I'm a student in the FTT - AMA

Hey brothers and sisters in Christ. I'm currently attending a FTT and am willing to answer any questions regarding the local churches or FTT in general. I hope that this could be a time of fellowship.

sigh!
Are you allowed to talk to outsiders during FTT?
What is AMA?

[SevenSpirits]

Originally Posted by Unregistered

sigh!
Are you allowed to talk to outsiders during FTT?
What is AMA?

Ama means to ask me anything.

I don't know what you mean by outsiders. But if you mean those brothers and sisters that are no longer meeting with the saints in the local church, i don't see why not because we are all believers, and we all love the same God.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by SevenSpirits

Ama means to ask me anything.

Thought this guy might stick around a little longer the way he talked.

Disciplined.

[aron]

Originally Posted by Ohio

Thought this guy might stick around a little longer the way he talked.

I bet an FTT 'serving one' got wind that a trainee was on the dreaded internet and put a stop to it, right quick. But I wanted to answer them, anyway; eventually another one of them will end up here, looking around. So there's a couple of questions waiting for ya.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by aron

I bet an FTT 'serving one' got wind that a trainee was on the dreaded internet and put a stop to it, right quick. But I wanted to answer them, anyway; eventually another one of them will end up here, looking around. So there's a couple of questions waiting for ya.

The hall monitor has his eye on you.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by UnregisteredFTT

Hey brothers and sisters in Christ. I'm currently attending a FTT and am willing to answer any questions regarding the local churches or FTT in general. I hope that this could be a time of fellowship.

Welcome!

Happy Thanksgiving!

[SevenSpirits]

Originally Posted by Ohio

Welcome!

Happy Thanksgiving!

Thanks brother

Happy thanksgiving to you too! (I'm not from America, but it doesnt mean I don't love me some turkey!! Haha)

[UntoHim]

Welcome to Local Church Discussion! When you get a chance please send and email requesting membership, along with your desired UserName, to LocalChurchDiscussions@Gmail.Com, and then we will forward a temporary password to you. As a registered member of LCD your posts will appear immediately without having to go through the moderation que (which can take anywhere from an hour to a full day) Also you will then have access to the Private Message area in which you can communicate in privacy with other members.

[micah6v8]

I would like to know what is the daily schedule in a FTT.

[Intothewind]

I'd love to know if you were raised in the lc or gained off thecampuses.

After peeking around, how complete do you feel your knowledge of lc history is?

Welcome!

[Freedom]

Welcome to the forum SevenSpirits!

I hope that you would find the opportunity for fellowship here that you are looking for.

[aron]

I have a few questions.

- Do they still tell you, "don't waste your time" with the poor, the orphans, the widows, with those who have no means to repay you in the present age? See Luke 14:13,14; cf Prov 19:17. Paul wrote (Gal 2:10) that he was "eager to remember the poor" but I didn't see much eagerness when I was in the FTTA. Instead they were eager for "good building material", such as Caucasian college students. How 'normal' is this disdain for the weak and the sick among us? It doesn't seem like a normal Christian church life, to me.

- Your moniker is SevenSpirits: do you really believe in seven spirits, or in just one spirit, sevenfold intensified to overcome the degradation of the church? If this "seven is really one" idea is true, then why didn't WL use the same methodology throughout the Revelation? Why didn't he say that Revelation 21:12 showed one gate, which had become twelvefold intensified, or that Revelation 8:2 showed merely one angel standing before God, who was sevenfold intensified, or that the seven churches in Rev 2 and 3 were in fact one church, sevenfold? Why use one methodology (seven = one) in one place, and abandon that interpretive method everywhere else? Why the inconsistency of method?

And if Moses built a lampstand holding up seven lamps in Exodus, then was the church already degraded in Exodus when he went on the holy mountain and received the vision? So, why did Moses need to create seven lights in Exodus? In the NT we see only one spirit (e.g. Ephesians 4:4), and then in Revelation 1 (once again?) John beheld seven flames burning before the throne?

I suspect there were seven flames all along, and the "degraded church" idea was something that WL needed to distance himself from every other teacher, all of whom were of course useless. "They're all degraded!!" Only WL had the oracle, so we were taught. Yes, were problems in the Asian churches in Revs 2 & 3, but there also were problems in Jerusalem, Antioch, etc. So why seven flames in Revelation? And why WL's need to overturn the plain language right in front of him, and make seven equal one? And if his logic were right, why didn't he consistently use it?

