadn't reacted it would have meant UN laws are a sham. Tit for Tat is a legitimate strategy in game theory, adding the option to forgive in certain situations is the ideal strategy. Trump's action was clearly a Tit for Tat. He hit the air base that used the Sarin Gas with a lot of missiles and it sent a very clear message that Syria will pay if they do this again. On the other hand you don't want to destroy Syria's air force because that would open the door for ISIS. It seems clear to me this was a plan developed by the Pentagon, it was implemented cleanly without any loss of US life, and it sent a very clear message -- use chemical weapons and you will pay a price. We don't want to destroy your air force unless you force us to do it.
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04-09-2017, 12:09 PM | #674 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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The strike left a string of jets untouched. And Assad used the same airstrip to take off from, to go bomb the city he gassed. Zeek is right "Trump's ineffectual missle strike...." But who cares. Trump is great. It sure accomplished that ; missile strike effective.
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04-09-2017, 12:27 PM | #675 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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The Pentagon prepped the identical plan for Obama, the black man, five years ago who should have acted on it, but never did. Obama was pro-Shiite, since Valerie Jarrett was an Iranian communist. Hillary, McCain, and half of DC knew the plan. The UN is worthless. They and Obama are totally anti-Israel. They take strategic action against Israel for building houses, yet do nothing when Assad gases his own people. The UN charter was supposed to stop genocide, not better housing. Trump should end all payments to the UN.
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04-09-2017, 12:35 PM | #676 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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Obama set us up for WWIII. He did nothing about North Korean nukes. He gave Iran billions for their Nuke program. He did nothing to stop Assad since Hezbollah trained in Syria. Obama even scolded Romney for being concerned about Russia. The entire Russian hacking fake news is a ruse to coverup Clinton ties with Putin. Then he got his coveted UN resolution condemning Israel over Palestine.
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04-09-2017, 01:15 PM | #677 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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04-09-2017, 01:19 PM | #678 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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04-09-2017, 04:20 PM | #679 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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We don't want to destabilize Syria, that opens the door to ISIS. What we want is for Syria to continue to be a buffer against ISIS without using chemical weapons.
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04-09-2017, 04:21 PM | #680 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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04-09-2017, 08:58 PM | #681 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
The Syrian government killed 70 people, of which 20 were children. That's a child to civilian ration of 29%.
Trump in response, killed 9 civilians, of which 4 were children.That's a child to total civilian ratio of 44%. Therefore Trump is more of a child-killer than Assad, in this instance. |
04-10-2017, 03:59 AM | #682 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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This is terrifying. I read a story about this "sweet" old lady who "accidentally" hit and killed a child while driving. It came out in the story that this was her first accident. She only killed one person in her entire life and it was a child! OMG, she is a bigger child killer than Stalin, Hitler, or even Trump! Great use of statistics in verifying Mark Twain's claim. BTW I also read that teenage pregnancy drops off dramatically when girls hit the age of 25.
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04-10-2017, 04:53 AM | #683 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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There were little children playing in armored military hangers at 3 am, while all the Russians were taking off!
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04-10-2017, 07:24 AM | #684 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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It would only take one Tomahawk to do so.
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04-10-2017, 07:59 AM | #685 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
I'm not sure I understand what you are saying here. Ya can't be totally against Israel and send the largest shipment of military weapons in history for Israel to use against the Gazans ... including white phosphorus bombs.
Maybe you are just seeing appearances. Obama has to stick up for the plight of the Palestinians ... as any humane human should do. But behind the appearances, money and weapons, proved that he was with Israel. Methinks, as I gather from most anywhere, that it's religion that blinds people to the plight of the Palestinians ; driving them to even go so far as to claim antisemitism against those sticking up for the Palestinians. Like Jimmy Carter, for instance.
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04-10-2017, 08:08 AM | #686 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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Returning to the WWI analogy -- Russia was viewed as a country that was growing unchecked both in population and wealth. They seemed like an unstoppable force. It may seem weird to us today, but this was definitely the feeling of Germany and others. That is not unlike the view of China today. Germany felt that war was inevitable and the longer they waited the more likely they would lose. England and France were so caught up in their own security they did not regard the security of Germany. I think this is called the "security dilemma" where one country increases their feeling of security at the expense of another which then feels less secure. But in the mix of these four you had the "Austro Hungarian" empire which was a patchwork quilt of different ethnicities who were the most miserable -- Serbia, Kosovo and Montenegro being the foremost. These countries were the only ones who actually wanted war. Today that would be ISIS, Iraq and Syria. If you take out Assad with a missile you also take out Russia's connection to the Middle East. That would greatly increase their feeling of insecurity. You can't do that unless you want to start WWIII. Syria and ISIS are fighting an ugly, no holds barred war to the death. We don't need to have these two misfits drag the US and Russia into a world war over the Middle East. What we need is for a negotiated settlement where Russia removes Assad and replaces him with someone they are comfortable with. The UN is today's "Austro-Hungarian" Empire and could easily be the lynchpin to another major war.
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04-10-2017, 10:55 AM | #687 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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04-10-2017, 11:54 AM | #688 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Hard to buy what Trump says. He's been practicing one of his self-help books where he suggests the use of "truthful hyperbole." Something true said in a way that significantly overstates the truth yet somehow seems impossible to challenge.
I noted back during the campaign that a lot of what Trump said was so scattered and bombastic that the only response was that of the AFLAC duck when faced with Yogi Berra's statements about money. "What insurance is that, Yogi?" "It's the one you need because if you don't have it, that's why you need it." "If you get hurt and miss work, it won't hurt to miss work." "And they give you cash, which is just as good as money." At which everyone opens their mouth to speak but nothing comes out.
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04-10-2017, 12:46 PM | #689 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Apparently you prefer the Jarrett/Obama way -- give our enemies all the money they need to build nuclear arsenals, and then hide our head in the sands of political correctness.
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04-10-2017, 03:07 PM | #690 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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04-10-2017, 03:20 PM | #691 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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For your info, Trump is holding a seder tonight to mark the first night of Passover, that was started in 2008 and carried on by Obama since. See, Obama is not "totally anti-Israel." Money, and weapons, to Israel, and a seder, don't make for much anti-Israel.
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04-10-2017, 09:09 PM | #692 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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04-10-2017, 10:31 PM | #693 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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But even if you only go by the allegation that Assad's chemical weapon strike killed 20 children and Trump's missile killed four, Assad killed a larger percentage of the total number of children in Syria than Trump's did. On that basis, a child in Syria has a bigger chance of being killed by one of Assad's chemical attacks than a Trump's missiles.
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04-11-2017, 04:41 AM | #694 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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As for Trump his military strike landed clearly and undeniably in a military base that was actively being used for war. Yes, according to Mark Twain this is how statistics works, to build a case for damn liars.
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04-11-2017, 06:47 AM | #695 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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04-11-2017, 06:59 AM | #696 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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04-11-2017, 08:28 AM | #697 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
!!! NEWS FLASH !!!
Putin expects to see a fake gas attack in Syria to justify America hitting the Syrian capital. http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-n...ice=responsive
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04-11-2017, 10:40 AM | #698 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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Remember Russian Nukes in Cuba? It was US surveillance photos which exposed their lies.
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04-11-2017, 11:47 AM | #699 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
I thought the empty seat was for Moses or God?
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04-11-2017, 06:01 PM | #700 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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04-11-2017, 06:27 PM | #701 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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I think the message is not that "the US wants to destroy your airforce" but rather "if you use chemical weapons we will humiliate you and make you pay"
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04-11-2017, 08:58 PM | #702 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
I mostly wonder if Evangelical ever told the truth or is he a liar?
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04-11-2017, 10:34 PM | #703 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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from here: http://www.newshub.co.nz/home/world/...ia-claims.html The claim was 20 aircraft destroyed. If true, that is only 4%. So it seems like the Syrian State Media and the American Government are on par in terms of spreading falsehoods. |
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04-12-2017, 04:07 AM | #704 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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If that is the case then I find that a reasonable explanation. If we are to close our ears to any "corrections" or "clarifications" then I would conclude that you also are on par with Syria in spreading falsehoods.
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04-12-2017, 05:52 AM | #705 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
True ... and Putin may be acting a role to help Trump divert the investigation into campaign Russia ties ... just for show ... to throw off the investigations.
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04-12-2017, 06:04 AM | #706 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
If Trump really cared about the children he would let the clearly destitute Syrian refugees into America.
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04-12-2017, 06:41 AM | #707 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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The US is now the poorest country on earth. Perhaps Trump will help us get thru bankruptcy, since he has some experience in this area. Have you not read what is happening in European countries due to the "compassionate" policies of those in Brussels? Have you not read all the stories about "destitute" refugees raping all the locals?
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04-12-2017, 07:54 AM | #708 | |
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Brilliant! You have already banned guns. What's next? Banning kitchen knives, baseball bats, and rope? Why not castrate all sex offenders from Syria? In one Swedish Mooslim community, the police force is no longer permitted to take public transportation to work at the local police station. It's just too dangerous for them. The new police station they have to build is like a fortress in Syria -- right in the center of Stockholm.
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04-12-2017, 09:41 AM | #709 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Bannon doesn't play well with others. He's standing on shaky ground with Trump.
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04-12-2017, 09:52 AM | #710 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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04-12-2017, 10:49 AM | #711 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
$20 Trillion deficit. Borrowing nearly $3 Billion a day to stay afloat.
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04-12-2017, 11:04 AM | #712 | |
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04-12-2017, 11:08 AM | #713 |
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That's the debt not the deficit.
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04-12-2017, 11:18 AM | #714 | |
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04-12-2017, 11:38 AM | #715 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Thanks for the warm welcome!
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04-12-2017, 01:34 PM | #716 | |
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From 1950 to 1980 our debt to GNP ratio was less than 200%, a healthy ratio.
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04-12-2017, 04:10 PM | #717 | |
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04-12-2017, 05:40 PM | #718 | |
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04-12-2017, 05:53 PM | #719 | |
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How about we let Mattis clarify his own statements. Aye Matey?
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04-12-2017, 09:56 PM | #720 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Right. None of that polite liberal politically correct **** for me. You **** with me and I'll **** you back ten times as hard. Trump is president now. I'm following his teaching. Jesus was about forgiveness. Trump preaches revenge is sweet.
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04-13-2017, 02:38 AM | #721 | |
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Sorry, but the PC liberal progressives never have been very polite. Have you not read about violent protests all over the US from these intolerant snowflakes, becoming anarchists in the name of safe space? Apparently you feel this alt-forum is your cyber "safe space."
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04-13-2017, 03:52 AM | #722 | |
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Defense analysts IHS Jane's estimate the Syrian airforce has about 262 strike aircraft, although the company admits this may be an imperfect number due to the ongoing war. CNN Tue April 11, 2017 Owning 262 strike aircraft is not equal to having 262 "operational" strike aircraft. The question then becomes how many of the 262 are operational. Unless you have a better source than Janes or the US defense department, I'll stick with the existing estimate.
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04-13-2017, 06:04 AM | #723 | ||
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Re: Politics and the Church
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As usual, you are misinformed. Obviously you haven't read Trump's book "Think Big" where he teaches how sweet revenge is. https://www.amazon.com/Think-Big-Mak...sap_bc?ie=UTF8 Didn't you listen to his speeches? Here's an excerpt from one: Quote:
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04-13-2017, 07:28 AM | #724 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
I just finished reading "The Plot to Hack America" by Malcolm Nance.
He does an excellent job of providing convincing evidence that two different and independent Russian groups of hackers operated on hacking the election with the same goal of helping Donald Trump's campaign. (It is suggested that the KGB does this to encourage competition). He does a decent job of explaining how the KGB works, why they might target Donald Trump for "development" and why they might want him to win the election. There was, however, no evidence given in this book of collusion between Trump and the Russians. The most you could say is that the evidence in this book demands that we investigate the election and that has to include Trump's tax records.
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04-13-2017, 09:29 AM | #725 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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The regulations in the bible clearly and specifically prohibit chattel slavery or slave traders or slavery based on race or lifetime slavery, etc. According to the Biblical regulations slavery was a choice that the person being enslaved chose and it was temporary. However, when you say that the Bible "justified" slavery those unfamiliar with the Bible assume you are saying that the Bible justified slavery as practiced by Southern plantations in the US prior to the Civil War. The Bible does not justify those practices, it specifically prohibited them. Hence your statements are intentionally misleading.
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04-13-2017, 10:09 AM | #726 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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Funny thing is that having debt is not a sign of being poor. Inability to pay it could be. But then what is the chance that anyone is going to call the debt? BTW. Has it changed under the new administration? Did it under Bush (either one)? or Regan? Time for us to stop blaming only the liberals. The conservatives just spend more than they make on different things. For example, on military toys rather than people.
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04-13-2017, 10:27 AM | #727 | |
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But you have given up on the faith in the word of God, and you will lecture me on following Jesus? According to what, how much Jesus loves terrorists? Your over-generalized and intolerant identity politics are getting so old -- casting all of Trump's sins and snafus upon any and all Americans who have found him preferable to crooked Hillary. Should I do the same and continually slander you for all of Bill and Hillary's crimes and failures? Can't you distinguish the two? Aren't you a grown man? I expect more from you than from all the campus snowflakes. Can't you at least show an ounce of Christian charity? Today is the remembrance of the Last Supper when the New Covenant was enacted.
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04-13-2017, 10:40 AM | #728 | |
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I made a comment about the US being the poorest nation, and now I get your lecture about "blaming only liberals." What do I need republican disclaimers in my signature line? The time will come when we won't be able to even pay the interest payments. I thought you were an accountant. Don't you know how money works? We can't just keep borrowing to even pay the interest. BTW, Reagan's military toys ended the cold war. They made us safer. They gave lots of jobs to American scientists and engineers rather than illegal aliens. Why is it that these wealthy Mooslem countries like the Emirates don't have to take in any Syrian refugees? I thought they were all "brothers." They got black gold flowing out of the ground -- plenty for everybody.
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04-13-2017, 10:43 AM | #729 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
After watching the movie Concussion, perhaps Biblical slavery is preferable.
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04-13-2017, 10:54 AM | #730 | |
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But the KGB also thrives on chaos, and we have had plenty of that since last Nov 8. So I think we could make a strong case for Russia supporting both candidates. Support Trump and get chaos, support Clinton and get a pushover. Both are desirable to Russia.
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04-13-2017, 11:33 AM | #731 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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04-13-2017, 11:37 AM | #732 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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Bankruptcy is how the rich get rich, they buy assets at fire sale prices and then sell them at inflated prices at the height of the speculative bubble.
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04-13-2017, 11:51 AM | #733 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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What these guys did was fully focused on Trump. They stole the DNC playbook on how to take down Trump. Then their leaks were totally aligned and timed with what would help Trump's campaign the most. They leaked the inference that the DNC was helping Clinton to the disadvantage of Sanders right before the Democratic convention, right before Sanders was going to pledge his support for Clinton. It was the best time to cause a split in the Democratic party. That is one example, but there are two or three remarkable coincidences when Trump called for the Russian hackers to find something, only for them to leak it the next day. Why would they target Trump? 1. They look for egotistical, narcissists. 2. They look for people who are motivated by money or sex. 3. The Russian oligarchy has become very much involved in real estate, investing in US real estate. 4. They specifically invited Trump to run the Miss Universe contest in Moscow. 5. They invited Trump to build a Trump tower in Moscow. 6. This is why I feel the conclusion is we must see Trump's tax returns, he was in bankruptcy, no US bank would loan him money at the same time he became endeared with the Russians and was quoted as saying how much he wanted to invest in Russia. 7. There are a number of people who are closely related to the KGB involved in Trump's real estate deals, some we know about, one woman who was very clearly a KGB agent, was one that I had not heard of before. That said I wonder if Trump was unwitting in the hack. It seems only a complete and utter idiot would publicly call on Russia to get the 30,000 missing emails of Clinton if he was colluding with them. Such an act would qualify as treason and would be punishable by a minimum of 5 years in prison, and a maximum of the death penalty. I do not consider Trump as a "complete and utter idiot", therefore I find it very difficult to believe he was knowingly involved in the hack.
