STUDY: White Police Officers NOT more likely to Kill Minorities

[Sons to Glory!]

This past week the USA has been inflamed - emotionally & literally - regarding the allegedly brutal death of George Floyd at the hands of a white police officer. (I use "allegedly" because while the officer has been charged with 2nd degree murder, manslaughter and other charges, he has not been found guilty in a court of law.) We are told by those protesting this event that there is a severe problem of deep, systemic racism inherent in our police forces nationwide, and that there must be swift and decisive change to correct this. While the videos of Mr. Floyd's death are deeply disturbing and it seems the office was clearly guilty of killing this fellow unnecessarily, is this indicative of widespread racism in police forces across America?

Larry Elder is a black radio commentator who is carried on stations across the USA. A couple nights ago I heard him speak about a peer-reviewed study published in June 2019 by the National Academy of Sciences, which looked into the matter of police killings by shooting in this country. In particular, the study was done to determine if there was evidence for the allegation that a disproportionate number of minorities were killed by police and specifically by white officers in the USA.

Here are a couple quotes from this study found here: NAS RESEARCH ARTICLE - Officer characteristics and racial disparities in fatal officer-involved shootings
“We find no evidence of anti-Black or anti-Hispanic disparities across shootings, and White officers are not more likely to shoot minority civilians than non-White officers. Instead, race-specific crime strongly predicts civilian race. This suggests that increasing diversity among officers by itself is unlikely to reduce racial disparity in police shootings.”

“1) As the proportion of Black or Hispanic officers in a FOIS (fatal office-involved shooting) increases, a person shot is more likely to be Black or Hispanic than White, a disparity explained by county demographics; 2) race-specific county-level violent crime strongly predicts the race of the civilian shot;”

Read a National Review article discussing this study: There Is No Epidemic of Racist Police Shootings

So while everyone rushes headlong to use the unfortunate and apparently despicable killing of George Floyd as solid proof that there is a huge racism problem in most of the police forces across America, the evidence of this is not supported - at least not by this study. (And from what I have found, it is probably the most definitive study of this kind that has been done so far.)

I can't help but think of Psalm "Surely are they disquited in vain."

[Sons to Glory!]

In all fairness, I need to say that there are a few who are disputing some of the methods used in the June 2019 study (see 1st post). As a result, the original study researchers did change a very small piece of their report to reflect one of these concerns, but to me it doesn't seem like it changed the resulting conclusions very much at all.

Others are suggesting different ways additional studies on systemic police racism should be conducted, like looking at all police stops and not just the police shooting related killings.

So while the academics hash out exactly how the these studies should be conducted and the exact metrics to use, what occurs to me is this: What is being reported as a blatant problem of systemic racism in this country's police departments is not so easy to prove as the protesters and general media seemingly would like us to believe. And so far, the evidence I see doesn't support the claims that there actually is this huge problem!

It's easy, in this instantaneous information age, to say, "Look, this minority was killed here and that minority there!" if that is all someone is looking for. This doesn't prove that there is systemic racism. How many white suspects get killed by police during the same time period and as a proportion of the local demographic? For instance, if I said that the police are systemically brutalizing redheads, I could likely find plenty of anecdotal information to support my claim, as police probably have to forcefully confront redheads several times daily around this big country.

[Ohio]

This was a real eye-opener for me ...

Candace Owens: "I DO NOT support George Floyd!" & Here's Why!

I have concluded that the media today is purely brainwashing propaganda. Look at all the attention on George Floyd's funeral, yet thousands of decent folks got no funeral at all due to the covid-1984.


Why do the heathen rage?

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by Ohio

This was a real eye-opener for me ...

Candace Owens: "I DO NOT support George Floyd!" & Here's Why!

I have concluded that the media today is purely brainwashing propaganda. Look at all the attention on George Floyd's funeral, yet thousands of decent folks got no funeral at all due to the covid-1984.


Why do the heathen rage?

That was a good video - thanks for sharing! Isn't ol' mob-rule Adam distressing to watch when he really gets gets going!? A lie gets repeated enough, then hook up some emotion with it, and logic just goes out the window. It would all make Goebbels so proud. (and stay tuned, because we ain't seen nothin' yet!)

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Ohio

Why do the heathen rage?

Yes! Why are they raging out here?

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by awareness

Yes! Why are they raging out here?

Who is raging where?

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

That was a good video - thanks for sharing! Isn't ol' mob-rule Adam distressing to watch when he really gets gets going!? A lie gets repeated enough, then hook up some emotion with it, and logic just goes out the window. It would all make Goebbels so proud. (and stay tuned, because we ain't seen nothin' yet!)

It has now become obvious what is important. It was never about black lives. Black lives matter nothing to them. They have already killed 5 blacks in the riots. 5 real decent black lives, not the guy in Minneapolis who was wasted on Meth and Fent, with a violent drug-laden rap sheet 1,473.9 mm long.

What they hate is authority. They fight for lawlessness, anarchy, destruction, chaos. They want to defund and eliminate the police.

God have mercy on us!

[TLFisher]

Originally Posted by Ohio

It has now become obvious what is important. It was never about black lives. Black lives matter nothing to them. They have already killed 5 blacks in the riots. 5 real decent black lives, not the guy in Minneapolis who was wasted on Meth and Fent, with a violent drug-laden rap sheet 1,473.9 mm long.

What they hate is authority. They fight for lawlessness, anarchy, destruction, chaos. They want to defund and eliminate the police.

God have mercy on us!

You had David Dorn (killed by looters), Dave Underwood, Itialia Kelly (by a rioter), David McAtee (by police), Chris Beaty (thieves). Not to mention numbers more in Chicago and elsewhere. Lives; black, white, asian. latino are all treated as pawns. It's about following through on a narrative. It's about an election. It's about removing an undesirable president. Only when November 3 passes could there be civility.
Many places appear to be following through on defunding the police. etc.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by Terry

You had David Dorn (killed by looters), Dave Underwood, Itialia Kelly (by a rioter), David McAtee (by police), Chris Beaty (thieves). Not to mention numbers more in Chicago and elsewhere. Lives; black, white, asian. latino are all treated as pawns. It's about following through on a narrative. It's about an election. It's about removing an undesirable president. Only when November 3 passes could there be civility.
Many places appear to be following through on defunding the police. etc.

Even bigger than removing Trump is the Antifa goal to destroy America.

Their agenda is absolutely Marxist: remove all police, create chaos in all of our community, eliminate income inequality, destroy our free market economy, end all private property ownership, make all citizenry dependent on the government, eliminate all gun ownership, terminate all objectionable speech, convince us all of white guilt and the corrupt racial nature of America, etc.

[Weighingin]

Originally Posted by Ohio

Even bigger than removing Trump is the Antifa goal to destroy America.

Their agenda is absolutely Marxist: remove all police, create chaos in all of our community, eliminate income inequality, destroy our free market economy, end all private property ownership, make all citizenry dependent on the government, eliminate all gun ownership, terminate all objectionable speech, convince us all of white guilt and the corrupt racial nature of America, etc.

Just as Hitler had an enforcement arm in the Brown Shirts (think that’s what they were called) that would beat opponents in the street, wreck stuff, etc, I wonder if the far
Left now has an enforcement arm in Antifa groups and the like. Though, it is not organized under one person as Hitler.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by Weighingin

Just as Hitler had an enforcement arm in the Brown Shirts (think that’s what they were called) that would beat opponents in the street, wreck stuff, etc, I wonder if the far
Left now has an enforcement arm in Antifa groups and the like. Though, it is not organized under one person as Hitler.

That's an interesting twist of fate. Antifa, anti-fascist, was started in the Soviet Union back in the 1930's. Their infiltration into the USA was matched by the OSS. Since the fascists were such a threat to humanity, they solicited many in the US with their countering, albeit communistic, ideals. These ideals are sold as socialism, but require the totalitarian tactics of a strong-armed dictatorship to implement. Many in Hollywood first embraced them, and McCarthyism was the reaction to it.

Antifa appealed also to many in academia since their stated objectives appeared so highly desirable. Unfortunately the communists merely replaced one oppressive regime (Hitller) with another (Stalin.) Then their ideals were picked up by many around the globe including Mao, Fidel Castro, and Hugo Chavez. Though these two systems became labeled "left" and "right" in Pre-WW2 Europe, their oppressive tactics were similar.

Today we are learning that Antifa is quite organized. They hide in the chaos and solicit protesters and looters as their cover. One of their stated objectives is the abolition of the police, which is even being promoted by many politicians in the Bernie wing of the Democratic Party, promising a utopian alternative to the "rampant police brutality." Follow the money. Much of it leads back to billionaire Soros, whose stated goal is the destruction of America.

One journalist has called the current protests across America as the SuperBowl of Antifa. Note their deception. While exalting one black victim, 5 more black victims of rioting (to date) are permitted collateral, exposing their blatant hypocrisy. Of course, the real objective was never Black Lives Matter but all police must be eliminated, not because they are inherently bad, which statistics prove, but because they are in the way of their plans to transform American society like they have in Russia and China.

[Sons to Glory!]

Antifa is a serious threat to our free market economy and democratic way of life! They are exploiting the opportunity to tear down what is good, to make way for their Marxist agenda power-grab.

In the end, it's all just a big manifestation of Adam. I was listening to a radio commentator last night decrying how blacks are treated differently. Then he commented that athletes and celebrities are also treated differently (not worse, but just differently). That caused me to start thinking - well shoot, just about everyone is treated differently for some reason. Ugly people, fat people, overly skinny people, short people, poor people, liberals, yellow people, rich people, red people, conservatives . . . you name it - they're are treated differently!

And then there's the biggest demographic: women! Women are treated differently too, and there's probably much more data to support "unfair" treatment of women than of anyone else. So what if women also rose up and started marching & protesting and carrying on?! And not as they have in the past, but what if women really came out in force to protest and shut things down for a long time, widespread all over the country (or maybe the world)? Now THAT would be a most serious game changer!

My point is, Adam pretty much treats anyone who is unlike him differently. And even if someone looks pretty much just like him, Adam will still try to take advantage!

So, of course, the only real solution is to ditch Adam and start fresh.

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Ohio

Who is raging where?

Candace Owens, and all you out here that support her. She ain't got the sense that God gave a goose. She's as loony as AOC, except on the far right.

Plus, she's one of those dreaded pagans, y'all like to denigrate. We should all be raging against her.

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by awareness

Candace Owens, and all you out here that support her. She ain't got the sense that God gave a goose. She's as loony as AOC, except on the far right.

Plus, she's one of those dreaded pagans, y'all like to denigrate. We should all be raging against her.

So now that you've done the character assassination on Ms. Owens --- did you watch her video, and if so, can you dispute specifics?

BTW: over 3,600,000 views on that video in less than two days. (which doesn't mean it's good, bad or ugly . . .)

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by awareness

Candace Owens, and all you out here that support her. She ain't got the sense that God gave a goose. She's as loony as AOC, except on the far right.

Plus, she's one of those dreaded pagans, y'all like to denigrate. We should all be raging against her.

Sorry, bro, but you been brainwashed by Leftist propaganda.

Name one thing in her youtube that was factually wrong.

It sounds like you support these ANTIFA riots as atonement for America's evil. Last count 17 have died in the chaos. Most of them black.

Honest questions: How many deaths will be required to atone for George Floyd's death? How many buildings must be destroyed?

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Ohio

Honest questions: How many deaths will be required to atone for George Floyd's death? How many buildings must be destroyed?

I have a couple of questions for you and anyone else out here:

1) Are you against police brutality against blacks?

2) Are you anti-racism?

Please answer those questions, and then we can continue our discussion,

[Sons to Glory!]

Interesting discussion on the patio having breakfast with my wife this morning. We were talking about how everyone gets treated differently, if they are different from another person. That is, fat people are treated differently by skinny people, and so forth. This is just how it is. One can choose to take on the victum mentality, which does nobody any good, or one can choose to figure out a way to overcome it. For instance, she (in her corporate career) rose to the level of VP in an international company and thought nothing of disadvantages she might have faced as a woman. She paid perceived disadvantages little attention, because what one focuses on tends to become bigger. When being interviewed by the media, she disappointed a reporter because she replied to the reporter's questions by asking, "What glass ceiling are you referring to?"

Human nature says we will have a big knee-jerk reaction to this current situation, paying little attention to any actual empirical data regarding systemic racism among our police and related systems. In doing this, there will be another big over-reach of government (a new oversight agency?) that will cost us all more tax money. But in the end, this government reaction will assuage the perceptions of many, and that will "solve" the problem - because that's where the problem mainly is . . . in many people's perception.

So what's to do? Accept that it's just another manifestation of futile Adam being disquieted in vain, and go praise the Lord with the saints! (which is just what I'm about to do!)

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by awareness

I have a couple of questions for you and anyone else out here:

1) Are you against police brutality against blacks?

2) Are you anti-racism?

Please answer those questions, and then we can continue our discussion,

Yes and yes - easiest answers I've given so far today!

And I'd be interested in your thoughts on my post just before this one.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by awareness

I have a couple of questions for you and anyone else out here:

1) Are you against police brutality against blacks?

2) Are you anti-racism?

Please answer those questions, and then we can continue our discussion,

Of course, I am against racism, racism against blacks, against whites, against natives, against hispanics, against asians, I am against all racism.

Of course, I am against police brutality, police brutality against blacks, police brutality against whites, police brutality against asians, police brutality against hispanics. I am against all police brutality towards all people.


awareness, are you also against the torture, murder, and mistreatment of Christians?

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Ohio

awareness, are you also against the torture, murder, and mistreatment of Christians?

I'll take that as a rhetorical question.

Other than that, I'm totally with you with anti-racism, and police brutality. I believe also that, all lives matter ; as long as it isn't used to dismiss black lives matter.

Thanks for your kind reply.

[awareness]

Okay, back to Candace.

On Sunday, Owens revealed that her campaign to support Dykes’ cafe was suspended by GoFundMe after the company found her fundraiser “to be in support of hate, violence, harassment, bullying, discrimination, terrorism, or intolerance of any kind.”

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by awareness

Okay, back to Candace.

On Sunday, Owens revealed that her campaign to support Dykes’ cafe was suspended by GoFundMe after the company found her fundraiser “to be in support of hate, violence, harassment, bullying, discrimination, terrorism, or intolerance of any kind.”

These are the false charges they bring against all conservatives to intimidate them into subservience. Where have you been? Haven't you seen film clips of the vile hate, bullying, terrorism, and intimidation coming from ANTIFA thugs?

Where are the charges of being a science and climate denier? How about being more murderous than Hitler? The list goes on -- she must be a xenophobe too.

THESE ARE THE EXACT THINGS HER ACCUSERS ARE DOING TO HER!

I thought you were smart enough to see thru this nonsense. ANTIFA is a dangerous cult. Didn't you say that you would always be there thinking for them? So they don't have to, because they are not!

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by awareness

Okay, back to Candace.

She does appear to be a tad polarizing, doesn't she?

Awareness, you may have not seen my post below, and then where I was asking for your response . . .

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

Interesting discussion on the patio having breakfast with my wife this morning. We were talking about how everyone gets treated differently, if they are different from another person. That is, fat people are treated differently by skinny people, and so forth. This is just how it is. One can choose to take on the victum mentality, which does nobody any good, or one can choose to figure out a way to overcome it. For instance, she (in her corporate career) rose to the level of VP in an international company and thought nothing of disadvantages she might have faced as a woman. She paid perceived disadvantages little attention, because what one focuses on tends to become bigger. When being interviewed by the media, she disappointed a reporter because she replied to the reporter's questions by asking, "What glass ceiling are you referring to?"

Human nature says we will have a big knee-jerk reaction to this current situation, paying little attention to any actual empirical data regarding systemic racism among our police and related systems. In doing this, there will be another big over-reach of government (a new oversight agency?) that will cost us all more tax money. But in the end, this government reaction will assuage the perceptions of many, and that will "solve" the problem - because that's where the problem mainly is . . . in many people's perception.

So what's to do? Accept that it's just another manifestation of futile Adam being disquieted in vain, and go praise the Lord with the saints! (which is just what I'm about to do!)

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

She does appear to be a tad polarizing, doesn't she?

Owens is no different than the dozens of conservative black scholars, writers, and talk show hosts and guests that I have heard. They are only speaking truth to power during this state of anarchy.

At what point do we stand up to lawlessness and these bully tactics?

Is not ANTIFA/BLM a dangerous cult? A terrorist organization? Awareness acts all brave and courageous when he speaks out against Southern Baptists, Evangelicals, and this Anaheim "cult," claiming to think for them. But note that they never fight back, at least not with violence. I would like to see him take a stand and do some thinking for all the little victims --men, women, old and young -- of all colors -- who have lost their lives, loved ones, homes, livelihood, neighborhoods, and property to this vicious mob.

Shouldn't we support all of the courageous ones who speak out against thugs who would rob us blind of who we are, what we own, our human rights, and our freedoms? If not, think about that mob coming to your neighborhood, breaking down your door, smashing, looting, and burning everything in sight. And forget about calling 911, because that "de-funded" thin Blue line stayed home to defend their own families.

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by Ohio

Owens is no different than the dozens of conservative black scholars, writers, and talk show hosts and guests that I have heard. They are only speaking truth to power during this state of anarchy.

At what point do we stand up to lawlessness and these bully tactics?

Is not ANTIFA/BLM a dangerous cult? A terrorist organization? Awareness acts all brave and courageous when he speaks out against Southern Baptists, Evangelicals, and this Anaheim "cult," claiming to think for them. But note that they never fight back, at least not with violence. I would like to see him take a stand and do some thinking for all the little victims --men, women, old and young -- of all colors -- who have lost their lives, loved ones, homes, livelihood, neighborhoods, and property to this vicious mob.

Shouldn't we support all of the courageous ones who speak out against thugs who would rob us blind of who we are, what we own, our human rights, and our freedoms? If not, think about that mob coming to your neighborhood, breaking down your door, smashing, looting, and burning everything in sight. And forget about calling 911, because that "de-funded" thin Blue line stayed home to defend their own families.

I liked what she had to say, and thought it was a good balance to what the extreme leftists are peddling.

I find it quite fascinating in observing Adam in action. As each side gets more extreme and vocal about something, the other side has to become louder and more extreme to counter what they perceive as the other side becoming more extreme. Therefore I observed that Miss Owens was "a tad polarizing" somewhat in a sarcastic way . . .

My my my, where will it all end?! (oh wait, we know the answer to that)

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Ohio

ANTIFA is a dangerous cult.

I don't think any of us is for fascism ; certainly today, with government control of everything.

I was certainly on the side of antifa in Charlottesville, against the KKK, neo-Nazi's, white supremacists, etc. They're worse than any antifa.

I know Trumpites believe every word that comes out of Saint Trump's mouth, but the facts don't hold up, that they are behind the violence and looting during the anti-racism protests. But since when has Trump ever cared about facts?

How come Trump isn't calling the Boogaloo Boys terrorists?

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

Interesting discussion on the patio having breakfast with my wife this morning. We were talking about how everyone gets treated differently, if they are different from another person. That is, fat people are treated differently by skinny people, and so forth. This is just how it is. One can choose to take on the victum mentality, which does nobody any good, or one can choose to figure out a way to overcome it. For instance, she (in her corporate career) rose to the level of VP in an international company and thought nothing of disadvantages she might have faced as a woman. She paid perceived disadvantages little attention, because what one focuses on tends to become bigger. When being interviewed by the media, she disappointed a reporter because she replied to the reporter's questions by asking, "What glass ceiling are you referring to?"

Human nature says we will have a big knee-jerk reaction to this current situation, paying little attention to any actual empirical data regarding systemic racism among our police and related systems. In doing this, there will be another big over-reach of government (a new oversight agency?) that will cost us all more tax money. But in the end, this government reaction will assuage the perceptions of many, and that will "solve" the problem - because that's where the problem mainly is . . . in many people's perception.

So what's to do? Accept that it's just another manifestation of futile Adam being disquieted in vain, and go praise the Lord with the saints! (which is just what I'm about to do!)

Good post StG. I think there's two major problems.

First, we're made of mud, and we can't expect too much from mud.

Second : tribalism. In prehistoric days, and afterwards, tribes were important for the survival of the human race ; back when human population was next to nothing.

But it seems that we lived so long with it, that it's become hard-wired in our human nature, in our psyche. We can't seem to kick it. That's one thing I hated even when I was in the local church. It's the we against them problem.

Tribalism may have worked in the past, but now, with our population pushing 8 billion, it is now very destructive, and dangerous. And cults are an extreme example of it.

And I know bro Ohio will likely say I'm in this or that cult. But there's no question that Trump is a personality cult leader -- like Lee -- and his rally attendees are his cult followers.

Thanks StG.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by awareness

I don't think any of us is for fascism ; certainly today, with government control of everything.

Hitler's Fascism ended with WWII. Did you miss that story?

Originally Posted by awareness

I was certainly on the side of antifa in Charlottesville, against the KKK, neo-Nazi's, white supremacists, etc. They're worse than any antifa.

Are you delusional? ANTIFA defines Fascism in the US. We now have death and destruction from ANTIFA in every major city. We have had NAZI style Kristallnacht in every US city for 2 weeks. The entire country is spiraling downward into total chaos and anarchy, and you are stuck on the monuments debate of 3 years ago?

We had one crazy Confederate neo-NAZI named Fields, convicted of 1st degree murder, driving his car into a crowd in Charlottesville, killing Heather Hoyer and hurting 8 others. No one from the Unite The Right crowd even knew him.

Have you not seen the recent news? Dozens senselessly killed by ANTIFA thugs. Tens of thousands of buildings, businesses, public structures destroyed and defaced. Do you also believe in ghosts and UFO's? You are equating a firecracker with an atom bomb, claiming the firecracker is more dangerous.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by awareness

And I know bro Ohio will likely say I'm in this or that cult. But there's no question that Trump is a personality cult leader -- like Lee -- and his rally attendees are his cult followers.

You are in the cult. So you are not kneeling down to that great BLM god Obama like all the others?

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Ohio

Hitler's Fascism ended with WWII. Did you miss that story?


Are you delusional? ANTIFA defines Fascism in the US. We now have death and destruction from ANTIFA in every major city. We have had NAZI style Kristallnacht in every US city for 2 weeks. The entire country is spiraling downward into total chaos and anarchy, and you are stuck on the monuments debate of 3 years ago?

We had one crazy Confederate neo-NAZI named Fields, convicted of 1st degree murder, driving his car into a crowd in Charlottesville, killing Heather Hoyer and hurting 8 others. No one from the Unite The Right crowd even knew him.

Have you not seen the recent news? Dozens senselessly killed by ANTIFA thugs. Tens of thousands of buildings, businesses, public structures destroyed and defaced. Do you also believe in ghosts and UFO's? You are equating a firecracker with an atom bomb, claiming the firecracker is more dangerous.

You you you ... always making, taking, it personal.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by awareness

You you you ... always making, taking, it personal.

Yeah personal, it's my country. Yours too!

[Sons to Glory!]

