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Old 04-02-2016, 03:46 PM   #1
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Default Los Angeles Premier of Play Written about the Local Church

April 16 - May 15 at the Skylight Theatre in Los Angeles.

Skylight Theatre Company to Premier THE END TIMES

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Skylight Theatre Company is proud to announce that they will be co-producing the World Premiere of Jesse Mu-En Shao's THE END TIMES, in collaboration with Jon Lawrence Rivera's Playwrights' Arena. This marks Jesse's first produced work. The collaboration between the two companies is a longtime in planning. Both companies pride themselves on nurturing and developing new works.

Enter the world of a religious cult. Dare to ask the questions you haven't asked, to discover the truths that shatter your beliefs. Who do you turn to then? Tim, born and raised in the Lord's Recovery, has always been a devout follower to Witness Lee's ministry. He is young, loyal, and a true believer. However, after his best friend Evan is cast out of the Church in Pullman for "living in his mind." Tim's life slowly unravels as he begins to question the foundations of his faith.
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Old 04-02-2016, 04:00 PM   #2
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April 16 - May 15 at the Skylight Theatre in Los Angeles.

Skylight Theatre Company to Premier THE END TIMES
Would love to view a video clip!
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Old 04-02-2016, 06:55 PM   #3
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Default Re: Los Angeles Premier of Play Written about the Local Church

Interesting.

I often wondered if there would ever be some kind of documentary/production that would give outsiders a look into what the LC is like. I would sure like to see this, and I and I do live in Southern California...
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Old 04-02-2016, 09:57 PM   #4
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Default Re: Los Angeles Premier of Play Written about the Local Church

A devout follower of WL and a true believer - but in what or who? In WL I suppose. This should be interesting. I wonder if the folks at Affirmation and Critique will review it. Or maybe DCP will be more interested. I'll bet they never considered this scenario.
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Old 04-03-2016, 01:47 PM   #5
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I wonder who will play the role of elders? Will they be in white shirts and dark ties? Will the wear cardigan sweaters? Will they be carrying briefcases? Will they invite the perp into the elders' room where he sits in the middle? Or will the elders all enter the interview room from a closed side room? How many times will the elders use the terms "god's economy", burden, feeling of the body, authority, the ministry, OUR BROTHER, saints, your mind, or "for the sake of the body"?
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Old 04-03-2016, 06:09 PM   #6
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Default Re: Los Angeles Premier of Play Written about the Local Church

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I wonder who will play the role of elders? Will they be in white shirts and dark ties? Will the wear cardigan sweaters? Will they be carrying briefcases? Will they invite the perp into the elders' room where he sits in the middle? Or will the elders all enter the interview room from a closed side room? How many times will the elders use the terms "god's economy", burden, feeling of the body, authority, the ministry, OUR BROTHER, saints, your mind, or "for the sake of the body"?
To outsiders the LC talk must seem like utter nonsense. It's actually scary to think that all the spiritual mumbo jumbo is something that we all bought into at one point in time. Who else would even understand what this kind of talk means? I guess each cult has their own lingo.
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Old 04-04-2016, 03:33 AM   #7
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Default Re: Los Angeles Premier of Play Written about the Local Church

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To outsiders the LC talk must seem like utter nonsense. It's actually scary to think that all the spiritual mumbo jumbo is something that we all bought into at one point in time. Who else would even understand what this kind of talk means? I guess each cult has their own lingo.
To a certain degree, i guess each region had its own lingo.

I would think that this forum should be contacted in order to provide expert consulting services.
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Old 04-04-2016, 04:02 PM   #8
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A devout follower of WL and a true believer - but in what or who? In WL I suppose. This should be interesting. I wonder if the folks at Affirmation and Critique will review it. Or maybe DCP will be more interested. I'll bet they never considered this scenario.
My thoughts exactly! Based on the link provided it seems a case of art imitating life.
If anyone plans on seeing the play, please provide a critique and affirmation

Much rather more like a former LCer using the theatre to shout from the rooftop.