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04-13-2017, 12:16 PM | #734 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
I would quote Shakespeare -- "blistered be thy tongue for such thoughts" but apparently your tongue already is blistered.
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04-13-2017, 02:12 PM | #735 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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At least the Bible tells them up front -- you may get beaten but if you recover from the beating then there is no liability to the one who gave you the contract.
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04-13-2017, 02:21 PM | #736 | |
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Logically we cannot take a line of appeasement to the terrorists. If you justify their actions as a response to previous injustice then this feud will go on forever. Either everyone comes to a table to reconcile or else you have to defeat them on the battlefield. It is not possible to negotiate with them because their demands are so far removed from any reasonable request. Now I appreciate what I think I see in Trump's strategy (it is very difficult to discern, I will give you that). Essentially he has authorized the military, the professionals, to do all that they can to annihilate ISIS within the bounds of UN laws.
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04-13-2017, 04:22 PM | #737 | |
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I am at that point where I can start to be like my aunt who just thinks the whole world is under the control of the people with the black helicopters and it would be better to just die today than have to live with any of it. Or I can point at the problem and ask what could be the solution. And when the push back is "It's so big we just can't do anything about it" (not talking about you) then it is evident that we need to change our thinking from fixing everything to fixing something while trying to at least keep a hold on everything else. As Dr. Leo Marvin suggested to Bob "baby steps." Don't either cow at the existence of $20T or open your mouth and demand to eat it all in one bite. I know that a nearly endless war in Iraq followed by ISIS is a drain. But there are segments that would jump at the chance to keep us all so worked up over ISIS that we keep pumping all that money that could go to us in the U.S. and instead is being pumped like New year's fireworks into the deserts of the Middle East. Yeah, if we didn't have ISIS, then someone would figure out how to raise the poverty level and pump it all into an ever growing welfare plantation. ZNP doesn't like slaves. But the existing welfare system creates a lot of slaves. Slaves to those who will give them money for nothing (except votes — and the chicks aren't even free).
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04-13-2017, 05:43 PM | #738 | |
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Actually I liked Dubya as a person, yet some of his policies were naive and in the long run created more problems than they solved. But I know people like your aunt. And they are not kooks. And btw a few years ago the military did a few black helicopter "exercises" in my town. And there's nothing you can do about it.
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04-13-2017, 08:55 PM | #739 | |
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04-14-2017, 04:51 AM | #740 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Christian charity? The charity that "vaunteth not itself, and is not puffed up"? Death's ambassador to us teaches us not to think more highly of ourselves than we ought to.
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04-14-2017, 09:01 AM | #741 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Thank you.
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04-14-2017, 09:40 AM | #742 | |
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I would never propose such an action, but at the same time, there is little chance that there would be any serious effort to force our hand with such an option at our disposal. And not much chance that they could force anything. Would that likely define a new reality here at home? Surely it would. And likely the end of some of our favorite "rights." And it would hurt.
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04-14-2017, 10:21 AM | #743 | |
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Government will never allow some chaos to pass without bringing an end to some of our favorite "rights." They are also known to create chaos for just that purpose. The time will come when our Bill of Rights are history. We can already see that with the serious erosion of 1st, 2nd, and 4th amends. Many liberal Univs. have already in effect banned the 1st amend. Whole cities have banned the 2nd amend. Snowden/Assange have informed us that the 4th amend. is history. Like I posted yesterday, Sweden has already banned guns, and now some there are proposing that all vehicles be banned because they can be used as weapons. What's next? Rope, Lead Pipe, Knife, Wrench, Candlestick, and a Revolver? One day Snowflakes will ban the game of CLUE because it's so dangerous.
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04-14-2017, 10:43 AM | #744 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Wow! That's penetrating! But it kind of reminds me of "He who smelt it dealt it." I don't know why.
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04-14-2017, 11:13 AM | #745 | |
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I liken it to the Hummingbirds. I sometimes sit and watch them. They spend more time fighting over the sugar water than they do eating it. All this religion crap we see all around the world, and I mean all of them, the whole kit and kaboodle, are products of human development. This is where we have evolved to. If you are looking for reasons to be critical of evolution, you've got one : RELIGION!. That's why I don't go for singling people out, as if they are more flawed than the rest, and are the source of all our problems ; like blaming it all on liberals, or conservatives. By doing so all we are doing is "expecting more of us," expecting more perhaps than humans are able to deliver. That enables us to live in denial that, we are only human. Maybe we'll outgrow it someday. Pinker, in his book, The Better Angels of our Nature, certainly proves we're headed that way. Let's not despair. Humans are a work in progress. Maybe one day we'll outgrow are religions, and partisanships.
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04-14-2017, 11:59 AM | #746 | |
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But back to my comment. Emirates and other MidEast countries can reject their Mohammedan "brothers" because they are "human," but if the USA does it, then we must be xenophobic, racist, insufficiently evolved, inadequately developed, crazed religionists, mean-spirited, evil, fascist, fundamentalists, and downright hypocritical Christians. Just like Trump! Oh ... now I get it! Thanks for splainin it so clearly!
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04-14-2017, 12:47 PM | #747 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Upon such sacrifices the priests throw incense. Now you know why.
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04-14-2017, 03:48 PM | #748 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
I really don't want to get into a speculative debate about an apocalypse that has nothing to do with Christ. But the following comment you made got me wondering.
Quote:
But is the issue really the lifespan of the currency, but the lifespan of the government that issues the currency? Even there the Brits have us beat by at least a little, no matter how you dice it.
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04-14-2017, 04:28 PM | #749 | |
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04-15-2017, 02:26 AM | #750 | |
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https://russianmilitaryanalysis.word...rief-analysis/ 9 aircraft destroyed. Pentagon claimed 20, but so far we can only count 9, then subsequently in a recent press release the Pentagon changed the story to 20% of Syrian air power destroyed. |
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04-15-2017, 03:09 AM | #751 | |
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Government debt is not like personal debt, governments can create money. Government debt never has to be paid off unless the government chooses to. Basically this sort of comparison is a scare tactic used by governments to make unpopular decisions seem reasonable. e.g. "we must cancel this social program to save money because the government is in debt, otherwise future generations won't have a good standard of living etc etc" Another scare tactic is when the media says that America is somehow enslaved to foreign countries because they own them money. What the government owes overseas countries is nothing compared to what the government owes itself. See here: https://econproph.com/2011/07/14/pri...vernment-debt/ https://www.thebalance.com/who-owns-...l-debt-3306124 |
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04-15-2017, 08:14 AM | #752 | |
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04-15-2017, 01:39 PM | #753 | |
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Second, governments have gone bankrupt in the past. It is very common. The demise of every empire was similar to "bankruptcy". Likewise, if a government runs a debt it stands to reason that someone is buying that debt and just like an individual the government will have a credit rating. If you default on your debts your credit rating will collapse and no one will buy your debt. For the US to survive we are living on debt, therefore on a daily basis we need to be able to sell debt and have someone buy it. Therefore even the slightest hint that we are not going to pay will have huge repercussions, we would have to pay a higher and higher interest. But it gets worse. We pay our debt in US dollars. If the US dollar is devaluated we are robbing those who loaned us money and they would then stop buying our debt. But the value of our dollar is based on the GDP. This is why China is considered a currency manipulator, their currency is artificially low based on GDP. This is the flip side of the coin, China needs a huge trade surplus to employ everyone in the country. If their currency was properly valued their trade surplus would shrink. Hence they manipulate it. So then, if our GDP does not keep pace with our debt our currency will be devalued, and then the only way to encourage investors to buy our debt is for us to pay much higher interest rates. You don't have to pay off the debt, but since our debt has doubled in the last 8 years while our GDP has risen anemically our currency should depreciate, and if that happens the interest we have to pay on this astronomical debt will increase. So then why hasn't this happened? Because the baby boomers haven't retired. About 75% of the entire US debt is held by Social Security and other retirement accounts. As long as Baby boomers were working no one is drawing down on that debt. But once the baby boomers retire and want to collect Social Security that is when it will go bust. You have seen this before, lots of major corporations had retirement accounts which were great right up until the workers retired, at which point the business declares bankruptcy and says "oops, can't pay your retirement account". Not a big deal if you are 20, but pretty catastrophic if you are 71 and now need to return to the workforce. Social Security is projected to go broke by 2025. Since I do not plan on retiring that soon I will have spent my whole life paying into this and be left with 0. You can imagine how angry many will be to have their government rob them blind like that.
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04-15-2017, 02:40 PM | #754 | |
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04-15-2017, 04:10 PM | #755 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
I am having a harder and harder time distinguishing you from Awareness. It is like you are the Yin to his Yang.
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04-15-2017, 04:12 PM | #756 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
The US displays the "Mother of all Bombs" and N. Korea displays the Mother of All Canisters.
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04-15-2017, 07:58 PM | #757 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Occasionally our words match, but the meaning does not.
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04-16-2017, 12:49 AM | #758 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Trump said the US cannot default on its debt:
http://www.slate.com/blogs/moneybox/...nts_money.html Are you telling us that you disagree with Trump (for once) ? |
04-16-2017, 05:45 AM | #759 | |
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04-16-2017, 08:24 AM | #760 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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04-16-2017, 09:08 AM | #761 | |
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Yo zeek ... Let's let others speak.
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Read that link above to see some other great Slate fabrications. But liberal progressives will cling to their fake news until the left and right coastlines are completely submerged.
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04-16-2017, 09:47 AM | #762 | |
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04-16-2017, 10:21 AM | #763 | |
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Let's face it, you are against the Christian faith and the Bible, which is why you are here on the Alt-Views forum openly criticizing it. You turned on me many years ago when I repeatedly came to the defense of the gospel of Christ. For the last year or so you have incessantly posted your Trump hate, your liberal Obama/Clinton love, and all the accompanying fake news fabrications which you endorse. Then you condemn my pushback. I don't condemn every religion. I do prefer the Bible, while you love to discredit it, using your hero Bart Ehrman. You obviously favor Islam and Mohammedans, which have numerous terrible and abusive practices which trouble me and have no place in modern society. It is one of the greatest ironies of the 21st century that liberals and progressive feminists would support Islamic practices in the USA.
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04-16-2017, 10:48 AM | #764 | |
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Your dim opinions of me and my position are simply another example of your extreme prejudice. You have accused of statements I never made because you have lumped me in with a group of people you condemn. That's how you think. I don't see any cure for it. Hate on bro.
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04-16-2017, 11:07 AM | #765 | |
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You keep accusing me of "extreme prejudice" yet cannot rebut my facts. It's strikes me as quite funny that I need to be "cured" of my "hate" and "extreme prejudice" for exposing fake news websites which you regularly post on this forum. See you later.
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04-16-2017, 10:11 PM | #766 | |
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Show me where I posted a fake news cite. Who told you it was fake news? Tapper finds fault with one article in Slate and you advise not to believe anything you read there. That typifies all-or-nothing, absolutistic thinking. That kind of thinking perpetuates prejudice.
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04-17-2017, 03:43 AM | #767 | |
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You have often provided numerous links that were simply Trump hate and slander. It's you who provides absolutistic thinking. You just project your bad traits on me. But being a know-it-all, you can't see yourself objectively. Why is it, for example, that not one of your posts ever presents either the Bible or Trump positively. I posted numerous times about my concerns about Trump, but you can't hear that because I don't hate like you do. He one the election, but like the media "opposition party," you don't give him a chance.
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04-17-2017, 08:07 AM | #768 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Goodness Ohio and zeek! Y'all are making me want to swear off this thread for some kind of petroactive Lent.
Why is it that we're stuck being either a liberal or conservative/democrat or republican. It's funny to me ... NOT !!!. I'm registered as an independent ... I'm actually a mugwump. I'll read Slate AND Breitbart, Huff Po AND Drudgereport. That way I learn the worst about both political parties. Cuz I'm also a misanthrope, and realize I'm dealing with fallible humans, that can't be trusted ; don't matter what they call themselves. Hey, I saw Clintoon, and his wagging finger. And Newt condemning him while doing the same thing. And after I saw all the lame-stream media, even Fox news, get behind the Iraq war, I don't trust any of them any more either. By reading both sides of the political story, I've gotten pretty handy at catching both sides of the news lying. But fake news today is flying hot and heavy, like a swarm of bees. It's making my head spin. I can't keep up. Is that why we join a political party? cuz we can't keep up? So settling for a party just makes it easier? Then we don't have to give it much thought ... (like it's a religion, a cult)??? I don't know. I'm just a cantankerous old curmudgeon. Go on my yard and I'll take a broomstick to ya. You guys settle down, and try to kiss and make up or something. Or at least sing Kumbaya. Can't we all just get along.? Hey, I've got an idea. It's kind of wacky and crazy. Let's give being Christians a try ... the Jesus in the gospels kind of Christian -- the real Christian -- not the Jesus in Revelation kind of Christian, which is the fake news Jesus. Goodness! Goodness! Goodness! Even Jesus is polarized! See! I told you I can't keep up!
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04-17-2017, 08:34 AM | #769 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
MIT expert claims latest chemical weapons attack in Syria was staged.
(https://www.yahoo.com/news/mit-exper...100819428.html) If this was staged by ISIS that would be very embarrassing.
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04-17-2017, 08:42 AM | #770 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
He one big mess.
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04-17-2017, 07:40 PM | #771 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
I could have posted the same thing from 20 or so websites. But if you want to listen for yourself where Trump said it (it was in a CNN interview), see the video on this page:
http://www.cnbc.com/2016/05/09/donal...nts-money.html Trump said it, why don't you believe it? If you believe in Trump then you should believe him that the US will never have to default. I think he's right. |
04-17-2017, 07:43 PM | #772 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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So to pay off Japan's debt they merely print more money -- hyper inflation, like the Weimar Republic. The problem with making your money worthless is that you can't buy anything. People in their minds are a first world country without realizing they are making a 3rd world salary. Also those Japanese banks that had all of that debt and at one time were seen as being so wealthy, are losing money on a daily basis as the Yen is devalued. So what happened to Japan, they used to be an economic powerhouse? Simple, no children. What we are seeing happening to Japan today, will hit the US in about 5-10 years when the Baby boomers want to retire. Japan is one of the largest foreign holders of US debt. So as they go bankrupt they will likely be forced to redeem that debt, which in turn will cause us great financial stress. So it is like dominoes, as one falls, it takes two more with it, etc. So if the US went into hyper inflation we would not be able to purchase nearly as much goods from China (our trade with them is unsustainable). So then, what happens to China which desperately needs this trade to keep their people employed and fed? Also, if you are in hyper inflation you cannot afford to import commodities like oil and gas. In the end money cannot be simply paper and ink, it has to represent a Gross domestic product. All those Japanese that saved their money, they will wake up and realize they have been robbed. Just like all those Americans paying into Social Security will one day realize they have been robbed.