So Awareness (and anyone else) - did you look at the study regarding police shootings in my original post? Wondering what you might think.

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

So Awareness (and anyone else) - did you look at the study regarding police shootings in my original post? Wondering what you might think.

Yes I did. Interesting study. I don't have time to go over blacks killed by cops, by shooting or choking, but the whites cops involved in Floyd's killing where shouting the n word. They obviously were racist.

That aside, for now, as far as I see the cops, not all of them, are out of control. Maybe the Supreme Court can help solve it by negating Qualified Immunity. Then cops putting 20 shots in the back of someone during a traffic stop will have to answer.

At any rate, seems everyone wants to stoke fear. But Christians should be immune to it.

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by awareness

Yes I did. Interesting study. I don't have time to go over blacks killed by cops, by shooting or choking, but the whites cops involved in Floyd's killing where shouting the n word. They obviously were racist.

That aside, for now, as far as I see the cops, not all of them, are out of control. Maybe the Supreme Court can help solve it by negating Qualified Immunity. Then cops putting 20 shots in the back of someone during a traffic stop will have to answer.

At any rate, seems everyone wants to stoke fear. But Christians should be immune to it.

So police brutality happens. No one wants it. But it's not so easy to show empirical evidence that there is systemic police racism. We use a saying a lot in our work: "You can't manage what you don't measure." To take action just upon supposition is not effectively managing - it's knee jerk just for the sake of looking like you're doing something.

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

So police brutality happens. No one wants it. But it's not so easy to show empirical evidence that there is systemic police racism. We use a saying a lot in our work: "You can't manage what you don't measure." To take action just upon supposition is not effectively managing - it's knee jerk just for the sake of looking like you're doing something.

Here's a 6 minute youtube that's interesting, and bears looking deeper into :

The Police Trainer Who Teaches Cops to Kill | The New Yorker
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ETf7NJOMS6Y

[awareness]

Little evidence of antifa links in U.S. prosecutions of those charged in protest violence

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-m...-idUSKBN23H06J

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by awareness

Here's a 6 minute youtube that's interesting, and bears looking deeper into :

The Police Trainer Who Teaches Cops to Kill | The New Yorker
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ETf7NJOMS6Y

A good deal of ex-milatary goes into police work I understand and it seems pretty natural for that to happen. The video certainly shows disturbing clips and apparently (I wasn't there) wrong-headed shootings with people of color. (But it must also be said that if a police officer isn't able, physically & mentally, to defend us from shooters and/or killers, then they shouldn't be in that job, right?)

However, you can't say this is conclusive proof rising to the level of empirical evidence - demonstrating systemic racism, right (are you saying that?)? Again, you can't manage what you don't measure, otherwise you'll just be having a knee-jerk reaction to what appears to be so, but may not be the actual case in reality. And does it apply to every police force, or just certain of them?

If there really is systemic racism shown by solid data, then fine, let's do something about that . . . based upon real intelligence - not mob rule!

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by awareness

Here's a 6 minute youtube that's interesting, and bears looking deeper into :

The Police Trainer Who Teaches Cops to Kill | The New Yorker
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ETf7NJOMS6Y

The police are 20 times more likely to die than the criminals by the police.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

However, you can't say this is conclusive proof rising to the level of empirical evidence - demonstrating systemic racism, right (are you saying that?)? Again, you can't manage what you don't measure, otherwise you'll just be having a knee-jerk reaction to what appears to be so, but may not be the actual case in reality. And does it apply to every police force, or just certain of them?

If there really is systemic racism shown by solid data, then fine, let's do something about that . . . based upon real intelligence - not mob rule!

You can't manage what you don't measure?

You start talking real stats like that, you might get yourself killed.

The real problem in the 21st century, is not systemic racism, never was, stats prove that.

The root problem is union protection of bad actors. Every police department knows who their bad actors are real quick, when the complaints and lawsuits come rolling in, as with Derek Chauvin. Did you notice that none of his friends or family came to his defense? His wife filed for divorce that day after it all happened.

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by Ohio

You can't manage what you don't measure?

You start talking real stats like that, you might get yourself killed.

The real problem in the 21st century, is not systemic racism, never was, stats prove that.

The root problem is union protection of bad actors. Every police department knows who their bad actors are real quick, when the complaints and lawsuits come rolling in, as with Derek Chauvin. Did you notice that none of his friends or family came to his defense? His wife filed for divorce that day after it all happened.

Huh - police unions?! Actually, that strikes a chord with me. When I was in CA I had my first exposure to unions while working in a public school system, a job that lasted about 5 years. I was sent there as a contractor to train employees and put management systems and efficient practices in place, which were very sorely needed. The employee union fought us at every turn. An employee really, really had to be bad/rotten before the union would admit that something should be done with them (then getting something actually done with them was a different story). I was able to implement a few positive things at one point, as I developed something of a decent relationship with a new union steward. This steward was smarter than his predecessor, and realized certain employees were giving the union a bad name. I could work with him and we agreed it was a waste of energy to fight over every little thing . . . we learned which battles to pick, and that worked better for everyone.

And the school district administration simply caved whenever the union said "boo." It was very frustrating as I saw firsthand how much tax money was just going down the toilet, because of the ineffective system they had created.

That was one situation (among many) that made me glad to not live in California any more!

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

Huh - police unions?! Actually, that strikes a chord with me. When I was in CA I had my first exposure to unions while working in a public school system, a job that lasted about 5 years. I was sent there as a contractor to train employees and put management systems and efficient practices in place, which were very sorely needed. The employee union fought us at every turn. An employee really, really had to be bad/rotten before the union would admit that something should be done with them (then getting something actually done with them was a different story). I was able to implement a few positive things at one point, as I developed something of a decent relationship with a new union steward. This steward was smarter than his predecessor, and realized certain employees were giving the union a bad name. I could work with him and we agreed it was a waste of energy to fight over every little thing . . . we learned which battles to pick, and that worked better for everyone.

And the school district administration simply caved whenever the union said "boo." It was very frustrating as I saw firsthand how much tax money was just going down the toilet, because of the ineffective system they had created.

That was one situation (among many) that made me glad to not live in California any more!

One brother of mine was asst manager at a food store chain. He caught an employee stealing beer and drinking in the back room. He fired the guy, but it went to court because of union protection. The union lawyer destroyed my brother on the witness stand. Later he resigned. Ever hear of too much of a good thing? That's the food unions. It's like life on junk food and desert. If a coworker wants to "eat healthy," i.e. work hard, they will go after him.

Every time we have a case of police brutality, we then find out this cop has a lengthy "rap sheet" of complaints. My other brother was living in NYC and driving to work when this murder occurred. It shook him up. Noel Polanco, a national guardsman, picked up a friend at work and was hurrying home. Another friend, an off-duty NYC cop was in the back seat. He cut off an unmarked swat team van. They stopped Noel and rushed his car. His friend in the friend seat said the driver's hands were on the wheel. No resistance, but one quick kill shot from the aggressive cop. Claimed the driver was reaching for a gun. The NYC police union had already paid out on two prior lawsuits for this bad cop. They obviously got to the off-duty police officer in the back seat, who later claimed to be sleeping thru the whole event. She traded justice for her future.

NYC Detective Hassan Hamdy, 40, was charged later with a single count: “failure to employ proper tactics that caused a civilian’s death." A Queens grand jury declined to indict Hamdy, a 15-year veteran and former U.S. Marine, of any criminal wrongdoing last year. Happens all the time.

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Ohio

Happens all the time.

What's the difference now : CELL PHONES WITH CAMERAS.

[Sons to Glory!]

Here's something really positive for the Kingdom: At the brothers' breakfast this morning, there was mention about the prayer and worship gatherings being held at the site of George Floyd's death - many are coming to Christ and are even being baptized!

Floyd Ministry Memorial Article

CBN Article about Floyd Intersection

"There are too many testimonies to recount!! They were able to preach to thousands and saw hundreds responding to the Gospel of Jesus!!"

Someone at breakfast made this comment: "Wouldn't it be interesting if we find out some day, that Mr. Floyd was actually a believer? And that his death was a falling into the ground that life would spring forth!?"

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

Here's something really positive for the Kingdom: At the brothers' breakfast this morning, there was mention about the prayer and worship gatherings being held at the site of George Floyd's death - many are coming to Christ and are even being baptized!

Floyd Ministry Memorial Article

CBN Article about Floyd Intersection

"There are too many testimonies to recount!! They were able to preach to thousands and saw hundreds responding to the Gospel of Jesus!!"
Someone at breakfast made this comment: "Wouldn't it be interesting if we find out some day, that Mr. Floyd was actually a believer? And that his death was a falling into the ground that life would spring forth!?"

StG, thanks for the good news. What the devil is now using for death and destruction around the Western world, God can use for good! (Gen 50.20)

And here's more verses: Phil 1.15-18 It made me sick watching Sharpton preach out of strife, pretense, and contention, but still we should rejoice since Christ is announced! And we all should rejoice, "yes, and will rejoice!"

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

Here's something really positive for the Kingdom: At the brothers' breakfast this morning, there was mention about the prayer and worship gatherings being held at the site of George Floyd's death - many are coming to Christ and are even being baptized!

Floyd Ministry Memorial Article

CBN Article about Floyd Intersection

"There are too many testimonies to recount!! They were able to preach to thousands and saw hundreds responding to the Gospel of Jesus!!"

Someone at breakfast made this comment: "Wouldn't it be interesting if we find out some day, that Mr. Floyd was actually a believer? And that his death was a falling into the ground that life would spring forth!?"

I guess Floyd is a sacrificial lamb ... and the cop is a pagan Roman. All we're missing is a cross.

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by awareness

I guess Floyd is a sacrificial lamb ... and the cop is a pagan Roman. All we're missing is a cross.

It could be a Sampson type thing. Here's what I mean - this morning there was some conversation at the brothers' breakfast about how amazing the seed of life within us is. It will achieve its goal of transforming us into His image and bringing many sons to glory! So let's say Mr. Floyd received the Lord into him at an early age. (of course, we don't know either way, but just supposing) Then as he got older he struggled with a lot of issues and got into trouble repeatedly. Regardless, the Lord would have never left him and always loved him, and wanted his life to have real meaning and profit.

And what if God decided that even though Floyd's life looked to be a failure (and certainly in respect to the Kingdom of Christ), so that God would make "lemonade" out of the bitter lemons? And would not Mr. Floyd - and Jesus - then be more joyous that his life turned into a profit at his death, as many get saved as a result?

Who is to say?! God works in very mysterious ways to us. But one day we'll know the full story to this and many other events, and then He will really get all the glory!

But of course, Sampson gave his life willingly, so that's probably where the similarity in my little made-up story ends . . .

[Weighingin]

George Floyd Left A Gospel Legacy In Houston
www.christianitytoday

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by Weighingin

George Floyd Left A Gospel Legacy In Houston
www.christianitytoday

That link doesn't work, try this link:

https://www.christianitytoday.com/ne...rd-church.html

[Weighingin]

Yes, I apologize for that no link. I found it can be located under a general Google search for Christianity Today and that article.

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Weighingin

Yes, I apologize for that no link. I found it can be located under a general Google search for Christianity Today and that article.

"The fact that he has been held up as a martyr sickens me.” - Candace Owens

But he is a martyr, a Christian martyr. Sorry Candace, you are wrong to make inflammatory statements denigrating Floyd. Shame on you.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by awareness

"The fact that he has been held up as a martyr sickens me.” - Candace Owens

But he is a martyr, a Christian martyr. Sorry Candace, you are wrong to make inflammatory statements denigrating Floyd. Shame on you.

Christian martyr? Says Pope awareness? Martyrs die for their profession of faith. They are the Lord's witnesses. George Floyd said nothing about the Lord.

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by Ohio

Christian martyr? Says Pope awareness? Martyrs die for their profession of faith. They are the Lord's witnesses. George Floyd said nothing about the Lord.

Ya know, I hafta agree. This is why, in my little imaginary story, I sort of imagined - what if he was saved. We don't know, although some news article seemed to allude to the fact that he might have done some "good works" in Houston, but I don't think I read there about specific professions towards Jesus. If he did, please point that out to us. I'm glad he was apparently doing good things, but that does not a Christian make by itself. (much like MLK I might add)

If he was really a brother - great! Nonetheless, the Lord is able to use this occurrence to bring some (hopefully many) to Him!

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

Ya know, I hafta agree. This is why, in my little imaginary story, I sort of imagined - what if he was saved. We don't know, although some news article seemed to allude to the fact that he might have done some "good works" in Houston, but I don't think I read there about specific professions towards Jesus. If he did, please point that out to us. I'm glad he was apparently doing good things, but that does not a Christian make by itself. (much like MLK I might add)

If he was really a brother - great! Nonetheless, the Lord is able to use this occurrence to bring some (hopefully many) to Him!

And we can't know if they truly get saved and are real Christians either.

Pope Awareness ...

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by awareness

And we can't know if they truly get saved and are real Christians either.

Pope Awareness ...

And I don't even know what I'm having for lunch!

"Pope Awareness" ---> you and bro Ohio seem to have a most "special" relationship on here . . .

[awareness]

I remember signing this song when I was a kid in the SBC :

Jesus loves the little children
All the children of the world
Red, brown, yellow
Black and white
They are precious in His sight
Jesus loves the little children
Of the world
Jesus died for all the children
All the children of the world
Red, brown, yellow
Black and white
They are precious in His sight
Jesus died for all the children
Of the world.
Jesus rose for all the children
All the children of the world
Red, brown, yellow
Black and white
They are precious in His sight
Jesus rose for all the children
Of the world.

Now, finally, I think they mean it :

Christianity Today calls for churches to pay reparations to black people: "Repentance is not enough"

https://disrn.com/news/christianity-...-is-not-enough

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by awareness

I remember signing this song when I was a kid in the SBC :

Jesus loves the little children
All the children of the world
Red, brown, yellow
Black and white
They are precious in His sight
Jesus loves the little children
Of the world
Jesus died for all the children
All the children of the world
Red, brown, yellow
Black and white
They are precious in His sight
Jesus died for all the children
Of the world.
Jesus rose for all the children
All the children of the world
Red, brown, yellow
Black and white
They are precious in His sight
Jesus rose for all the children
Of the world.

Now, finally, I think they mean it :

Christianity Today calls for churches to pay reparations to black people: "Repentance is not enough"

https://disrn.com/news/christianity-...-is-not-enough

Yes, I read that yesterday - now it's big news (on Drudge Report)!

Oh boy oh boy - where can I send all our money!?

Seriously, I think even the talk of reparations only makes things MUCH worse between the races!

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

And I don't even know what I'm having for lunch!

"Pope Awareness" ---> you and bro Ohio seem to have a most "special" relationship on here . . .

Yeah, we love each other, and we're not even neighbors.

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

Yes, I read that yesterday - now it's big news (on Drudge Report)!

Oh boy oh boy - where can I send all our money!?

Seriously, I think even the talk of reparations only makes things MUCH worse between the races!

I guess the SBC is feeling guilty for being founded back in the mid-19th c. all in for holding slaves ; using the Bible in support of it. I guess they no longer see the Bible in the same way, even tho the Bible, nor Jesus, nor Paul, speak out against slavery.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by awareness

I guess the SBC is feeling guilty for being founded back in the mid-19th c. all in for holding slaves ; using the Bible in support of it. I guess they no longer see the Bible in the same way, even tho the Bible, nor Jesus, nor Paul, speak out against slavery.

Since awareness was part of the Southern Baptist Church, I can understand why he feels that he owes reparations for decades of prejudice, along with penalties and interest.

But let's return to reality here, and recognize the insanity all around us. We now live in an age where completely innocent people are now guilty for crimes committed before they were born, and completely guilty people are no longer accountable for crimes they are committing right now.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by awareness

I remember signing this song when I was a kid in the SBC :

Jesus loves the little children
All the children of the world
Red, brown, yellow
Black and white
They are precious in His sight
Jesus loves the little children
Of the world
Jesus died for all the children
All the children of the world
Red, brown, yellow
Black and white
They are precious in His sight
Jesus died for all the children
Of the world.
Jesus rose for all the children
All the children of the world
Red, brown, yellow
Black and white
They are precious in His sight
Jesus rose for all the children
Of the world.

Now, finally, I think they mean it :

Sorry to break the news to you bro, but most of these anarchists are also atheists and don't seem to care two bits for Jesus love. They only asking for drugs, food, alcohol, cigarettes, weapons, and free tuition.

[TLFisher]

Originally Posted by awareness

I have a couple of questions for you and anyone else out here:

1) Are you against police brutality against blacks?

2) Are you anti-racism?

Please answer those questions, and then we can continue our discussion,

Yes and Yes and for good measure anti-double standards.

[TLFisher]

Originally Posted by Weighingin

Just as Hitler had an enforcement arm in the Brown Shirts (think that’s what they were called) that would beat opponents in the street, wreck stuff, etc, I wonder if the far
Left now has an enforcement arm in Antifa groups and the like. Though, it is not organized under one person as Hitler.

Antifa, KKK, Neo-nazis, etc are all fruit of the same tree.
Yes antifa is now what the brownshirts were in the early 1930's. In Berlin police were prohibited from obstructing brownshirts activities. Eventually brownshirts filled the role of police. Can you imagine police becoming disbanded and antifa filling the role as law enforcement. Scary thought. Toss civil liberties out the window.

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by Terry

Antifa, KKK, Neo-nazis, etc are all fruit of the same tree.
Yes antifa is now what the brownshirts were in the early 1930's. In Berlin police were prohibited from obstructing brownshirts activities. Eventually brownshirts filled the role of police. Can you imagine police becoming disbanded and antifa filling the role as law enforcement. Scary thought. Toss civil liberties out the window.

Yes, we just need to keep in mind that this is all simply a fuller manifestation of Adam, and that the kingdom he is part of will become more and more manifested as the closing of the age gets nearer. But praise the Lord, where sin does abound . . . the grace of God much more!

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Ohio

Sorry to break the news to you bro, but most of these anarchists are also atheists . . .

I wonder about that. Anyone have stats on it?

Originally Posted by Ohio

and don't seem to care two bits for Jesus love. They only asking for drugs, food, alcohol, cigarettes, weapons, and free tuition.

And we're commanded by Jesus to love them, even if they are enemies, or atheists.

Not that it is easy, and most Christians don't even try to live up to it.

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Terry

Antifa, KKK, Neo-nazis, etc are all fruit of the same tree.
Yes antifa is now what the brownshirts were in the early 1930's. In Berlin police were prohibited from obstructing brownshirts activities. Eventually brownshirts filled the role of police. Can you imagine police becoming disbanded and antifa filling the role as law enforcement. Scary thought. Toss civil liberties out the window.

That would more likely be the far right boogaloo boys, whose stated purpose is a race war, civil war, and over throw of the government.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by awareness

I wonder about that. Anyone have stats on it?

And we're commanded by Jesus to love them, even if they are enemies, or atheists.

Not that it is easy, and most Christians don't even try to live up to it.

Anybody have stats on that?

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Ohio

Anybody have stats on that?

I know at least one.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by awareness

I know at least one.

Now I understand.


Your generalizations are made on a sample size of one.

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by awareness

And we're commanded by Jesus to love them, even if they are enemies, or atheists.

Not that it is easy, and most Christians don't even try to live up to it.

Well, here's a news flash - the message is we CAN'T LOVE without Him! I'm convinced all I can do is pray, "Lord, I don't have it in me . . . You hafta love this person through me!" (then act in faith that He is supplying)

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

Well, here's a news flash - the message is we CAN'T LOVE without Him! I'm convinced all I can do is pray, "Lord, I don't have it in me . . . You hafta love this person through me!" (then act in faith that He is supplying)

Very interesting bro StG. I hope you're trusting in the Jesus in the gospels, and not the one in the book of Revelation.

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by awareness

Very interesting bro StG. I hope you're trusting in the Jesus in the gospels, and not the one in the book of Revelation.

It's a different Jesus in Revelation? I don't think so! My eyes were opened regarding this when we went through Revelation again a couple years ago - believe it or not it is really a book of love! Judgments are only toward exposing and eradicating the dark kingdom.

Yes, if man aligns himself with this evil, then he will partake of the judgment poured out, but love dictates the cancer has to be removed.

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

It's a different Jesus in Revelation? I don't think so! My eyes were opened regarding this when we went through Revelation again a couple years ago - believe it or not it is really a book of love! Judgments are only toward exposing and eradicating the dark kingdom.

Yes, if man aligns himself with this evil, then he will partake of the judgment poured out, but love dictates the cancer has to be removed.

I guess after 65 years, when Rev was written, Jesus forgot about love your enemies.

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by awareness

I guess after 65 years, when Rev was written, Jesus forgot about love your enemies.

Huh? If your enemy is a cancer (aka Satan & his kingdom) and just wants to kill & destroy everyone you created, you should "love" him!? Love your enemies has to do with your fellow man, not completely corrupt and insidiously evil principalities. Again, if someone completely aligns with the cancer, that's their choice and they will then needlessly suffer the consequences of that choice, right?

[Ohio]

We had a BLM protest rally in our little community today. Most folks in the community believe that all lives matter. I doubt if the Burn, Loot, Murder crowd would get any sympathy once they start their pernicious ways.

The BLM movement is both racist and hypocritical. Racist because they want certain lives to be more valuable than others, and hypocritical because so many black lives are lost when they begin to riot.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

Huh? If your enemy is a cancer (aka Satan & his kingdom) and just wants to kill & destroy everyone you created, you should "love" him!? Love your enemies has to do with your fellow man, not completely corrupt and insidiously evil principalities. Again, if someone completely aligns with the cancer, that's their choice and they will then needlessly suffer the consequences of that choice, right?

You remind me of the leftist movement to de-fund the police, as if the police are the enemy of law-abiding citizens. The actual citizens of these ravaged communities are actually crying out for justice and more police presence, as in Rev 6.10, "And they cried out with a loud voice saying, How long O sovereign Lord, holy and true, will You not judge and avenge our blood?" The criminals, composed of rioting anarchists, and disguised as peaceful protesters by day, work with certain corrupt city leaders to "steal, kill, and destroy." (John 10)

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

Huh? If your enemy is a cancer (aka Satan & his kingdom) and just wants to kill & destroy everyone you created, you should "love" him!? Love your enemies has to do with your fellow man, not completely corrupt and insidiously evil principalities. Again, if someone completely aligns with the cancer, that's their choice and they will then needlessly suffer the consequences of that choice, right?

The book is not speaking of cancerous cells. It speaks of real human beings.

But hey, there's harps of God, lots of 'em. You can have mine. i'm not a fan of harps.

But I don't think you really want to hear my take on Rev. All I'll say is : Preterism. And kindly end it at that.

Blessings bro ... and hope you avoid the bowls of the wrath of God.

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Ohio

Racist because they want certain lives to be more valuable than others,

No, I think they want to matter as much as whites.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by awareness

No, I think they want to matter as much as whites.

Of course black lives matter, all lives matter, blue lives matter, and the lives of the unborn also matter. But that's not the point. Statistics prove that. A police officer is more likely to be killed by a bad guy rather than the other way around. More white guys get killed by police than blacks. And worse than all -- blacks are killing blacks at record levels!