I'm sure if DCP knew beforehand they would have initiated threats to stop the company from putting on the play.
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Old 04-04-2016, 08:28 PM   #9
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Default Re: Los Angeles Premier of Play Written about the Local Church

:I usually don't understand what's going on but would I ever like to see this. I'm not flying to LA but would pay a price to see it in Dallas.
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Old 04-04-2016, 09:12 PM   #10
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All this proves that life is stranger (and funnier) than fiction. Someone took our lives and made a play of it. How about that! I am cracking up and wondering how I got looped into it with the rest of you. Can I play the guy who has a mental breakdown trying to do everything by all of the rules?
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Old 04-05-2016, 06:49 AM   #11
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All this proves that life is stranger (and funnier) than fiction. Someone took our lives and made a play of it. How about that! I am cracking up and wondering how I got looped into it with the rest of you. Can I play the guy who has a mental breakdown trying to do everything by all of the rules?
We used to say that cults had "church-like" traits as a reason to explain our strange behavior.
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Old 04-08-2016, 03:45 AM   #12
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Default Re: Los Angeles Premier of Play Written about the Local Church

There's more info in an interview with the playwright where he explains his motivations behind the play and his own experiences growing up in the LC:

http://www.hollywoodrevealed.com/is-...the-end-times/
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Old 04-08-2016, 04:33 AM   #13
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Default Re: Los Angeles Premier of Play Written about the Local Church

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There's more info in an interview with the playwright where he explains his motivations behind the play and his own experiences growing up in the LC:

http://www.hollywoodrevealed.com/is-...the-end-times/
DCP is already staffing up for the pending lawsuit ...
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Old 04-18-2016, 11:59 AM   #14
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Default Re: Los Angeles Premier of Play Written about the Local Church

First review for this showing I found:

BWW Review: THE END TIMES - Not the Best of Times

A post on an earlier showing two years ago:

The Attraction of Cults
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Old 04-18-2016, 01:05 PM   #15
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A trailer can be viewed here
http://skylighttheatrecompany.com/pl...end-times.html
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Old 04-18-2016, 01:43 PM   #16
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Does anybody know if this has attracted the attention of any LC folks?
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Old 04-18-2016, 08:38 PM   #17
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http://reviewplays.com/4-16-jjr-endtime.htm
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Old 04-19-2016, 01:00 PM   #18
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Default Re: Los Angeles Premier of Play Written about the Local Church

I think this is a new site with a bit of new information.

It was the same, so I removed the link.
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Old 04-20-2016, 06:26 PM   #19
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Default Re: Los Angeles Premier of Play Written about the Local Church

Here's another review:

http://www.lasplash.com/publish/Los_...mes-review.php

"THE END TIMES is a powerful study of what faith is and should be and how vulnerable people can become enmeshed in groups that offer love, caring, and complete acceptance in exchange for giving up freedom of thought and refraining from judicious inquiry."
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Old 04-20-2016, 06:30 PM   #20
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And another one:

http://www.discoverhollywood.com/Dis...re-Review.aspx
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Old 04-20-2016, 06:39 PM   #21
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Nothing is closer to the truth than this phrase:

"You now ask yourself if what you thought was faith is nothing more than a clever manipulation by some charlatan to gain personal wealth. "

It was clever manipulation. Standing orders anyone?
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Old 04-22-2016, 06:36 PM   #22
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Default Re: Los Angeles Premier of Play Written about the Local Church

http://www.edgemedianetwork.com/ente...w_::_end_times
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Old 04-23-2016, 10:58 PM   #23
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http://stageraw.com/2016/04/21/the-e...heater-review/
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Old 04-25-2016, 01:11 PM   #24
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I must commend this fellow for his bravery of sharing this story. I am still torn about even posting this on my FB! I will be down in the LA area over the weekend and if I have time will try to see it.
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Old 04-26-2016, 12:17 PM   #25
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I would love to be able to see this play. It got glowing reviews.

So bizarre and interesting to see actors portraying the words and attitudes of the LC.

Here is a direct link to the trailer.

https://vimeo.com/163002398

I would suggest half-price tickets for current LCers and free admittance for the Blendeds. They might actually learn something.
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Old 04-26-2016, 01:41 PM   #26
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I would suggest half-price tickets for current LCers and free admittance for the Blendeds. They might actually learn something.
Doubtful.

This will only harden their resolve that they are on the straight and narrow, and God's enemy has stirred up the latest round of persecution.

I feel for this young man's family, and the shame they must be facing through.
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Old 04-26-2016, 01:46 PM   #27
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Here's a radio interview with the actors.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rj_H...a4zCc2tj7bg6oV

The play's author indicates he's not sure about his faith given the fact that the LC poisoned the well (my words not his) regarding other Christian groups. To me this is another example of LSM sacrificing the little ones to preserve a religious system. Matthew 18:6

New International Version
"If anyone causes one of these little ones--those who believe in me--to stumble, it would be better for them to have a large millstone hung around their neck and to be drowned in the depths of the sea.