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04-17-2017, 08:32 PM | #773 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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What I find interesting is the ones that's presenting this news on the web found by google. Free Republic saw fit to publish it. Infowars too. And The Libertarian Republic. Plus Christian sites. Yahoo published it. But opens with the Pentagon's official position on it ; that Assad did it. (Watch it. It sounds like a 1984 soundbite, with pomp and nationalistic music, and military type's standing at attention). Who to believe? Of course after the fact of 59 missiles, the gov is going to publish that they known for certain Assad did it. So how does Theodore Postol know different? Fake news? And let's not forget that Putin claimed another gas attack will happen, staged by the U.S., to justify bombing the Syrian capital. So we got Putin and Theodore Postol agreeing. ??? Will the real fake news please stand up? How can we know what's really going on? This might be like the book 1984, where war is propaganda to keep the people loyal to Ingsoc. For all we know this could be Newspeak. For that matter the war on terror may be Newspeak ; it's a perpetual never ending war, just like in 1984. All we need now, to put all this together is for a high level conspiracy theorist to join AltVs. Then perchance we can be certain about our certainty. God knows we need that precious certitude. How else are we ever gonna be able to live in denial? Denial is precious too ... like the Easter bunny. And necessary to get thru life. haha
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04-17-2017, 11:24 PM | #774 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
So Much Trouble in the World - Bob Marley
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gAFbYTvXXyY
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04-18-2017, 03:10 AM | #775 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
If we examine the facts we can see that the US was wrong to strike Syria.
1. No approval by the UN. It was an act of war against a sovereign state. Syria has never invited the US to involve itself in its affairs. If any other country did it, it would be a declaration of war. Hypocrisy and double standards is one reason why many countries are questioning the legitimacy of the action. 2. No proof it was the Syrian government before the strike, or after.. |
04-18-2017, 05:56 AM | #776 | |
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Sounds like what Dubya said about Iraq. And talking about Iraq, Trump explained in an interview that he sent 59 missiles to Iraq, while he and Xi were eating the most wonderful chocolate cake you've ever seen. There was no purpose in the 59 missiles, as can be seen now, except they made Trump great again, after his health care reform failure. So who knows what he's gonna do if his tax reform fails. He'll prolly preemptively strike North Korea, with 59 nukes, to look great again.
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04-18-2017, 06:25 AM | #777 | |
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I believe Trump is doing the right thing on North Korea, even if he nukes it. The sooner he strikes the better because if and when they do get an ICBM with nukes, they will use it. That is what defectors have said. Why? Because America killed off 20% of the population, napalm etc, nasty stuff. They have not forgotten. If given the chance, I am sure they would want to pay America back in kind - any one of the major cities would balance the scales in terms of civilian deaths I would think. Ironically, back then it was America threatening North Korea and China with nuclear war. Japan did nasty things to Korea as well during WW2, so NK would have no problem sending a nuke to Tokyo, for example. While the rest of the world has moved on, they are still living in the 1950's post WW2 mindset, where carpet bombing entire populations with napalm and threatening (and even carrying out) a nuclear strike is acceptable. Man for man I'd say a North Korean is tougher than South Koreans or Americans, so they need to be prepared for that too. So I think Trump should take NK out as soon as possible, and not mess about in Syria. |
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04-18-2017, 08:49 AM | #778 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Well maybe. Maybe not. With this statement on Fox and Friends :
“They’ve been talking with this gentleman for a long time. You read Clinton’s book, he said, ‘Oh, we made such a great peace deal,’ and it was a joke. You look at different things over the years with President Obama. Everybody has been outplayed, they’ve all been outplayed by this gentleman and we’ll see what happens. But I just don’t telegraph my moves.” He sure looks like he knows nothing about NK leadership.
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04-18-2017, 11:38 AM | #779 | |
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04-18-2017, 11:40 AM | #780 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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2. According to the US they did have proof.
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04-18-2017, 11:42 AM | #781 | |
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04-18-2017, 11:45 AM | #782 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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Japan is teetering on the brink of bankruptcy, China cannot afford a drop in exports, NK is on the verge of starvation, what happens when you add to this mix a South Korea in a catastrophic war?
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04-18-2017, 03:14 PM | #783 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
It has been revealed that the "Armada" which was supposedly sailing towards North Korea has not even left. They were heading in the opposite direction.
http://edition.cnn.com/2017/04/18/po...ump/index.html It was fake news, propagated by the government. Spicer answered questions about it as if it was a certainty. This fake news seems to have been sourced to the same person who erroneously claimed that 20% of Syria's airforce was destroyed. This is really a silly thing to do because NK could have launched a preemptive attack in this past week and the American forces were not even there yet! The white house has yet again shown its incompetence in getting its facts wrong and shows a breakdown in communication between the decision makers in the white house and the naval commanders. If they cannot get even simple things like this correct how can they manage the country. It turns out that Trump has been misguiding the public. This "show of force" is a routine deployment in the Pacific anyway, there is no great "Armada" that has been constructed for the purpose of going to North Korea. |
04-18-2017, 05:06 PM | #784 | |
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04-18-2017, 05:09 PM | #785 | |
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2. If they had proof, they did not show it. There was no need to strike suddenly and without warning. They should have got the consensus from the UN first before taking action. It seems like the US expects everyone to abide by international law but themselves. Trump had no authority under international law to attack Syria. |
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04-19-2017, 11:01 AM | #786 | |
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04-19-2017, 04:17 PM | #787 | |
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Take a chill pill! Two aspirins and get a good night sleep. Snowflakes still have heartburn over last November 8. Like it's the end of the world. Armageddon or something worse. As sub-forum moderator, perhaps you could pray-read (or just read silently, or even hum as you meditate to your higher power) the "Serenity Prayer." You don't have to worry that it's some corrupted 3rd century manuscript of a pseudo-gospel writer. It doesn't even mention the name of Jesus, so your Southern Baptist heritage won't resurface with a vengeance. It's even Tatted on some athlete's arms, so it can't be too dangerous. Just a prayer to an un-named God for wisdom, serenity, and courage to face today's news.
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04-19-2017, 05:13 PM | #788 | |
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1. WWIII is not started during this administration, but climate change continues at an exponential rate, 3rd world collapse continues with it, and instead of any assistance to the problem we batten down the hatches and build a yuuge wall. or 2. WWIII is started. But either way Armageddon is the destination, you were told this 2,000 years ago, you were warned the world is a "condemned house" and that you need to leave. Like Ohio shared, every reference to money in the NT says to "give it to the poor". You would be idiotic to think that "investments" can be smart. 1. Trump said the US cannot go broke because we print the money. That means his solution is hyper inflation which means any investments you have ultimately become worthless. I realize this could kick off thousands of words about the value of commodities, but remember if that is your path make sure you have a gang of 20+ mad maxes with machine guns attached to the rear of jeeps with jerry cans of gas to make it through the apocalypse. 2. Regardless of how "smart" your investments are that is on the most temporary of temporary scales. In light of eternity the best investment is to give the money to the poor. There it is stored where rust, moths and hyper inflation cannot get it, just as Jesus said. If you are not worried about your investments and you are not worried about Armageddon, then you don't need to hyperventilate about the administration, and you can rest in peace.
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04-19-2017, 05:33 PM | #789 | |
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Evangelical attacked Trump for punishing Syria over the use of WMD's without UN approval. Is he serious? China, France, UK, and Russia all agreed to the security council condemnation of Israel for building houses, yet where oh where was the slightest of outrage around the UN at the video of children gassed by Assad?
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04-19-2017, 06:11 PM | #790 | |
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Yes the focus is on the Middle East. Many forget that the boundary of Israel given in the OT is not what we now recognize, but rather goes from the Euphrates to the Mediterranean. It was supposed to be the entire Middle East. One issue we didn't raise is Peak Oil. The only reason we haven't "noticed" this event is because of fracking and oil sand, two of the most destructive environmental practices ever dreamed up. We are very quickly turning the world into a hell scape so that we can continue to pretend that everything will continue as it is.
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04-19-2017, 06:21 PM | #791 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Where has Bill O'Reilly gone? Like gas passing. Where has Bill O'Reilly gone? Short time ago. Where has Bill O'Reilly gone? Advertisers left him every one. When will he ever learn? When will he ever learn?
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04-19-2017, 07:04 PM | #792 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Good riddance to your buddy Bill.
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04-19-2017, 11:33 PM | #793 |
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Under the bus for Bro. Bill? Ouch! Kind of harsh there bro. He's been Numero Uno water carrier for the Murdoch family for years i.e. the top purveyor of the Republican Talking Points Machine that is Fox [so-called] News. I would have thought that he would be one of your favs? A conservative's conservative.
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04-20-2017, 01:52 AM | #794 | |
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04-20-2017, 01:57 AM | #795 | |
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04-20-2017, 04:33 AM | #796 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Fracking cannot possibly be controlled. You are setting off explosives underground to break up the formations. It is virtually guaranteed that this will cause natural gas and underground aquifers to mix which in turn is creating tap water that burns. What is more appropriate as a "hell scape" than watching your tap water in your sink catch fire?
Peak oil is a fantastically scary topic. You can google it to get a good idea. But just to give you the quick summary for over 100 years we have been drilling, refining and developing oil reserves. Worldwide consumption has been growing non stop during all of this time and production has been fighting to keep up with the consumption. However, just like any oil reserve pumped out of the ground the production can increase right up until half of the oil is extracted (that can be extracted), from that point on the production from that reservoir will decline. This was true of Texas oil fields, Ohio oil fields, US oil fields as a whole, Saudi Arabian fields, etc. What is interesting is that this takes place when you have removed 1/3 of the reserves. This is because you can't get the last third, oil is sticky and it sticks to all those little sand grains in the ground, so that third remains in the ground. Now you might think that if it took us 100 years to remove the first 1/3 of worldwide oil then we still have another 100 years of oil left. But what peak oil points out is once you hit that 1/3 mark worldwide production will drop, as it drops production cannot keep up with demand. That will be the point where the 3rd world begins to go up in flames. You will see refugee crisis, wars, terrorists, pretty much what we have been seeing since 2001 (peak oil was probably 2008, it is hard to calculate precisely because OPEC hides all of their records). What we also see at that point is much more destructive methods at getting the oil. Things like the horror of offshore oil drilling (often the oil spills out at the ocean bottom and is not readily apparent. You see tar balls wash up on the beach but don't see the spill), oil sand development and fracking. This is the main motivation to do away with the EPA, the only way we go another 8 years without a serious spike in oil costs is to stop being so careful about poisoning the water, land and sea. But each year it gets worse. Hence Russia viewing Syria and Iran as critical allies. China was responsible for the genocide in Sudan, because that is there foothold onto oil reserves in the area. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peak_oil
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04-20-2017, 06:57 AM | #797 | |
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The point is that most disasters are preventable. We can no longer look at certain industries as "evil." Obama and Warren Buffet-owned railroads preferred to transport high-volatile Balkan crude via consists through major cities, rather than thru Keystone and Dakota Access pipelines which are far safer. Off shore drilling in the gulf was pushed into the dangerous Gulf depths stupidly thinking that that was ecologically safer than in the shelf nearer to shore. Then BP cut corners and cheated, but where were the inspectors? It's a huge mistake to think that "green" politicians really are looking out for our well-being. They may have a platform to spread their "care," the media to broadcast it, and the students to protest for them, but they also got tons of money in their pockets from other beneficiaries. Remember Obama solar energy boondoggles? But, of course, Obama endorses the religion of Green, so those got little coverage.
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04-20-2017, 07:50 AM | #798 | |
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Likewise, instead of going to war for oil in 2001 (the real reason Cheney wanted us to blame Iraq for 9/11) we could have spent $1 Trillion dollars on wind turbines. If we had done that instead we would really have a chance right now to switch from fossil fuel to renewable. That said I have not seen a single calculation where it will be in time. Apparently half of the energy consumed by a car takes place when they build it. So, replacing every gas powered car with an electric car would consume a huge amount of energy before we could switch to electric. Also, we are now looking at the whole world. When we stop buying cars in the US they are then moved to countries like Mexico and Cuba where they continue to be built. Weening ourselves off of fossil fuel is going to be a long process. And when you are on the far side of Hubert's peak it is going to be a very wild ride.
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04-20-2017, 10:08 AM | #799 | |
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04-20-2017, 10:10 AM | #800 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
The feminazi pussy crabber. One down, one to go.
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04-20-2017, 10:14 AM | #801 | |
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I listened to that on CNN (I never watched O'Reilly) and felt her complaint was absurd. The idea that you can't use "hysterical" to refer to a woman because of the history of the word is, and that you would use this as some basis for a lawsuit, is in my opinion, an example of a feminazi.
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04-20-2017, 12:36 PM | #802 | |
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04-20-2017, 02:11 PM | #803 | |
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So why the $13 mil? And why fire the guy if there weren't more than meets our eyes there?
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04-20-2017, 02:39 PM | #804 | |
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04-20-2017, 03:40 PM | #805 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Hey Moda ... let's keep it clean!
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04-20-2017, 04:38 PM | #806 |
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How come these primetime players when they fail don't get punished. O'Reilly is coming away from Fox with $25 mil.[LIST]
I tell you Fox is dirty from the top down. Rupert Murdoch is a sleeze ball. How my Christian fundamentalists family members can be such fans I don't know. It's certainly not any more Christian than all the other networks ... in fact, less so.
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04-20-2017, 04:41 PM | #807 |
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Hey, 80% of evangelicals voted for the P grabber. It must not be sin any more.
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04-20-2017, 07:06 PM | #808 | |
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Maybe all the SNOWFLAKES secretly voted for Trump.
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04-20-2017, 07:12 PM | #809 | |
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Apparently you just don't get it. Too bad you're still hatin' on all the Christians. Do you really spy on all your family's TV watching habits? Bad Moda!
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04-20-2017, 07:19 PM | #810 | |
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So if some braggadocio Trumpster jock talks about grabbing, that's horrible, but when officially sanctioned Mooslam doctors mutilate little girls for life, you progressive liberals all turn the other way. Hippocrats.
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04-21-2017, 07:12 AM | #811 | |
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I said that cuz his dad and mom have Fox news on all day. And I didn't need to spy. They have a B&B, that I've stayed at with them several times. My sister, a proud Yellowdog Democrat, won't talk politics with them. It get's too heated. I don't have that problem with them. They know I'm a mugwump. Everyone seems to know I'm a mugwump but you. Our maybe you consider a fence sitter a liberal. I guess you only round up, never down. I sit on the fence because I can't stand Trump or Hillary. By comparison Bernie looks great ... but then, now, so does Dubya, and I didn't like him either. But thanks for the laughs bro Ohio. I do like them.
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04-21-2017, 09:53 AM | #812 |
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http://www.independent.co.uk/news/wo...-a7694316.html
Donald Trump has a “dangerous mental illness” and is not fit to lead the US, a group of psychiatrists has warned during a conference at Yale University.
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04-21-2017, 12:16 PM | #813 | |
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2. Are they saying that we have never had a narcissistic president? 3. Are they recommending a psychological test for future presidential candidates? Think of all the good Trump is doing. As a result of his election we are now pushing for laws that all Presidential candidates have to release their tax returns and be screened for mental illness. That is just in the first 100 days. Who knows we might also get tougher nepotism laws. One thing I thought of, every person who has access to classified material has to have security clearance as a result of a rigorous examination. Why not have Presidential candidates go through this screening process as well. The president gets the highest security clearance and yet never got screened.
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04-21-2017, 04:24 PM | #814 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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Only problem is, FGM has been a practice long before Mohammed was a twinkle in Allah's eye. It's not a Moooooooooooooooooooslaaaam thing, and has nothing to do with Sharia law.