The current protests give the impression that the police single out blacks. The protests then become the way to end the police, create chaos, justify rioting, murder, and looting. Neighborhoods and lives are then ruined. Who cares about them? What do these poor people do to get around, buy food and supplies?

But the media ignores their plight and is actually endorsing this anarchy. Prior to this, they were shaming all Americans for leaving their homes. This was like dry kindling ready for ignition. I have always felt that protesters should not be allowed to wear masks. Now we have the perfect storm.

The police need some serious reform. How does a guy die after selling "loosey" cigarettes (Eric Garner)? How does a guy die after passing a bogus Jackson (George Floyd)? How does a guy die after falling asleep in a drive thru (Rayshard Brooks)? This is what troubles lots of people.

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by awareness

The book is not speaking of cancerous cells. It speaks of real human beings.

But hey, there's harps of God, lots of 'em. You can have mine. i'm not a fan of harps.

But I don't think you really want to hear my take on Rev. All I'll say is : Preterism. And kindly end it at that.

Blessings bro ... and hope you avoid the bowls of the wrath of God.

There are two kingdoms operating in this world - the kingdom of light and the kingdom of darkness. It started with the two trees in the garden. The tree of life remains in the end and the other must be uprooted. What's so difficult about understanding that?

Uprooting is not pleasant, and will not be for those who make their home in that tree/kingdom. But many will be frightened and call on the Savior. Therefore, as many as can be saved, will be saved out of that evil system. The progressive judgements will be a mercy to mankind, as it will wake many up. (at the same time it will cause the real enemy - the "cancer" - to go bananas, because he knows his time is short - hallelujah!)

Seems pretty easy to understand, at least to me.

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by awareness

No, I think they want to matter as much as whites.

Adam always sees himself as a victim - "It was that woman You gave me!"
That's when it started. Nothing's changed in that dark kingdom.

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by Ohio

Of course black lives matter, all lives matter, blue lives matter, and the lives of the unborn also matter. But that's not the point. Statistics prove that. A police officer is more likely to be killed by a bad guy rather than the other way around. More white guys get killed by police than blacks. And worse than all -- blacks are killing blacks at record levels!

The current protests give the impression that the police single out blacks. The protests then become the way to end the police, create chaos, justify rioting, murder, and looting. Neighborhoods and lives are then ruined. Who cares about them? What do these poor people do to get around, buy food and supplies?

But the media ignores their plight and is actually endorsing this anarchy. Prior to this, they were shaming all Americans for leaving their homes. This was like dry kindling ready for ignition. I have always felt that protesters should not be allowed to wear masks. Now we have the perfect storm.

The police need some serious reform. How does a guy die after selling "loosey" cigarettes (Eric Garner)? How does a guy die after passing a bogus Jackson (George Floyd)? How does a guy die after falling asleep in a drive thru (Rayshard Brooks)? This is what troubles lots of people.

I'm right here with you in your thinking, bro! Look, there are a lot of jugheads in law enforcement (like everywhere else). They have a tough job and have to be prepared at all times to use force. That use of force can then be easily abused. I remember being frightened out of my wits one time in the back of a police car, mainly just because I had long hair (circa early 70s). The guy wanted to show me, in no uncertain terms, that he was either going to Mace me or club me (fortunately he didn't do either). But then other times I was picked up, and the cops were pretty nice to me. Over all, they were nice more than not (i.e., back when I was a wannabe hippie type).

But I am white. Blacks commit a disproportionately higher number of crimes (including violet crimes) than whites, even considering that they are only 13% of the overall population. So cops are influenced by this knowledge and tend to profile. It's natural and is a knee-jerk, fear-based instinct. (Adam sorta profiled both God and Eve when he blamed the two of them for his downfall.)

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Ohio

Of course black lives matter, all lives matter, blue lives matter, and the lives of the unborn also matter. But that's not the point. Statistics prove that. A police officer is more likely to be killed by a bad guy rather than the other way around. More white guys get killed by police than blacks. And worse than all -- blacks are killing blacks at record levels!

The current protests give the impression that the police single out blacks. The protests then become the way to end the police, create chaos, justify rioting, murder, and looting. Neighborhoods and lives are then ruined. Who cares about them? What do these poor people do to get around, buy food and supplies?

But the media ignores their plight and is actually endorsing this anarchy. Prior to this, they were shaming all Americans for leaving their homes. This was like dry kindling ready for ignition. I have always felt that protesters should not be allowed to wear masks. Now we have the perfect storm.

The police need some serious reform. How does a guy die after selling "loosey" cigarettes (Eric Garner)? How does a guy die after passing a bogus Jackson (George Floyd)? How does a guy die after falling asleep in a drive thru (Rayshard Brooks)? This is what troubles lots of people.

I think there's just too many "Karens" out there, and people of color have had enough of it.

And, given the 1033 program, where cops look like military out on the battle field, what do they expect? Then add cameras showing cops gunning down people, especially people of color, in the back, while running away, and 8:48 is the match to the tinder box.

And then, add to all that, Covid crazy, and we've got massive protesters, made up of people of all colors, ... that, as I sang as a kid, Jesus loves.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by awareness

I think there's just too many "Karens" out there, and people of color have had enough of it.

And then, add to all that, Covid crazy, and we've got massive protesters, made up of people of all colors, ... that, as I sang as a kid, Jesus loves.

According to awareness, it sounds like BLM is what America needs -- Burning down their cities, Looting all their shops, and Murdering their neighbors is the right thing to do then?

Because Jesus loves them, eh?

Wait until the rest of the people have "had enough of it" too.

[zeek]

Originally Posted by Ohio

The police need some serious reform. How does a guy die after selling "loosey" cigarettes (Eric Garner)? How does a guy die after passing a bogus Jackson (George Floyd)? How does a guy die after falling asleep in a drive thru (Rayshard Brooks)? This is what troubles lots of people.

Good points!

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Ohio

According to awareness, it sounds like BLM is what America needs -- Burning down their cities, Looting all their shops, and Murdering their neighbors is the right thing to do then?

You have a wild imagination bro Ohio, with your "all."

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by awareness

You have a wild imagination bro Ohio, with your "all."

Read the news, bro.

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Ohio

Read the news, bro.

I read the news from various sites every morning, starting with Drudge, Fox, Knewz, Mail online, and a number of others. I don't really trust any of them.
I see bias in all of them.

Do you have a particular one in mind? Do you have a hotline to the one and only true news, that even knows what goes on in secret and behind closed doors, and top classified, with an all seeing eye, seeing everywhere and everything going on all at the same time? You certainly act that way. Like you're special, with the deepest insight and broadest knowledge.

Or maybe you get you're info straight from God.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by awareness

You have a wild imagination bro Ohio, with your "all."

Who, what, where, why, how is this character "all?"

[Ohio]

Protesters Pull Down Joe Biden After Mistaking Him For Old Racist Statue



WASHINGTON, D.C.—Enraged protesters were marching through D.C. toppling racist statues when they came upon one standing on a street corner. The archaic, racist statue looked very, very old. It even had some kind of obsolete soundbite-playing device in it, probably an early phonograph from how old the statue looked. It kept saying things about black people being clean and articulate and how poor kids are just as bright as white kids.

The rioters threw a lasso around the top of the statue after googling "How to tie a lasso" and arguing for a while about how lassos are racist. They then brought it tumbling down after graffitiing all over it.

Unfortunately, the old, racist statue turned out to be former vice president and current presidential candidate Joe Biden.

"Classic pranksters," Biden said, chuckling, as he dusted himself off. "You know, this happens from time to time. Back in my day, we were out at the community pool, hanging out and throwing rocks at each other, as was the fashion at the time. CornPop and I were dishing it out and running our fingers through our leg hairs when..." As he continued to drone on, though, another racist group came up and toppled him the other way.

Eventually the rioters had had their fun and moved on, knocking over Nancy Pelosi and Ruth Bader Ginsburg, mistaking both of them for ancient statues.

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by awareness

I read the news from various sites every morning, starting with Drudge, Fox, Knewz, Mail online, and a number of others. I don't really trust any of them.
I see bias in all of them.

Do you have a particular one in mind? Do you have a hotline to the one and only true news, that even knows what goes on in secret and behind closed doors, and top classified, with an all seeing eye, seeing everywhere and everything going on all at the same time? You certainly act that way. Like you're special, with the deepest insight and broadest knowledge.

Or maybe you get you're info straight from God.

They are all tilted one way or another, because they're all of Adam! I look at a few sites almost daily, including some you mentioned. I also get The Week, a weekly magazine (aptly named). For most subjects, it quotes other news sources from right, left and the middle. However, in the end, they still tilt left, as just about any piece they do concludes with a left-leaning view or source. But since I know that upfront, I make the necessary mental adjustments.

And the best advice regarding the news I think, is not to get too much of it! We are what we eat, and if we eat a bunch of fear and confusion all the time, guess what!?

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by awareness

I read the news from various sites every morning, starting with Drudge, Fox, Knewz, Mail online, and a number of others. I don't really trust any of them.

I get all my news from the Babylon Bee. Completely trustworthy. And it cheers me up!

[Ohio]

Apparently the new northwest welfare nation (formerly the East Police Precinct in Seattle) of CHAZ / CHOP needs a few supplies:



Since we are basically repeating many of the same events which occurred during the French Revolution, note that for those who refuse to cooperate with the new regime, "permanent" public shaming techniques are now being prepared:

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

They are all tilted one way or another, because they're all of Adam! I look at a few sites almost daily, including some you mentioned. I also get The Week, a weekly magazine (aptly named). For most subjects, it quotes other news sources from right, left and the middle. However, in the end, they still tilt left, as just about any piece they do concludes with a left-leaning view or source. But since I know that upfront, I make the necessary mental adjustments.

And the best advice regarding the news I think, is not to get too much of it! We are what we eat, and if we eat a bunch of fear and confusion all the time, guess what!?

I too make the necessary mental adjustments when reading news from the left, right, and middle.

I want to see it all, and all the awful news around the world. And it's ugly. But I've been doing it for so long I'm immune to it. I guess I've developed mental clauses.

[awareness]

Here's the real Trump photo op:

[Sons to Glory!]

OK - can we get back to, or at least stay more in line with the main topic, and not do this thing?



I understand politics comes into this topic, but . . .

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by awareness

Here's the real Trump photo op:

The media never covered how Trump was brutally attacked outside of his home. How courageous!

If they rioted in your front yard, I'm sure you would fire up that "pump action."

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Ohio

The media never covered how Trump was brutally attacked outside of his home. How courageous!

If they rioted in your front yard, I'm sure you would fire up that "pump action."

No. I would take a knee. Like Trump should have.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by awareness

No. I would take a knee. Like Trump should have.

Who are you bowing down to?


Are you god? Telling Trump to take a knee?

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by Ohio

Who are you bowing down to?


Are you god? Telling Trump to take a knee?

The knee thing bothers me (yes, I know what it apparently is supposed to symbolize). I'm not sure exactly what it's supposed to mean. And it does seem like in doing it you're being subservient to something, but I'm not sure what . . .

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

The knee thing bothers me (yes, I know what it apparently is supposed to symbolize). I'm not sure exactly what it's supposed to mean. And it does seem like in doing it you're being subservient to something, but I'm not sure what . . .

Goes back to the lovely Nessa Diab, the angry Bay Area muslim socialist radio talk host girlfriend of Colin Kaepernick, who seduced him to embrace her over the Christian faith he grew up with his adoptive parents. Nessa convinced Colin that America is evil, and that he should never respect the flag, our nation's symbol. Colin then began to kneel at the anthem, which many, including Trump protested. When Colin exercised his free agency clause of his contract, passing up millions with the 49ers, no other team signed him. So Colin made it about race, even though he has more white privilege than most others in the NFL.

The movement to kneel means you support black lives matter, hate Trump, hate police, hate Confederate symbols, hate Confederate leaders, hate all American founding fathers, and reject your white privilege. That is for the non-violent types. They have linked with ANTIFA's which hate all moderate Democrats and Conservatives.

Kneeling is now the bully tactic to force your subjection to their many whims. They are now extracting thuggery protection payments like the Mafia. Even if you pay up, like Wendy's who just gave $500K, they may still burn you down as a message to others.

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Ohio

Who are you bowing down to?


Are you god? Telling Trump to take a knee?

To your hubris I say yes and yes ... and yes yes yes yes yes.

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

The knee thing bothers me (yes, I know what it apparently is supposed to symbolize). I'm not sure exactly what it's supposed to mean. And it does seem like in doing it you're being subservient to something, but I'm not sure what . . .

Sorry StG ... but hogwash. It stands against police brutality against blacks.

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Ohio

Goes back to the lovely Nessa Diab, the angry Bay Area muslim socialist radio talk host girlfriend of Colin Kaepernick, who seduced him to embrace her over the Christian faith he grew up with his adoptive parents. Nessa convinced Colin that America is evil, and that he should never respect the flag,

That's a Trump position. But Trump often sees things that aren't there. Taking a knee has nothing to do with the flag.

[awareness]

Talking about killing minorities.

BLM has killed Aunt Jemima, Uncle Ben, and Mrs. Butterworth.

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by awareness

Sorry StG ... but hogwash. It stands against police brutality against blacks.

You misunderstand - I really don't know what it means. If, as you say, all it means is one is anti-police brutality against blacks, then sure, I'm for it.

However, I hope you can respect that I don't intend to physically take "a knee" for this cause (according to Romans 14:3).

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by awareness

Talking about killing minorities.

BLM has killed Aunt Jemima, Uncle Ben, and Mrs. Butterworth.

All our beloved institutions and symbols - what ever shall we do!?!?

Turn your eyes upon Jesus
Look full in His wonderful face
And the things of earth
Will grow strangely dim
In the light of His
Glory and Grace!

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by awareness

That's a Trump position. But Trump often sees things that aren't there. Taking a knee has nothing to do with the flag.

Not Trump at all. It was a anti-American Muslim position Colin Kaepernick got from his GF. Today everything, cancel culture, rioters, antifa, pro-abortion, pro-muslim, anti-Christian, open borders, gun-control, etc. etc. is hiding behind the Racist Banner. Here is an article:

Colin Kaepernick’s Communist-Sympathizing Muslim Girlfriend Believed To Be Behind Protest

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

All our beloved institutions and symbols - what ever shall we do!?!?

Turn your eyes upon Jesus
Look full in His wonderful face
And the things of earth
Will grow strangely dip
In the light of His
Glory and Grace!

not "strangely dip" but strangely dim

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by Ohio

not "strangely dip" but strangely dim

Thanks! Corrected now. (yer hired as a proof-reader!)

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Ohio

Not Trump at all. It was a anti-American Muslim position Colin Kaepernick got from his GF. Today everything, cancel culture, rioters, antifa, pro-abortion, pro-muslim, anti-Christian, open borders, gun-control, etc. etc. is hiding behind the Racist Banner. Here is an article:

Colin Kaepernick’s Communist-Sympathizing Muslim Girlfriend Believed To Be Behind Protest

And I suppose that Trump's communist wife, and parents, have no influence on Trump. Who begged China's president to help him win 2020.

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by awareness

And I suppose that Trump's communist wife, and parents, have no influence on Trump. Who begged China's president to help him win 2020.

In the words of our Dear Moderator (DM) - ENOUGH! This topic is about police actions with minorities, not about which side of the aisle is most evil (good luck figuring that out).

Please:

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

In the words of our Dear Moderator (DM) - ENOUGH! This topic is about police actions with minorities, not about which side of the aisle is most evil (good luck figuring that out).

Okay, our bad, Ohio and me, for mention of communists either related to Kaepernick or in the White House today.

So is Juneteenth on topic? How about the worst vigilante mob violence against blacks in our history, in Tulsa. The cops were there too, and allowed it, but claimed they couldn't stop the mob. I know it happened in the early 20th c. But is it relevant to today?

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by awareness

Okay, our bad, Ohio and me, for mention of communists either related to Kaepernick or in the White House today.

So is Juneteenth on topic? How about the worst vigilante mob violence against blacks in our history, in Tulsa. The cops were there too, and allowed it, but claimed they couldn't stop the mob. I know it happened in the early 20th c. But is it relevant to today?

If I were a POC, I could declare ole awareness a racist, forever silence him, and demand that he take a knee.

If ...

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by awareness

Okay, our bad, Ohio and me, for mention of communists either related to Kaepernick or in the White House today.

So is Juneteenth on topic? How about the worst vigilante mob violence against blacks in our history, in Tulsa. The cops were there too, and allowed it, but claimed they couldn't stop the mob. I know it happened in the early 20th c. But is it relevant to today?

Unless you understand the Communist origins to the ANTIFA movement and its continued activity since the 1930's in America, you will think that what you see happening today is due to racism.

It's not.

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by awareness

Okay, our bad, Ohio and me, for mention of communists either related to Kaepernick or in the White House today.

This topic was started regarding whether there is widespread, systemic racism in our police forces causing a distinct inclination of brutal behavior toward blacks. So thanks for your understanding - and I think the larger topic of general racism is perhaps not too far off. Unfortunately, like everything else these days, this topic can quickly get us off into the snorkeling-in-the-weeds of partisan politics!

From my standpoint, the anecdotal evidence is that I don't see the racism we're told is rampant in this country. I don't act in racists ways, nor does anyone I know. I have not seen it personally, especially in the more recent years. In Scottsdale there aren't a high percentage of black people, but some. There are a few blacks in our neighborhood and our ekklesia and I don't see any racism happening in these places. But again, this is just my personal, middle-aged white man anecdotal evidence.

(Let me say that I grew up with racism in the home of my grandparents who raised me. My grandfather was a KKK member in his early life. He let the N-word fly a lot. He would call the black trash collectors the N-word behind their back, but then be super nice to their face. He bought into all the stereotypical lies about blacks and voiced these frequently. But then as a teenager, I had a few good friends who were black - one was best man at my wedding. So I did experience racism in my early life.)

Does racism in our country occur? I'm sure it does, but other than what the media tells me, I don't personally see it around me. I also haven't seen the overwhelming evidence of systemic racism showing up in empirical data. The data and studies I have looked at, doesn't demonstrate the huge problem of systemic racism we're being told is rampant in our police forces. That's not to say some problem don't exist . . . it's just that either it's not as big as we're being told, or perhaps the studies are way off in their analytical methods.

As Christians, we know all these bad things exist in Adam. The list of negative and evil things present in Adam's race are long, and this includes racism and murder. Can I say I'm not guilty of having racist thoughts? No, I can't say that, because I still have the flesh. I have all kinds of thoughts that by the grace of God I don't act on because they are not of the new man, but rather of that old man. So what we are seeing in the world now is another manifestation of the old Adam man. He can't be fixed, and the one solution is his death. As Christians we know that anything else is mostly just putting the proverbial lipstick on the pig.

Adam likes to react in a knee-jerk fashion to things. All of this BLM stuff that's all the rage and being thrust into our face ("Why are they disquieted in vain?") . . . fine. Everyone has a right to voice their opinion in this country in a civil way. But I also have the choice to want to see a bonefide demonstration of solid empirical evidence before we react.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

This topic was started regarding whether there is widespread, systemic racism in our police forces causing a distinct inclination of brutal behavior toward blacks. So thanks for your understanding - and I think the larger topic of general racism is perhaps not too far off. Unfortunately, like everything else these days, this topic can quickly get us off into the snorkeling-in-the-weeds of partisan politics!

I don't think this thread went off topic. Because the real topic is how do we define racism?

Until racism is defined, specifically racism by police, there can never be a discussion. For example, the death of George Floyd, was that racism or police brutality, or perhaps both?

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by Ohio

I don't think this thread went off topic. Because the real topic is how do we define racism?

Until racism is defined, specifically racism by police, there can never be a discussion. For example, the death of George Floyd, was that racism or police brutality, or perhaps both?

Didn't go off topic? Well . . . sure . . . whatever. Let me just respond to your last question. The evidence I've seen definitely makes it appear as brutality. Racism? Perhaps, but I don't know what was in the cop's heart. So it could have been both, but that in and of itself does not demonstrate widespread systemic racism.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

Adam likes to react in a knee-jerk fashion to things. All of this BLM stuff that's all the rage and being thrust into our face ("Why are they disquieted in vain?") . . . fine. Everyone has a right to voice their opinion in this country in a civil way. But I also have the choice to want to see a bona fide demonstration of solid empirical evidence before we react.

I have seen and read and heard that much of the protests by blacks, loosely under the BLM umbrella, have been peaceful. The ANTIFA folks, who are mostly white youth, have not been peaceful.

The black community is not united in protest either. Young men particularly are the most loud-spoken about police brutality. Commonly known fact: “It’s important to note that black men commit nearly half of all murders in this country, which is astounding when you take into consideration the fact that they only make up 12-13 per cent of the population.” Obviously this fact alone will create much tension with the police, regardless of their color.

The law-abiding blacks, mostly families with young and old, however, see the police as friends and protectors. Without the police they become defenseless. They are the real victims in all these rioted communities. In fact, the real unspoken tension does not lie between black communities and the police, but between young blacks and the police.

It would be nice for the media to cover the tension between the protesting blacks, the shop owners, and the rioting, burning white Antifas. (Note that nothing today is homogeneous, and all characterizations will always be flawed.)

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

Didn't go off topic? Well . . . sure . . . whatever. Let me just respond to your last question. The evidence I've seen definitely makes it appear as brutality. Racism? Perhaps, but I don't know what was in the cop's heart. So it could have been both, but that in and of itself does not demonstrate widespread systemic racism.

Makes what appear as brutality?


You referring to Floyd or Brooks?

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by Ohio

Makes what appear as brutality?


You referring to Floyd or Brooks?

Apparent brutality by the cop. (That is, the infamous video of Floyd with the cop's knee on his neck.)

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

Apparent brutality by the cop. (That is, the infamous video of Floyd with the cop's knee on his neck.)

Definitely Floyd died due to brutality by one or more bad cops.

But . . . was it also racist?

And the bigger questions:

• Are all cops brutal?

• Are all cops racist?

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

This topic was started regarding whether there is widespread, systemic racism in our police forces causing a distinct inclination of brutal behavior toward blacks. So thanks for your understanding - and I think the larger topic of general racism is perhaps not too far off. Unfortunately, like everything else these days, this topic can quickly get us off into the snorkeling-in-the-weeds of partisan politics!

From my standpoint, the anecdotal evidence is that I don't see the racism we're told is rampant in this country. I don't act in racists ways, nor does anyone I know. I have not seen it personally, especially in the more recent years. In Scottsdale there aren't a high percentage of black people, but some. There are a few blacks in our neighborhood and our ekklesia and I don't see any racism happening in these places. But again, this is just my personal, middle-aged white man anecdotal evidence.

(Let me say that I grew up with racism in the home of my grandparents who raised me. My grandfather was a KKK member in his early life. He let the N-word fly a lot. He would call the black trash collectors the N-word behind their back, but then be super nice to their face. He bought into all the stereotypical lies about blacks and voiced these frequently. But then as a teenager, I had a few good friends who were black - one was best man at my wedding. So I did experience racism in my early life.)