1 Corinthians 8:12
When you sin against them in this way and wound their weak conscience, you sin against Christ.
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Old 04-26-2016, 04:40 PM   #28
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Here's another review:

http://www.stagescenela.com/2016/04/...es/#more-35102

From what I've read, the main conflict of this play is when Evan (the best friend of the main character Tim) is kicked out of the brother's house due to a rent dispute, and the Elders' lack of explanation on the situation starts giving Tim doubts. Did anything like this happen before? Were there complaints about the brother and sisters houses?
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Old 04-26-2016, 04:44 PM   #29
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and yet another review:

http://theatreghost.com/?p=1674
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Old 04-26-2016, 05:50 PM   #30
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Here's another review:

http://www.stagescenela.com/2016/04/...es/#more-35102

From what I've read, the main conflict of this play is when Evan (the best friend of the main character Tim) is kicked out of the brother's house due to a rent dispute, and the Elders' lack of explanation on the situation starts giving Tim doubts. Did anything like this happen before? Were there complaints about the brother and sisters houses?
In many cases these brothers house/corporate living arrangements involve property that elders own and lease out. I've seen a few places where the church will lease some units and then sublease it out to college aged members. The "brothers house" that I lived in was owned by the brothers (through an LLC), and that is who the rent ultimately went to. I never had the tenacity to question what my rent was being used for, but I can definitely see how there would be room for questions to arise if anyone were to dare question things.
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Old 04-26-2016, 06:23 PM   #31
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Originally Posted by Unsure View Post
Here's another review:

http://www.stagescenela.com/2016/04/...es/#more-35102

From what I've read, the main conflict of this play is when Evan (the best friend of the main character Tim) is kicked out of the brother's house due to a rent dispute, and the Elders' lack of explanation on the situation starts giving Tim doubts. Did anything like this happen before? Were there complaints about the brother and sisters houses?
In Bellevue I didn't have that experience. The couple that owned the house moved to Anaheim for the Grace Gardens project and in their absence the house was turned into a brothers house. The rent was sufficient to pay their mortgage so I thought the rent was more than fair.
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Old 04-26-2016, 06:33 PM   #32
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Here's a radio interview with the actors.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rj_H...a4zCc2tj7bg6oV

The play's author indicates he's not sure about his faith given the fact that the LC poisoned the well (my words not his) regarding other Christian groups. To me this is another example of LSM sacrificing the little ones to preserve a religious system. Matthew 18:6

New International Version
"If anyone causes one of these little ones--those who believe in me--to stumble, it would be better for them to have a large millstone hung around their neck and to be drowned in the depths of the sea.



1 Corinthians 8:12
When you sin against them in this way and wound their weak conscience, you sin against Christ.
I can relate to what the play's author is saying in regard to individuality for those raised in the local churches. When you're a younger brother or sister, those older than you all always right even when they are wrong. You feel your dreams, aspiration, etc are invalid in the mind of the church leadership. If it is compatible with the churchlife, it can be acceptable.
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Old 04-26-2016, 06:35 PM   #33
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I would love to be able to see this play. It got glowing reviews.
The reviews of this play bring this all close to home. My wife and I owned and managed two houses on campus, one brothers and one sisters. Back in '99 the local Fox affiliate ran a news blurb on us as a cult, featuring a new sister in the house. What a nightmare. The whole thing was surreal. Fox played it up like the occult. We almost had another lawsuit.

The video would probably make a good youtube. Anybody know how to do that?
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Old 04-26-2016, 07:30 PM   #34
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It's amazing how insightful these reviewers are. In the theatre ghost review the writer says about the character Tim, "We must see (without being told) how his faith has sustained him, yet failed to equip him."

Sustained, yet failed to equip. There is a whole thread's worth of stuff to discuss in that one sentence.