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04-21-2017, 08:46 PM | #815 | |
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04-21-2017, 08:48 PM | #816 | |
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04-22-2017, 02:57 AM | #817 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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04-22-2017, 03:48 AM | #818 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
The White House is now pressing hard for money to extend the U.S.-Mexico border wall –– funding the Democrats have flatly rejected and even House Speaker Paul Ryan (R-Wis.) has said should come later in the year. In the latest move, Mick Mulvaney, Trump’s budget director, said Friday that the White House would offer to fund controversial ObamaCare subsidies in return for equal funding for the border wall. The Democrats dismissed the proposal out of hand, with the office of Senate Minority Leader Charles Schumer (D-N.Y.) deeming it “a complete non-starter.” “The U.S. government is supposed to take care of its citizens and, according to the President, Mexico is supposed to pay for the wall,” Schumer spokesman Matt House said in an email. “If the administration would drop their 11th hour demand for a wall that Democrats, and a good number of Republicans oppose, Congressional leaders could quickly reach a deal.” http://thehill.com/homenews/house/33...spending-fight
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04-22-2017, 05:36 AM | #819 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Quote:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/ar...ists-warn.html
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04-22-2017, 05:45 AM | #820 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
I'm for equal rights of all. And it's easy to learn about FGM. Do a google search on it. Or start with Wiki:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Female...lation#History
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04-22-2017, 05:53 AM | #821 | |
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If this were part of the Pentagon's already huge budget, he could do this by actually decreasing the budget (eliminate the stupid manned mission to mars). Who knows if we do this with our military China, Russia and NATO might also follow. The next step might be to require military suppliers to also do this. A simple little move like this might get the dominoes falling on a trillion dollars worth of solar panels.
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04-22-2017, 05:58 AM | #822 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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04-22-2017, 07:24 AM | #823 | |
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04-22-2017, 07:44 AM | #824 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
And the divide is already so large that the lifeline won't reach.
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04-22-2017, 03:49 PM | #825 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Likewise the divide on this forum -- needing a lifeline larger than Life.
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04-22-2017, 04:14 PM | #826 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
the divide is due to people behaving in a way that is evil, corrupt, unethical, etc.
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04-22-2017, 07:12 PM | #827 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
The actions of Trump against science inspired thousands of Americans to march on Washington and around the country for science today. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/...ushpmg00000063
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04-22-2017, 09:34 PM | #828 | |
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04-23-2017, 01:03 AM | #829 | |
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Constant fear-mongering brought to us daily by the progressively liberal community organizers on the left, who now concluded that "Trump is against science," just like all his "twisted" supporters, most of whom are those science-denying evangelical Christians who also summarily reject evolution. For shame, for shame!
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04-23-2017, 01:05 AM | #830 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
What do you mean?
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04-23-2017, 04:26 AM | #831 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
The issue with Clinton was not his policies, or difference in opinion. It was due to his corrupt and unethical behavior. Likewise, a doctor violating all ethical guidelines to say that Trump has a dangerous mental illness, the problem is not that Trump is narcissistic which is probably true to some extent of all presidents, but the problem is that this doctor violates standard ethical guidelines.
If the Democrats are now claiming that the Republican president is "mentally unstable" does anyone think that there will not be a "tit for tat" when a Democrat is president? Everyone for the most part understands that there are different strategies and policies and there may not be a single right way, besides if we make a mistake we can correct it at the next election. The problem is with the corruption shown by Nixon, Clinton, Cheney, Bush, etc.
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04-23-2017, 09:00 AM | #832 | |
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I agree, but what corruption are you referring to with Bush.
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04-23-2017, 10:58 AM | #833 | |
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As with your denial of natural selection, your climate change denial serves your commitment to your years of ideological programming. You're not likely to change your thinking due to logical arguments or incontrovertible evidence. Just as you were trained, you fear that would jeopardize your salvation. At the base of your prejudices is sheer existential terror. What is reason or overwhelming evidence compared to that? The stupid liberals are oblivious to that and that's why you hate them. I get it, bro. No problem.
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04-23-2017, 12:28 PM | #834 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Iran Contra
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04-23-2017, 02:52 PM | #835 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
I thought that was Reagan's second term -- Poindexter, North, etc.
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04-23-2017, 05:22 PM | #836 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Bush was VP, but he ran the operation.
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04-23-2017, 09:25 PM | #837 | |
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Until you figure that Christianity has been divided from the get-go. You say I'm always critical of Christianity. How can I not be? How can you not be? We're even divided on that. Something that is obvious to anyone that gives it even a cursory look, and is honest about it.
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04-24-2017, 12:43 AM | #838 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
OK bro, bring on the debunking. Nevertheless Trump proposes cutting funding for much more science then climate change research. You would know that if you read the article I linked. You are opining for nothing, just another excuse to get your ignorance out in public.
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04-24-2017, 03:16 AM | #839 | |
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04-24-2017, 04:02 AM | #840 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Peter, Paul, and Mary got the Hudson river cleaned up. It used to catch fire, now you can swim in it.
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04-24-2017, 04:42 AM | #841 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
But the fire came from the Magic Dragon???
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04-24-2017, 05:13 AM | #842 | |
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FACT: The HadCRUT3 surface temperature index, produced by the Hadley Centre of the UK Met Office and the Climate Research Unit of the University of East Anglia, shows warming to 1878, cooling to 1911, warming to 1941, cooling to 1964, warming to 1998 and cooling through 2011. The warming rate from 1964 to 1998 was the same as the previous warming from 1911 to 1941. Satellites, weather balloons and ground stations all show cooling since 2001. The mild warming of 0.6 to 0.8 C over the 20th century is well within the natural variations recorded in the last millennium. The ground station network suffers from an uneven distribution across the globe; the stations are preferentially located in growing urban and industrial areas ("heat islands"), which show substantially higher readings than adjacent rural areas ("land use effects"). Two science teams have shown that correcting the surface temperature record for the effects of urban development would reduce the reported warming trend over land from 1980 by half. See here. There has been no catastrophic warming recorded. MYTH 2: The "hockey stick" graph proves that the earth has experienced a steady, very gradual temperature decrease for 1000 years, then recently began a sudden increase. FACT: Significant changes in climate have continually occurred throughout geologic time. For instance, the Medieval Warm Period, from around 1000 to1200 AD (when the Vikings farmed on Greenland) was followed by a period known as the Little Ice Age. Since the end of the 17th Century the "average global temperature" has been rising at the low steady rate mentioned above; although from 1940 – 1970 temperatures actually dropped, leading to a Global Cooling scare. The "hockey stick", a poster boy of both the UN's IPCC and Canada's Environment Department, ignores historical recorded climatic swings, and has now also been proven to be flawed and statistically unreliable as well. It is a computer construct and a faulty one at that. See here for more information. MYTH 3: Human produced carbon dioxide has increased over the last 100 years, adding to the Greenhouse effect, thus causing most of the earth's warming of the last 100 years. FACT: Carbon dioxide levels have indeed changed for various reasons, human and otherwise, just as they have throughout geologic time. Since the beginning of the industrial revolution, the CO2 content of the atmosphere has increased by about 120 part per million (ppm), most of which is likely due to human-caused CO2 emissions. The RATE of growth during this century has been about 0.55%/year. However, there is no proof that CO2 is the main driver of global warming. As measured in ice cores dated over many thousands of years, CO2 levels move up and down AFTER the temperature has done so, and thus are the RESULT OF, NOT THE CAUSE of warming. Geological field work in recent sediments confirms this causal relationship. There is solid evidence that, as temperatures move up and down naturally and cyclically through solar radiation, orbital and galactic influences, the warming surface layers of the earth's oceans expel more CO2 as a result. MYTH 4: CO2 is the most common greenhouse gas. FACT: Greenhouse gases form about 3% of the atmosphere by volume. They consist of varying amounts, (about 97%) of water vapour and clouds, with the remainder being gases like CO2, CH4, Ozone and N2O, of which carbon dioxide is the largest amount. Hence, CO2 constitutes about 0.04% of the atmosphere. While the minor gases are more effective as "greenhouse agents" than water vapour and clouds, the latter are overwhelming the effect by their sheer volume and – in the end – are thought to be responsible for 75% of the "Greenhouse effect". (See here) At current concentrations, a 3% change of water vapour in the atmosphere would have the same effect as a 100% change in CO2. Those attributing climate change to CO2 rarely mention these important facts. MYTH 5: Computer models verify that CO2 increases will cause significant global warming. FACT: The computer models assume that CO2 is the primary climate driver, and that the Sun has an insignificant effect on climate. Using the output of a model to verify its initial assumption is committing the logical fallacy of circular reasoning. Computer models can be made to roughly match the 20th century temperature rise by adjusting many input parameters and using strong positive feedbacks. They do not "prove" anything. Also, computer models predicting global warming are incapable of properly including the effects of the sun, cosmic rays and the clouds. The sun is a major cause of temperature variation on the earth surface as its received radiation changes all the time, This happens largely in cyclical fashion. The number and the lengths in time of sunspots can be correlated very closely with average temperatures on earth, e.g. the Little Ice Age and the Medieval Warm Period. Varying intensity of solar heat radiation affects the surface temperature of the oceans and the currents. Warmer ocean water expels gases, some of which are CO2. Solar radiation interferes with the cosmic ray flux, thus influencing the amount ionized nuclei which control cloud cover. MYTH 6: The United Nations' Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC) has proven that man–made CO2 causes global warming. FACT: In a 1996 report by the UN on global warming, two statements were deleted from the final draft approved and accepted by a panel of scientists. Here they are: 1) “None of the studies cited above has shown clear evidence that we can attribute the observed climate changes to increases in greenhouse gases.” 2) “No study to date has positively attributed all or part of the climate change to man–made causes” To the present day there is still no scientific proof that man-made CO2 causes significant global warming.
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04-24-2017, 05:40 AM | #843 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
That was Hanna Lee, not Hudson by the Sea.
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04-24-2017, 06:01 AM | #844 | ||||||
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Quote:
Yes, it is true that this has happened before in the geologic record. During the Permian extinction we hit CO2 levels similar to today. Of course we also saw the extinction of 95% of all species on Earth and we saw vast amounts of the ocean evaporate so that the sea floor was exposed to the atmosphere. Another similarity between today and the Permian extinction is the escape of methane hydrates into the atmosphere. This is an incredibly damaging feedback loop to the CO2 cycle (if you need an analogy to a "feedback loop" it is water rushing into a boat, as more water rushes in, the boat sinks, allowing for more water to rush in). Quote:
Quote:
1. CO2 is an emission from fossil fuel which we have been burning since the beginning of the industrial age and have been measuring it accurately for over 60 years. It is increasing to very high levels on any scale, even geologic scales of hundreds of millions of years. 2. Water Vapor will increase in the air along with temperature. So it creates a feedback loop. As the temperature rises, we will get more water vapor from the ocean evaporating which in turn will help the temperature rise. 3. Methane is perhaps the most powerful greenhouse gas, 100 times more powerful than CO2. McDonald's has done an extraordinary job of changing the diet of this planet and pumping Methane gas into the atmosphere as a result. There is a double whammy, in order to raise the cows for their hamburgers they are cutting down rain forests which act as a carbon sink. Quote:
Since there are many different models, just as there are for predicting a hurricane, we often find the best result from the average of the models. Quote:
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04-24-2017, 09:06 AM | #845 | ||
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So I'm with bro zeek, for maybe different reasons : Bring on the debunkers. In other words bro Evan, I'd like to consider the debunkers you're talking about. And bro zeek. Cool your jets.
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04-24-2017, 09:58 AM | #846 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Quote:
https://www.skepticalscience.com/argument.php
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04-24-2017, 10:48 AM | #847 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
The march for science was a first step. Scientists are organizing locally. The goal is to get scientists and pro-science people elected to public office at every level and then to change laws and policies in a direction conducive to science. If people adopt your position, defeat is a self-fulfilling prophesy.
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04-24-2017, 12:03 PM | #848 | |
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Therefore when the rest of the world discovered and then adopted this we could have skipped the toxic portion of burning fossil fuel. We could have avoided all of the ecological disasters we have seen this last 150 years and we would have avoided the human catastrophe resulting from these various empires invading each other (Roman Empire, Greek Empire, Medo Persian Empire, and Babylonian Empire). They all would have been stopped by Israel. Also, you can forget about Ghenghis Khan or even the Crusades. But man chose a different path, that of "the grass is greener on the other side of the fence". Wars, rape, pillage, coveting, stealing, etc. This is what drove the policy to invade Iraq. The biggest natural reserves of oil in the world, second only to Saudi Arabia (which had booby trapped their oil fields with dirty nuclear bombs) was Iraq. A very big gas field was discovered in Turkmenistan, which we got access to when we invaded Afghanistan. This is not about the science, or understanding the science. The US government has understood the science for years and the Pentagon has already put plans in place for the catastrophe of climate change. Hence the call to "build a wall", "Brexit", or "Ms. Le Pen". Even if the US were to convert tomorrow to being carbon neutral it would be too little too late. We are already in a negative feedback loop with methane hydrates escaping to the atmosphere and a huge loss in ice which reflects sunlight replaced by open ocean which absorbs the light. Most of our dirty factories have already moved to Asia, Mexico and the rest of the third world. We have already passed certain very key milestones, unprecedented CO2 levels in the atmosphere causing acidification of the ocean. Huge loss of biodiversity and habitat, weakening the ability of the Earth to bounce back. Incredible carbon pollution from the burning of fossil fuel and methane from cows. 7 billion people are like a huge ocean liner, it doesn't stop or turn quickly. Climate change is upon us. If you live within 200 feet of sea level you should move to higher ground while you can still get market value for your home. Other than that prepare for Mad Max to run the country. One day you will reminisce about the good old days when Trump was your biggest worry. Also, if you have a problem with the Bible talking about Hell fire, try visiting oil development of tar sands in Canada. Visit the oil field in Texas. Visit the land on fire in Pennsylvania. You will smell the sulfur, you will see the hellscape, just don't drink the water. You were warned that we were on a path that leads to hell, you didn't believe it, and now you can see the outskirts as we get closer and closer.
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04-24-2017, 12:30 PM | #849 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Global warming is caused by the heat of the loins.
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04-24-2017, 08:14 PM | #850 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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04-25-2017, 04:47 AM | #851 | |
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11 But my people would not hearken to my voice; and Israel would none of me. 12 So I gave them up unto their own hearts' lust: and they walked in their own counsels. 13 Oh that my people had hearkened unto me, and Israel had walked in my ways! 14 I should soon have subdued their enemies, and turned my hand against their adversaries. 15 The haters of the Lord should have submitted themselves unto him: but their time should have endured for ever. 16 He should have fed them also with the finest of the wheat: and with honey out of the rock should I have satisfied thee. I prefer to buy into the Lord's word, rather than those who walk according to their own counsel and lusts.
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04-25-2017, 06:28 AM | #852 | |
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http://www.realclearinvestigations.c..._the_cold.html When asked if he would voice dissent on climate change if he were a younger, less established physicist, he said: “Oh, no, definitely not. I held my tongue for a long time because friends told me I would not be elected to the National Academy of Sciences if I didn’t toe the alarmists’ company line.” |
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04-25-2017, 06:29 AM | #853 | |
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Even before Trump, I don't think scientists have ever had much of a say in politics. |
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04-25-2017, 06:42 AM | #854 | |
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Perhaps another pic from Flint showing us how well the EPA is caring for our drinking water.
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04-25-2017, 07:24 AM | #855 | |
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And again I find : Curry receives ongoing funding from the fossil fuel industry. http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php...ations_Network
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04-25-2017, 07:33 AM | #856 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
You do realize that those verses you quoted weren't talking about the Bible don't you?