Does racism in our country occur? I'm sure it does, but other than what the media tells me, I don't personally see it around me. I also haven't seen the overwhelming evidence of systemic racism showing up in empirical data. The data and studies I have looked at, doesn't demonstrate the huge problem of systemic racism we're being told is rampant in our police forces. That's not to say some problem don't exist . . . it's just that either it's not as big as we're being told, or perhaps the studies are way off in their analytical methods.

As Christians, we know all these bad things exist in Adam. The list of negative and evil things present in Adam's race are long, and this includes racism and murder. Can I say I'm not guilty of having racist thoughts? No, I can't say that, because I still have the flesh. I have all kinds of thoughts that by the grace of God I don't act on because they are not of the new man, but rather of that old man. So what we are seeing in the world now is another manifestation of the old Adam man. He can't be fixed, and the one solution is his death. As Christians we know that anything else is mostly just putting the proverbial lipstick on the pig.

Adam likes to react in a knee-jerk fashion to things. All of this BLM stuff that's all the rage and being thrust into our face ("Why are they disquieted in vain?") . . . fine. Everyone has a right to voice their opinion in this country in a civil way. But I also have the choice to want to see a bonefide demonstration of solid empirical evidence before we react.

All the very many, widespread, black lives matter protesters are like the weather ; like it or not we can't do anything about it.

And the data doesn't matter, except maybe to partisans looking for faults, and talking heads on TV, and sociology academics. It's perception that matters. And apparently, very many people perceive that there's a cop problem, and it looks like it's targeted more toward people of color.

I think we are witnessing some kind of a civil rights second great awaking ... in our modern times ; since MLK Jr.

Never the less, like it or not, all these goings-on are making changes happen : new things are happening, changes, a reshaping of our society is afoot.

Personally, I don't like the violence, from or by, either side -- both sides have bad apples -- they are after all made up of human primates -- both and all sides -- like all of us. If we were/are all angels we wouldn't need movements like we're seeing today. Just accept it. It's like a widespread weather system sweeping thru our collective consciousness

And then, let's not forget, there's the pandemic, causing Covid crazies. It must be one of the symptoms. I'm staying away from them, and cops, and protesters.

Harold

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by awareness

And the data doesn't matter, except maybe to partisans looking for faults, and talking heads on TV, and sociology academics. It's perception that matters. And apparently, very many people perceive that there's a cop problem, and it looks like it's targeted more toward people of color.

Awareness said it exactly right: It's perception that matters.

And who is driving this perception? A whole host of nefarious actors. And what is their agenda?

Listening and reading a diversity of black conservative scholars and talkers, many are convinced that this movement is not and will not benefit black people. Once again they are being used for others' benefit.

All they will get is more crime, burned out neighborhoods, and another black holiday or two -- Juneteenth Day and George Floyd Day will replace Columbus Day and Presidents Day.

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by Ohio

Awareness said it exactly right: It's perception that matters.

Yes, agree! Perception is what is important to Adam. For example, the entire value of the worldwide stock market is based upon man's perception of value. One day he sees great value in something so it is priced very high. The next day, driven by fear, the perceived value drops precipitously. When I saw that happen, after one of the several market crashes in the last 20 years, it made me realize that what man bases his reality on is just shifting sand.

[awareness]

Nearly 75 percent of disgruntled DC cops want to quit amid national protests while NYC murders have increased by 70 percent since unrest began and shootings in the Big Apple have more than doubled

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...0-percent.html

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by awareness

Nearly 75 percent of disgruntled DC cops want to quit amid national protests while NYC murders have increased by 70 percent since unrest began and shootings in the Big Apple have more than doubled

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...0-percent.html

This is what knee-jerk reactions get you. I just heard of an ex-neighbor lady who began sleeping with a revolver under her pillow because she's lost confidence. She's a believer too, but this is reacting out of fear. Lots of fast reactions and quick counter-reactions going on in the world now, and God only knows (literally) where it will wind-up. Only He can save us from ourselves!

[Sons to Glory!]

LINK: Muhammad Ali's son says he would've hated Black Lives Matters

Muhammad Ali's son speaks out against BLM saying it is unnecessary and divisive.

“It’s pitting black people against everyone else. It starts racial things to happen; I hate that.”

"Ali (the son) says he was never singled out by cops for his skin color, and defends them against charges of institutional racism."

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

"Ali (the son) says he was never singled out by cops for his skin color, and defends them against charges of institutional racism."[/I]

And we can trust MA jr's opinion why?

[awareness]

D.C. protesters pull down, burn statue of Confederate general

https://www.politico.com/news/2020/0...general-330132

And Trump goes off :

"The D.C. Police are not doing their job as they watch a statue be ripped down & burn," he tweeted. Trump also tagged the city's mayor, Muriel Bowser, a Democrat with whom he has clashed repeatedly in recent weeks. "These people should be immediately arrested. A disgrace to our Country!"

I'm thinking there's now shaping up the possibility that cop abuse, and BLM aren't going to be the top perception our nation will be concerned with, cuz civil war is now becoming a distinct possibility.

Let's hope not. Cuz then no lives will matter to each side, toward the opposite side.

It's time we all stop provoking and perpetuating a "Us v. Them" mentality. We're all a diverse family. It's so simple children can understand it :

Jesus loves the little children
All the children of the world
Red, brown, yellow
Black and white
They are precious in His sight

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by awareness

D.C. protesters pull down, burn statue of Confederate general

https://www.politico.com/news/2020/0...general-330132

And Trump goes off :



I'm thinking there's now shaping up the possibility that cop abuse, and BLM aren't going to be the top perception our nation will be concerned with, cuz civil war is now becoming a distinct possibility.

Let's hope not. Cuz then no lives will matter to each side, toward the opposite side.

It's time we all stop provoking and perpetuating a "Us v. Them" mentality. We're all a diverse family. It's so simple children can understand it :

Your post makes no sense. This is not a racial issue. Most of the police in these major cities are minorities. These rioting anarchists on the left hate America. The "us vs. them" is law-abiding citizens vs. lawless rioteers.

Which side are you on? Sounds to me like you believe that defunding the police will bring peace and security.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by awareness

And we can trust MA jr's opinion why?

You only trust opinions that match your own.

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by awareness

And we can trust MA jr's opinion why?

Simply another black person who says this is folly - to provide a small bit of balance to the loud, shrill tone we are hearing most everywhere else.

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Ohio

You only trust opinions that match your own.

You obviously haven't looked into the source. MA Jr. is not a good black guy. He's a bad apple.

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by awareness

You obviously haven't looked into the source. MA Jr. is not a good black guy. He's a bad apple.

A "bad apple"? I don't know anything about him, but in a big respect, all of Adam is a "bad apple." What's your point in saying that? And what discredits him from claiming BLM is folly and will only bring about undesired things? Is he not a black man with a right to speak freely about this matter? He's just giving his perspective and what he's experienced. His voice matters, doesn't it? Is he any less credible than a Jesse Jackson or Rev. Sharpton (who are largely just self-serving IMHO)?

My point is he's another black voice that is raising some objection to what BLM seems to be so hell-bent to push in the public's face, without empirical evidence to backup the notion that there's widespread and systemic racism going on.

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

A "bad apple"? I don't know anything about him, but in a big respect, all of Adam is a "bad apple." What's your point in saying that? And what discredits him from claiming BLM is folly and will only bring about undesired things? Is he not a black man with a right to speak freely about this matter? He's just giving his perspective and what he's experienced. His voice matters, doesn't it? Is he any less credible than a Jesse Jackson or Rev. Sharpton (who are largely just self-serving IMHO)?

My point is he's another black voice that is raising some objection to what BLM seems to be so hell-bent to push in the public's face, without empirical evidence to backup the notion that there's widespread and systemic racism going on.

His error is not expressing his opinion, but that of his father, that he couldn't really speak for. Muhammad Ali was a Muslim, and suffered for it. He might have been for BLM.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by awareness

His error is not expressing his opinion, but that of his father, that he couldn't really speak for. Muhammad Ali was a Muslim, and suffered for it. He might have been for BLM.

Like Hidin Joe Biden says, "he ain't black enough?"

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by awareness

His error is not expressing his opinion, but that of his father, that he couldn't really speak for. Muhammad Ali was a Muslim, and suffered for it. He might have been for BLM.

Junior is Muslim too, and has evidently not had a cushy life (gets around $1000/mo. from his dad's estate). And in the article he said he's had some instances with cops, but that they had always treated him respectfully. He supports law enforcement (not a bad thing!). Again, just a black person's perspective based on his own experience.

So, bro Awareness, I've brought up several times about the apparent lack of empirical evidence to support the notion that there is widespread, systemic racism happening. We should be able to see at least some solid data to support this, right? That is, since we are being told it is such an overpowering, unbridled and manifestly apparent problem. I don't think you've specifically addressed this, have you?

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

Junior is Muslim too, and has evidently not had a cushy life (gets around $1000/mo. from his dad's estate). And in the article he said he's had some instances with cops, but that they had always treated him respectfully. He supports law enforcement (not a bad thing!). Again, just a black person's perspective based on his own experience.

So, bro Awareness, I've brought up several times about the apparent lack of empirical evidence to support the notion that there is widespread, systemic racism happening. We should be able to see at least some solid data to support this, right? That is, since we are being told it is such an overpowering, unbridled and manifestly apparent problem. I don't think you've specifically addressed this, have you?

What we never hear about is how to behave when stopped by the Police. I knew some "tough" white guys years back who ran their mouth off and got roughed up by the police. They learned respect the hard way. And the cops never left a mark.

Here is a little secret for all you "tough guys" out there: Even the police tend to treat you better when you treat them with respect.

This whole thread defines stereotypical prejudice and generalizations -- one guy dies in Minneapolis and the media wants you to believe blacks are murdered every day. Let's be honest here. If I suckered a cop, stole his weapon, tried to shoot it at him, and things went bad for me, would anyone protest in my name? No? Didn't think so.

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by Ohio

What we never hear about is how to behave when stopped by the Police. I knew some "tough" white guys years back who ran their mouth off and got roughed up by the police. They learned respect the hard way. And the cops never left a mark.

Here is a little secret for all you "tough guys" out there: Even the police tend to treat you better when you treat them with respect.

This whole thread defines stereotypical prejudice and generalizations -- one guy dies in Minneapolis and the media wants you to believe blacks are murdered every day. Let's be honest here. If I suckered a cop, stole his weapon, tried to shoot it at him, and things went bad for me, would anyone protest in my name? No? Didn't think so.

That's it! Sensitivity Training for perps - I'm all for it!!

I'm taking notes on such ideas for a possible movie. So many ludicrous things happening the last few months that would make wonderful fodder for a film. Things like the TP shortage and people driving around with masks on for instance!

Speaking of film and such, last night we saw an old episode of Blue Bloods, the NYPD cop show, and on it they had protesters with signs that read, "We Can't Breathe!" My wife couldn't believe it and thought someone must have photo-shopped it in there! (it was from 2014 I think)

[Weighingin]

Originally Posted by Ohio

Like Hidin Joe Biden says, "he ain't black enough?"

Hidin’ Biden, why didn’t I think of that, so obvious?

[awareness]

Here's an interesting article from the Minneapolis police union :

Four weeks after George Floyd's death, an embattled police union finally speaks out

https://www.cnn.com/2020/06/23/us/mi...tvu/index.html

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

Junior is Muslim too, and has evidently not had a cushy life (gets around $1000/mo. from his dad's estate). And in the article he said he's had some instances with cops, but that they had always treated him respectfully. He supports law enforcement (not a bad thing!). Again, just a black person's perspective based on his own experience.

So, bro Awareness, I've brought up several times about the apparent lack of empirical evidence to support the notion that there is widespread, systemic racism happening. We should be able to see at least some solid data to support this, right? That is, since we are being told it is such an overpowering, unbridled and manifestly apparent problem. I don't think you've specifically addressed this, have you?

Bro StG, what you call Adamic nature I call human nature. Calling it Adam nature is not gender neutral ; not unless you call it Adam/Eve nature.

And then there's the dark nature, and the light nature ; in other words black and white. Dark/black, is bad, light/white, is good.

Turns out, there is prejudice even within black families ; as lighter skin kids are favored over darker skinned children. I asked a dark skinned black friend why that is, and he said because his parents believed their lighter skinned kids where more likely to do better in life ; of course they would, they're being favored.

So is there systemic racism?

REVEALED: 10 large Silicon Valley tech firms employ ZERO Black women and the net worth of the region's 10 richest moguls - all white men - is $248B, staggering inequality study finds

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...udy-finds.html

And then read the article I presented from the police union, post # 93606.

I guess it's Adamic nature that makes us so idealistic to think that racism does not exist in American society and culture ; and including within the culture of our police departments.

White skin good. Black skin bad.

Light good. Dark bad. It's in your Bible ... that supports slavery.

Thank God for black lives matter.

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by awareness

Bro StG, what you call Adamic nature I call human nature. Calling it Adam nature is not gender neutral ; not unless you call it Adam/Eve nature.

And then there's the dark nature, and the light nature ; in other words black and white. Dark/black, is bad, light/white, is good.

Turns out, there is prejudice even within black families ; as lighter skin kids are favored over darker skinned children. I asked a dark skinned black friend why that is, and he said because his parents believed their lighter skinned kids where more likely to do better in life ; of course they would, they're being favored.

So is there systemic racism?

REVEALED: 10 large Silicon Valley tech firms employ ZERO Black women and the net worth of the region's 10 richest moguls - all white men - is $248B, staggering inequality study finds

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...udy-finds.html

And then read the article I presented from the police union, post # 93606.

I guess it's Adamic nature that makes us so idealistic to think that racism does not exist in American society and culture ; and including within the culture of our police departments.

White skin good. Black skin bad.

Light good. Dark bad. It's in your Bible ... that supports slavery.

Thank God for black lives matter.

Thank God he loves us all (even 4th quarter white males)!

Regarding the Minneapolis Police Union article - this just sounds like Adam . . . always deflecting blame somewhere else and never wanting to take full responsibility. Hallelujah we have a Savior who isn't like that - and we've been placed in Him!

Yes there is systemic racism in "Human Nature." The only place it isn't is in the one new man through Christ in us our hope of glory!

So what's the bottom-line (at least as far as I'm concerned)? Adam (aka human nature) is raging and the source he partook of (because of that woman God gave him) needs to be fully manifested before the Lord returns. This source God warned about, and all of its fruit, needs to be fully exposed. Then the awesome mercy, love and salvation in Christ will be fully revealed - and what a contrast, between the two sources, will be evident to all!

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

Thank God he loves us all (even 4th quarter white males)!

And that's grand. We should be like Him. Except many evangelicals buy into David Barton, that America was founded by white Christians -- it wasn't, the red man was already here -- and should continue white today (white nationalism).

Originally Posted by StG

Regarding the Minneapolis Police Union article - this just sounds like Adam . . . always deflecting blame somewhere else and never wanting to take full responsibility. Hallelujah we have a Savior who isn't like that - and we've been placed in Him!

Except it doesn't seem to be working. Adam nature still dominates.

Originally Posted by StG

Yes there is systemic racism in "Human Nature." The only place it isn't is in the one new man through Christ in us our hope of glory!

Even in the LC I saw the Old Man still plenty at play. The Old Man is tribalistic. And tribalism dominated in the LC, that was suppose to be the New Man.

Originally Posted by StG

So what's the bottom-line (at least as far as I'm concerned)? Adam (aka human nature) is raging and the source he partook of (because of that woman God gave him) needs to be fully manifested before the Lord returns. This source God warned about, and all of its fruit, needs to be fully exposed. Then the awesome mercy, love and salvation in Christ will be fully revealed - and what a contrast, between the two sources, will be evident to all!

Then I doubt Jesus will ever return.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by awareness

And that's grand. We should be like Him. Except many evangelicals buy into David Barton, that America was founded by white Christians -- it wasn't, the red man was already here -- and should continue white today (white nationalism).

Except it doesn't seem to be working. Adam nature still dominates.

Even in the LC I saw the Old Man still plenty at play. The Old Man is tribalistic. And tribalism dominated in the LC, that was suppose to be the New Man.

Then I doubt Jesus will ever return.

That field is littered with rabbit holes.

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Ohio

That field is littered with rabbit holes.

Indeed. Thanks for the heads up. I'm trying to avoid them. I'm not following Alice.

[awareness]

StG, you've presented data that proves cops don't kill blacks more than whites. My question concerning the data is, does it take into consideration the population differences.

Whites make up a little over 75%. Blacks make up a little over 13%. So if cops kill the same amount of whites and blacks, then the percentage means cops kill more blacks per capita than whites.

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by awareness

StG, you've presented data that proves cops don't kill blacks more than whites. My question concerning the data is, does it take into consideration the population differences.

Whites make up a little over 75%. Blacks make up a little over 13%. So if cops kill the same amount of whites and blacks, then the percentage means cops kill more blacks per capita than whites.

Good question, and the answer is yes, that study does take those things into account. It was done by five researchers from Michigan State U. If you go back and read the study and/or its synopsis, that is what I think it says clearly (see posts 1 & 2 of this thread).

This was not a fly-by-night study and it appeared in the National Academy of Sciences publication last year, and was peer reviewed. On account of some peer questions that were brought up they did amend a small part of their conclusion's wording, but the overall conclusion remained.

Listen, I am not saying there isn't police racism and racist acts, or that there is no evince of systemic racism that is widespread in many police departments. What I am saying is there does not appear to be the well-research empirical data studies showing that this is indeed the case. If it was as big a problem as we're being told, shouldn't this data be, at least, fairly apparent and available?

To answer my own question, no empirical data research has been made public which demonstrates widespread systemic racism in police departments - at least to my knowledge.

The data I've seen so far that tries to demonstrate systemic racism is cherry-picked from this source and that source, without telling the complete story. If you know of another peer reviewed research study on the subject that clearly shows systemic racism, please let me know - I am most open to see it! (I am serious, because it is possible such a definitive study is out there and I'm just ignorant of its existence . . .)

On another note (and this sort of addresses you earlier response in #144), we had awesome fellowship in the Thursday brother's breakfast this morning about NT writings concerning end times (Jude, 2nd Timothy & 2nd Peter). The list of things put forth in these epistles, concerning how people will be in the end times, really pegs what we see out there now. Adam & the bad tree are coming into full bloom! But we, as Christians with Christ in us, have a choice - we can choose to put off the old man with all his corruption, and put on the new man. If we don't put off the old man, we are living the lie of the old man, and are lying to one another.

It also occurs to me that one of the key things in these lists of Adamic characteristics is unforgiveness (2 Tim 3:2) - this is rampant right now as everyone is accusing everyone else it seems! Oh may we be looking to Him as our source, our rest, our peace and abundant supply in these times (as the apostles have exhorted us to do)!

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by awareness

StG, you've presented data that proves cops don't kill blacks more than whites. My question concerning the data is, does it take into consideration the population differences.

Whites make up a little over 75%. Blacks make up a little over 13%. So if cops kill the same amount of whites and blacks, then the percentage means cops kill more blacks per capita than whites.

Whites are barely over 50% of the population, when we consider all the minorities and the illegal aliens among the population.

Remember I am not "white," I am a northern Euro-American mutt.

Why is it that young black males -- 4% of our population -- commit 54% of our murders?

And nobody cares!!!

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

Good question, and the answer is yes, that study does take those things into account. It was done by five researchers from Michigan State U. If you go back and read the study and/or its synopsis, that is what I think it says clearly (see posts 1 & 2 of this thread).

This was not a fly-by-night study and it appeared in the National Academy of Sciences publication last year, and was peer reviewed. On account of some peer questions that were brought up they did amend a small part of their conclusion's wording, but the overall conclusion remained.

Listen, I am not saying there isn't police racism and racist acts, or that there is no evince of systemic racism that is widespread in many police departments. What I am saying is there does not appear to be the well-research empirical data studies showing that this is indeed the case. If it was as big a problem as we're being told, shouldn't this data be, at least, fairly apparent and available?

To answer my own question, no empirical data research has been made public which demonstrates widespread systemic racism in police departments - at least to my knowledge.

Does the study research localities? Take Ferguson, Missouri for example. Back in 2014 a white cop killed Michael Brown Jr., an 18-year-old black man. Protesters exploded. In the end Ferguson was found to be covered up with racist cops. And I understand the problem hasn't been fixed 6 yrs later. So I guess the nation wide data levels that out.

Okay, onto your second matter. Thanks for your through presentation on the data.

Originally Posted by StG

On another note (and this sort of addresses you earlier response in #144), we had awesome fellowship in the Thursday brother's breakfast this morning about NT writings concerning end times (Jude, 2nd Timothy & 2nd Peter). The list of things put forth in these epistles, concerning how people will be in the end times, really pegs what we see out there now.

I think the days of Hitler better fits.

Originally Posted by StG

Adam & the bad tree are coming into full bloom! But we, as Christians with Christ in us, have a choice - we can choose to put off the old man with all his corruption, and put on the new man.

I wish it was that easy. I've not ever seen that really happen, sorry to say.

Originally Posted by StG

If we don't put off the old man, we are living the lie of the old man, and are lying to one another.

What I've seen, even in the local church, is that those that claim to put off the old man, and that claim to put on the new man, turns out to be not that much different than nonbelievers, are lying, except for going to meetings.

Originally Posted by StG

It also occurs to me that one of the key things in these lists of Adamic characteristics is unforgiveness (2 Tim 3:2) - this is rampant right now as everyone is accusing everyone else it seems! Oh may we be looking to Him as our source, our rest, our peace and abundant supply in these times (as the apostles have exhorted us to do)!

If only we could confidently get at what the apostles exhorted. We can with confidence get at the apostle Paul, the founder of what became known as Christianity, by proselytizing the gentiles. But where do we hear from all 12 of the disciples?

But if you think the return of Jesus depends upon us, and how we arrange things here on earth, you're thinking like the Cargo Cult's. You seem to be a learned man. Look 'em up. In a nutshell, they, primitives, if we can call them that, believed if they did everything just right, the gods would deliver the cargo to them. They, the gods, didn't. We, American troops stationed on their island during the war, did.

In short, it's completely up to the more than capable hands of God. Thank God. Cuz if it depends on us fallen critters, it will fail every time. Rest in grace, and watch and pray.

Blessings brother.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by awareness

Does the study research localities? Take Ferguson, Missouri for example. Back in 2014 a white cop killed Michael Brown Jr., an 18-year-old black man. Protesters exploded. In the end Ferguson was found to be covered up with racist cops. And I understand the problem hasn't been fixed 6 yrs later. So I guess the nation wide data levels that out.

The Ferguson riots were based on a hoax. "Hands up. Don't Shoot." Never happened. That's what all the eye-witnesses said, but the media perpetuated a hoax.

The claims of racism in Ferguson are lies. The Obama / Holder DOJ / FBI investigated everything ... Thoroughly ... And found nothing.

Awareness, you and half the country have been duped by the media. No statistics support your claims.