And this piece of dialogue from the play:
“We grow up, we go to a college where there’s a church life, live in Corporate Living, graduate with a degree that’s Church approved and then march our way to the Full-Time Training.”
I'm trying to detect where Shao has made a caricature of the LC. But it sounds like he's portrayed it almost verbatim. That has to be shocking to LC observers. This is unprecedented.
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Old 04-26-2016, 07:45 PM   #35
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I feel for this young man's family, and the shame they must be facing through.
Hopefully they are secretly proud of him (not to mention see his point). It's hard not to be proud of your kids when they accomplish uncommon things, even when you disagree with them. Somehow you become a fan of sorts.
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Old 04-26-2016, 08:05 PM   #36
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I'm his brother. I'm very proud of him and will be flying into LA in may to check out his play. This is an interesting discussion board.
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Old 04-27-2016, 05:12 AM   #37
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I'm his brother. I'm very proud of him and will be flying into LA in may to check out his play. This is an interesting discussion board.
Welcome! Will you tell your brother about the board if he doesn't already know about it? Enjoy the play!
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Old 04-27-2016, 06:01 AM   #38
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I think the title of the play is well chosen. The End Times. What's it like to grow up in a cloistered, segregated group that believes every one else is in darkness, including the rest of the Christian faith, and that believes that the end times are here? What happens to a child when the constant atmosphere their home environment is isolationism and antagonism to the larger world? I posit that it is a kind of generalized, heightened anxiety which can find resolution through some manufactured crisis state in which the subject submits absolutely to the group. Only in the group is there salvation - everything else is rendered as an unthinkable alternative.

I suppose that the young folks, immersed in this and groomed to enter what Gene Gruhler called "The Pipeline" from the time they could talk, ultimately become either docile and unthinking program robots, or else they become nihilistic outcasts. How to find a path outside of these two extremes, when everything is painted in such dramatic, black-and-white tones?

The other thing about the immanent end of the world is that it gave Lee leverage to displace his neediness onto us all. He'd get us into pentecostal fervor, and in this heightened state we were open to any and all suggestions. I was sure that the roof was going to come off of our "Meeting Hall" and the Lord Himself would arrive with a trumpet. So we'd better be toeing the line.

"We need to do this" and "We all must see that" were the typical modes of communication - it was all given in the imperative tone, including where we should live, or "migrate", and what job was appropriate for the LC living, and with whom we should associate. In this heightened atmosphere of being "absolute", you were either "sold out" for the program, i.e. in a Brother's House or the FTT, or you were on the fringes, even the the sidewalk in the outer darkness. It was an all-or-nothing proposition. To question leadership in this atmosphere is to be slated for removal.
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Old 04-27-2016, 09:23 AM   #39
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Here's a radio interview with the actors.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rj_H...a4zCc2tj7bg6oV
In the interview, Joe Spano, who plays the ominous leader, reveals his character's name is "Benson."

Getting more and more interesting....


Sad that Shao said he lost his faith, but he said he was still searching. Clearly he is a person with a good heart, and I'm sure the Lord is closer to him than he knows.

Another LC casualty. When will they learn.
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Old 04-27-2016, 09:33 AM   #40
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And this piece of dialogue from the play:
“We grow up, we go to a college where there’s a church life, live in Corporate Living, graduate with a degree that’s Church approved and then march our way to the Full-Time Training.”
I'm trying to detect where Shao has made a caricature of the LC. But it sounds like he's portrayed it almost verbatim. That has to be shocking to LC observers. This is unprecedented.
I'm also surprised at his boldness to frankly address this particular dynamic of the LC. It's no secret that the college work and FTTA are the center of the LC. I suppose that most who can't go along with the program leave quietly, but for someone to come along and expose to the general public this "pipeline" that the LC has for young people is a big deal, even if it only reaches a limited audience.

Back when college was still in front of me, I was already well aware of the predetermined path that the LC intended for my peers and I to take. This knowledge wasn't met with even the least bit of suspicious, rather, it was something that us young people viewed as the only sensible choice to make in our lives. Speaking for myself, I think that knowing that the LC had this predetermined path for us made me feel like I had some sort of "safety net" in wake of the uncertainty of life. It's no wonder so many fall victim to this. Thankfully, I came to my senses and avoided going to the FTTA.

What is expected for young people in the LC is one of the strongest cult-like dynamics of the LC. When I lived in the brothers house, the rules attested to this: no watching movies, no listening to music, no dating, etc, etc. Leaders exercise an extraordinary amount of control over young people, yet it escapes the notice of most members. This control is often disguised in various ways. Needless to say, I support anyone bringing the truth about this to light.
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Old 04-27-2016, 09:46 AM   #41
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Default Re: Los Angeles Premier of Play Written about the Local Church

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I'm his brother. I'm very proud of him and will be flying into LA in may to check out his play. This is an interesting discussion board.
By the way, I'm pretty sure there are a lot of ex-LCers who would jump at the chance to see this play, and would gladly pay for a ticket. Many of us live far from California, however.