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04-25-2017, 07:37 AM | #857 | |
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The worldly system is transforming the paradise (Eden) into hell. They are creating a world that is very accurately described in the Bible. Verses that have been rejected as being "inconsistent with a loving God" are now reality. Today they are talking about sending a "manned mission to Mars" and making us a dual planet species. There is a verse in Revelation that discusses the judgement of Climate Change and the Ozone hole and it concludes "and they shall by no means escape". Mars is not the solution. If they are destroying the land with the mining of Tar sands and fracking now, do you think this will decrease as the coming judgement approaches? When we descend into "Mad Max" land do you think the roving gangs will be planning to strike my house or one of Trump's palaces? Now you can understand the terror of these billionaires doing whatever it takes to put off that judgement for another year. I like to think that regardless of how bad it gets they will still want teachers, but then I see pictures of Syria and realize if it gets that bad you can forget teachers. These leaders are not thinking about a transition that can take 20 years, they are thinking about avoiding chaos over the next six months. Therefore it is "drill, baby, drill" and "I love coal miners". We have plenty of energy to supply the world for the next 20 years, some of the dirtiest, most polluting energy imaginable. For example tar sands often have a Return on investment of 2 barrels of oil for every barrel of oil used. Half of the oil they get from tar sands are used to destroy the land in order to get it. There is no way they use the other half to restore the land. This is rape and pillage. Promise anything, but only an idiot thinks that they intend to clean up their mess when they are done. Today some aquifers of drinking water are damaged due to fracking, water coming out of the tap can catch fire. Imagine 20 years from now with an exponential increase of fracking. Flint Michigan is the tip of the iceberg.
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04-25-2017, 07:41 AM | #858 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
I realize that your Biblical interpretation is biased and not credible. You convinced me with your recent discussion on Mark 9. Though there has been plenty prior to that. So if you have Bible commentary from someone credible I would be happy to respond to that.
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04-25-2017, 08:11 AM | #859 | |
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Science has always had to compete with political interests. But, science had a greater influence on public policy prior to the rise of conservative "faith-based" politics. Trump is against anything that doesn't serve his personal interests. He has already betrayed the working class people who voted for him in many ways yet I hear that his favorability among them is still 96%. Demagogues have that effect on their followers. On the day they died, Jim Jones' followers praised him for giving them the courage to drink the poisoned Kool-Aid.
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04-25-2017, 09:03 AM | #860 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
And how about our cops. All these hundreds of years and they haven't stopped crime. Let's do away with cops. They ain't no count.
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04-25-2017, 10:05 AM | #861 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Quote:
If he further designated that this entire purchase go to the Pentagon, perhaps even including it in their budget, then this might prompt similar purchases by China, Russia, NATO, Japan, etc. The New Testament describes the next age as "the restoration of all things" and says it will take 1,000 years. I have yet to see any scientific estimate on toxic sites that suggests it will take more than 1,000 years to restore. One reason I am suggesting the Pentagon to purchase solar power is because they are already planning for Climate change, you don't have to convince them. Also they have the budget. Third, if we descend to Mad Max type situation we need Marshall law and we need our military to not collapse. There are several descriptions in NT prophecy concerning a total collapse of the world's economy and currency. This is not hyperbole, it is the setting on which the Antichrist enters and the basis for Armageddon. I have also shared on this forum that the design for the New Jerusalem is the solution to the crisis of climate change, the crisis of terrorism, and the way to make peace in the Middle East. Everything I have shared is realistic based on the facts. We are witnessing a negative feedback loop on a massive scale. Methane Hydrates are bubbling into the atmosphere in a truly fantastic scale. The loss of ice in the last two years has been jaw dropping and results in the ocean absorbing more heat from the sun. No one is about to exterminate the billions of cows that are putting methane into the air. I have looked at the political reality, the US government would rather do nothing than address these issues, no other country is any better, and many have decided they cannot afford to be environmentally friendly. If anyone thinks that the current rate of emissions will not continue unabated they are in denial.
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04-25-2017, 11:07 AM | #862 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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04-25-2017, 01:56 PM | #863 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Yes, and that's because Trump really wants a coal furnace in the White House! Of course. It all makes so much sense.
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04-25-2017, 02:08 PM | #864 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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Why can't we continue with our mix of private coal, gas, nuclear power generation. The gov't should provide us with a national defense, and basically back out of everything else.
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04-25-2017, 04:32 PM | #865 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
You mean Mar-A-Lago?
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04-25-2017, 04:56 PM | #866 | |
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In addition, when you calculate the cost of oil, since it is imported the government does not receive tax dollars. But with solar that is manufactured in the US the US government gets back 40% of the cost in tax revenue, it generates excellent domestic jobs and industry and good service jobs going forward. It also is a clean energy that doesn't result in air pollution and asthma. Health care costs for asthma and related air pollution costs like cancer should also be calculated in as a very real saving. Solar is a very good investment based on today's cost for energy, but that is still not a reasonable calculation. When you pay for solar you are paying for 25 years of energy. Ask yourself, is oil going to get more expensive over the next 25 years? If so that has to be calculated into your determination. By every single measure solar is a very good investment for the US government. But it is especially good for our military because it results in a distributed power source. Right now the power grid is a target for terrorists, hackers and all foreign enemies. The more the military decentralizes it the smarter it is for a strategic point of view. Finally, a very large contract like the one I envision will have a huge impact on the development of US industry and manufacturing.
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04-25-2017, 05:01 PM | #867 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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Look at who is running this country, would you trust them? It is the same reason that Adam and Eve were banished from the garden, you cannot give these corrupt leaders this secret. Step 1 -- bind them. This will take place when the stock market crashes and currency crashes. Step 2 -- Jesus can come in and plunder this worldly system. The NJ comes in after this point.
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04-25-2017, 05:16 PM | #868 | |
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04-25-2017, 05:56 PM | #869 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
The NJ is an amazing design, once the world learns this it will be a game changer. The beauty of the unsustainable economy is that it reveals those who fleshly and their kingdom is unsustainable. There is no way you want them to get access to the NJ. Your question was "to whom are you making you recommendations". My "recommendations" is the gospel. The same guy who foresaw 2,000 years ago the crisis we are in now also laid out the solution. No one else can hold a candle to Him.
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04-26-2017, 07:15 AM | #870 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Many people are wringing their hands over climate change.
They rightly see that world leaders are ignoring catastrophic environmental change due to human activity (pollution). They suspect that this is because the rich are rich as a result of this pillage (billionaire club knows as Trump's cabinet, Major oil executives running the government ever since Reagan, etc). They look at the horrific sight of oil spills in the Gulf, tar sands in Canada, fracking in the Midwest, and see that these "developers" have no line of decency that they won't cross for the "almighty" buck. They rightly see what is happening in Syria, Afghanistan, and Iraq as a result of both unchecked development of oil and climate change. They look at the 1 trillion dollar price tag with horror when shown side by side with snapshots of Detroit and Flint. They see climate refugees beginning to flood the developed world, tropical diseases like Zika scaring us to death, and of course the disappearance of glaciers and ice caps in the relative blink of an eye. And again, they are unable to see the silver lining in all of this. Go back to the complaint that world leaders aren't doing anything. The good thing about climate change, the silver lining, is that it will remove the world leaders. That is what "revolution" means. The wheel revolves. Those in the mud move up to the top, those at the top move down to the mud.
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04-26-2017, 09:41 AM | #871 | |
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The climate changes with or without human intervention. During the 20th century alone we went thru both a cool down and a warming period. No model in existence is able to account for both past and present climate data, yet they still use their extrapolations to make "scientific" predictions. If spooking the people with Wooly Mammoths didn't work when I was young, then try something else. Have we all now become as "qualified" as Bill Nye the "science guy?" Even if their claims are true, US emissions are nothing compared to the rest of the world. We barely have a manufacturing base anymore, and our EPA regulations are orders of magnitude more stringent that the rest of the world, hence the US could effectively "turn off the lights" and it would have nearly no impact. Ever consider how much more dangerous volcanic emissions are than vehicular or manufacturing emissions? The earth itself has great "cleansing" power over pollutants, yet the earth itself is far more dangerous to "Mother Nature" than man actually is. But why not incite all the campus snowflakes for political gain? Why not twist all the data for political advantage? Clintons, Obamas, et. al. for decades got real rich and powerful with this "business model." Did anyone ever consider that perhaps climate change is good for man? What if it is part of God's plan to wake us up and speak to us? What if the "fullness of the time" is drawing near, and this earth is right on schedule? What if the increase in natural disasters (volcanoes, tsunamis, earthquakes, etc.) completely outside of man's control are all designed to be signals to us? What if our Creator has no intention that this earth should last us another millennia? What if the Biblical prophecies are actually true and will be soon accomplished?
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04-26-2017, 09:56 AM | #872 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
You said "I have already recommended that Trump drop the $450 billion slated for a mission to Mars and instead designate that the US Government buy $450 billion in solar power." So you consider $450 billion for solar power to be the "gospel"?
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04-26-2017, 10:05 AM | #873 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Sure. Coal furnaces are desperately needed throughout Florida.
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04-26-2017, 10:30 AM | #874 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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Can't be that many in the NJ. It's not the big. It's a big square like the Borg in Star Trek. It's only 1400 miles square. I wonder if the people in it will be like those connected to the Borg ; all connected, by the spirit, to central control. Resistance is futile ... haha. But I think that what makes the NJ so amazing, is not it's stunning arresting beauty, but the fact that there will be very few there. Members may not even know there are other members.
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04-26-2017, 11:06 AM | #875 | ||||||
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Re: Politics and the Church
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I do not call it God's plan, that just gives more fuel to Awareness with his POE arguments. I say that man came to a fork in the road at the time of king Solomon. At that time Solomon should have obeyed the Moses law to not go outside the kingdom, had he done that the industrial revolution would have been born. He was on the cusp. Once they disobeyed God we began down this path that led here. Quote:
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04-26-2017, 11:52 AM | #876 | |
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Should get replaced by a Blender.
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04-26-2017, 12:38 PM | #877 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Trump Tower?
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04-26-2017, 01:18 PM | #878 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Your question does not make sense, but the discussion started here ...
Quote:
But for typical coastline Liberals, these coal people are stupid "demagogues" who drink Kool-Aid. Your statement here is so indicative of the Proud Progressive Left with its arrogant condescending attitudes towards the working class. That's why Trump won. As long as the Left keeps these arrogant attitudes, they will continue to spiral into obscurity.
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04-26-2017, 01:20 PM | #879 | |
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04-26-2017, 01:58 PM | #880 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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04-26-2017, 02:09 PM | #881 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
The Christian population is not, though A's thought of no one realizing others are there is off to the other extreme.
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04-26-2017, 03:16 PM | #882 | |
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Quote:
Obviously I have no idea of the population of the NJ other than that estimate. But we did try reconstructing the model in pretty extensive detail.
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04-26-2017, 03:59 PM | #883 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Trump's tax proposal includes a massive cut in the top tax rate on “pass-through” companies like his own, from its current level of 39.6% to a mere 15%. This is a huge giveaway to the rich including Trump himself.
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04-26-2017, 07:07 PM | #884 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
The hottest day on record in NY city was July 9 1936:
https://realclimatescience.com/2016/...new-york-city/ You don't need to be a scientist to be able to interpret those graphs and realize that climate change is nonsense. For more on how the data is manipulated to fit the agenda see here: https://realclimatescience.com/globa...ion-and-fraud/ Just like they said in the 1970's that a "30 year cooling" may never end.. people were preparing for the new ice age. |
04-27-2017, 05:58 AM | #885 | |
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04-27-2017, 07:47 AM | #886 | |
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Wow, very scientific. So a calculation of the warmest year, including data from thousands of cities is thrown out for a calculation of the warmest city, basically one thermometer in central park? You can't have it both ways. You can't say that one thermometer in Central Park rules out climate change whereas hundreds of thousands of them over the last hundred years are not relevant. When I was a kid it was unthinkable that the Arctic Ice sheet would melt during the summer. No more. For all you budding scientists out there do you know why they chose to measure CO2 levels in Hawaii?
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04-27-2017, 09:53 AM | #887 | |
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Nee and Lee worked hard to make nonsense out of the Bible. You may not like their nonsense, but you seem to be working just as hard to take the Bible where it otherwise does not go. Just to a different place than Nee and Lee did.
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04-27-2017, 10:03 AM | #888 | |
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The population density of NJ is irrelevant to the comment I made. And the current population of the earth is irrelevant to the comment Awareness made about the number of people who would be inhabiting the New Jerusalem and therefore in proximity of each other if they spread out equally. (That assumes that his assumptions about the number there and how they would be dispersed is reasonable.)
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04-27-2017, 10:17 AM | #889 | |
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King Solomon's Mines Rediscovered? Rebecca Carroll for National Geographic News October 28, 2008 Copper mines in southern Jordan were active centuries earlier than previously believed, according to a new study that suggests the area was producing the metal at the same time the biblical figure of King Solomon is said to have built Jerusalem's first Jewish temple. Industrial-scale metal production was occurring at a site in Jordan in the tenth century B.C., according to the study's carbon dating of ancient industrial mining debris and analysis of the settlement's layout. http://news.nationalgeographic.com/n...-missions.html There are six factors that led to the industrial revolution 1. Industrial production — by all accounts archaeologists have determined that King’s Solomon’s mines did exist and produced iron and copper on an industrial scale. 2. Agricultural production — again, check. 3. Iron Smelting — check 4. Coal extraction — I assume they used coal for their smelting operation. It could have been charcoal. 5. The railways — they did not have this but needed it. According to the archaelogists they must have had a massively long camel train to transport the metal being smelted at the scale that was taking place. 6. Steam power — again they did not have this. But they had the need. The embargo act of 1807 had a big impact on pushing the US towards an industrial revolution because we had to produce the goods that we would have otherwise imported. Moses law imposed an artificial embargo act on Solomon which he ignored. However, had he obeyed the law he would have needed coal or oil for his mines. The war of 1812 also was a springboard for the industrial revolution because it forced us to see the need for a better transportation system. I think it is obvious that Solomon with his mines and long camel train would have also seen the need for a better transportation system. Other key factors were natural resources — iron and coal. Israel has both. Economic strength, Israel had this at the time of Solomon. Political stability, Israel had this at the time of Solomon. The description of Solomon as the “wisest man on earth” and how he had his servants in perfect order, with clockwork precision. This is the environment that would be ideal for making the key improvements for the industrial revolution. In 600 BC a basic form of the railway existed in Ancient Greece and Roman times called “the rutway”. I do not think it is far fetched to suggest that Solomon could have also come up with something like that. Heron of Alexandria had invented a number of gadgets that used steam power for various purposes. This was about 1,000 years after Solomon, but a good 1600 years before the invention of the steam engine. Once again, boiling water, seeing steam, and understanding how it works is not very complicated. The concept is relatively simple if you have the tools and capital to fabricate the metal parts. It would have been a great discovery had it taken place at the time of Solomon. My point is, necessity is the mother of invention. If Solomon had submitted to the self imposed embargo of Moses he would have had the need and according to the Bible “the wisest man on Earth” certainly had the resources and manpower to invent this. It is not reasonable to think of any other time. After Solomon the Kingdom was split, then they were invaded by Babylonians, and from that point on it was one empire after another sweeping through Israel. Obviously this is a hypothetical. But there are certain things that are not hypothetical. 1. Solomon's mines 2. Solomon's need for energy in smelting 3. Solomon's need for a better transportation system for his mines 4. Stabile government 5. Resources to do what was necessary 6. Strong centralized govt 7. Wise leader It is not a leap to think he would have created a prototype of a railway. Once he had a railway had he obeyed the self imposed embargo it would have been extraordinary if they had then invented the steam engine, but from a scientific or technological viewpoint that also would not have been a big leap. You have all the resources, you have the need, you have a railway, now you need an engine. Ask yourself "at what point did we take this fork in the road that led to catastrophic climate change and Armageddon being inevitable?" What was the instruction from God that we ignored? Obviously you don't like my suggestion that it was Solomon so why don't you tell me when it was? Also, please note, I think this is a reasonable interpretation of Ps 81.