Same thing with Trayvon Martin. Repeat in Baltimore. The Obama / Holder / Sharpton admin gave us nothing good, just race riots.

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Ohio

The Ferguson riots were based on a hoax. "Hands up. Don't Shoot." Never happened. That's what all the eye-witnesses said, but the media perpetuated a hoax.

The claims of racism in Ferguson are lies. The Obama / Holder DOJ / FBI investigated everything ... Thoroughly ... And found nothing.

Awareness, you and half the country have been duped by the media. No statistics support your claims.

Same thing with Trayvon Martin. Repeat in Baltimore. The Obama / Holder / Sharpton admin gave us nothing good, just race riots.

My son lives in Missouri, not far from Ferguson. My info comes mostly from him. Where's your superior info come from, Mooooooslim Obama hating, God?

[Ohio]

BLM/Antifa Violence Is Prelude for November

The left is going to riot in November no matter who wins the presidency. Leftists have established by precedent the premise that "mostly peaceful" rioting, arson, assault, and rampant property destruction are not only acceptable, but necessary in order to purge our nation of imagined original sin.

George Floyd was merely a stroke of luck for the left; if it were not for his murder, they would have needed to conjure up another excuse for the studied and deliberate anarchy we are experiencing today.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by awareness

My son lives in Missouri, not far from Ferguson. My info comes mostly from him. Where's your superior info come from, Mooooooslim Obama hating, God?

The News. Real journalism. Honest factual reporting.

Just not your Leftist brainwashing propaganda.


Btw, did you read what came out the other day? Obama himself and Hidin Biden directed General Flynn's Frame Job.

Strzok Notes Reveal Obama Directed Flynn Investigation, Biden Raised Logan Act Violation

[Sons to Glory!]

Please see my responses in blue.

Originally Posted by awareness

So I guess the nation wide data levels that out. Probably true. The point is widespread, systemic racism should show up in national data. doesn't mean there aren't pockets of it.

I think the days of Hitler better fits. I think it's all a precursor to what's coming. We likely ain't seen nothing yet!

I wish it was that easy. I've not ever seen that really happen, sorry to say. Not sure how to respond here. It's all part of the unseen world of faith, bro.

What I've seen, even in the local church, is that those that claim to put off the old man, and that claim to put on the new man, turns out to be not that much different than nonbelievers, are lying, except for going to meetings. Sorry that's has been your experience. Look, is there much difference these days between how worldly ones look and Christians? No, at least not in America. The American church is generally probably like the one in Corinth - all sorts of ungodly things abound. Why? The flesh is being manifested.


If only we could confidently get at what the apostles exhorted. We can with confidence get at the apostle Paul, the founder of what became known as Christianity, by proselytizing the gentiles. But where do we hear from all 12 of the disciples? Not sure what you're trying to say here . . .

But if you think the return of Jesus depends upon us, and how we arrange things here on earth, you're thinking like the Cargo Cult's. You seem to be a learned man. Look 'em up. In a nutshell, they, primitives, if we can call them that, believed if they did everything just right, the gods would deliver the cargo to them. They, the gods, didn't. We, American troops stationed on their island during the war, did. Yes, have heard of the Cargo Cult before (I think from someone on this forum - maybe you). I don't think I was conveying anything regarding "the return of Jesus depends on us," was I? However, there is that verse in 2 Peter 3:12 - "Looking for and hastening the coming day of God." And Jesus did say only the Father knows the specific time. But Christ will return for His bride - when will she be ready for Him? (Have you ever waiting for your wife to get herself all made up . . . ? )

In short, it's completely up to the more than capable hands of God. Thank God. Cuz if it depends on us fallen critters, it will fail every time. Rest in grace, and watch and pray. AMEN!

Blessings brother.

And blessings to you - the Lord IS with your spirit, grace IS with you!

[awareness]

WOW!

Minneapolis city council votes 12-0 to abolish its police department after death of George Floyd and will replace it with a 'department of community safety and violence prevention'

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ce-motion.html

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by awareness

WOW!

Minneapolis city council votes 12-0 to abolish its police department after death of George Floyd and will replace it with a 'department of community safety and violence prevention'

I heard that they proposed counseling sessions between victims and perpetrators.

I wondered how the heck they would ever catch the perpetrators?

They already practiced having no police in the new country of CHOP, formerly known as CHAZ. Several people got shot, but the CHOPistani warlords would not let the police into their newly formed country. CHOPistani residents are being terrorized by roving gangs at war with each other.

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Ohio

The News. Real journalism. Honest factual reporting.

That does not exist. All news sources are biased. It is you that are being brainwashed.

You remind me of one of my cousins, that announced at a family dinner table that Fox news is the only one that tells the truth, and all other news outlets lie.

He's the one that said God is judging America, because America is not keeping Gods law, according to the curse of Ham, and keeping blacks as slaves.

Should I consider you as in his camp?

And knock it off with your hateful politics.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by awareness

That does not exist. All news sources are biased. It is you that are being brainwashed.

You remind me of one of my cousins, that announced at a family dinner table that Fox news is the only one that tells the truth, and all other news outlets lie.

He's the one that said God is judging America, because America is not keeping Gods law, according to the curse of Ham, and keeping blacks as slaves.

Should I consider you as in his camp?

And knock it off will your hateful politics.

You got triggered by honest news? You reacted like a snowflake, bro. You really owe it to yourself to consider whether the "enemy" of fake news just might have some truth on their side.

You apparently are stuck in binary mode. A prisoner of 2 opinions. One side being fake, and the other being your cousin. (If you are portraying him honestly. ) Neither are good choices. Both are very bad extremes. These are definitely hateful politics, as you said.

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by awareness

That does not exist. All news sources are biased. It is you that are being brainwashed.

You remind me of one of my cousins, that announced at a family dinner table that Fox news is the only one that tells the truth, and all other news outlets lie.

He's the one that said God is judging America, because America is not keeping Gods law, according to the curse of Ham, and keeping blacks as slaves.

Should I consider you as in his camp?

And knock it off will your hateful politics.

What Adam does is point the finger at another and say: "Yer the big hypocrite!" When I tell my friends on the left that the right is being hypocritical, they're in full and enthusiastic agreement. But when I point out that the left is also guilty of the same thing, the head nodding slows way down. Same thing with my friends on the right. What I then usually hear (from either side) is, "Well yeah, but they're guilty of it much, much more!"

And I don't buy into the "God is judging America and the world" thing (like your cousin) anymore, because either Christ took all man's condemnation on the cross or He didn't. I think when God's judgement comes, we won't have any question about that!

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

And I don't buy into the "God is judging America and the world" thing (like your cousin) anymore, because either Christ took all man's condemnation on the cross or He didn't. I think when God's judgement comes, we won't have any question about that!

That drives me crazy too. Many so-called prophets, using OT scripture taken out of context, love to predict God's judgment on America.

My answer is simple. Why would God judge this country, when so many of His children are here praying for their nation? If God really was as spiteful as they think, then God would have wiped out every muslam and communist country long ago.

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Ohio

That drives me crazy too. Many so-called prophets, using OT scripture taken out of context, love to predict God's judgment on America.

My answer is simple. Why would God judge this country, when so many of His children are here praying for their nation? If God really was as spiteful as they think, then God would have wiped out every muslam and communist country long ago.

Could it be that God loves Muslims and communists? In the OT he often used enemy nations to judge the unfaithful.

He might even be using BLM to judge America right now and today.

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by awareness

Could it be that God loves Muslims and communists? In the OT he often used enemy nations to judge the unfaithful.

He might even be using BLM to judge America right now and today.

Yes, God loves Adam no matter where he has strayed - into being Muslims & Communists & Democrats & Republicans and you name it!

God uses everything, but right now I don't think He is judging (as per me and Ohio's earlier posts today). Therefore, He can certainly use BLM for good, but I don't think it's for judgement - He put that on His Son!

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by awareness

Could it be that God loves Muslims and communists? In the OT he often used enemy nations to judge the unfaithful.

He might even be using BLM to judge America right now and today.

Why would God use BLM to judge America for what the Democrats have done to the blacks for hundreds of years? That's like judging the Jews for what the high priests did to Jesus 2,000 years ago.

Many blacks and BLM supporters are now horrified by the anarchy taking place. Since MLK was homophobic, they expect his statues will be torn down too. When it comes to antifa anarchy, everything must be torn down.

Yes, God did use the nations to judge unfaithful and idolatrous Israel, and then judged those same nations. The story of the overnight destruction of Babylon (the moments right before were recorded by Daniel -- i.e. the "writing on the wall" story) was really incredible.

Of course God loves all men, including Muslims and communists, and one day we will be surprised to know how many of them secretly believed in the Lord while living in those oppressive regimes. China, which was once open to the gospel, has now dramatically changed under their dictator Xi.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

Yes, God loves Adam no matter where he has strayed - into being Muslims & Communists & Democrats & Republicans and you name it!

God uses everything, but right now I don't think He is judging (as per me and Ohio's earlier posts today). Therefore, He can certainly use BLM for good, but I don't think it's for judgement - He put that on His Son!

God does use "judgment" to humble mankind, with the intention to draw them to His Son. I'm sure you have seen this happen to those around you. Often He begins with His own house. Revelations makes it clear that some will never repent, and will prefer God's wrath to repentance and salvation. It's their choice. Free will does not always mean freedom.

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by Ohio

God does use "judgment" to humble mankind, with the intention to draw them to His Son. I'm sure you have seen this happen to those around you. Often He begins with His own house. Revelations makes it clear that some will never repent, and will prefer God's wrath to repentance and salvation. It's their choice. Free will does not always mean freedom.

Yes, certainly, but I'm wondering - is "judgment" the best word for that? Perhaps "dealing" or "shepherding" would be more accurate. Watayathimk?

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

Yes, certainly, but I'm wondering - is "judgment" the best word for that? Perhaps "dealing" or "shepherding" would be more accurate. Watayathink?

Well ... Peter uses that word. John speaks of "bowls of wrath."

Perhaps a Greek word study would help. Or maybe our thinking needs to change.

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by Ohio

Well ... Peter uses that word. John speaks of "bowls of wrath."

Perhaps a Greek word study would help. Or maybe our thinking needs to change.

The transliteration of that word in 1 Peter 4:17 is "krima" (Strongs G2917) which can be translated as judgement, verdict, condemnation or decision. I think maybe to be righteous, then God must judge or discipline His own household first. It would be like someone telling a neighbor that their kids shouldn't be throwing rocks through windows when his kids are doing the same thing. As believers, we freely accept His discipline now (or should) for our betterment.

This short article brings up Hebrews 12 with this verse, which talks about disciplining those He accepts as sons: What does 1 Peter 4:17 mean?

[Ohio]

I just took a walk and saw 2 BLM signs on my street. Kind of burns me up because the sign is so racist and hypocritical. Do non-black lives matter? Do the black unborn lives matter? No? I didn't think so!

I'd like to put up a sign, "All lives matter." Or perhaps, "All Lives Matter to the Lord Jesus." The only reason I won't is because of the violent backlash. My signs would justify their violence against me.

Even though I live in a suburb that leans conservative, none of my neighbors ever put up a Trump sign, and for the same reason. This is how the violent Left silences free speech.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by awareness

No. I would take a knee. Like Trump should have.

The "kneelers" have become the biggest cult in America.

BLM are demanding everyone to bow down to their demands.

I'm so glad one guy on this forum is here thinking for this cult, because none of them are.

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Ohio

My answer is simple. Why would God judge this country, when so many of His children are here praying for their nation? If God really was as spiteful as they think, then God would have wiped out every muslam and communist country long ago.

God might not be that involved. He may be just letting everything run its course without Him. Does God always have to micromanage everything?

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by awareness

God might not be that involved. He may be just letting everything run its course without Him. Does God always have to micromanage everything?

Well, yeah - Romans 8:28!

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

Well, yeah - Romans 8:28!

Cute StG. And a great verse. But "all things" there apply to those that love God, not to all things otherwise ... IMHO

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by awareness

Cute StG. And a great verse. But "all things" there apply to those that love God, not to all things otherwise ... IMHO

Well, you and me love God, right? So that's all that's important!

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by awareness

God might not be that involved. He may be just letting everything run its course without Him. Does God always have to micromanage everything?

He provides your next heartbeat and give you life. Is that too much micromanagement for you?

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Ohio

He provides your next heartbeat and give you life. Is that too much micromanagement for you?

A brother in his 30's at a Church of Christ was by every sign as healthy as a horse. He farmed, hunted, and play sports with his kids. No problem. But a examination revealed he had a bad heart valve. So a valve replacement was scheduled at Vanderbilt University hospital in Nashville.

The Sunday before his operation we all in Sunday School class formed a circle and prayed that the operation would go well. And, he was well known to all the Church's of Christ in the area and around 1500 members were praying for him.

In the end, he walked into the hospital with no symptoms, and came out with a toe tag. Our pastor held the funeral services, along with the pastor of the largest Church of Christ in the state of Kentucky. Thousands attended.

Afterward, our preacher fell into a depression. God had failed the brother, his family, the preachers, and all that was praying for him.

Is that God micromanaging? Should we blame Him for failing to do His job?

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by awareness

A brother in his 30's at a Church of Christ was by every sign as healthy as a horse. He farmed, hunted, and play sports with his kids. No problem. But a examination revealed he had a bad heart valve. So a valve replacement was scheduled at Vanderbilt University hospital in Nashville.

The Sunday before his operation we all in Sunday School class formed a circle and prayed that the operation would go well. And, he was well known to all the Church's of Christ in the area and around 1500 members were praying for him.

In the end, he walked into the hospital with no symptoms, and came out with a toe tag. Our pastor held the funeral services, along with the pastor of the largest Church of Christ in the state of Kentucky. Thousands attended.

Afterward, our preacher fell into a depression. God had failed the brother, his family, the preachers, and all that was praying for him.

Is that God micromanaging? Should we blame Him for failing to do His job?

Sad story. Of course, the kicker is that He delegated authority on this earth to man, then man gave it away to the devil. So now humans are swimming in the devil's cesspool. God, delegating free will to us, also respects that free will, yet He has an overwhelmingly grand, wonderful and loving purpose to fulfill on our behalf. This reminds me a little how federal, state & local governmental authorities all interact/don't interact well with each other . . . pretty hard to figure out oftentimes!

So this life is an "interesting" situation - we have to trust He knows what He is doing and is quite capable of doing it!

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by awareness

A brother in his 30's at a Church of Christ was by every sign as healthy as a horse. He farmed, hunted, and play sports with his kids. No problem. But a examination revealed he had a bad heart valve. So a valve replacement was scheduled at Vanderbilt University hospital in Nashville.

The Sunday before his operation we all in Sunday School class formed a circle and prayed that the operation would go well. And, he was well known to all the Church's of Christ in the area and around 1500 members were praying for him.

In the end, he walked into the hospital with no symptoms, and came out with a toe tag. Our pastor held the funeral services, along with the pastor of the largest Church of Christ in the state of Kentucky. Thousands attended.

Afterward, our preacher fell into a depression. God had failed the brother, his family, the preachers, and all that was praying for him.

Is that God micromanaging? Should we blame Him for failing to do His job?

Just another story about how God always get the blame for anything that is sad or tragic, but He never gets thanked ...

Being God must be the most miserable existence in the universe.

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Ohio

Just another story about how God always get the blame for anything that is sad or tragic, but He never gets thanked ...

Being God must be the most miserable existence in the universe.

I don't know. I go around all day thanking him .. even when just turning the water on ... but all kinds of little things ... like Brother Lawrence.

[awareness]

Is America becoming a police state?

https://thehill.com/opinion/civil-ri...n-police-state

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by awareness

Is America becoming a police state?

https://thehill.com/opinion/civil-ri...n-police-state

Answer is no. America is becoming lawless chaos, like the movie "Purge" every night of the week.

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Ohio

Answer is no. America is becoming lawless chaos, like the movie "Purge" every night of the week.

Did you even read the article, or is The Hill to liberal for you?

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by awareness

Did you even read the article, or is The Hill to liberal for you?

I read the article and the comments. Elias Yousif has no idea what he is talking about. Here is opening paragraph, where he states his case:

In repressive states across the world, I have often watched with deep dismay the response of foreign military and police forces towards political reform movements or popular mobilization efforts. In many cases, brutal tactics, sometimes made possible by U.S. equipment, are used to stifle civil society and to guard the regime in power from criticism, accountability and reform. Yet, even as a member of an organization that tracks and scrutinizes the policies and behaviors of U.S.-backed foreign security forces, I was ill-prepared for the surreal yet painfully familiar scenes that have taken place across the United States since the killing of George Floyd.

Yousif equivocates two events. Firstly, repressive regimes using brutal tactics on civil society outside the US. Secondly, burnings, lootings, and murders following the death of Floyd within the US. Then Yousif combines these events with the supposed reason that these regimes are protecting their power comparing it to the US.

I find zero evidence of this. There are no facts. All fake news propaganda to brainwash the Kool-Aid drinkers. These people are not peaceful protesters.

Yes, there are antifa / BLM anarchists attacking all of our major cities, but no one is stopping them. No one is protecting the citizens and properties within these cities. Have you heard their tragic stories? Probably not! Nearly every large city police force, from NYC to Seattle to Minneapolis to LA and beyond, is on STAND DOWN. The same thing happened to Baltimore several years ago when Freddie Gray died. The police have even abandoned their precincts to Antifa rioters.

Where are the brutal tactics? I have seen none! I have witnessed anarchists and agitators in many cities endlessly provoking police, pushing, spitting, throwing rocks and gasoline bombs, and the police can DO NOTHING. Since Floyd's death, over 1,000 police have been injured, blacks, minorities, and women included. The police all across the country are furious that they can no longer do their jobs protecting the innocent.

So this article is pure deception, with enough facts sprinkled in to deceive the reader. That's why I compare today's events to the movie "The Purge." But instead of an "annual holiday" as in the movie, this happens every night. Not oppression from the government, but from other citizens.

Awareness, for a guy who prides himself in being "aware," I am shocked at how easily this article fooled you.

[Ohio]

Here is a great, yet frightening, article that explains what is behind the present chaos today. If you don't understand this article, you will never understand what is happening to Western Civilization.

The Russian Origins of Black Neo-Marxism

“White” does not mean white. “White” in radical parlance means anyone of any race, creed, nationality, color, sex, or sexual preference who embraces capitalism, free markets, limited government, and American traditional culture and values.”This philosophical concept belongs to Noel Ignatiev, a white American of Russian origin, who is the ideological founding father of numerous radical black movements in America. The author of this concept was even lucky enough to see his best students -- Black Lives Matter (BLM) -- in action.

Research into the work of this former Harvard professor finally answered the question of why BLM proponents are so negative about the perfectly rational slogan “All Lives Matter.” The fact is that the “black” in the interpretation of Ignatiev is a revolutionary Marxist. All those who do not agree with the Left ideology should, according to Ignatiev, be eliminated.

The slogan “All Lives Matter” blurs the concept of the enemy and brings confusion to the minds of revolutionaries. That is why any mention of “All Lives Matter” (or its version in support of the police -- “Blue Lives Matter”) provokes such an acute reaction of the Left.

According to Ignatiev, “black” is not the level of pigment in the skin, but the level of adherence to the Marxist doctrine.

According to this definition, the great American free-market economist Thomas Sowell, although he has quite enough black pigment, is not “black.” The conservative justice of the U.S. Supreme Court Clarence Thomas is not “black” either. According to Ignatiev, many black Americans are not “black” just because they do not want to follow the Marxist dogma.

Noel Ignatiev (1940-2019) was born in America in a family of Jewish immigrants from Russia and was a third-generation communist. Moreover, he was not just a member of the Communist Party of the USA from the age of 17 but belonged to its most radical, ultra-left Marxist-Leninist wing. What was his most outstanding contribution to American philosophy? Here it is:

“Eventually white women can breed out, but my feeling is that if you are a white male, you should kill yourself now. If you are a thoughtful person, with a social consciousness who considers himself white, you will consider suicide.”

It was he, a convinced, uncompromising, and resolute communist, who in 1967 proposed the doctrine of “white privilege.” Not as a racial term, but as a somewhat modified Marxist term of the class struggle. The notorious “eradication of white privileges” is simply the standard Marxist wealth redistribution, expressed in newspeak.

[Continued in the link above.]

[Sons to Glory!]

Sounds like my dad may be right all along. Basically he thinks Marxists are behind many of these social unrest issues, especially in America (Marxism's hated enemy).

In looking at BLM founders, they all appear to be Marxists of one degree or another, as well as most of the groups they are closely associated with! See here: Discover the Networks

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

Sounds like my dad may be right all along. Basically he thinks Marxists are behind many of these social unrest issues, especially in America (Marxism's hated enemy).

In looking at BLM founders, they all appear to be Marxists of one degree or another, as well as most of the groups they are closely associated with! See here: Discover the Networks

Most blacks want a better life, a safer environment, good schools, opportunities, etc. -- the same things everyone else wants.

BLM, however, along with Antifa, Occupy Wall Street, and the race hustlers like Sharpton and Jackson, want to use the blacks for their own mischievous devices. The race hustlers merely want money, fame, and power. It is the others which have more sinister motives. They are the Marxist idealogs who hate free markets, Judeo-Christian values, and civil liberties. These ones are the fruit of liberal academia, consumed with white guilt, and sponsored by moneys from the likes of George Soros. Make no mistake, these anarchists are paid to destroy western civilization.

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Ohio

I read the article and the comments. Elias Yousif has no idea what he is talking about. Here is opening paragraph, where he states his case:
Yousif equivocates two events. Firstly, repressive regimes using brutal tactics on civil society outside the US. Secondly, burnings, lootings, and murders following the death of Floyd within the US. Then Yousif combines these events with the supposed reason that these regimes are protecting their power comparing it to the US.

I find zero evidence of this. There are no facts. All fake news propaganda to brainwash the Kool-Aid drinkers. These people are not peaceful protesters.

Yes, there are antifa / BLM anarchists attacking all of our major cities, but no one is stopping them. No one is protecting the citizens and properties within these cities. Have you heard their tragic stories? Probably not! Nearly every large city police force, from NYC to Seattle to Minneapolis to LA and beyond, is on STAND DOWN. The same thing happened to Baltimore several years ago when Freddie Gray died. The police have even abandoned their precincts to Antifa rioters.

Where are the brutal tactics? I have seen none! I have witnessed anarchists and agitators in many cities endlessly provoking police, pushing, spitting, throwing rocks and gasoline bombs, and the police can DO NOTHING. Since Floyd's death, over 1,000 police have been injured, blacks, minorities, and women included. The police all across the country are furious that they can no longer do their jobs protecting the innocent.

So this article is pure deception, with enough facts sprinkled in to deceive the reader. That's why I compare today's events to the movie "The Purge." But instead of an "annual holiday" as in the movie, this happens every night. Not oppression from the government, but from other citizens.

Awareness, for a guy who prides himself in being "aware," I am shocked at how easily this article fooled you.