- Why were women prominent in the early "recovery" movement, but now they can't even give a message in church on Sunday morning? Ruth Lee, Peace Wang, etc etc; there were dozens functioning alongside WN. Ironically, one hundred years ago, women couldn't vote or hold public office, but could function in WN's "Little Flock" movement. Today women can run for President but can't speak on Sunday morning? What got recovered, here? Where's Priscilla and Aquila in the Lord's recovery movement? Banished.

I thought about the seven spirits. Please write more on this topic.
I suspect the FTT kid is banned from this site and not allowed to talk to 'insiders' anything 'negative'. He/she reckoned he/she knew it all (having been taught WL all-incisive high peak blah blah) and had confidently declared AMA (ask me anything).
Now this kid is learning. Pray for him/her that The Lord reveals Himself and His own word, that this one in The Lord's hand is supported by The Lord Himself.
Sad spies and sad leaders in the LSM controlled system. Is it worth it? Butcher the young that you shepherded. Lord Jesus Christ is coming soon.

[aron]

Originally Posted by aron

- Why were women prominent in the early "recovery" movement, but now they can't even give a message in church on Sunday morning? Ruth Lee, Peace Wang, etc etc; there were dozens functioning alongside WN. Ironically, one hundred years ago, women couldn't vote or hold public office, but could function in WN's "Little Flock" movement. Today women can run for President but can't speak on Sunday morning? What got recovered, here?

One of today's leading ones, RK, once told us that he thought the only thing worse than a rebellious brother was a spiritual sister. Do you think he'd be able to say that in front of M.E. Barber, who'd shepherded Watchman Nee? Or to Miss Groves, a missionary co-worker of Barber? Or to Ruth Lee, or Peace Wang, or Dora Yu? I doubt it. I think there is some serious disconnect here.

[Jay]

Originally Posted by aron

I have a few questions.

- Do they still tell you, "don't waste your time" with the poor, the orphans, the widows, with those who have no means to repay you in the present age? See Luke 14:13,14; cf Prov 19:17. Paul wrote (Gal 2:10) that he was "eager to remember the poor" but I didn't see much eagerness when I was in the FTTA. Instead they were eager for "good building material", such as Caucasian college students. How 'normal' is this disdain for the weak and the sick among us? It doesn't seem like a normal Christian church life, to me.

- Your moniker is SevenSpirits: do you really believe in seven spirits, or in just one spirit, sevenfold intensified to overcome the degradation of the church? If this "seven is really one" idea is true, then why didn't WL use the same methodology throughout the Revelation? Why didn't he say that Revelation 21:12 showed one gate, which had become twelvefold intensified, or that Revelation 8:2 showed merely one angel standing before God, who was sevenfold intensified, or that the seven churches in Rev 2 and 3 were in fact one church, sevenfold? Why use one methodology (seven = one) in one place, and abandon that interpretive method everywhere else? Why the inconsistency of method?

And if Moses built a lampstand holding up seven lamps in Exodus, then was the church already degraded in Exodus when he went on the holy mountain and received the vision? So, why did Moses need to create seven lights in Exodus? In the NT we see only one spirit (e.g. Ephesians 4:4), and then in Revelation 1 (once again?) John beheld seven flames burning before the throne?

I suspect there were seven flames all along, and the "degraded church" idea was something that WL needed to distance himself from every other teacher, all of whom were of course useless. "They're all degraded!!" Only WL had the oracle, so we were taught. Yes, were problems in the Asian churches in Revs 2 & 3, but there also were problems in Jerusalem, Antioch, etc. So why seven flames in Revelation? And why WL's need to overturn the plain language right in front of him, and make seven equal one? And if his logic were right, why didn't he consistently use it?

- Why were women prominent in the early "recovery" movement, but now they can't even give a message in church on Sunday morning? Ruth Lee, Peace Wang, etc etc; there were dozens functioning alongside WN. Ironically, one hundred years ago, women couldn't vote or hold public office, but could function in WN's "Little Flock" movement. Today women can run for President but can't speak on Sunday morning? What got recovered, here? Where's Priscilla and Aquila in the Lord's recovery movement? Banished.