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04-27-2017, 10:20 AM | #890 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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My comment was a response to Awareness saying there would be very few people there. Therefore it is relevant.
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04-27-2017, 10:46 AM | #891 | |
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And I think the people of earth have far more serious concerns than melting snow in the Arctic Circle.
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04-27-2017, 02:08 PM | #892 | |
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1. What is happening? 2. Why? 3. What are the risks or dangers involved? I think the science has done an adequate job of answering these three questions. We can quibble over the details, but denying the facts is not a defensible position. that said I do agree that the solution is not necessarily to jump to some form of hysteria. Instead: 4. What is the solution? 5. How much will it cost? This is the problem, there is no solution that can be implemented solely by the US. If India and China are not on board we don't have a solution. By my understanding we have passed the point of no return a long time ago. We are on a runaway train, it has 5 or 6 engines of which we can only control one engine and we have no way of stopping this train. We cannot avoid the storm, therefore prepare for it. If our military had an independent power source from the Sun then it would be unlikely that they would be unable to operate during a worldwide collapse. This is something we can do. It does make sense economically. We have the money and it is an efficient use of the money. By comparison trying to secure oil fields in the Middle East where Russia, Iran, India, China and Europe will all be fighting as well is not a good strategy. When the major powers are running their navies like Somali pirates the situation will be very different for us. No way to get an oil tanker from the Middle East to the US.
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04-27-2017, 02:54 PM | #893 | |
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So let's review them. Factor 1. Not particularly meaningful since it is merely a measure of quantity, not quality or mode of delivery. And it was stated (by you) as including something that is not otherwise included — iron production. Not saying they didn't produce any, but you surely haven't provided any evidence of anything like significant production of it. Rather just copper. Factor 2. Agricultural production. And breathing and eating. They hadn't died, so they must be on the verge of an industrial revolution. Factor 3. Iron smelting. It would be impressive if true. But you provided no evidence of it. Factor 4. Coal extraction. Stated separately from the other mining so that it could be propped-up as another factor? Factor 5. Railways. Nope. Factor 6. Steam engines. Nope. I guess we really don't have much except for the fact that they did mining in a particular region 300 years before previously thought. Yep, they are on the cusp of an industrial revolution. Probably will occur in about 2,800 years. You really think that man had advanced so far by 1,000 BC but then regressed so extremely that they couldn't get back to the same place until around 1800 AD? It boggles the mind. Did the kind of mining they were doing become so poor that it was not seen again until the 1500s or later? The problem is that the claim of industrial revolution is something that you are saying, but it appears that no one else is supporting your claims. National Geographic is not saying it. When referring to the building of the Temple, there is a reference to a lot of copper, and to smaller amounts of gold and silver, but not to iron. Where do you get this stuff. Do you just make it up?
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04-27-2017, 03:00 PM | #894 | |
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Not very helpful. Then when I come back and ask about that, you provide the persons per square mile in NJ. Still irrelevant if we don't have a number to spread over any number of square miles. In other words, for every question raised, you answered a different question. You should run for political office.
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04-27-2017, 03:27 PM | #895 | ||
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Two Detroit doctors and a woman are charged over genital mutilation of two seven-year-old girls http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...ung-girls.html
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04-27-2017, 03:33 PM | #896 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Well he seems to be pulling it out of somewhere. And there's not many options.
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04-27-2017, 03:44 PM | #897 | |
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But back to the pending "ice age" we faced decades ago. How did we fix that? What was the solution? How much did it cost?
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04-27-2017, 03:52 PM | #898 | |
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If Christians were doing this, you would be all over it. Why is it all the liberal news outlets, which you handily espouse, are so silent on this? Do you agree with this evil and perverted chauvinist practice? Sounds like it. And why is it when some conservative like me brings up these dangerous "habits" of Muslams, like terrorism and FGM, you get so upset? This evil religious practice is worse than barbaric and cultic. And you want to bring these folks into the US? These young girls need asylum and these Quacks need an electric chair!
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04-27-2017, 04:03 PM | #899 | |
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Many of our "modern" discoveries, post Renaissance era, actually built upon their work. In other words, remove centuries of wars, sinful corruptions, and religious evils (E.g. the RCC, idolatry, Mohammedism, etc.) from the equation, and who knows how much more quickly mankind would have advanced. Obviously man has spent more time going backwards than going forward.
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04-27-2017, 05:42 PM | #900 | |
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I am not going to go into detail on the design of the NJ on this thread.
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04-27-2017, 05:48 PM | #901 | |
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But once again, you did not answer my question. 1. Is it a sin that man uses fossil fuel? 2. If not then please explain how we could have avoided the pollution and climate change that burning this fuel has caused? At what point in human history did we take a wrong turn that has led us here? That is what this interpretation does. It shows what it means that "his wisdom is turned to foolishness" in 1 Cor. Solomon is a model of wisdom, yet it was by his wisdom that he ignored God's commands. As a result he did not know God and his wisdom was reckoned as foolishness. This is a theory, a hypothetical, but one day God can answer this question. My guess is that God will agree that had Solomon obeyed Him he would have been blessed with discovering the industrial revolution.
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04-27-2017, 05:53 PM | #902 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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There is some thought that as the ice in the Arctic melts it will cause a mini ice age in Europe. This is due to the fact that fresh water is less dense than salt water and therefore will not sink and that in turn will cause the ocean currents to be short circuited. I don't know if "ice age" or "mini ice age" is the best term as no one that I am familiar with is suggesting glaciers a km thick, but massive snowfall is not at all unlikely. But while this is happening in Europe you can also expect the equatorial regions to get much hotter and probably see a massive die off in the ocean.
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04-27-2017, 06:01 PM | #903 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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Why the delay? You needed equipment that most people did not have access to, you needed someone who could afford to tinker and experiment without the constant pressure to feed themselves, and you needed an economy where this invention would be more than some carnival attraction. There have only been a few times in history when we had all of these combined. Heron's inventions were merely carnival attractions.
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04-27-2017, 06:10 PM | #904 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
For quite a while I was accused on this forum of "parroting WL". It has been quite a while since anyone suggested that. Maybe a search on LSM website under Solomon
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04-27-2017, 06:45 PM | #905 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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Scientists should listen to engineers more, like Ohio, particularly about these matters of climate change. Many engineers I know disagree with global warming. It's not because they are against science or are stupid, but because they see things differently. Somehow engineers are not blinded by cognitive bias because they are trained to be pragmatic. Remember, engineers make stuff, not scientists. Through experience, engineers have a better idea of how the world works than scientists in some lab looking into a petri dish. |
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04-27-2017, 07:30 PM | #906 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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What happened? The earth got a little cooler, scientists panicked and projected doom and gloom. Things turned around without costing a penny. Now we have the opposite happening.
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04-27-2017, 07:46 PM | #907 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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I'm now wondering if you think hell is hell because it's full of liberals, and heaven is heaven because it's full of conservatives ... cuz God hates liberals, even tho His Son didn't ... right?
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04-27-2017, 07:48 PM | #908 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
duplicate post
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04-27-2017, 10:09 PM | #909 | |
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04-27-2017, 10:57 PM | #910 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
The irony is that the threat of NK nukes is dismissed as "they don't have the tech. yet", while scientists are watching the ice melt, drip drip drip, biting their nails in fear and trembling. No, actually what they are doing is salivating at the thought of getting the next grant approved as they watch the melting ice confirm their hypothesis.
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04-28-2017, 04:17 AM | #911 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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04-28-2017, 05:40 AM | #912 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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College snowflakes, neither knowing God nor prior bogey men, however, are especially vulnerable.
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04-28-2017, 06:19 AM | #913 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Who predicted an ice age based on what evidence?
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04-28-2017, 06:28 AM | #914 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
The so-called "Trump bump" flopped. The economy barely grew in the first quarter, expanding at an annual rate of only 0.7 percent.
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04-28-2017, 07:44 AM | #915 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Why is it that you ask many questions which I answer and when I ask you questions you ignore them, avoid them or all we hear are crickets?
20 Where is the wise? where is the scribe? where is the disputer of this world? hath not God made foolish the wisdom of this world? When Paul refers to "the wise" is it reasonable to include Solomon? If so, explain how God made foolish the wisdom of Solomon? If not, please explain why Solomon of all people is not included in "the wise". 21 For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe. Regardless of what your interpretation is, I include Solomon with "the wise". Therefore, it is also completely reasonable to ask how Solomon, in his wisdom, did not know God. The obvious answer is that in his wisdom he ignored God's command to not have dealings with Egypt and Lebanon. He was told the reason he was not to go to Egypt for horses and Lebanon for cedars was because God had given him "a very good land". He would have learned this had he not disobeyed God's command, but in his wisdom he chose to disobey God's command and as a result he did not learn that the Middle East is "a very good land". Now at this point the only "rich" thing about the Middle East that I think Solomon could have learned but didn't was: oil, concrete and steel. That is where I got this. From Paul. It is also reasonable to conclude that all world leaders have followed Solomon's example. Whether we are talking about Gehghis Khan, Hannibal, the various empires, or the Crusades.
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04-28-2017, 07:51 AM | #916 |
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Well that's not an answerable question. I can's provide sources for what I was taught between 1970-1975, other than giving you the name of my high school and university.
I can say that it was common knowledge, or at least presented that way, that all civilization was going to die in the next 10,000 years due to smokestack and tailpipe emissions. Pictures of extinct frozen wooly mammoths in a block of ice were cited as proof. I thought you were old enough to have lived thru that scare. The scare tactic hysteria was prompted by political agendas driven by extrapolated climate data. Hence, it is understandable why I am a little skeptical of scientific theories coupled with political mandates, but ole zeek is convinced that it is due to "LC programming." Whatever!
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04-28-2017, 07:59 AM | #917 | |
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Even LIBERALS like Senator Warren are going crazy over this. What a sellout! Laughing all the way to his Wall St. bank. NEWS FLASH: Obama cashes in on Wall Street
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04-28-2017, 09:48 AM | #918 | |
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Not answerable? As I recall it, even in the '70s when there was far less a consensus about climate change among the scientists who study it than there is today, most of the scientists studying the phenomenon were more concerned with global greenhouse warming.
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04-28-2017, 09:53 AM | #919 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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http://www.cnn.com/2015/03/10/europe...e-snow-record/ http://www.telegraph.co.uk/travel/ne...ansport-chaos/
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04-28-2017, 10:36 AM | #920 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
He wanted answers about things I was taught 40-45 years ago, and I am supposed to provide sources?
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04-28-2017, 12:18 PM | #921 | |
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Damn the torpedos, full speed ahead.
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04-28-2017, 12:37 PM | #922 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
When an observer can't answer basic questions about a phenomenon, the accuracy of their recollection becomes doubtful as in this instance.
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04-28-2017, 01:36 PM | #923 | |
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But I wouldn't worry about God making Solomon foolish. My concern is the scribes. Cuz up until Gutenberg the copies of scripture depended on the scribes. And because of the foolishness of the scribes we can't depend upon the Bible being inerrant. Solomon and his foolishness is long gone. But the foolishness of the scribes had lasting effects ... even up to today. We can't even depend on 1 Corinthians 1:20 being accurate according to the autograph original because of them.
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04-28-2017, 02:24 PM | #924 | |
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I mean, I can put numbers in front of text that reads like something from the Bible. That doesn't make it into anything or make it relevant to the discussion. Without a full reference, you are just being a jerk. Yes, a jerk. I know this verse/passage generically, so I can comment on it — generically. But it has not be given an "home" so I cannot tell you how you misrepresented its context. And it is almost an assured thing that you did. Otherwise you would have provided enough to establish its context. It refers to the wisdom of the world being made foolish. But there is no implication in the excised part what is being talked about. It is doubtful that the purpose is to declare that wisdom concerning manufacturing and other business operations was intended to be befuddled. Rather that the kind of wisdom that man considers that gets him to his ultimate ends is not really wisdom. It is foolishness because the ultimate ends are God's. It is irrelevant whether you do or don't think Solomon's wisdom might be included in that, mostly because it is not suggesting that man is simply foolish and incapable of anything in the worldly sense. Rather that man is incapable in the Spiritual sense. And building mines and smelting copper just aren't part of the conversation in "20," wherever that is. There is nothing to explain about whether Solomon's wisdom should or should not be considered. It is an irrelevant strawman. This verse/passage makes no comment on whether Solomon/Israel was on the cusp of an industrial revolution. And if you manage to be right, you are arguing that whatever there really was that could have been close to it was so thoroughly messed-up by God (in a sort of Tower of Babel way) that no one can prove or disprove it. Therefore you think you can just say it and make it stick. That is such a Leeism if there ever was one. You know, if we didn't already have Lee to mess-up the understanding of the Bible, we could have drafted you for the job. And since he has died, no one is trying to create new Leeisms. Maybe you should apply.
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04-28-2017, 02:37 PM | #925 | ||
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I answered all the basic questions. Here is how things have changed from Wikipedia ... Quote:
Good reason to be skeptical of both science and the media. But for some folks around here, the old saying "in God we trust" is replaced by "in science and the mainstream media we trust."
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04-28-2017, 02:51 PM | #926 | ||||
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Re: Politics and the Church
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Quote:
That is the context, that is the "home". So then the question is simple, 1. How did God make foolish the wisdom of Solomon? 2. How did Solomon not know God by his "wisdom" in disobeying God's direct command? "There is no wisdom nor understanding nor counsel against the Lord." -- So please explain Solomon rejecting the Lord's command in his "wisdom". Quote:
There is no doubt, regardless of your political affiliation, that the wisdom of this world that has resulted in an unsustainable industrial economy is coming to nought. So please, speak the wisdom of the Lord to us, where did we go wrong? Quote:
But to test this you need to look at something that is universally viewed as "the wisdom of this world". I have chosen Solomon. Solomon is synonymous with wisdom. 31 The Queen of the South will rise at the judgment with the people of this generation and condemn them, for she came from the ends of the earth to listen to Solomon’s wisdom; and now something greater than Solomon is here. This is a man who had "the wisdom of the world". Yet when he chose to disregard the Lord's command he put his wisdom up against the Lord's. So then, how was that "wisdom" made foolish?
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04-28-2017, 03:00 PM | #927 | |
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But I agree with you that OBW's insults are uncalled for. Where's a good MODA when you need one?