Outside of your projection on me in the last line I'm thankful for your reply. I posted it for discussion.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by awareness

Outside of your projection on me in the last line I'm thankful for your reply. I posted it for discussion.

As our country descends into anarchy, with police forces in every major city either neutered or dismantled, Leftist media types with be still furthering the George Floyd cause by proclaiming the horrors of a fake police state.

It is they who are projecting. Because the only way a country can move into socialism (just ask Cuba and Venezuela) with the end of all income inequality and private property ownership is with a strong police state. Do you really think all of those rich liberal entertainers, sports figures, wall streeters, media moguls, techies, and academics will voluntarily give away all their money to poor folks like you and me?

You do know that things just don't happen like that? Don't you?

Isn't that at the core of the issue? How many antifa / blm / occupier rioters have you actually talked to? Have you ever studied what their goals really are? Don't you know that blacks kill thousands of their own for every single black killed by a white cop? Is this really about one black life named George Floyd?

Remember only communism can deliver on the promise of income equality. Sure capitalism is "bad" with both the rich and the poor, but socialism is supposedly "better" because we are all poor, except for those in power. Like I said, you should should go study how the wealthiest, most beautiful country in the Americas -- Venezuela -- became a s***hole country almost overnight following the same socialist handbook.

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by Ohio

You do know that things just don't happen like that? Don't you?

Isn't that at the core of the issue? How many antifa / blm / occupier rioters have you actually talked to? Have you ever studied what their goals really are? Don't you know that blacks kill thousands of their own for every single black killed by a white cop? Is this really about one black life named George Floyd?

In looking at that website (see my post yesterday) that shows the linkage between so many of these groups, it appears that most all of them have one thing in common - they all lean left, way left. It also seems to me that groups like this are just looking for the event, cause or flash-point to capitalize on and promote their real agenda, which is Marxism. I mean, these groups are out there, and it's naive to think these folks are sitting around doing nothing and not looking for a good opportunity to promote their extreme ideas.

Marxism and free market capitalism don't mix well at all. It's not like just having a left-leaning social program operating in our government. Marxism's intent is always to take down the other system, because only then can it operate.

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

In looking at that website (see my post yesterday) that shows the linkage between so many of these groups, it appears that most all of them have one thing in common - they all lean left, way left. It also seems to me that groups like this are just looking for the event, cause or flash-point to capitalize on and promote their real agenda, which is Marxism. I mean, these groups are out there, and it's naive to think these folks are sitting around doing nothing and not looking for a good opportunity to promote their extreme ideas.

Marxism and free market capitalism don't mix well at all. It's not like just having a left-leaning social program operating in our government. Marxism's intent is always to take down the other system, because only then can it operate.

Boobaloo Boys, are far right. And their broadcasted intent is to overthrow the government, start a race war, and civil war.

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by awareness

Boobaloo Boys, are far right. And their broadcasted intent is to overthrow the government, start a race war, and civil war.

Okay, but they don't seem to have everyone's attention right now - this BLM thing does. I don't want ANY extremist - right or left, doing their thing to subvert the country.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by awareness

Boobaloo Boys, are far right. And their broadcasted intent is to overthrow the government, start a race war, and civil war.

And who would donate a penny to them?

Take a look at the millions of $$$ flowing into BLM these days. They are using their brutal tactics to extort $$$ from even corporate America. In Atlanta they burned down the Wendy's right after they donated $500,000 to BLM. I guess that was not enough for the BLMafia.

Who even knows about Boobaloo Boys except for awareness?

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

Okay, but they don't seem to have everyone's attention right now - this BLM thing does. I don't want ANY extremist - right or left, doing their thing to subvert the country.

Zealots on both extremes, those certain they have the truth, are the problem, both right and left.

America is a complete mess. What happened to making America great, and winning so much we'd get tired of winning? I sure wish that were true.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by awareness

Zealots on both extremes, those certain they have the truth, are the problem, both right and left.

America is a complete mess. What happened to making America great, and winning so much we'd get tired of winning? I sure wish that were true.

No, you don't! You have been glamorizing every failure made in America, and never once acknowledged any of Trump's accomplishments. You have sided with every far left opinion since Obama took office a decade ago.

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by awareness

Zealots on both extremes, those certain they have the truth, are the problem, both right and left.

America is a complete mess. What happened to making America great, and winning so much we'd get tired of winning? I sure wish that were true.

Originally Posted by Ohio

No, you don't! You have been glamorizing every failure made in America, and never once acknowledged any of Trump's accomplishments. You have sided with every far left opinion since Obama took office a decade ago.

Now there's polarization for you! So glad there's none of that divisive stuff in Christ!

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Ohio

Who even knows about Boobaloo Boys except for awareness?

Stop pretending to be stupid.

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Ohio

No, you don't! You have been glamorizing every failure made in America, and never once acknowledged any of Trump's accomplishments. You have sided with every far left opinion since Obama took office a decade ago.

Stop projecting upon me.

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

Now there's polarization for you! So glad there's none of that divisive stuff in Christ!

Yes. It's the Old Man stuff to be tribal.

[awareness]

Attorney General William Barr admits unfair policing of African Americans is a 'widespread phenomenon' but rejects calls to defund the police and says 'black lives are protected' by cops

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...henomenon.html

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by awareness

Attorney General William Barr admits unfair policing of African Americans is a 'widespread phenomenon' but rejects calls to defund the police and says 'black lives are protected' by cops

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...henomenon.html

That is interesting! I still wonder if there will be some good data shared to support this thought (and not the cherry-picked data that keeps being referenced in the media)?

I agreed with what Barr had to say about BLM in this interview below:

Thomas explained to Barr that 'Black Lives Matter is a term that's being used, it's a group that pushes for civil rights of African Americans,' before asking: 'What's-- what's your view of Black Lives Matter? And are you willing to say Black Lives Matter?'

'Well, I make a distinction. I'd make a distinction between the organization, which I don't agree with. They have a broader agenda,' Barr responded.

'But in terms of the proposition that black lives matter, obviously black lives matter. I think all lives all human life is sacred and entitled to respect. And obviously, black lives matter.

'But I also think that it's being used now is sort of distorting the debate to some extent, because it's used really to refer exclusively to black lives that are lost to police misconduct, which are, you know, have been going down statistically.

'I also think [the phrase] is being used now – it is distorting the debate to some extent, because it is used really to refer almost exclusively to black lives that are lost to police misconduct,' he said.

'Then you compare it to 8,000 homicides in the African American community, those are black lives that matter, too. And those are lives that are protected by the police.'

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

That is interesting! I still wonder if there will be some good data shared to support this thought (and not the cherry-picked data that keeps being referenced in the media)?

I agreed with what Barr had to say about BLM in this interview below:

"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness."

But back then black lives mattered, as livestock, as slaves ... even by those that wrote those words ... all men weren't created equal, weren't endowed by their creator with unalienable rights, if they were black.

And after emancipation whites had a full plate and the plates of blacks were empty -- there was no 40 acres and a mule. Then came Black Code laws, and Jim Crow laws.

In other words, Blacks have been held down for way too long, and have not been considered equal, except in untrue words, like those found in the Declaration of Independence.

And blacks have obviously had enough of it. Thus, not that all lives matter, at the expense of black lives matter. It's about time that the Declaration of Independence actually be achieved today. That's why the black lives matter movement. Let's hope it works, and isn't negated by "full-plated" all lives matter.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by awareness

"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness."

But back then black lives mattered, as livestock, as slaves ... even by those that wrote those words ... all men weren't created equal, weren't endowed by their creator with unalienable rights, if they were black.

And after emancipation whites had a full plate and the plates of blacks were empty -- there was no 40 acres and a mule. Then came Black Code laws, and Jim Crow laws.

In other words, Blacks have been held down for way too long, and have not been considered equal, except in untrue words, like those found in the Declaration of Independence.

And blacks have obviously had enough of it. Thus, not that all lives matter, at the expense of black lives matter. It's about time that the Declaration of Independence actually be achieved today. That's why the black lives matter movement. Let's hope it works, and isn't negated by "full-plated" all lives matter.

This post is so racist and full of biased prejudice. So typical of today's progressives. No Republican, the party of Lincoln, ever owned a slave. You describe black life of old in the deep South run by Democrats, and today in the big cities run by Democrats. The endless hypocrisy characterized here has to be addressed.

Black lives do not matter to Black Lives Matter. The only black lives that matter to BLM are those black lives killed by white cops, a minuscule fraction of the black lives murdered today. If BLM cared anything about black lives they would do something about the incredible violence in Democratically run ghettoes. They would protest the unborn black lives slaughtered every day. Margaret Sanger started Planned Parenthood to exterminate all blacks, yet the Democrats guarantee unlimited funding for it every year.

Read some black scholars instead like Thomas Sowell. They will all cite facts and statistics that prove that the plight of black man is today worse than before the Civil Rights legislation of the 60's. Scholars point to Democratic policies which are perpetuated in the big cities which all but guarantee continued victim status, the lack of accountability, the incredible numbers of young blacks who all grow up in fatherless homes, the lack of emphasis in the home on education, and like factors for the plight of today's blacks. Graduation rates pre civil rates far exceed today. The number one reason for their poverty is the breakdown of the family. No amount of reparations will ever change this fact, rather will make it worse.

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by awareness

"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness."

But back then black lives mattered, as livestock, as slaves ... even by those that wrote those words ... all men weren't created equal, weren't endowed by their creator with unalienable rights, if they were black.

And after emancipation whites had a full plate and the plates of blacks were empty -- there was no 40 acres and a mule. Then came Black Code laws, and Jim Crow laws.

In other words, Blacks have been held down for way too long, and have not been considered equal, except in untrue words, like those found in the Declaration of Independence.

And blacks have obviously had enough of it. Thus, not that all lives matter, at the expense of black lives matter. It's about time that the Declaration of Independence actually be achieved today. That's why the black lives matter movement. Let's hope it works, and isn't negated by "full-plated" all lives matter.

So this is one side. But the framers of the US Constituition, from what I've read and understand, did want it to apply to ALL men. And this included Native Americans, blacks, everyone! But the south was deeply entrenched in a money-making machine that used blacks, so they didn't want it. It was a very delicate dance getting the southern block onboard. I don't want to put the whole blame on the south, but much of the problems with the Indians came out of the south, specifically Georgia (from my limited understanding of the history of the period at least) with the Creek, Cherokee and other "civilized tribes."

George Washington made a treaty with the civilized tribes and had very high hopes for them as equal citizens. He brought their leaders to DC and made a very big deal of how they were included in the grand American experiment. However, it was not to be, because the Feds didn't have the power, at that time, to enforce this treaty with the states. Settlers overran tribal lands and the states didn't enforce the Federal treaty. At the end of his 2nd term, Washington said that he thought his greatest failure (and said it was a personal heartbreak) was regarding how the tribes were handled.

So this shows how good intentions are not always able to be carried out in light of political realities.

Of course things were not good with owning people as slaves, but that was the time then. Christian abolitionists were key in finally bringing their freedom about. Yes, many political leaders had slaves back then. But that was the culture, just like it was in Roman times. This country paid an enormous and bitter price, in terms of hundreds of thousands of soldiers' lives, to correct that situation - and we won. But again, politics and power being what it was, resulted in the evil Jim Crowe laws situation.

It's been a long slog. Men are prejudice. We all have some of this in the flesh. It would be hard to be black and not have an over-sensitivity to all that's happened, which would now tend to cloud one's actions with bitterness, fear and a desire for vengeance. But this is Adam.

And consider half of the population - women - who didn't have the right to vote until 1920! We think we're so "civilized" and advanced, but Adam abounds. Forgiveness is needed, to quell the root of bitterness that is in some many, but Adam doesn't see the profit in forgiving. So what's to be done? God's answer is scrap it all and start over with humanity in His Son!

Originally Posted by Ohio

This post is so racist and full of biased prejudice. So typical of today's progressives. No Republican, the party of Lincoln, ever owned a slave. You describe black life of old in the deep South run by Democrats, and today in the big cities run by Democrats. The endless hypocrisy characterized here has to be addressed.

Black lives do not matter to Black Lives Matter. The only black lives that matter to BLM are those black lives killed by white cops, a minuscule fraction of the black lives murdered today. If BLM cared anything about black lives they would do something about the incredible violence in Democratically run ghettoes. They would protest the unborn black lives slaughtered every day. Margaret Sanger started Planned Parenthood to exterminate all blacks, yet the Democrats guarantee unlimited funding for it every year.

Read some black scholars instead like Thomas Sowell. They will all cite facts and statistics that prove that the plight of black man is today worse than before the Civil Rights legislation of the 60's. Scholars point to Democratic policies which are perpetuated in the big cities which all but guarantee continued victim status, the lack of accountability, the incredible numbers of young blacks who all grow up in fatherless homes, the lack of emphasis in the home on education, and like factors for the plight of today's blacks. Graduation rates pre civil rates far exceed today. The number one reason for their poverty is the breakdown of the family. No amount of reparations will ever change this fact, rather will make it worse.

Yes, I agree. BLM is racist. It focuses us on racial problems, to which there is no end (as far as man's reactions and efforts are concerned). Focusing on race might seem like a good thing, and we may see some apparent short-term results, but it will just cause many more problems eventually. It will not unite us, but rather divide us more. Many will be even more resentful whether they're white or black. And if the extreme notion of reparations bears fruit, it will likewise not help in the long run. In fact, it would hurt those who receive it, and not heal their bitterness. Was slavery stupid? Yes, but you really can't fix stupid Adam, just kill him off! Again, that's God's answer - put mankind in Christ as the one new man.

I listen to and read a number of black speakers. (I really enjoy Thomas Sowell - I'm still slowly chewing on things of his I read 15 years ago . . . very wise and insightful) I would encourage Awareness to read and listen to some of these wise black folks, like Sowell, Larry Elders, etc. They have a black perspective and make some pretty good sense!

And I too, have become more aware that there are scads of blacks being killed all the time, but it is only when it happens at the hands of police that anyone seems to notice and get all upset and righteous about it. As pointed out before, BLM is a political entity started by three very liberal (spelled M-A-R-X-I-S-T") women, with a hidden agenda. So this whole BLM thing is designed to play on white guilt, and I think it aims to not just reform, but destroy this country. May God have mercy and save us from ourselves!

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Ohio

This post is so racist and full of biased prejudice. So typical of today's progressives. No Republican, the party of Lincoln, ever owned a slave. You describe black life of old in the deep South run by Democrats, and today in the big cities run by Democrats. The endless hypocrisy characterized here has to be addressed.

Black lives do not matter to Black Lives Matter. The only black lives that matter to BLM are those black lives killed by white cops, a minuscule fraction of the black lives murdered today. If BLM cared anything about black lives they would do something about the incredible violence in Democratically run ghettoes. They would protest the unborn black lives slaughtered every day. Margaret Sanger started Planned Parenthood to exterminate all blacks, yet the Democrats guarantee unlimited funding for it every year.

Read some black scholars instead like Thomas Sowell. They will all cite facts and statistics that prove that the plight of black man is today worse than before the Civil Rights legislation of the 60's. Scholars point to Democratic policies which are perpetuated in the big cities which all but guarantee continued victim status, the lack of accountability, the incredible numbers of young blacks who all grow up in fatherless homes, the lack of emphasis in the home on education, and like factors for the plight of today's blacks. Graduation rates pre civil rates far exceed today. The number one reason for their poverty is the breakdown of the family. No amount of reparations will ever change this fact, rather will make it worse.

I wrote that post as an attempt to explain BLM. I did not wax political. But you can't help yourself. You can only see in terms of black and white ; and white is good, and black is bad.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by awareness

I wrote that post as an attempt to explain BLM. I did not wax political. But you can't help yourself. You can only see in terms of black and white ; and white is good, and black is bad.

Not true at all. Your post had 3 paragraphs of history and 2 paragraphs of incendiary politics. Too bad you just don't get it.

Originally Posted by awareness

"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness."

But back then black lives mattered, as livestock, as slaves ... even by those that wrote those words ... all men weren't created equal, weren't endowed by their creator with unalienable rights, if they were black.

And after emancipation whites had a full plate and the plates of blacks were empty -- there was no 40 acres and a mule. Then came Black Code laws, and Jim Crow laws.

In other words, Blacks have been held down for way too long, and have not been considered equal, except in untrue words, like those found in the Declaration of Independence.

And blacks have obviously had enough of it. Thus, not that all lives matter, at the expense of black lives matter. It's about time that the Declaration of Independence actually be achieved today. That's why the black lives matter movement. Let's hope it works, and isn't negated by "full-plated" all lives matter.

No one is holding down the blacks. They have endless social programs and educational opportunities to take advantage of. With Affirmative Action they have more perks at their disposal than whites. There are lots of people in America who still live in poverty, (is it really poverty when you have designer shoes, a smart phone, and a car?) but you conveniently forget Appalachia and the like, even those in your own state. All races have equal opportunity unde the Constitution. And I would say honestly, if there is inequality of justice in America, it is not between black and white, but between rich and poor. Just ask O.J. Simpson, who got away with double murder.

There is an abundance of information now available that proves that BLM cares nothing for actual black lives. Look at the facts, my friend. They only care about black lives killed by white police. Though horribly tragic, as in the case of George Floyd, it is no more common than white men killed by black police. If they really cared for black lives, they would care for all black lives. Obviously the evidence proves that their real agenda is anti-police, anti-law-and-order. You need to examine those leading and funding this rotten organization.

I would hope that the voices of the real victims, those in the communities burned and trashed by anything but peaceful protesters, would rise up and fight back against these riotous thugs. These silent, hard-working folks of all colors are the ones suffering. They did nothing wrong, but have lost everything. Dozens have been killed too, and where's the outrage for them? Only Fox News will carry their stories. But you dare not watch that. Read about the "Ferguson Effect." It takes decades for these trashed communities to be restored.

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Ohio

Not true at all. Your post had 3 paragraphs of history and 2 paragraphs of incendiary politics. Too bad you just don't get it.


No one is holding down the blacks. They have endless social programs and educational opportunities to take advantage of. With Affirmative Action they have more perks at their disposal than whites. There are lots of people in America who still live in poverty, (is it really poverty when you have designer shoes, a smart phone, and a car?) but you conveniently forget Appalachia and the like, even those in your own state. All races have equal opportunity unde the Constitution. And I would say honestly, if there is inequality of justice in America, it is not between black and white, but between rich and poor. Just ask O.J. Simpson, who got away with double murder.

There is an abundance of information now available that proves that BLM cares nothing for actual black lives. Look at the facts, my friend. They only care about black lives killed by white police. Though horribly tragic, as in the case of George Floyd, it is no more common than white men killed by black police. If they really cared for black lives, they would care for all black lives. Obviously the evidence proves that their real agenda is anti-police, anti-law-and-order. You need to examine those leading and funding this rotten organization.

I would hope that the voices of the real victims, those in the communities burned and trashed by anything but peaceful protesters, would rise up and fight back against these riotous thugs. These silent, hard-working folks of all colors are the ones suffering. They did nothing wrong, but have lost everything. Dozens have been killed too, and where's the outrage for them? Only Fox News will carry their stories. But you dare not watch that. Read about the "Ferguson Effect." It takes decades for these trashed communities to be restored.

Again, I posted that in an attempt to explain BLM, and I did not wax political. You're seeing things that aren't there..

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by awareness

Again, I posted that in an attempt to explain BLM, and I did not wax political. You're seeing things that aren't there..

Then how do you explain this quote? If it's not political, then it's extremely deceptive.

In other words, Blacks have been held down for way too long, and have not been considered equal, except in untrue words, like those found in the Declaration of Independence.

And blacks have obviously had enough of it. Thus, not that all lives matter, at the expense of black lives matter. It's about time that the Declaration of Independence actually be achieved today. That's why the black lives matter movement. Let's hope it works, and isn't negated by "full-plated" all lives matter.

And why don't you respond to any of these basic questions:

1. Why are BLM rioters also killing blacks?
2. Why are so many BLM rioters white?
3. Why do the blacks in these ravaged communities reject BLM rioters?
4. Who has held the blacks down since the 60's?

There is no systemic racism in America. Blacks can progress in every career path available. Billionaires Oprah and Johnson own their own networks. Jordan owns a basketball franchise. Black artists dominate music, black athletes dominate sports, and blacks are prominent lawyers, judges, professors, businessmen, politicians, etc. I would say that they outnumber whites percentagewise in many fields.

[Ohio]

Thomas Sowell: ‘Systemic Racism’ Has ‘No Meaning’

Conservative African American economist Thomas Sowell says that the term “systemic racism,” which is central to the Black Lives Matter movement, has “no meaning.”

You hear this phrase, ‘systemic racism’ [or] ‘systemic oppression’,” host Mark Levin told Sowell. “You hear it on our college campuses. You hear it from very wealthy and fabulously famous sports stars. What does that mean? And whatever it means, is it true?”

“It really has no meaning that can be specified and tested in the way that one tests hypotheses,” answered Sowell, who added that the currency of the phrase reminds him of the “propaganda tactics” of Nazi Germany, where Sowell claimed that if a lie was “repeated long enough and loud enough” it would be widely believed.

In his 2005 book Affirmative Action Around the World: An Empirical Study, Sowell observed: “Despite sweeping claims made for affirmative action programs, an examination of their actual consequences makes it hard to support those claims, or even to say that these programs have been beneficial on net balance — unless one is prepared to say that any amount of social redress, however small, is worth any amount of costs and dangers, however large.”

In an interview with the Wall Street Journal in 2017, Sowell described President Donald Trump as “the first Republican who’s made any serious attempt to get the black vote by addressing problems that affect most blacks who are trying to do the right thing—such as education, which is such low-hanging fruit.”

On Life, Liberty, and Levin, Sowell added: “If the election goes to [Joe] Biden, there’s a good chance that the Democrats will control [Congress] and considering the kinds of things that they’re proposing, that could well be the point of no return for this country.”

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Ohio

Then how do you explain this quote? If it's not political, then it's extremely deceptive.
And why don't you respond to any of these basic questions:

1. Why are BLM rioters also killing blacks?
2. Why are so many BLM rioters white?
3. Why do the blacks in these ravaged communities reject BLM rioters?
4. Who has held the blacks down since the 60's?

There is no systemic racism in America. Blacks can progress in every career path available. Billionaires Oprah and Johnson own their own networks. Jordan owns a basketball franchise. Black artists dominate music, black athletes dominate sports, and blacks are prominent lawyers, judges, professors, businessmen, politicians, etc. I would say that they outnumber whites percentagewise in many fields.

Your political biases are affecting your vision. You're seeing what you want to see.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by awareness

Your political biases are affecting your vision. You're seeing what you want to see.

I was not waxing political at all. I have been carefully reading the accounts from both sides, and merely posed some pertinent questions for your consideration.

I had thought you were a careful consumer of the news, and did not want you to be influenced by the constant propaganda coming from the media.

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Ohio

I was not waxing political at all. I have been carefully reading the accounts from both sides, and merely posed some pertinent questions for your consideration.

I had thought you were a careful consumer of the news, and did not want you to be influenced by the constant propaganda coming from the media.