I was wondering if there might be any way a performance could be recorded for public viewing. If you think about it, I'd appreciate it if you'd mention that to your brother. I think watching this play would be quite helpful to many who have gone through similar experiences. I understand if such a recording would not be possible legally or if its existence could not be made known before the play finishes its run. Thanks!
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Old 04-27-2016, 11:19 AM   #42
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Default Re: Los Angeles Premier of Play Written about the Local Church

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:I usually don't understand what's going on but would I ever like to see this. I'm not flying to LA but would pay a price to see it in Dallas.
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I'm itching to see it too. Maybe they should offer a video.
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Old 04-27-2016, 01:00 PM   #43
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Default Re: Los Angeles Premier of Play Written about the Local Church

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It's amazing how insightful these reviewers are. In the theatre ghost review the writer says about the character Tim, "We must see (without being told) how his faith has sustained him, yet failed to equip him."

Sustained, yet failed to equip. There is a whole thread's worth of stuff to discuss in that one sentence.
Sustained with milk...

"I gave you milk to drink, not solid food; for you were not yet able to receive it. Indeed, even now you are not yet able, " 1 Corinthians 3:2

"For though by this time you ought to be teachers, you have need again for someone to teach you the elementary principles of the oracles of God, and you have come to need milk and not solid food. For everyone who partakes only of milk is not accustomed to the word of righteousness, for he is an infant." Hebrews 5:12-13

The ministry LSM publishes is focused on their perception of "the high peaks" they've completely whiffed on "elementary principles" the author of Hebrews is writing about. Verse 13 is followed up by this from Hebrews 5:14

"But solid food is for the mature, who because of practice have their senses trained to discern good and evil."
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Old 04-27-2016, 01:50 PM   #44
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Default Re: Los Angeles Premier of Play Written about the Local Church

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I'm itching to see it too. Maybe they should offer a video.
Hi Harold,

I contacted the Starlight Theatre Company and the lady there said that unfortunately union rules prohibit videoing plays.

Bummer. We go to LA every now and then, but have nothing planned in May.
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Old 04-27-2016, 02:19 PM   #45
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Default Re: Los Angeles Premier of Play Written about the Local Church

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The ministry LSM publishes is focused on their perception of "the high peaks" they've completely whiffed on "elementary principles" the author of Hebrews is writing about. Verse 13 is followed up by this from Hebrews 5:14

"But solid food is for the mature, who because of practice have their senses trained to discern good and evil."
Good points, Terry.
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Old 04-27-2016, 07:53 PM   #46
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Default Re: Los Angeles Premier of Play Written about the Local Church

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Sustained with milk...

"I gave you milk to drink, not solid food; for you were not yet able to receive it. Indeed, even now you are not yet able, " 1 Corinthians 3:2

"For though by this time you ought to be teachers, you have need again for someone to teach you the elementary principles of the oracles of God, and you have come to need milk and not solid food. For everyone who partakes only of milk is not accustomed to the word of righteousness, for he is an infant." Hebrews 5:12-13

The ministry LSM publishes is focused on their perception of "the high peaks" they've completely whiffed on "elementary principles" the author of Hebrews is writing about. Verse 13 is followed up by this from Hebrews 5:

"But solid food is for the mature, who because of practice have their senses trained to discern good and evil."
Right on Terry,

The elementary principles are "Consider the apostle and high priest of our faith, Jesus (not anyone else). Maturity is "the word of righteousness" (oh no, that's right and wrong, we don't talk about that, that's the tree of knowledge!!!).
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Old 04-29-2016, 01:04 PM   #47
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Default Re: Los Angeles Premier of Play Written about the Local Church