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04-28-2017, 04:09 PM | #928 | |
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1. Reproved them of their sin in holding up some leaders as superior to others. The reason is they placed their faith in the wisdom of men. The Corinthians were immature, fleshly, and their work was going to be burnt up. Paul warned them no to think of others more highly than that which is written that no one be puffed up for one against the other. 10We are fools for Christ's sake, but ye are wise in Christ; we are weak, but ye are strong; ye are honourable, but we are despised. 11Even unto this present hour we both hunger, and thirst, and are naked, and are buffeted, and have no certain dwellingplace; 12And labour, working with our own hands: being reviled, we bless; being persecuted, we suffer it: 13Being defamed, we intreat: we are made as the filth of the world, and are the offscouring of all things unto this day. This is the “home” in which Paul shares that “God made foolish the wisdom of the world” because “the world by wisdom knew not God”. I use Solomon as an example of this to illustrate the principle. A man that others “placed their faith in his wisdom”. I would add that the work he did that came out of his rebellion will be burnt up. Why did he take all those concubines and go to Egypt and go to Lebanon? He despised the land that was given to him. There cannot be any dispute that he did not fully appreciate the richness of the land given to him. As a result of his wisdom he never did get to know the riches of that land. This is Paul's burden, he wants us to know and appreciate Christ and not be distracted with the "wisdom of the world" which is nothing but a distraction and deception. It is poetic and ironic that the man known as "the wisest man on earth" would be the man responsible for leading us down the path to Armageddon. I realize that is a very big leap for many. But everyone should be able to see that Solomon led Israel down a path that led to the Babylonian empire rolling in and seizing them 700 years later. Had he submitted to God's command of a self imposed embargo they would have taken a different path. For 700 years they would have been forced to supply their own needs with whatever they had available. Ironically it was the embargo act of 1807 that led to the US discovering the industrial revolution. When you realize you need to be economically independent it leads to invention, innovation and industrialization. It is the same with the church. If they lean on the world, TV, Hollywood, Rock singers, etc it is a path that is unsustainable and will lead to your work being burnt up. An enforced embargo to be self sufficient -- that is the idea behind 1Cor 14 -- "whenever you come together each one has". 19 But I will come to you shortly, if the Lord will, and will know, not the speech of them which are puffed up, but the power. 20 For the kingdom of God is not in word, but in power. This is a story that has been repeated ad infinitum, not just by WL and WN. The posers, the frauds, the wannabe apostles are "puffed up" like balloons in a Macy's day parade. MOTA, Super Apostle, they are "wise in Christ", they are "strong", they are "honorable". When you look at human history those are always the frauds. It is the guy who is working with his own hands, being reviled, being persecuted, suffering with a vision. The vision is that "this is a good land, a rich land". But Solomon was not the guy being reviled, being persecuted, suffering with this vision as he worked with his own hands. Had he been that person the whole earth would have been blessed. But he is by no means the only one, anymore than WL is the only fraud. This is the way of the world, the whole thing is a pretense. It only works if everyone buys into the "wisdom" of those taking the lead. If you expose that it is a sham, their whole life's work about to go up in smoke, then you will see the barren teeth of the snake spitting poison.
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04-29-2017, 11:49 AM | #929 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Like Trump. He only punishes those that's critical of him. haha
But maybe ... just maybe ... us hell bound liberals always stick together. Not saying OBW is a liberal. He seems more of a centrist. But centrists are considered liberals to those on the far right. But liberals out here have an out. We're use to being in a cult. So just jump into the JW cult, and there's no hell to be sent to. Maybe that explains my JW friend. He's a liberal. Sorry guys, for not jumping OBW. Actually I'm behind and haven't even read the offense yet. So don't know if he needs jumping. Who knows, I might agree with him. After all, I am the author of "harebrained notions." Tho I meant it in all love.
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04-29-2017, 12:33 PM | #930 | |
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And since I forgave ZNP's "twisted mind" remark, I think he's big enough to forgive this jerk remark. Agree? or disagree?
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04-29-2017, 03:54 PM | #931 | |
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Liberals have been punishing him since Nov 8. And long before. They have humiliated him on numerous occasions. Remember that 2011 White House correspondents dinner? Obama roasted and lampooned Trump. P.S. If I knew I was a "hell bound liberal," I would do something about it. Wouldn't that make sense?
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04-29-2017, 04:28 PM | #932 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Did anyone else take notice when the famed New York Times just published its first column by Bret Stephens, the former Wall Street Journal columnist and Pulitzer Prize winner, recently hired as a "conservative" voice. Imagine that a "conservative" voice at the NYT. What is the world coming to? The rest of his "journalistic" comrades became totally unhinged.
So, of all the potential topics to choose from, Bret Stephens chooses Climate Change sprinkled with politics from the recent election. Talk about courage! Anyone think his new colleagues would give him a chance to get settled? No way. It runs counter to their religion. In case you have not noticed, mainstream media defines religious fundamentalism in America. The are the mouthpiece and loudspeakers of religious demagoguery. Take a look at what he said ... Quote:
But if you are interested you can read an article at News Busters for yourself, not that it would make any difference for their fundamentalist followers.
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04-29-2017, 04:42 PM | #933 | |
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04-29-2017, 04:44 PM | #934 | |
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04-29-2017, 06:25 PM | #935 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
"Heaven for climate ... hell for society." - Mark Twain
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04-29-2017, 06:45 PM | #936 | ||
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Trump's following, like Lee's, is clearly a personality cult. Science isn't a personality, but still, scientists, it seems, aren't strangers to culting up. Seems to me a cause of our problems is our tendency to cult up. Competing cults aren't very productive. Quote:
Else, bro Ohio will jump me for always being critical of Christianity. And God forbid I would be critical of the RCC.
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04-29-2017, 06:46 PM | #937 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
The NJ is the solution:
1. We could build cities according to this design. This would create a great many jobs, similar to what FDR did. That would respond to those who have lost their good paying jobs and we could become a leader in manufacturing again, only this time we are manufacturing cities. 2. It will deal with the 10 million illegal aliens in a way that is sensible. They cannot jump the line for citizenship, but at the same time they should not be deported. So there needs to be a solution similar to the refuge city in the OT. These 10 million could be offered a deal where they could work building these cities in exchange for a home in the city and a path to citizenship. In this way they would not be taking away anyone's job in any existing city or town. 3. The border with Mexico needs to be secured as that is a concern to tens of millions of Americans. Therefore these cities could be built along that border. The NJ is designed to be extremely efficient with the use of water, so much so that it would be ideal for the SW US. 4. The solution should also be sustainable. The NJ is the most advanced design for sustainability. It is a design that eliminates the need for fossil fuel. We could have cities for millions of Americans that are carbon sinks rather than net emitters. We could once again take the moral high ground. Trump supporters would be happy, Environmentalists would be happy, Wall Street would be happy, Main Street would be happy.
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04-29-2017, 07:07 PM | #938 | |
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And as some wise person said, "Stupid is as stupid does." Let's own up when we're stupid. I didn't deny my twisted brain. Ain't no brain free of being twisted at times ... I was thinking recently, about a remark a preacher made to me concerning "baptism for remission of sins," and some exception examples I presented in the book of Acts. He said, "Yes there are exceptions in the NT, but I have to teach the rule, not the exceptions, so as not to confuse the flock." I remember telling him something along the line of : "Shouldn't you teach all of it, the rule and the exceptions? And if the flock is confused that's the way God wants them to be, for making the Bible that way. I wonder why God wants us to be confused? Maybe so we'll trust in Him. How's that working out for Him?
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04-29-2017, 07:17 PM | #939 | |
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04-29-2017, 08:10 PM | #940 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Bret Stephens: "...much else that passes as accepted fact is really a matter of probabilities."
So we should go with improbabilities? That guy would fit right in on LCD. When the probabilities in question become certainties it will be too late. We are near the tipping point now. That's why we don't have time for Trump's anti-science agenda in the White House.
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04-30-2017, 03:36 AM | #941 | |
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But what a show he put on when he kissed ole Tipper, proving he was "for real."
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04-30-2017, 03:39 AM | #942 | |
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04-30-2017, 03:47 AM | #943 | |
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But, did you see Trump's "personality cult" at the WH correspondents dinner gushing all over him last night? Fawning like a bunch of lap dogs, same as they did with Obama?
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04-30-2017, 06:29 AM | #944 | |
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With 1.2 billion the RCC is the very definition of Christianity. All others are alternative christianity. And journalists have to kiss up, else they get branded fake news. Or Counterfeit News Network.
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04-30-2017, 11:13 AM | #945 | |
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Narrow is the way and few there be that find it. Jesus is the way that leads to the Father. A NT definition of "Christianity" would be the few that are on this path to the father.
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04-30-2017, 11:19 AM | #946 | |
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04-30-2017, 11:48 AM | #947 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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That's my defonition. If there is a better one, I'll reconsider it.
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04-30-2017, 02:33 PM | #948 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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1. Christianity as the followers of Jesus Christ described in the NT. and 2. Christianity as a work of man. For those with faith they would see definition 1, for those without they would see definition 2.
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04-30-2017, 06:32 PM | #949 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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04-30-2017, 06:36 PM | #950 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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04-30-2017, 08:04 PM | #951 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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Everything Obama did had no impact on our climate? And now our climate will get much worse? Are you serious? And why do you think everybody in NY and NE still wants to move to Florida? Cause the climate is so much worse? I thought you have a few more brains than these campus snowflakes, but now I am beginning to wonder.
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04-30-2017, 11:25 PM | #952 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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Trump's executive orders go beyond ending protections from the consequences of greenhouse gases. He is crippling the EPA's capacity to protect clean air and clean water. https://www.usnews.com/opinion/op-ed...tal-protection He's also opening the national parks for all kinds of exploitation and endangered species to extinction. All of which you don't seem to give a **** about as long as your precious soul gets saved.
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05-01-2017, 02:31 AM | #953 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
So since the RCC isn't part of Christianity I can't be accused of being critical of Christianity by be critical of the RCC.
It's a given I can be critical of them venerating the holy foreskin of Jesus for millennia. I can be critical of the creeds. I can be critical of the trinity, that they developed. I can be critical of the canon of the Bible, they developed. I can be critical of all the changes they made to all the autographs of the books of the Bible, removing confidence in the Bible by removing Biblical inerrancy. I can be critical of birth control and their position on abortion. I can be critical of all that and more, without considered being critical of Christianity. I'll remember this ... and will try not to be critical of Christianity by being critical only of the RCC.
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05-01-2017, 04:17 AM | #954 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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EPA protecting our air and water??? Like they did in Flint, MI??? Like they did in that Colorado river? Dumping millions of gallons of yellow filth from an old mine??? Did you not see those pictures on this thread above??? Your fanatical religious comments are simply hysterical! Devoid of common sense, whipped up in the frenzy of planet progressivism, yes, but still funny!
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05-01-2017, 04:26 AM | #955 | |
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You're sounding like some petulant child. Why are you so obsessed with holy foreskins? Is that your latest discovery from the dark ages? Since when has anyone ever been able to stop your endless criticisms of all things Christian, and your subtle promotion of Muslams?? You probably loved that Mooslam comedian at the WH correspondents dinner.
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05-01-2017, 04:32 AM | #956 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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1. You don't like what Trump is doing because there is a much better path to take which he has chosen not to take. Because he is stupid, or crooked, or lacks insight, whatever. This option shows he is a "bad" president. Which even then is not the issue, the real issue is whether or not he is worse than Hillary Clinton or 2. You don't like what Trump is doing because the world has become a dangerous and messed up place. However, N. Korea is not because of Trump. ISIS is not because of Trump. Drug Cartels are not because of Trump. Loss of US manufacturing is not because of Trump. If you do not have a better path for him to take it puts your whiny posts into perspective.
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05-01-2017, 04:34 AM | #957 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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05-01-2017, 04:41 AM | #958 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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You can buy a water testing kit for $29 on Amazon.com Drinking Water Test Kit - 10 Minute Testing For Lead Bacteria Pesticide Iron Copper and More Test your own water, it is far safer than relying on the EPA to keep you safe from lead in your drinking water.
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05-01-2017, 04:42 AM | #959 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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05-01-2017, 04:49 AM | #960 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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Every year, half of Florida moves back to NY in April. I have not found a better climate where I am. A few years ago we had two of the coldest winters on record, with horrible windchills. I lost nearly all my evergreens -- junipers and cedars. How do evergreens die in the winter? It was a boon for local landscapers. So much for "global warming." Oh ... I must have forgot. Colder winters are "climate change."
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05-01-2017, 05:01 AM | #961 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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No what is happening right now is the weather is getting more energetic. You are adding energy to the system, not just heat. This can result in bigger and more frequent storms. It seems to me natural disasters are much more frequent on the news, and they only show domestic ones, you have to search the internet to see what happened in Asia or Europe. So you see bigger hurricanes and tornadoes, more frequent hurricanes and tornadoes, more floods, hail, more droughts and yes bigger blizzards. All of these suggest a more "energetic" weather system.
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05-01-2017, 05:06 AM | #962 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
So here is one idea where you could easily bring manufacturing jobs to US.
The market price for a 32GB iPhone 7 is $649, yet the phone reportedly costs Apple just $225 to build. That's according to a new report from IHS Markit, which found the materials cost around $219.80, plus an additional $5 to assemble. Shipping from China adds less than $1 to the total cost. Now these phones can be assembled with robots and that would be a factory that could operate in the US on a similar cost to China. Why not have a law that there is no State sales tax on an item manufactured in that state. Apple could cut the total cost of an iPhone sold in NY State by 8%, or $52 if they were assembled in NY. Plus you would eliminate the $1 shipping cost. Therefore you would have $58 per iPhone for assembly to be competitive with China. Since you can use robots that seems very realistic. Now that we have 3d printers, robots, and the ability to order via the internet it seems this would be a very viable option for a wide range of products. Also it would be very simple for someone in Pennsylvania, NJ, Vermont, Connecticut, NH or Mass to come to NY to make these purchases. Apple would not need 52 factories. You put 7 factories around the country in strategic places. Same would be true for cars, appliances, electronics and a whole host of other items.
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05-01-2017, 05:48 AM | #963 | |
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God is warning us, sending a message to humanity. This earth, like our own bodies, is not our permanent home. The weather and climate change are in His hands. All the regulations in the world are not go to improve planet earth. A difficult pill to swallow for some of my fellow posters who thought Obama was their climate and planet messiah. As bad as climate chamge is this plague of Asian stink bugs. As I type this, one landed on my arm. Yuck!
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05-01-2017, 05:51 AM | #964 | |
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05-01-2017, 07:29 AM | #965 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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Woman was cursed after sinning that she would have birth pains. This is just another reason why I say that although the destination hasn't changed, the path we have taken did change as a result of sin. If you want you can claim that Solomon's sins was due to Adam's sin.
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05-01-2017, 07:32 AM | #966 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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05-01-2017, 07:34 AM | #967 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
I would also point out that this budgets 11x more money for the cost to assemble it in the US than in China. In China the typical worker at an iPhone factory (who works 60 hours a week) makes $450 a month. However, many of the processes are not automated because the labor in China is cheaper.
So it seems to me very reasonable that they could assemble this here using robots and hiring fewer people whose job is to keep the robots working, a guard dog and a person to feed the dog. Which creates an entirely new problem. All of these manufacturing jobs in China, Asia, and the 3rd world are about to be replaced with robots. What are you going to do with all of these unemployed men?
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05-01-2017, 07:52 AM | #968 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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Jerry Falwell Jr. Calls Donald Trump The ‘Dream President’ For Evangelicals Liberty University president also said GOP moderates “make my blood boil.” http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/...ushpmg00000009
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05-01-2017, 08:00 AM | #969 | |
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You want to talk about "greed," read one of the Clinton bios. Obama cared little for science or business. On the golf course, Trump meets with business and gov't leaders, while Obama met with Hollywood elites, and sports and rock stars. After James Foley got his head cut off by ISIS, Obama could hardly break away from golfing with former Miami Heat center Alonzo Mourning. What sacrifice! The only path he knew was the golf path.
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05-01-2017, 08:11 AM | #970 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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At least you are consistent in this regard!
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05-01-2017, 08:28 AM | #971 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
I saw this article with the following spiteful quote against Christians.
Perhaps, in some way, this helps to understand our dear brother awareness. Quote:
See what the Lord Jesus would say, "Blessed are those who have been persecuted for the sake of righteousness, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven."