Thanks for that. I get my constant propaganda not from TV, but from many different news sources on the web. And the web is pretty much constant propaganda. But it's all I have. I learned way back before shock and awe in Iraq, when all the news sources (except for one), including Fox, got behind Dubya's lies, that none of them can be trusted. But it's all we little consumers have. Actual undoctored video, like from cell phones, can be most trusted.

Let's get back to topic. StG rescue us.

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by awareness

Let's get back to topic. StG rescue us.

Well here's my attempt!

My wife and I were discussing some of this while in the car yesterday. I made the point that if BLM and the media really cared about black lives (and not a political agenda), then they would be concerned about the much larger number of blacks put to death at the hands of those besides police. She questions some of the statistics I used - good for her! This caused me to look-up things afresh.

I found death statistics on the FBI website and another website. These sites said that black on black killings in the US were 2,570 (2016), while police killings of blacks average around 220 per year. That is 11 times the amount. Why is so little attention focused on the causes of the 2,570 deaths, and so much on the 220? (BTW - Of those 220, around 17% are technically unarmed. So we're really looking at about 30 of these unarmed instances a year, and those must be looked at case by case.)

FBI Homicide Data Chart 2016

Police Killings by Race Graph

And if you're really interested in reading various reports on the subject SEE HERE

In looking at the summaries and abstracts of some of these reports, it seems apparent to me that the media is trying to focus us on a false narrative that there truly is "systemic racism" and overwhelming police brutality against blacks. If this was true, then one would think it would be very obvious and therefore easy to demonstrate with solid data. This does not appear to be the case at all. (of course, as has been said over & over, there certainly are incidences of police racism and racist brutality, but nowhere like what we are being lead to believe)

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by awareness

Thanks for that. I get my constant propaganda not from TV, but from many different news sources on the web. And the web is pretty much constant propaganda. But it's all I have. I learned way back before shock and awe in Iraq, when all the news sources (except for one), including Fox, got behind Dubya's lies, that none of them can be trusted. But it's all we little consumers have. Actual undoctored video, like from cell phones, can be most trusted.

And all of your Democratic heroes, including your lovely Hilary and flip-flop Kerry got behind these "lies" too.

And was it really a "lie" when we had overwhelming evidence that Saddam had gassed the Kurds? Chemical Weapons are WMD's last I read, and so are Biological Weapons, like the Novel Corona Virus China unleashed on us.

And while we are revising history, I think we all should blame you for all the problems that LSM has inflicted upon us. Weren't you there years before us? Why did you perpetuate the lies? Why didn't you see thru the errors and warn us all? It's all your fault!

[Ohio]

BLM Goal: Reparations for all 41 million Blacks

• Mayors back reparations that could cost $6.2 quadrillion, or $151M per descendant
• Cost almost 100x more than Green New Deal
• Cost to every American $19 million

I contend that no Republicans should have to pay since none of us ever owned a slave. The cost must be borne by all Democrats.

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Ohio

BLM Goal: Reparations for all 41 million Blacks

• Mayors back reparations that could cost $6.2 quadrillion, or $151M per descendant
• Cost almost 100x more than Green New Deal
• Cost to every American $19 million

I contend that no Republicans should have to pay since none of us ever owned a slave. The cost must be borne by all Democrats.

Oh knock it off with your political bigotry.

The Republicans and Slavery.
https://www.nytimes.com/1860/11/05/a...d-slavery.html

And :
The Founding Fathers Tried to Warn Us About the Threat From a Two-Party System
https://ritholtz.com/2011/07/foundin...-party-system/

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by awareness

Oh knock it off with your political bigotry.

The Republicans and Slavery.
https://www.nytimes.com/1860/11/05/a...d-slavery.html

And :
The Founding Fathers Tried to Warn Us About the Threat From a Two-Party System
https://ritholtz.com/2011/07/foundin...-party-system/

Article says nothing about Republicans owning slaves. All those joining the Republican Party were AGAINST SLAVERY. It has always been that way. We won that fight long ago.

We are still fighting the battle to free the UNBORN. The Democrats, like those of old, always resist, and care nothing for the God given liberties of all mankind, the most basic of which is the right to life.

Yes, Two Party Systems are nasty, but Multi-Party Systems like Israel's are just as nasty. Democrats like you, however, prefer the Single Party System, which is much less nasty. Think about how "nice" the Communist Party System is -- unanimous elections, no dissenting media, full "cooperation" by all of its citizens. It solves all the problems of a free market society.


And stay on topic!

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Ohio

Article says nothing about Republicans owning slaves.

You missed the very first line in the article, and I quote :

"Senator SEWARD, in his speech on Friday night, declared the whole aim and duty of the Republican Party to be, to leave Slavery just where it is.."

Originally Posted by Ohiio

All those joining the Republican Party were AGAINST SLAVERY. It has always been that way. We won that fight long ago.

Mitch McConnell's ancestors owned slaves.

Jefferson was in the Democratic-Republican party. I suppose according to you, the democratic side owned slaves, and the republican side didn't. We could do without your political propaganda.

Besides, it was you that wrote : "Every society labels opponents "left and right." But you are a smart guy. Do you really think that all of these "lefts" and "rights" since the stone age can be lumped together?"

And the pubbies of old aren't the pubbies today. Today they are the Trump party, and Donald got his racism from his father, but the pubbies aren't against that.

Originally Posted by Ohio

We are still fighting the battle to free the UNBORN. The Democrats, like those of old, always resist, and care nothing for the God given liberties of all mankind, the most basic of which is the right to life.

Even the pubbie Supremeies voted against restricting abortion, just recently. And now the FDA permits that women can order the abortion pill online. So, sorry to say, you're just kicking against the pricks. Give it up. You lost.

Originally Posted by Ohio

Democrats like you,. . .

You know damn well that I'm not a democrat. That's just a box you for some reason need to put me in. Maybe anyone that doesn't agree with you you consider to be a democrat. It fits your political bigotry.

[Sons to Glory!]

Okay, I confess, I have totally lost control of this conversation! (not that someone who starts a thread really has much control anyways . . .)

Awareness, you asked me a question and I responded in my post #212 (right before you and Ohio went at it again). Do you care to comment on the things presented there?

BTW - My wife, who I mentioned in that post, is a VERY* analytical person. She told me this morning that she also looked up black homicide data and police related black deaths, and wondered about the same thing I mentioned in that post.

*she is totally fearless in asking ANYONE what the source of their information is! (I keep telling her that a "good wife" wouldn't always question the data her husband presents to her, but so far she hasn't bought into that concept . . .. )

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

Okay, I confess, I have totally lost control of this conversation! (not that someone who starts a thread really has much control anyways . . .)

Awareness, you asked me a question and I responded in my post #212 (right before you and Ohio went at it again). Do you care to comment on the things presented there?

BTW - My wife, who I mentioned in that post, is a VERY* analytical person. She told me this morning that she also looked up black homicide data and police related black deaths, and wondered about the same thing I mentioned in that post.

*she is totally fearless in asking ANYONE what the source of their information is! (I keep telling her that a "good wife" wouldn't always question the data her husband presents to her, but so far she hasn't bought into that concept . . .. )

Perhaps your wife could have a talk with our moderator awareness.
Unfortunately he has little use for actual facts and stats.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by awareness

You missed the very first line in the article, and I quote : "Senator SEWARD, in his speech on Friday night, declared the whole aim and duty of the Republican Party to be, to leave Slavery just where it is.."

Mitch McConnell's ancestors owned slaves.

Jefferson was in the Democratic-Republican party. I suppose according to you, the democratic side owned slaves, and the republican side didn't. We could do without your political propaganda.

Besides, it was you that wrote : "Every society labels opponents "left and right." But you are a smart guy. Do you really think that all of these "lefts" and "rights" since the stone age can be lumped together?"

And the pubbies of old aren't the pubbies today. Today they are the Trump party, and Donald got his racism from his father, but the pubbies aren't against that.

Even the pubbie Supremeies voted against restricting abortion, just recently. And now the FDA permits that women can order the abortion pill online. So, sorry to say, you're just kicking against the pricks. Give it up. You lost.

You know damn well that I'm not a democrat. That's just a box you for some reason need to put me in. Maybe anyone that doesn't agree with you you consider to be a democrat. It fits your political bigotry.

Your quote from the crooked NYT is deceptive. Here is an opening paragraph from wikipedia:

William Henry Seward (May 16, 1801 – October 10, 1872) was United States Secretary of State from 1861 to 1869, and earlier served as governor of New York and as a United States Senator. A determined opponent of the spread of slavery in the years leading up to the American Civil War, he was a prominent figure in the Republican Party in its formative years, and was praised for his work on behalf of the Union as Secretary of State during the Civil War.

Who cares about McConnell's relatives. Would you like to be condemned for the sins of your ancestors? How about just the sins of your parents? No? I didn't think so. Me neither.

The Democratic/Republican Party of Madison and Jefferson had nothing to do with the GOP Republican Party of Lincoln founded in 1854. Both Madison and Jefferson were dead by then.

And today's Socialist/Democrat Party has nothing to do with the Democratic Party of Kennedy or Carter. What's the point about the SCOTUS decision? And there are only a handful of SCOTUS appointees who have not moved to the Left over time. It's a shame, but it does not represent Republican values. Those guys answer to no one, not even the Constitution, and especially not to Republican voters.

You are definitely not a Democrat. You tend to espouse the views of AOC and the Socialist Squad. Lots of political bigotry there for you.

[awareness]

I guess that whites getting killed by cops dismisses blacks being killed ... according to Trump.

'White people are being killed too, MORE white people!' Trump’s response when asked why black Americans are still being killed by cops

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...lled-cops.html

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Ohio

You are definitely not a Democrat. You tend to espouse the views of AOC and the Socialist Squad. Lots of political bigotry there for you.

Oh yeah, me and AOC -- a hot youngin -- and the Socialist squad. That's me alright. Ya got me pegged.

And I tire of all this. Since you're hard right, you need a hard left to tangle with. And that's not me. I'm the wrong guy. Go debate AOC on twitter.

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by awareness

I guess that whites getting killed by cops dismisses blacks being killed ... according to Trump.

'White people are being killed too, MORE white people!' Trump’s response when asked why black Americans are still being killed by cops

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...lled-cops.html

And here's the bullet-points at the top of that article:

• President Donald Trump brushed off a question about why more black people are dying at the hands of police, arguing 'so are white people'
• 'So are white people. So are white people. What a terrible question to ask. So are white people,' he told CBS News. 'More people, by the way. More white people'
• While black Americans account for less than 13 per cent of the U.S. population, they are killed by police at more than twice the rate of white Americans
• Trump called the killing of George Floyd 'terrible'

What's the point?!
Everything said by both Trump and the journalist here are true. The one statistic that gets left out is - OF COURSE - a much larger percentage of violent crimes are committed by black folk. So what does that tell you? (I guess maybe, perhaps, sorta kinda there are far more opportunities for police to use strong force against violent crime committing blacks . . . sorta . . . kinda . . .)

DUH! There, am I sounding like you guys?

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by awareness

I guess that whites getting killed by cops dismisses blacks being killed ... according to Trump.

True. Trump pays much more attention to actual facts and science than any in the media.

The Progressive Left only pays lip service to facts and science with unending propaganda in the media. That's why I find it so funny every time I read your tagline -- Cults: My brain will always be there for you. Thinking. So you don't have to.

If you would actually use your brain to study the BLM movement, their leaders, their agenda, their goals, their lies, etc. then you would understand it as the most violent and dangerous cult in all of America.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by awareness

Oh yeah, me and AOC -- a hot youngin -- and the Socialist squad. That's me alright. Ya got me pegged.

And I tire of all this. Since you're hard right, you need a hard left to tangle with. And that's not me. I'm the wrong guy. Go debate AOC on twitter.

I'm not "hard right." I have the same values as the Kennedy Democrats I grew up with 50+ years ago.

It is your people that have moved LEFT. Far Left. Compare the value system. Use your brain to research and study actual facts of history.

Perhaps Prevagen would help you. I just saw a great commercial on TV about it.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

What's the point?!

Someone please explain to me how all of these BLACK people can be killed by those protesting the death of George Floyd. Here's just two articles:

The 17 people who have died in the protests and riots so far

The Black Lives Matter Effect is Killing Black Children

[awareness]

Good post bro StG.

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

Well here's my attempt!

My wife and I were discussing some of this while in the car yesterday. I made the point that if BLM and the media really cared about black lives (and not a political agenda), then they would be concerned about the much larger number of blacks put to death at the hands of those besides police. She questions some of the statistics I used - good for her! This caused me to look-up things afresh.

I found death statistics on the FBI website and another website. These sites said that black on black killings in the US were 2,570 (2016), while police killings of blacks average around 220 per year. That is 11 times the amount. Why is so little attention focused on the causes of the 2,570 deaths, and so much on the 220? (BTW - Of those 220, around 17% are technically unarmed. So we're really looking at about 30 of these unarmed instances a year, and those must be looked at case by case.)

FBI Homicide Data Chart 2016

Police Killings by Race Graph

And if you're really interested in reading various reports on the subject SEE HERE

In looking at the summaries and abstracts of some of these reports, it seems apparent to me that the media is trying to focus us on a false narrative that there truly is "systemic racism" and overwhelming police brutality against blacks. If this was true, then one would think it would be very obvious and therefore easy to demonstrate with solid data. This does not appear to be the case at all. (of course, as has been said over & over, there certainly are incidences of police racism and racist brutality, but nowhere like what we are being lead to believe)

Again, the actual data is not driving their narrative. It's perception.

And what about all the black on black killings? From what I've seen it's a result of gang against gang. And why gangs? I present that it's a need to belong, in their communities where there's lots of disenfranchisement, and no sense of belonging.

And that opens another can of worms, of questions and reasons why that is.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by awareness

Good post bro StG.


Again, the actual data is not driving their narrative. It's perception.

And what about all the black on black killings? From what I've seen it's a result of gang against gang. And why gangs? I present that it's a need to belong, in their communities where there's lots of disenfranchisement, and no sense of belonging.

And that opens another can of worms, of questions and reasons why that is.

Read the black scholar Dr. Thomas Sowell or others. He will tell you that Democratic policies controlling the inner cities have destroyed the Black family structure since Civil Rights Legislation was passed. We now have multi-generational black homes that are fatherless. The destruction of the family, with no father figure in the homes creates disenfranchisement with no sense of belonging to a family unit. Sowell has evidence to prove that the black culture, prior to the 60's, had a much better family structure, with less crime, no gangs, better educational success, less violence, less black-on-black crime. The victim status, blame-shifting, and lack of ownership perpetuates their dysfunctional culture.

[Ohio]

This is for awareness our cult expert, an incredible insight into the cultic practices of the BLM movement . . .

Black Lives Matter is a full-blown CULT, and its supporters are mindless FANATICS

Every guilt-ridden white person out there who has joined up with the Black Lives Matter (BLM) movement is convinced that he or she has taken the moral high ground while everyone else is still mired in racism. But as pointed out by social justice theorist James Lindsey, BLM adherents are actually cult members who fail to recognize how they have been co-opted into joining a newfangled religion, which we would contend is marked by racism against whites and black supremacy.

According to Lindsey, there are three stages to the cult-joining process: initiation, indoctrination, and reprogramming. He also delves into the mentality of cult members, the deprogramming process, and how to leave a cult – which is helpful information for those who eventually come to the realization that they have been duped.

During the initiation phase, potential cult members are baited through exploitation of emotional vulnerability. In the case of BLM, this might take the form of asking the cult initiates, “Did you know you’re complicit in racist systems?” the purpose being to shame these initiates into believing that they need guidance on how to change.

Systemic racism, of course, is a completely made-up concept that serves the interest of denigrating whiteness while elevating blackness. And it is precisely the emotional vulnerability that is being used to exploit masses of mostly white people into hating themselves, as well as others like them with similar skin tones.

Continued here.

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Ohio

This is for awareness our cult expert, an incredible insight into the cultic practices of the BLM movement . . .

Black Lives Matter is a full-blown CULT, and its supporters are mindless FANATICS

Every guilt-ridden white person out there who has joined up with the Black Lives Matter (BLM) movement is convinced that he or she has taken the moral high ground while everyone else is still mired in racism. But as pointed out by social justice theorist James Lindsey, BLM adherents are actually cult members who fail to recognize how they have been co-opted into joining a newfangled religion, which we would contend is marked by racism against whites and black supremacy.

According to Lindsey, there are three stages to the cult-joining process: initiation, indoctrination, and reprogramming. He also delves into the mentality of cult members, the deprogramming process, and how to leave a cult – which is helpful information for those who eventually come to the realization that they have been duped.

During the initiation phase, potential cult members are baited through exploitation of emotional vulnerability. In the case of BLM, this might take the form of asking the cult initiates, “Did you know you’re complicit in racist systems?” the purpose being to shame these initiates into believing that they need guidance on how to change.

Systemic racism, of course, is a completely made-up concept that serves the interest of denigrating whiteness while elevating blackness. And it is precisely the emotional vulnerability that is being used to exploit masses of mostly white people into hating themselves, as well as others like them with similar skin tones.

Continued here.

As the cult expert on this site, I busted out laughing. James Lindsey is a academic, a learned man, which gives him out-sized credence ........ as a comedian. When I was reading the above I was certain it was from The Onion. But it wasn't. It was from another site, that specializes in sarcasm.

Thanks for the belly laugh bro Ohio. Yer a peach.

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by awareness

As the cult expert on this site, I busted out laughing. James Lindsey is a academic, a learned man, which gives him out-sized credence ........ as a comedian. When I was reading the above I was certain it was from The Onion. But it wasn't. It was from another site, that specializes in sarcasm.

Thanks for the belly laugh bro Ohio. Yer a peach.

What I found is that the Patriot Daily Press is "borderline extreme right," but not described as "sarcastic."

[Ohio]

In a predictable twist of events, Black activists in NYC demand their police back.

Black Activists in New York City Want Their Police Back

Keep laughing awareness! Here we see evidence that Blacks have been treated as pawns throughout this so-called BLM movement.

Mostly white Marxist anarchists have just played the black urban population.

But there is no cult here! Just brainwashed, crazy, mostly rich, white radicals destroying every major city. It doesn't have to be a "personality cult" to be a cult.

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

What I found is that the Patriot Daily Press is "borderline extreme right," but not described as "sarcastic."

Maybe just James was being sarcastic. Or trying to troll the PDP readers.

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Ohio

In a predictable twist of events, Black activists in NYC demand their police back.

Black Activists in New York City Want Their Police Back

Keep laughing awareness! Here we see evidence that Blacks have been treated as pawns throughout this so-called BLM movement.

Mostly white Marxist anarchists have just played the black urban population.

But there is no cult here! Just brainwashed, crazy, mostly rich, white radicals destroying every major city. It doesn't have to be a "personality cult" to be a cult.

You're just a crackup today.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by awareness

You're just a crackup today.

Glad you enjoyed the irony.


Praying that these "peaceful protestors" don't visit any of us soon.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by awareness

As the cult expert on this site, I busted out laughing. James Lindsey is a academic, a learned man, which gives him out-sized credence ........ as a comedian. When I was reading the above I was certain it was from The Onion. But it wasn't. It was from another site, that specializes in sarcasm.

Thanks for the belly laugh bro Ohio. Yer a peach.

Every time I see your signature line ...

"Cults: My brain will always be there for you. Thinking. So you don't have to."

I enjoy a good chuckle also!

[OBW]

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

I found death statistics on the FBI website and another website. These sites said that black on black killings in the US were 2,570 (2016), while police killings of blacks average around 220 per year. That is 11 times the amount. Why is so little attention focused on the causes of the 2,570 deaths, and so much on the 220? (BTW - Of those 220, around 17% are technically unarmed. So we're really looking at about 30 of these unarmed instances a year, and those must be looked at case by case.)

First, everything must be looked at as both a whole and on a case-by-case basis. To only consider on a case-by-case basis ignores the total and attempts to stratify the whole in such a manner as to make the impact of the whole go away.

But another question is how it compares to similar deaths of whites in similar circumstances. On a per-capita basis, not in just total numbers.

But another problem is that I have heard from way too many blacks that tell of personal experiences of being stopped by police for simply looking "out of place." Also known as "driving while black," "walking while black," and "shopping while black." I have never had any reason to even consider this kind of thing possible for me (a white person). And when the police too often begin with their guns out (I've never seen a policeman's gun out), there is reason for them to be fearful beyond the kind of fear that equals respect. And that leads to misunderstanding, and beyond. There is a problem. It may only be some police. But the others will almost unanimously put the blue wall of defense when something goes wrong. That taints even the majority of so-called "good cops."

And, referring to a more recent post, except for a few extremists, the whole "defund the police" rhetoric never meant "get rid of the police." It meant a change in the way police operate. They always knew they needed police. Ranting about Marxists is just buying into yet another conspiracy theory. There's always another nefarious group set on taking over the world (or at least the US) and we've got to stop them. Q is constantly telling everyone that will listen. We should not be among them.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by OBW

And, referring to a more recent post, except for a few extremists, the whole "defund the police" rhetoric never meant "get rid of the police." It meant a change in the way police operate. They always knew they needed police.

This is nothing more than willful ignorance, and a refusal to examine all sides of the story.

A few extremists? Oh really? You mean like thousands and thousands of protesters in every city? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2RPR_kNkII8

OBW, have you seen 65 straight days of violent protests in Portland assaulting federal officers tasked with guarding court houses? Tell me again how "peaceful" protesters bring molotov cocktails, baseball bats, high power lasers, cement "shakes," rocks and bricks, commercial grade fireworks, kerosene balloons, knives and guns, etc. to their "peaceful" protests every night, all night long.

Sorry, bro, but you have been living in a leftist bubble of misinformation and brainwashing propaganda put on by CNN/MSNBC/ABC/CBS/NBC/NYT/WaPo/etc.

Life in the WL Local Churches was nothing compared to what is going on today. And this BLM movement is merely a ruse for the overthrow of civil society in America. I know that you hate Trump, but you have no idea what the alternative will be. Think Venezuela. Or "back in the USSR." Perhaps Cuba under Fidel Castro?

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by OBW

Ranting about Marxists is just buying into yet another conspiracy theory. There's always another nefarious group set on taking over the world (or at least the US) and we've got to stop them. Q is constantly telling everyone that will listen. We should not be among them.

When these Marxists now control the Democratic Socialist Party, Hollywood, Big Tech, The Media, and the major Universities, perhaps you should take notice.


No? Ok, go back to sleep.

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Ohio

When these Marxists now control the Democratic Socialist Party, Hollywood, Big Tech, The Media, and the major Universities, perhaps you should take notice.


No? Ok, go back to sleep.

I think it's more realistic to be concerned about the Trump supporting Aryan Nation, White Supremacists -- "Call Trump":

Man yells, ‘I am a white supremacist,’ strikes woman at Nokomis
https://www.heraldtribune.com/news/2...mis-restaurant

[Sons to Glory!]

Velly intellesting . . . whichever side of the aisle you (ubiquitously speaking) tend toward, people have no doubt that the big, bad boogieman definitely comes from the other side.