I agree with you on the LC treating poor people without love. They treated me this way. I was looked at with disdain for not being an excelling brother, and some brothers have even used condescending language towards me. There was also a brother who came into our locality a few years ago and he got baptized with us and later on ran into some trouble and became homeless. He reached out to the leading brothers and was basically ignored. I was in the room with one of them when he called and asked for help and he was redirected to a different locality where a brother had maybe a room for him. Which was ok I guess, but then that brother got off the phone and said verbatim "we are not a salvation army." And he laughed about it. That has never sat right with me

But I don't agree that Lee was talking about degraded Christianity in an errant way in the sense that he is objectively wrong about them. Certainly the denominations are sectarian and degraded in more ways than one. But we could also argue that Lee's constant bashing of them wasn't righteous either. To the point where you almost get an "us vrs them" type of thought. At the end of the day these are our brothers and sisters in the Lord. They may be to whatever extent lost in the worldly Christian system, but that doesn't make them less than us, and Lee was constantly bashing them and putting them down, which would give the listener an air of superiority over them, as if these were foreign people who didn't deserve our time. Which would make the members of the local churches special and extraordinary in comparison with other believers. And I do think this type of thinking is latent in the recovery. They really do believe they're a special class of Christian and they absolutely do talk like they're more blessed than other Christians. Which is debatable objectively, but it's also not right to talk about yourselves that way. It's certainly a matter of pride

[Lisbon]

How things changed. One of my first trainings in the Anaheim convention center WL thought he had trouble making his point and very spontaneously called at least half dozen people whom he knew could possibly contribute come forward and speak to the subject for a few minutes. Averil Hendrickson was one of them and the only sister. She did very well. To my observation she did as well as any but such an observation is not worth much from 40 years ago. You can be sure something like that would not take place today.

Lisbon

[Timotheist]

We can't have sisters 'blending' with brothers. What kind of testimony would that be?

[HERn]

Our dear brother/sister only posted once. May the Lord destroy the strongholds of satan. And release our brother /sister to post again.

[aron]

Originally Posted by HERn

Our dear brother/sister only posted once. May the Lord destroy the strongholds of satan. And release our brother /sister to post again.

I'd have a full-time trainee ask their trainer:

1. "Why were women prominent in the early work of recovery, from Madame Guyon and Jessie Penn-Lewis to Margaret Barber, Peace Wang and Ruth Lee, and 100 years later this is no longer the case? What happened?"

2. "Why did Watchman Nee use Christian writings from ancient sources up to contemporary, while we have "One Trumpet" and only draw from one source? Why could Nee pick through varied writings, taking what was good and balancing them, yet we're expected to accept only Nee and Lee, and that 'whole cloth', complete and entire? Why was Nee able to exercise such discernment and judgment while we're not?"

I could think of other questions, but in the interest of simplicity and brevity offer those two.

My own answers are: 1. Women were used while it was expedient. But eventually it was no longer expedient. Just like with John Ingalls, Max Rapoport, and so many others; they find that this is a ministry of expedience. What's good, or useful, or praised today, may be rejected, suppressed, or forgotten when it's no longer needed. Women had their moment, the "recovery" was established, and then they could be cast aside. The ministry of the age had moved on.

2. Nee had discernment as the Apostle of the Age. God's Deputy. The rest of us are to exercise our discernment to realize that he was God's Man of the Hour; now we no longer need to do the hard work Nee did, of thinking and proving all things.

Ditto with Lee. He was bright enough to realize that Nee was his meal ticket - sorry, that Nee was the Man of the Hour, God's chosen Vessel of the Age. And Lee's heart was pure enough to follow the Vision of the Age without deviation, and bring it to us. The rest of us should realize that it's all figured out, and we can become Witness Lee Tape Recorders in the his God-Man Duplication Factory. Don't bother to read any other materials, because that will just bring in confusion and frustrate God's sole move on the earth today.

That second answer had a touch of sarcasm, sorry. In actuality it's man-elevating and man-worshipping human culture, paired with self-aggrandizement - "everybody else makes mistakes; not me". Present that heady brew to people who need to be told what to say and think, and there's a unholy trinity at work. It's seen in Local Church historical narratives: "From the Darkness (i.e. fallen and degraded Christianity), God raised up His Chosen Servant of the Present Revelation, who alone could lead us all into the Wonderful Recovered Church age!"

I bet if you asked a 'responsible one' in the FTT they would give you a sentence like the last one, with a straight face. All you'll get is recitation of pet phrases.

I’m waiting to reset my password but still wanted to reply. I know you asked if anyone had any questions and you seem sincere. It’s an interesting question though bc my first thought is why you’re not asking why people have left? Why would a group like this be needed? Many of us grew up in the local churches so I could probably predict the answers you’d give. Something in you seems curious if you’re even on this site. Do you have any questions?