I wanted to note that I talked via email to Jesse Shao, the playwright of "The End Times," who grew up in the LC. He was very gracious and had nice things to say about this board, especially its inclusiveness. But he did reiterate that videoing stage productions is not allowed. However, he did not rule out the possibility of the play going regional and even beyond. It will be interesting to see what happens.
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Old 04-29-2016, 01:12 PM   #48
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This interesting report and interview mentions Witness Lee:

http://www.hollywoodrevealed.com/is-...the-end-times/
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Old 04-29-2016, 03:30 PM   #49
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I wanted to note that I talked via email to Jesse Shao, the playwright of "The End Times," who grew up in the LC. He was very gracious and had nice things to say about this board, especially its inclusiveness. But he did reiterate that videoing stage productions is not allowed. However, he did not rule out the possibility of the play going regional and even beyond. It will be interesting to see what happens.
Would it be possible to have the script published in book form?
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Old 04-30-2016, 05:37 AM   #50
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Default Re: Los Angeles Premier of Play Written about the Local Church

Joe Spano, a first rate actor who appeared as a regular in TV shows Hill Street Blues and NCIS plays the Witness Lee-like leader and, fittingly, appears only on videos in the play.
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Old 05-02-2016, 09:23 AM   #51
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Joe Spano, a first rate actor who appeared as a regular in TV shows Hill Street Blues and NCIS plays the Witness Lee-like leader and, fittingly, appears only on videos in the play.
Joe Spano was in American Graffiti, too. He's been in the business a long time and has forged a very respectable career.

He is Witness Lee-like in the play. But the character's name is actually "Benson."

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Old 05-09-2016, 10:06 AM   #52
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Default Re: Los Angeles Premier of Play Written about the Local Church

I will be going to see the play this coming weekend (it's last weekend run). I work just down the street from Skylight Books and know exactly where it is as I've been there numerous times. Both my daughter and I are going. I will be sure to post my thoughts. I shared the link to the trailer on my daughter's fb page, along with the article/video of the producer (Jesse), and when my husband (who is entrenched in the San Gabriel LC) saw it, became a bit upset as you can imagine.
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Old 05-09-2016, 03:45 PM   #53
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Default Re: Los Angeles Premier of Play Written about the Local Church

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I will be going to see the play this coming weekend (it's last weekend run). I work just down the street from Skylight Books and know exactly where it is as I've been there numerous times. Both my daughter and I are going. I will be sure to post my thoughts. I shared the link to the trailer on my daughter's fb page, along with the article/video of the producer (Jesse), and when my husband (who is entrenched in the San Gabriel LC) saw it, became a bit upset as you can imagine.
Be sure to tell us all about it!
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Old 05-10-2016, 08:46 AM   #54
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I wish someone could get attendance figure for the End Times play. Any chance?

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Old 05-10-2016, 07:42 PM   #55
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http://www.laweekly.com/event/the-end-times-go-6893874
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Old 05-10-2016, 07:50 PM   #56
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http://www.stagescenela.com/2016/04/the-end-times/
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Old 05-10-2016, 08:00 PM   #57
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http://www.reviewplays.com/4-16-jjr-...jessemesha.htm
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Old 05-12-2016, 03:06 AM   #58
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https://youtu.be/ET6t9dHh3a8

In Chinese.
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Old 05-16-2016, 01:51 PM   #59
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Default Re: Los Angeles Premier of Play Written about the Local Church

My daughter and I went to see the End Times play yesterday afternoon. I saw and introduced myself to Jesse, the writer of the play, whom I recognized from a photo I saw somewhere (trailer?) and who was very gracious. I explained to him that I was there to see the play because of my husband's involvement in TLR and the LC's, which he immediately guessed to be a point of contention between us. We talked for a few minutes before we went inside to see the play. He mentioned that a brother from a LC in Los Angeles had reached out to him and that he was going to give him the opportunity to dialogue with him. I thought to myself: Good luck with that! I counted about 30 people in attendance at yesterday's 3pm show. Jesse also said that the play has been extended for another two weeks!!. It was about 90 minutes long with no intermission.

I thought it was well done. Of course I am familiar with all the crazy mumbo-jumbo, even though I myself never bought into or believed any of their assertions about WL or their pushy/frightening way of speaking and doing things, thanks to my dear husband.

I wondered what everyone thought of the lingo TLR/LC's have? To have the words ringing out over a loudspeaker when "Nelson's" character (WL) was pontificating from the recorded messages was a bit unnerving. Scientologists came to mind, although I don't know why. Maybe because both founders, L. Ron Hubbard and WL, are both deceased yet their followers hold as ABSOLUTE truth what was taught by them. I felt a shudder followed by gratefulness that The Lord has spared me, and prayed for grace towards my husband.
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