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05-01-2017, 10:45 AM | #972 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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I see no evidence in the NT that Jesus and/or his followers ever politicked. Jesus said to render, but said his kingdom is not of this world. There's no admonishment to politick whatsoever. Jerry Falwell Jr. is a numbskull, riding on the coattails of his father. Anyone listening to him is a sucker. But sola scriptural's are trained to be suckers by their Bible. They are an easy mark for Falwell Jr. and Trump.
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05-01-2017, 11:02 AM | #973 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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05-01-2017, 12:06 PM | #974 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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05-01-2017, 12:11 PM | #975 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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05-01-2017, 12:17 PM | #976 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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What exactly was the "right path" that we were on that Trump has changed? According to the pundits the only thing he has accomplished was to get his Supreme court nominee approved. Are you seriously claiming that this is some kind of catastrophic choice for America? There are 9 Supreme court justices and they don't make laws, how could one choice have doomed us so?
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05-01-2017, 12:20 PM | #977 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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Are you saying Matthew and Zacchaeus acted like Falwell Jr. does today ; actually politicking for Trump? That they went around politicking for Roman leaders? Where's your evidence for that?
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05-01-2017, 12:30 PM | #978 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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I have no idea what they did after following Jesus, if they continued in their profession. But we do know that the fishermen continued to fish, we do know that the disciples had to continue to support themselves. We do know that Zacchaeus never said he was going to stop working, only that he would repay those he defrauded. There were Roman centurions that had faith in Jesus, what should they step down from their position after believing?
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05-01-2017, 12:34 PM | #979 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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So, in your mind, I must be a racist if I complain that Obama goes golfing. It can't be about job accountability, who he's with, how often, or who's dying because of his policies. Remember the "red line?" With you, it's all about race, isn't it. That's why Bernie was not allowed to win. And that's why the Democrats will never nominate another white man -- unless he is gay -- because then he has to be accountable, whereas critics of Obama and Hillary can always be labeled racists, homophobes, xenophobes, and misogynists. Straight from the Saul Alinsky Rules for Radicals play book.
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05-01-2017, 12:43 PM | #980 | |
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If you believe the Bible -- sola scriptural -- then you must be a sucker, cause you have been trained to be that way. So says awareness.
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05-01-2017, 12:49 PM | #981 | ||
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Re: Politics and the Church
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In a much earlier post I ask you "where do you get this stuff" to which you replied that you did say where and then provide two homeless verses along with some comment about what Paul was talking about but never provided any basis for tying the verses (and their missing contexts) to the fantasy about an impending industrial age. The problem is that no matter how you do or don't make those lost verses fit into the discussion, that doesn't answer how it is that you think they were almost there. You gave 6 criteria which were mostly not met. So I had to ask where you were getting it. The article you linked to didn't suggest Solomon was on the verge of an industrial revolution. Just that they had been mining in a particular area at a particular time and might account for evidence of earlier mining in mines in what is now Jordan. Nothing about near industrial revolutions. You got a personal attack because it seems to take a sledge hammer to make you pull your head out of you little lalaland of conjecture. You don't like it when I stick my head into any particular conversation you are engaged in. Yet you carry on in a public forum and I have questions. I don't necessarily have answers. But I do have questions. When you make some of your more fantastic statements, I am generally curious how you get there. But you seldom answer my question. If you ask other, unrelated questions, it is not responsive to my questions, so I ignore them and return to my questions. You are the one who has made grand claims about so many things. In this case the status of industry during the time of Solomon. And whether or not Paul's verses about the wisdom of man are in any way relevant to what was happening in the days of Solomon, it doesn't answer the question of how it is that you think that there actually was a near industrial revolution. Quote:
But to ask yet another question, why is it a "should be universally true" when even Paul's comment was not about wisdom in simply every context? This kind of thinking is what gets people convinced that man should not own cars or refrigerators. That is the notion that everything in the Bible is always all-encompassing. Contexts become irrelevant. To read this particular (still homeless) verse your way, the "wisdom" of 1+1=2 is foolishness because of God's wisdom. But only in the sense that it is simple math and not Organic Chemistry. It is still true. But if you are talking about man's wisdom as to the right way to live when it is not according to God's way, then the outcome is different. And even if God did something to confound things back in Solomon's day, it didn't make the mechanical knowledge of the day wrong or "foolishness," but rather just made it "lost" until some later date. Sort of like the tower of Babel. The confounding of he languages was to separate the men of knowledge from each other so they could not achieve what they were preparing to do. But that is not the same thing as "wisdom made foolish." It is wisdom confounded but not invalidated.
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05-01-2017, 01:07 PM | #982 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Continuing on the prior discussion:
Quote:
I finally did see the context of the verse (which I had never made any comment on before you threw it at me in an irrelevant way). It is in 1 Corinthians. And Ohio got it right. It was not a reference to simply anything that might be called wisdom, but to specific prevailing Greek wisdom of the day that Paul was addressing.
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05-01-2017, 02:01 PM | #983 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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1. I believe that God is omniscient. Standard belief for most fundamental Christians though I suppose it is up for interpretation exactly what that means to each individual. 2. I also feel, based on the evidence I have seen, that pollution from the industrial revolution is going to result in catastrophic climate change. By that I mean millions of climate refugees (a process I believe has already begun), spread of tropical diseases like Zika and Dengue (a process I believe has already begun), much more energetic weather resulting in more storms, droughts, etc (a process I believe has already begun) and finally just like a sinking sail ship we will have a negative feedback loop of methane hydrates bubbling up into the atmosphere (a process that has started with a vengeance). So then, it is a simple question -- What should we do and when should we have done it? If the Titanic hits an iceberg and sinks it is a reasonable question that will be asked at some point, when did they make a mistake and what was it. Perhaps there were a comedy of errors, perhaps it was one error. It seemed clear to me, after eliminating various possibilities, that the error was made prior to Jesus coming because the prophecies indicated catastrophic climate change was already where we were headed. I realize that it is hard for anyone to wrap their head around climate change due to the industrial revolution being inevitable 1800 years prior to the industrial revolution, but if this post were 200 pages I think I could make a strong case that this is not a crazy idea. The damage from fossil fuel is not simply from burning it, but from the greed, and corruption that results from "he who has the gold makes the rules". The world and its system was already condemned at that point. I realized while reading the OT that the boundaries of the land given to the children of Israel was not Israel as we know it. He gave them two boundaries -- Tigris Euphrates river and the Mediterranean. That means He gave them the entire Middle East. That is really a very good land if you know about the oil, and is nothing but a wasteland if you don't. I also knew that oil was first discovered in the Middle East based on some reading about "pitch" in the OT (a tar pit that has bubbled up to the surface). So this goes back to the initial question -- if God is omniscient did He know how much oil was in the Middle East (yes) and is this what He was referring to when He said it was a very good land? Hind sight is 20/20, perhaps our sight today is not as good as God's was back then, but if you today, knowing what you know, said that "The Middle East is a very rich land" would anyone not be including the oil in that equation? I also knew that every Empire went through Israel -- Roman, Greek, Medo Persian, Babylonian, etc. If Israel had been much, much stronger than they were prior to the Babylonian empire then it would have essentially meant world peace and prosperity thousands of years earlier. Therefore the key was this 700 year period from Solomon to the Babylonian invasion. With that in mind read Psalm 81. So then, my question was in what way did we not listen to God? What did we not do that led to us not being blessed? It is quite obvious that Solomon disobeyed God when he went to Lebanon for Cedars and Egypt for horses. But that seemed wise, what was the point of that law in the first place? Every single successful nation has bought into the concept of "world trade", why forbid it? But when you look at the factors that resulted in the industrial revolution a self imposed embargo is a key factor. A country had to supply their needs with the resources they had, this resulted in them coming up with a better, more efficient way to produce the goods. Read the archaelogical reports on Solomon's mine, he had a major issue in transporting the ore. I think it is a certainty that he would have come up with something similar to the ancient train found in Greece. His mining operation was already on an industrial scale but he also had a problem housing his workers. Egypt had already discovered the use of lime and gypsum in making mortar, so it is not unreasonable that Solomon would have discovered concrete. Once you have those two things it is just a matter of improving on the model. So then, Solomon was on the cusp of discovering the industrial revolution, why didn't he? Because he violated God's law and went to Lebanon for Cedars and Egypt for horses. If he had not done that he would have. Maybe not in Solomon's lifetime, but if he honored the principle of making do with what God had given them the Israelites would have invented the steam engine hundreds of years before the Babylonians invaded. It has been about 180 years since we discovered the steam engine. Imagine just for a second that Israel had discovered the steam engine 180 years before the Babylonians invaded. Now I ask you, if you can imagine that do you think an omniscient God could have imagined that? And that brings us back to the so called "homeless verses" in 1 Cor. It is the standard temptation in the church -- go to the elite universities for the cedars and go to Hollywood for the horsepower. Get a pastor from Princeton and get a music ministry that can pull in the crowds. He points out that his is "puffed up", that these works will burn up and leave you with nothing, and that the apostles are nothing like this. They are the "off scouring", they poor, laboring, no gold rings, no fancy cars. If you bring in the "specialists" then you will turn all the saints into spectators. If you kill their function you never discover the riches hidden in them. Instead "whenever you come together each one has..." But in this context he says that "God has made foolish the wisdom of the world" -- not future tense but past tense. What is he talking about? This should be a Bible reference, otherwise Paul should give us more explanation. This may not be the "only" interpretation but I think it is reasonable that Solomon's wisdom to disobey God's law can be looked at in light of this verse. So then, once again let's just blow your mind. Solomon does not disobey God. He needs transportation, he tells the Israelites to figure it out, no one is getting horses from Egypt. They invent a "train". Perhaps cats with wheels running on a concrete track pulled by mules. They need houses for the workers, they make concrete houses. The nation sticks to this law and they invent the steam engine after a few hundred years. Then 180 years later the Babylonians ride in on horses with bow and arrows and find Israel with trains, high rise apartments, cars, airplanes, etc. That was the destiny of those who obeyed God's command. It would have been the foolishness of living the crucified life. But instead, what is our destiny now due to Solomon's "wisdom"? War due to one empire after the next. Pollution from industrialization due to 7 billion people on this planet burning fossil fuel. Human society being pushed off a cliff. God turned the "wisdom of the world" into foolishness because the foolishness of God is wiser than men.
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05-01-2017, 02:42 PM | #984 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
How do you get 700 years from Solomon (1000BC) to the Babylonian invasion (600BC)?
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05-01-2017, 03:17 PM | #985 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Erroneous memory I guess. 400 years, not 700.
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05-01-2017, 03:38 PM | #986 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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This was turned to foolishness when the Roman's gave these people citizenship. No one even thought of this as a commodity prior to the Romans. No one thought someone living in a different country, speaking a different language could have a dual citizenship. But that little secret defeated the Greek empire. It is just like McDonald's. The initial hamburger joint was all about innovative ideas. They made hamburgers better than anyone else. But when Ray Kroc figured out the business is not about making a better hamburger but about real estate then the original owners were put out of business and made to look foolish. This is the revelation behind the NJ, it is not about a city, it is about real estate. Donald Trump wants to pay off the US debt by selling park land. Park land is the least valuable land. You want to make money selling land, sell the land that a city is built on. Imagine for a moment that you could build a large city, similar in population to Houston, but in West Texas, on the Mexican border, on land that is dirt cheap. Now imagine that your city has a population density similar to downtown Manhattan. So you have a population of 2 million in 4 square miles. You could sell the immediate surround land for $1 billion, and you could own the land that the city is built on, leasing it, similar to Hong Kong. You would then have the assets and capital to go and build a second city, etc. If you have 9 million illegal aliens and they were given asylum in these newly built cities you could easily build 10 cities on this border and populate them with over a million each. Instead of franchising hamburger joints you could franchise cities, pay off the US debt, deal with the illegal aliens, strengthen your border, and create many new jobs. You also control the US government, a huge bureaucracy that can house all kinds of agencies to get these cities off the ground. You could incentivize businesses like google to build a server farm and other businesses. It is no longer about the tax revenue but about owning the land. If you own the land you will get the revenue. All you need is a design that can thrive in a place with very little water -- the key secret of the NJ. I used to live in Odessa Texas, that is where I learned there is no shortage of water in the desert, the real problem in the desert is not lack of water, but rather evaporation. If you can prevent evaporation you will have no problem with water.
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05-01-2017, 08:30 PM | #987 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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And none of them were politicking like Falwell Jr. There's zero evidence that they did. Your imagination about it is cute, but not realistic according to scripture.
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05-01-2017, 08:51 PM | #988 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
!!! BREAKING NEWS !!!
Congress shot down Trumps budget cuts to science and the NIH, and instead of cuts, increased funding ... beyond Obama's increases.: https://www.statnews.com/2017/05/01/...ongress-trump/
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05-02-2017, 04:22 AM | #989 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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05-02-2017, 06:15 AM | #990 | ||
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Re: Politics and the Church
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Here's just a few comments to Bret Stevens' many bashers .. Quote:
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05-02-2017, 06:26 AM | #991 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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They do it all the time, but then get this false sense of appall, when I return the "compliment" to them.
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05-02-2017, 07:35 AM | #992 |
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Re: Politics and the Church
Think about this, Awareness does not like the "politicking" that Falwell does. Therefore the solution is that no Christian can be involved in the political process. Can't be a senator, or congressman, or governor, or mayor, etc. Who would come up with a rule like that?
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05-02-2017, 07:53 AM | #993 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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05-02-2017, 08:40 AM | #994 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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In fact, you are the only evangelical I know that don't support Trump. Here in Ky I'm surrounded by evangelical Trump supporters.
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05-02-2017, 09:36 AM | #995 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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Have all the rich, liberal, democratic elites abandoned you? And why do evangelicals have to forfeit their liberties and 1st Amendment rights in your religion?
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05-02-2017, 09:42 AM | #996 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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But that aside, what's wrong with reducing our carbon footprint? What's wrong with converting to renewable energy? Is it a nefarious evil plan of the liberals and scientists? Are they secretly trying to kill us?
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05-02-2017, 09:48 AM | #997 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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Just like Paul said, as citizens we have certain rights. If Christians were prohibited from voting and speaking, then they would be ignored and their concerns irrelevant during an election. But just because someone is a christians and says they support a certain candidate doesn't have anything to do with me. I disagree with Christians about many things.
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05-02-2017, 09:51 AM | #998 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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ISIS is trying to kill us, so what is wrong with wanting to defeat them? There are multiple issues, they are all legitimate.
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05-02-2017, 10:31 AM | #999 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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05-02-2017, 10:41 AM | #1000 | |
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Re: Politics and the Church
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It's these guys like Ozone Al Gore who need to reduce their carbon footprint. But wait ... isn't Ozone Al the High Priest of Mother Earth planet worship? But I want a "FOOTPRINT" like he's got, with his mansion, limo, and private jet!!! Awareness, am I that wrong for seeing thru the hypocrisy here? Wealthy elitist liberal fundamentalists preaching their fire, brimstone, and rising oceans to the rest of us in order to reduce OUR emissions? Just think how much Obama's FOOTPRINT grew, every time he went golfing in Hawaii on Air Force One with his entourage of 500 secret service agents? But who am I to complain just because I can't afford to golf down the street? Then they whip up these $50K/year college kids and 3rd generation welfare recipients (neither of which ever held a real job) to go protest those "evil" capitalistic institutions like banks in big cities. Can't you see thru this hypocrisy? Why is it so hard for you? You can't keep blaming Kentuckian Evangelicals for this mess.
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Ohio's motto is: With God all things are possible!. Keeping all my posts short, quick, living, and to the point! Last edited by Ohio; 05-02-2017 at 11:31 AM. |
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