Oh no Mr. Bill - what could this mean!?

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

big, bad boogieman

Boogieman? Ain't he friends with the devil?

Or is that just a way to dehumanize the other group?

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by awareness

I think it's more realistic to be concerned about the Trump supporting Aryan Nation, White Supremacists -- "Call Trump":

Man yells, ‘I am a white supremacist,’ strikes woman at Nokomis
https://www.heraldtribune.com/news/2...mis-restaurant

Yeah, because we have had months of these fictitious white supremacists rioting, burning, and looting every city in the country, killing dozens of people, injuring hundreds more?

Awareness, do you still have trouble sleeping at night because of that nasty bogey man in the closet gonna eat you?

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Ohio

Yeah, because we have had months of these fictitious white supremacists rioting, burning, and looting every city in the country, killing dozens of people, injuring hundreds more?

Awareness, do you still have trouble sleeping at night because of that nasty bogey man in the closet gonna eat you?

I ate him for breakfast. So my closet is holy now. And don't dehumanize others anymore ... as we all are made in the image of God ... and are sons of God ... and besides, they are my neighbors.

How 'bout you, bro Ohio? Agree?

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by awareness

I ate him for breakfast. So my closet is holy now. And don't dehumanize others anymore ... as we all are made in the image of God ... and are sons of God ... and besides, they are my neighbors.

How 'bout you, bro Ohio? Agree?

Enforcing law and order properly dehumanizes no one, and even helps the criminals turn their lives around.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by awareness

I think it's more realistic to be concerned about the Trump supporting Aryan Nation, White Supremacists -- "Call Trump":

Man yells, ‘I am a white supremacist,’ strikes woman at Nokomis
https://www.heraldtribune.com/news/2...mis-restaurant

Where is the evidence that Trump has ever supported Aryan Nation???

As forum moderator you should at least have a semblance of honesty.

Your Democratic Party sainted the Senator from West Virginia, Robert Byrd, who was a Grand Wizard of the KKK.

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by awareness

Boogieman? Ain't he friends with the devil?

Or is that just a way to dehumanize the other group?

The devil is the boogieman on both sides of worldly manifestations. He's pulling the strings on both sides and laughing maniacally when men don't recognize him who's only purpose is to steal, kill and destroy us. He points to those on the other side and says, "See how bad and hypocritical those guys are - they're the enemy!"

Then when it's pointed out how they themselves are being hypocritical, the response is, "Yeah perhaps, but we're not nearly as bad as those guys!" I think the devil gets a real good belly laugh over that.

"For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers,
against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places."

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Ohio

Where is the evidence that Trump has ever supported Aryan Nation???

The evidence in the article is when the white supremacist, says the Aryan Nation will take over, and says, "Call Trump." So the Aryan Nation believes Trump supports them. Why?

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by awareness

The evidence in the article is when the white supremacist, says the Aryan Nation will take over, and says, "Call Trump." So the Aryan Nation believes Trump supports them. Why?

That's evidence???


So when someone says, "call the police," that is evidence that the police are fascists? And that's why the left wants them all abolished?


What's wrong with your logic here?

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Ohio

That's evidence???


So when someone says, "call the police," that is evidence that the police are fascists? And that's why the left wants them all abolished?


What's wrong with your logic here?

No logic. Just quoting and asking why. Maybe they hear the dog whistle, that you don't want to hear. Read Mary Trump's book, and it might improve your hearing. But no. You're stuck on Trump like you're stuck on Jesus is God.

[Sons to Glory!]

I think I'm done with this thread - mostly just two brothers talking past each other . . .

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

I think I'm done with this thread - mostly just two brothers talking past each other . . .

Me too! Everything just devolves into Trump hatred. This world has become far too toxic for reasoned discussion.

[awareness]

My work is done. I'm finished here.

[Sons to Glory!]

In the three months since I started this thread, I am still not aware of any solid, empirical, peer-reviewed studies that clearly demonstrate that there is widespread systemic racism in America's police departments. Yet just about everything I see on news media states that widespread systemic racism among police is an established and undeniable fact. The best study I've seen thus far (as linked to at the start of this thread), strongly undermines that notion.

I continue to suspect that someone is trying to manipulate our minds, by repeating an unsubstantiated claim over and over. The flesh is very susceptible to this tactic (as employed by the flesh's father, the devil, who is a master marketeer).

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

In the three months since I started this thread, I am still not aware of any solid, empirical, peer-reviewed studies that clearly demonstrate that there is widespread systemic racism in America's police departments. Yet just about everything I see on news media states that widespread systemic racism among police is an established and undeniable fact. The best study I've seen thus far (as linked to at the start of this thread), strongly undermines that notion.

I continue to suspect that someone is trying to manipulate our minds, by repeating an unsubstantiated claim over and over. The flesh is very susceptible to this tactic (as employed by the flesh's father, the devil, who is a master marketeer).

Think about it. Trump is called a racist because He said there are good people on both sides of the monuments debate. Aren't there? There's good people on both sides of every point of contention.

This is the only "evidence" they have that Trump is racist, a twisted quote. Yet the media constantly portrays him as racist, and the country as racist. Who needs facts? Same goes with the Police. The facts tell us that far more Police die at the hands of blacks then vice versa.

They called Jesus Christ "Beelzebub," a demon, the devil. The sad thing is watching so-called intelligent people believe these lies. What we decide to believe speaks volumes about us, and determines our eternal destiny.

Senator Rand Paul was accosted by a mob the other day. Some demanded that he say Breanna Taylor's name, as if RP was racist. The irony is lost on these anarchist idiots because RP actually sponsored legislation to end these "no knock warrants."

[OBW]

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

Velly intellesting . . . whichever side of the aisle you (ubiquitously speaking) tend toward, people have no doubt that the big, bad boogieman definitely comes from the other side.

Oh no Mr. Bill - what could this mean!?

Well it is almost certain that the big bad boogeyman is on a side because almost everyone has moved to one pole or the other. There is almost no longer a middle ground in American society. And it is not all the fault of the ones on the "other" side. It has been a gradual thing. The biggest events in this polarization (to me) were 1) the advent of the extreme right radio broadcasters, beginning with Rush Limbaugh and the election of Bill Clinton in 1992, 2) the "birther" extremists in 2008 coupled with declarations of some that they were going to move out of the US if Obama was elected coupled with an internal Resuplican rejection of moderate Republicans by somewhat rejecting McCain after nominating him for president, and 3) the election of Trump. I am not blaming the "right" for the whole thing, but they did have the more visible part of these particular changes. And I do see the Republican part in the polarization better because it is the party that I best identify with, though from a more moderate position.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by OBW

Well it is almost certain that the big bad boogeyman is on a side because almost everyone has moved to one pole or the other. There is almost no longer a middle ground in American society. And it is not all the fault of the ones on the "other" side. It has been a gradual thing. The biggest events in this polarization (to me) were 1) the advent of the extreme right radio broadcasters, beginning with Rush Limbaugh and the election of Bill Clinton in 1992, 2) the "birther" extremists in 2008 coupled with declarations of some that they were going to move out of the US if Obama was elected coupled with an internal Resuplican rejection of moderate Republicans by somewhat rejecting McCain after nominating him for president, and 3) the election of Trump.

This is so funny, and void of facts.

Those on the Left always blame the problems of polarization on the Right. So convenient. So disingenuous.

1. Conservative radio, with Limbaugh and others, did not create polarization, rather that resulted from the steady mass migration of nearly all media oulets to more progressive positions, always skewing news and opinion, creating endless double standards. It was the demands of the conservative public, the silent majority, the flyover country, the forgotten heartland, etc. which gave conservative radio its market.

2. I have seen these documents analyzed by forensic document specialists, both his birth certificate and selective service. They were forgeries. Plain and simple. Not by Obama, but his parents. I'm surprised that a candidate for president never has to show proof of citizenship. But it happened. Don't blame conservatives for only wanting the rule of law.

3. The polarization by Trump is merely a reaction to false attacks attempting to frame him. For 4 years he was accused of being a foreign agent, an asset of Putin, who corrupted the 2016 election. Top FBI brass, the media, State officials, intelligence officials, and Congress continually assured the American people that they had seen "overwhelming evidence in plain sight" that condemned Trump, General Flynn, and others. It is this collection of deceivers who have polarized the country. Where is the evidence? Mueller and staff never found anything! All of these false witnesses stood and lied to the American people, day after day, but under oath, behind closed doors, they told another story -- that they had no evidence!!!

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Ohio

This is so funny, and void of facts.

Those on the Left always blame the problems of polarization on the Right. So convenient. So disingenuous.

1. Conservative radio, with Limbaugh and others, did not create polarization, rather that resulted from the steady mass migration of nearly all media oulets to more progressive positions, always skewing news and opinion, creating endless double standards. It was the demands of the conservative public, the silent majority, the flyover country, the forgotten heartland, etc. which gave conservative radio its market.

2. I have seen these documents analyzed by forensic document specialists, both his birth certificate and selective service. They were forgeries. Plain and simple. Not by Obama, but his parents. I'm surprised that a candidate for president never has to show proof of citizenship. But it happened. Don't blame conservatives for only wanting the rule of law.

3. The polarization by Trump is merely a reaction to false attacks attempting to frame him. For 4 years he was accused of being a foreign agent, an asset of Putin, who corrupted the 2016 election. Top FBI brass, the media, State officials, intelligence officials, and Congress continually assured the American people that they had seen "overwhelming evidence in plain sight" that condemned Trump, General Flynn, and others. It is this collection of deceivers who have polarized the country. Where is the evidence? Mueller and staff never found anything! All of these false witnesses stood and lied to the American people, day after day, but under oath, behind closed doors, they told another story -- that they had no evidence!!!

Talk about lack of facts ... and proof of OBW's statement : "the big bad boogeyman is on a side because almost everyone has moved to one pole or the other."

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by awareness

Talk about lack of facts ... and proof of OBW's statement : "the big bad boogeyman is on a side because almost everyone has moved to one pole or the other."

For a guy who only traffics in fake news, beware of that which might upset you occasionally ... like the facts!

And as one who has abandoned all things Christian, you must now supply your own "light" to see in the darkness. Good luck!

[Sons to Glory!]

I'm keeping my eyes open for new studies to come out which empirically demonstrate widespread, systemic racism in American police departments. If this is the case, it shouldn't be that hard to show. So far what I've seen just seems to be a roar from the crowd.

If such a bonafide study comes out, please let me know, okay?

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

I'm keeping my eyes open for new studies to come out which empirically demonstrate widespread, systemic racism in American police departments. If this is the case, it shouldn't be that hard to show. So far what I've seen just seems to be a roar from the crowd.

If such a bonafide study comes out, please let me know, okay?

POLICE KILLINGS OF UNARMED AMERICANS
1. A study by a University of California, Davis professor found “evidence of a significant bias in the killing of unarmed black Americans relative to unarmed white Americans, in that the probability of being black, unarmed, and shot by police is about 3.49 times the probability of being white, unarmed, and shot by police on average.”

https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2016...ce-racial-bias

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by awareness

POLICE KILLINGS OF UNARMED AMERICANS
1. A study by a University of California, Davis professor found “evidence of a significant bias in the killing of unarmed black Americans relative to unarmed white Americans, in that the probability of being black, unarmed, and shot by police is about 3.49 times the probability of being white, unarmed, and shot by police on average.”

https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2016...ce-racial-bias

I didn't read it, but trusting that the quote you presented is an accurate synopsis, as always it begs the same question: How many more times is it likely that a violent crime is committed by black Americans than white ones?

So to be on a level playing field, it has to take this factor (% of violent crimes committed by blacks vs. whites) into account.

[Sons to Glory!]

This was posted on the BLM website yesterday:

Statement by Black Lives Matter Global Network Foundation in Response to Grand Jury Verdict in the Breonna Taylor Case

September 23, 2020
We are completely disgusted and outraged by the indescribable decision that has been rendered in the murder of our beloved, Breonna Taylor. Here we are, yet again, a Black life that has been dehumanized at the hands of the police in cold-blooded murder; has no value in a criminal legal system that is supposed to protect it.

Two independent investigations have said there is conclusive evidence and witnesses that police both banged on the door AND announced themselves before entering (i.e., they did not execute the "no-knock warrant" without knocking), and then Breonna's boyfriend opened fire on police first.

There are also jailhouse phone recordings of inmates calling Breonna that make her complicit in drug dealing.

So why is this message (above) still on the BLM website?

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by awareness

POLICE KILLINGS OF UNARMED AMERICANS
1. A study by a University of California, Davis professor found “evidence of a significant bias in the killing of unarmed black Americans relative to unarmed white Americans, in that the probability of being black, unarmed, and shot by police is about 3.49 times the probability of being white, unarmed, and shot by police on average.”

https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2016...ce-racial-bias

I have not seen one Democratic leader come forward with a few pointers about how to cooperate with law authorities. Apparently no one has ever taught them that committing crimes and resisting arrest might not work out too well for you.

After seeing more video and legal opinions concerning George Floyd, I doubt that Minneapolis cop will be convicted for murder. GF was complaining of not being able to breathe long before he wanted to lay on the ground. And it was GF who wanted to lie down rather than sit in the back seat of the police car. The jury probably will conclude that he was over-dosing on Fentanal which is known to cause problems with breathing.

And btw it's probably not the best idea to get your info from vanity fair.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

This was posted on the BLM website yesterday:
Two independent investigations have said there is conclusive evidence and witnesses that police both banged on the door AND announced themselves before entering (i.e., they did not execute the "no-knock warrant" without knocking), and then Breonna's boyfriend opened fire on police first.

There are also jailhouse phone recordings of inmates calling Breonna that make her complicit in drug dealing.

So why is this message (above) still on the BLM website?

Every time we see one of these stories, the initial reports are sensational and skewed never reflecting the actual events. I BLAME THE MEDIA. Then when the public learns of the lack of indictments, a second round of rioting begins.

One must seriously ask whether the media wants civil chaos for their own business model? Apart from FNC and WSJ, all other outlets walk in lockstep, reporting the same misinformation. Then they never retract their errors.

Trayvon Martin, Michael Brown in Ferguson, and Freddie Grey in Baltimore all followed this same pattern. And those were during the Obama Administration. The recent incidents under Trump are not new, only designed to be worse. The MEDIA is totally complicit. All of them reported the rioting, looting, arson, and anarchy as "peaceful protests," hiding the truth from the public.

[Sons to Glory!]

So I thought I'd watch some of the NBA finals for the heck of it just now. I wasn't really into it all that much as I haven't paid much attention this season. But upon seeing "Black Lives Matter" painted in large letters on the court, and various political messages on the player's shirts and elsewhere, I lost interest and am now watching a rather cheesy old move, Geronimo with Chuck Conners in the lead role - actually much more entertaining.

Geez - do you think I must be a closet bigot, because I haven't swallowed this thing (hook, line, sinker, rod & reel) like the rest of the world seems to have - regarding the whole BLM movement with all it's Marxist undertones?

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

So I thought I'd watch some of the NBA finals for the heck of it just now. I wasn't really into it all that much as I haven't paid much attention this season. But upon seeing "Black Lives Matter" painted in large letters on the court, and various political messages on the player's shirts and elsewhere, I lost interest and am now watching a rather cheesy old move, Geronimo with Chuck Conners in the lead role - actually much more entertaining.

Geez - do you think I must be a closet bigot, because I haven't swallowed this thing (hook, line, sinker, rod & reel) like the rest of the world seems to have - regarding the whole BLM movement with all it's Marxist undertones?

I caught some NBA news too. With LeBron winning another championship, the old battle over who is the greatest surfaces again. But after this year, I see no comparison. Michael Jordan elevated the entire sport of basketball. He was basically a-political. The liberals even criticized him for it. But he was not only a B-Ball player but a leader and a business man. He famously said, "Republicans buy shoes too."

LeBron however is a fool. He is more of a race hustler. He leads without facts or the truth. He said every time he leaves the house, people are hunting him down, as if that is happening to every black. Nonsense. They only chased him down for autographs. He made the current game of B-Ball totally political. And racist. He has brought the game to its lowest point in 70 years. So many people now just refuse to watch. LaBron has upset half the country. After the NBA renegotiates its TV contracts, the salaries will begin to crash. Then this generation of athletes will get a long awaited shock.

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by Ohio

I caught some NBA news too. With LeBron winning another championship, the old battle over who is the greatest surfaces again. But after this year, I see no comparison. Michael Jordan elevated the entire sport of basketball. He was basically a-political. The liberals even criticized him for it. But he was not only a B-Ball player but a leader and a business man. He famously said, "Republicans buy shoes too."

LeBron however is a fool. He is more of a race hustler. He leads without facts or the truth. He said every time he leaves the house, people are hunting him down, as if that is happening to every black. Nonsense. They only chased him down for autographs. He made the current game of B-Ball totally political. And racist. He has brought the game to its lowest point in 70 years. So many people now just refuse to watch. LaBron has upset half the country. After the NBA renegotiates its TV contracts, the salaries will begin to crash. Then this generation of athletes will get a long awaited shock.

Well, I didn't even realize that it was potentially the very last game and just saw this morning the Lakers had won. So what.

I'm beginning to see various things going on in the country as just childish - full of immature emotion . . . children throwing tantrums about things they really don't understand well.

[Sons to Glory!]

This morning I read that blacks are voting in significantly higher numbers, because of perceived racism. This evidently translates to a huge black vote against Trump, as he is perceived as a racist. My opinion is that blacks have allowed themselves to be swayed by all they're hearing in the media, because (to my knowledge) there is still no empirical evidence demonstrating widespread, systemic racism in American police forces nationwide.

So (again my opinion) they have fallen victim to all the hyperbole of the BLM movement and the complicit media.

But then I had a thought that what if racism really is a huge problem and they are actually right? Maybe I'm the one being duped by the sources I allow myself to trust at least more than certain other sources . . .

Might I be deceived? Of course, because that's the nature of deception! (but I don't think so)

The moral of this little post? "Lean not unto your own understanding." Therefore there's only One who should be trusted - "God in Christ" who is "reconciling the world to Himself."

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

This morning I read that blacks are voting in significantly higher numbers, because of perceived racism. This evidently translates to a huge black vote against Trump, as he is perceived as a racist. My opinion is that blacks have allowed themselves to be swayed by all they're hearing in the media, because (to my knowledge) there is still no empirical evidence demonstrating widespread, systemic racism in American police forces nationwide.

So (again my opinion) they have fallen victim to all the hyperbole of the BLM movement and the complicit media.

But then I had a thought that what if racism really is a huge problem and they are actually right? Maybe I'm the one being duped by the sources I allow myself to trust at least more than certain other sources . . .

Might I be deceived? Of course, because that's the nature of deception! (but I don't think so)

The moral of this little post? "Lean not unto your own understanding." Therefore there's only One who should be trusted - "God in Christ" who is "reconciling the world to Himself."

Savannah Guthrie interrogates Trump on why he never rejected white supremacists. Yet film exists with his repeated denials. Yet not on her station, so to her he never denied. Isn't that how the liberal media works?

Consider the stories of Michael Brown, Freddie Gray, George Floyd, and Breanna Taylor. Every case was full of misinformation and distorted conclusions. Why is it that falsehoods spread so much faster than the truth? The media knows this all too well. As long as they can lead every story with their skewed agenda, they can brainwash the gullible public however they wish.

[Ohio]

From another thread . . .

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

And BLM seems to be solely based upon an assumption that there is widespread, systemic racism in America's police forces, even though no one has produced empirical, peer reviewed studies demonstrating that thunderous postulation (see the thread on that topic, also in the Alternative Topics section of this forum). So it appears like the thing to do, if you want to get traction on something, is to say, "It's all about civil rights!" and label those who question it as backward haters. That proclamation then brings civilized discussion effectively to an end . . .

Philadelphia, the city of Brotherly Love, is now exploding. The police are called to help out, and this perp attacks them with a knife. Obviously it won't go well for anyone to ambush a cop with a knife. The poor guy got shot. They say he also had mental health issues.

But we have no leaders calming the situation with a few basic facts. Instead we are daily told that "there is widespread, systemic racism in America's police forces." The NFL, NBA, MLB, ABC, NBC, CBS, NYT, NBC, WaPo, LAT, MSNBC, CNN, NAACP, SPLC, etc. etc. etc. The entire alphabet tells us this every minute of the day!

30 cops got hurt last night. One female officer got run over. Horrible.

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by Ohio

From another thread . . .

Philadelphia, the city of Brotherly Love, is now exploding. The police are called to help out, and this perp attacks them with a knife. Obviously it won't go well for anyone to ambush a cop with a knife. The poor guy got shot. They say he also had mental health issues.

But we have no leaders calming the situation with a few basic facts. Instead we are daily told that "there is widespread, systemic racism in America's police forces." The NFL, NBA, MLB, ABC, NBC, CBS, NYT, NBC, WaPo, LAT, MSNBC, CNN, NAACP, SPLC, etc. etc. etc. The entire alphabet tells us this every minute of the day!

30 cops got hurt last night. One female officer got run over. Horrible.

Yes, my wife and I had a pained laugh last night when we heard that there were violent protests after "The police shot the man when he wouldn't put his knife down . . ." Appears to be just like the Louisville thing - very unfortunate? Yes, of course, but don't blame the police for responding to potentially deadly force.

Maybe if the police had a giant marshmallow gun to shoot these perps with . . .

[Sons to Glory!]

My my, more violence in Philly over this nonsense. My wife and I see this as just any excuse to go and childishly break windows and steal Nikes, and in the process some more get hurt or killed. Irrational children using this as a poor excuse to throw bad tantrums and get attention.

And now we see ads on TV to send money to support the fundamentally Marxist organization, BLM. Oh that's just rich - you can't make this stuff up!

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

My my, more violence in Philly over this nonsense. My wife and I see this as just any excuse to go and childishly break windows and steal Nikes, and in the process some more get hurt or killed. Irrational children using this as a poor excuse to throw bad tantrums and get attention.

And now we see ads on TV to send money to support the fundamentally Marxist organization, BLM. Oh that's just rich - you can't make this stuff up!

I saw a news clip of a guy who was stealing a washing machine. Must have stole the appliance mover too. He'll have to go back tonight for the matching dryer.

It's all about using every excuse for short term looting. As if these are "reparations" for America's sins of slavery 2 centuries ago. But wait ... There was never slavery in Philadelphia.

And the looters will wonder why all of their needed retail stores moved out of their neighborhoods. Tomorrow the looters will then protest all of their boarded up stores.

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by Ohio

I saw a news clip of a guy who was stealing a washing machine. Must have stole the appliance mover too. He'll have to go back tonight for the matching dryer.

It's all about using every excuse for short term looting. As if these are "reparations" for America's sins of slavery 2 centuries ago. But wait ... There was never slavery in Philadelphia.

And the looters will wonder why all of their needed retail stores moved out of their neighborhoods. Tomorrow the looters will then protest all of their boarded up stores.

That's rich! Oh you have such a knack for putting things in a good perspective! Childish behavior to say the least.