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Old 10-08-2010, 12:01 AM   #1
PriestlyScribe
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Default The LC's Flawed Basis Of Discernment

Falling right into satan's trap, most LC leaders have "allowed their spiritual brains to fall out" by adopting a solitary, un-scriptural, replacement for true Biblical Discernment. Feelings!

Now I will admit there is a proper place for FEELING in the Christian life, but it should definitely not be placed at the front of the Train!


This peculiar idea has become well established among LC leaders that in order to judge whether or not something is "safe for LC consumption" we should first run it through the following tests:

1) If anything makes me feel good inside it must be from God. - It's Life!
2) If anything makes me feel bad inside it must be from satan. - It's Death!
3) If anything makes me feel uncomfortable, and it's obviously false, it's coming from the Tree Of Knowledge! - It's Death!
4) If anything makes me feel uncomfortable, although it seems to be true, it's coming from the Tree Of Knowledge! - It's Death!
5) If anything makes me feel comfortable, and it's not true, it's still coming from the Triune God! - because in the LC we are no longer governed by right and wrong!
6) If anything makes me feel comfortable, and it's true, it's coming from the Triune God! - It's Life!
7) If anything makes me feel inwardly happy, it's coming from the Triune God! - It's Life!
8) If anything makes me feel inwardly disturbed, it's always coming from the gates of Hades! - It's Death! Hang up the phone, jam the delete key, feed that letter into the shredder, run in the opposite direction at top speed, etc..


Under that bizarre detection system, saints could easily take in most of today's Hollywood Blockbusters without ever setting off one alarm bell!

And under that same set of rules, the language spoken by any of God's true prophets who might yet remain in the LCs, would be vigorously rejected.

Oh, I forgot about the specialized category for detecting Leaven in Messages and Media:

A) If it mentions God and it comes from Living Stream Ministry, it's unquestionably safe for consumption. No danger of any Leaven here so relax and take it all in.
B) If it mentions God and it's NOT from Living Stream Ministry, it's definitely leavened and should always be rejected. Just a tiny bit of this dangerous stuff will surely contaminate you!


Sorry to say I was hard pressed to find much counterbalance to this hugely popular concept of "Discerning only by the sense of Life" inside of WL's main body of writings. But here is one helpful example, and it's from a recently released publication:

"We must seek the Lord concerning what we speak and concerning the issue of our speaking. It is not a matter of how well we speak, the logistics of our presentation, or whether the saints are touched; rather, it is a matter of what will be produced in the saints...We need to know the condition of those who come to listen to a message."

"They might not have any feeling concerning their own condition, but we need to be clear and full of feeling concerning their condition. They may be able to sit and listen peacefully week after week, but we cannot speak peacefully week after week. We need to receive the burden to "disturb" and "trouble" them so that even if they come to the meeting peacefully, they will be inwardly disturbed when they leave..."

"If the listeners are lukewarm, even though they may listen peacefully, those who minister the word should not be at peace. They should go before the Lord, and let Him take away their peace, even to the point of losing sleep and not eating until they receive a burden from the Lord. Then their speaking will enable the Holy Spirit to work in the listeners."

"Only this kind of speaking is the speaking of God. Brothers who minister the word must have a burden, not merely doctrines, logic, and examples. Ministering the word in this way is intolerable; it is an offense to God, and it is a sin in His eyes."

(Witness Lee, The Administration of the Church and the Ministry of the Word, Chapter 2, Section 1, Living Stream Ministry, 2007)

So, based upon the criteria in that section of WL's early ministry, pretty much all of the current "feel good" material issuing from the "Seven Feasts" is absolutely NOT the Word of God. Rather, according to Witness Lee himself, it "is intolerable; it is an offense to God, and it is a sin in His eyes."

A keyword search of the Recovery Version pretty much came up empty.
Here are the only two semi-clear references that I found: Hebrews 5:14 and 1 Corinthians 14:29

This flawed concept regarding Discernment has resulted from an over-emphasis on "Enjoying Life" [or the spirit] and a de-emphasis of "Applying The Truth".

What follows is a prime example of this criteria being used by a person who really should know better:


Ron's Message to leaders in Equador in 2008 [mp3, 14Meg]
Steve Isitt's Transcription of Ron's Message [pdf, 51K]
The Source Webpage

So I would ask, is it even in the realm of possibility that a group of believers could be rescued from such a foundational flaw in understanding?

I hope that the answer is yes.

P.S.
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Old 10-08-2010, 10:28 AM   #2
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Default Re: The LC's Flawed Basis Of Discernment

This is something that has really caught my attention for some time.

I remember singing the LRC song (to the tune of "Since I Have Been Redeemed") that went:
The feelings do not change the facts
Jesus is Lord of all
The problem was that while that is actually a true statement, to the LRC the feelings are the absolute filter for the interpretation of facts. They are saying that if you are an overcoming child of God, you should not pay any attention to your feelings and instead just find exhilaration in declaring that Jesus is Lord of all.

There was something that had you up or down. If you were up, it was God. If you were down, it was Satan or the world. No need to consider that you might be down because you were out of place with God, or that God was dealing with you. Just turn to your spirit, get out of your mind, and find that good feeling again.

So, the real understanding of that song line should have been "Jesus is Lord of all no matter how you feel. But you should never feel bad, so don't worry about why you feel bad. Just ignore it and turn to your spirit (not God/Christ/The Spirit) and you will feel better."
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Old 10-19-2010, 02:45 PM   #3
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Default Re: The LC's Flawed Basis Of Discernment

It has come to my attention that the Source Webpage which linked to Ron Kangas' speaking in Ecuador, is no longer functioning. I know for a fact that it was working ten days ago when this thread was initiated. But now that page appears to be completely gone!

It's possible that this is a temporary outage due to a technical problem somewhere. But in the mean time, and just in case it was taken down deliberately - below you can access the backup copy of it which we captured on Sept 29, 2009.

The Ambato Ecuador Messages Source Webpage - BACKUP <---This one works! [SPANISH]

And below is a rough English translation of that same page:
Translation from Spanish to English courtesy of www.freetranslation.com

P.S.
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Therefore seeing we have this ministry, even as we obtained mercy, we faint not; but we have renounced the hidden things of shame, not walking in craftiness, nor handling the word of God deceitfully; but by the manifestation of the truth commending ourselves to every man's conscience in the sight of God. [2 Cor 4:1-2 ASV] - OUR WEBSITES - OUR FAVORITE SONG, ''I Abdicate''
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Old 01-19-2011, 08:40 PM   #4
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Default Re: The LC's Flawed Basis Of Discernment

The English link works, Steve.

I'm sorry, dear brother, that this one attacked you in this way. To call a brother evil is a damning, damning judgement - but a judgement not against the brother charged but rather against his accuser. A time will come when an answer must be given for this testimony, and not to the likes of us must this answer be given. Who are we emulating, when we become Accusers of the Brethren, brother Kangas?
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Old 01-21-2011, 11:29 AM   #5
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Default Re: The LC's Flawed Basis Of Discernment

Quote:
Originally Posted by NeitherFirstnorLast View Post
Who are we emulating, when we become Accusers of the Brethren, brother Kangas?
Discernment becomes flawed when Ron can say what he did without one brother in attendance calling it to halt. Did the brothers just receive it without question? When you call another brother, evil and a man of death, a rebuke is in order.
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