The Place of Love in the Local Church Denomination

[jigsaw44]

Hey fellow forum contributors, I was requested to make a thread on a question I had for a certain recent forum contributor who posted recently. Here is the question, copied and pasted from the other thread.

Q. What is the idea of philosophy of "Love" in the LC?
1. Do they seem it as something that needs to be controlled until a certain point of time when one is ready for marriage. Or do they see it as a "worldly" and sinful thing? The idea of being super strict on dating for youth is common in the Christian world of parenting. But I have seen men beyond 30 who can't even approach a women just as a 15 year old can't. It has to be something more than, simply- don't worry about love until your older. Since even older gentlemen in the LC can't pursue a women they "love".

2. Is love a positive emotion in the LC at any point? Or is any sign of emotional attachment bad? Cause they don't even believe in friends, I couldn't even imagine a positive outlook of love for another person. That is probably why they separate genders so much is to prevent emotional development on any significant scale. But what is the benefit of just not letting people chose who they truly want? Why are elders the puppet master's in regards to putting people together like animals with no emotions and just testosterone that needs to be utilized for "fruitful" purposes"? Is it to make sure a ****ty marriage leads to one hanging on closer to the church rather than someone they truly love? I am not saying all LC marriages have no Joy, I have seen a darn good handful of happy LC Marriages, but the ****ty marriages are there in large numbers and the couple can barely put a smile on their faces when together and look downright miserable. Bad marriages are in every facet of society and happen for one reason or another. But why make it so hard for one to experience love and proper pursuit of a life long partner at even an adult age when one has their life in order? It must be their personal and official view of "love".

3. Also from what I witnessed with a fellow brother, would you say that the people closely associated with elders and other higher ranking position men have the sole privilege's in pursuing their preferred choice without resistance and repercussion?
Specific Example-Can a man with the position of Co-worker snatch a man or women like property and put together a empty marriage at his sole discretion at any locality simply due to his self interest?
- This question is just trying to get a picture of the mental servitude an individual can be subjugated to while in the LC.

4. Is there a statement by witness Lee or some living stream ministry publication by the coworkers that emphasizes this skewed philosophy of anti love sentiment? Or is it just some de facto customers that developed due to the overall LC culture crafting this seemingly negative view on "love"?

[Curious]

It is typical of a cult to want 'love' to be directed to the personality at the top. To find ways to block love from being directed elsewhere, to a spouse, to children, to friendships, is contrary to their aim. If all other bonds between humans can become strained or unsatisfying, the cult leader is the winner. An unrealistic and fantasy - based ideal can surround them as hurting and inwardly lonely people creep into an unrealistic idealism that distracts them from their own real life misery. And keeps them stuck there, ever more dependant on their 'love' and loyalty to the cult leader to give them a sense of purpose, meaning and destiny to their lives. It's exactly how Indian gurus do things too.

I suspect this may not have a precise doctrine or theology to express it. I could be wrong, but it's more a push that works under the surface rather than finding much bible-verse backing.

[NZexCK]

This is my take/how I saw things as a CK.

Up until the age of 11 things were relatively "normal" then all of a sudden CK's reach the age of puberty and the genders are segregated. In my locality the boys would meet at one location on a Friday night and the girls would meet at another. At trainings or summer schools boys sat on one side of the room, girls sat on the other. Every camp, training, conference multiple times a year included some kind of talk about the importance if ignoring the opposite sex, how wrong it was to engage in a relationship, how much it would damage us. I remember at one high schoolers training one particular brother likened forming a relationship to incest. You wouldn't have a relationship with your own brother/sister in real life so its no different in the church life. But it magically becomes ok once you've followed the magic formula. Our paths were laid out for us. Get through high school, get a degree, attend the FTT and then the lord would provide us with the perfect spouse for us (more like the elders will play puppet master under the guise of "fellowship"). At this same training a friend and I were waving our arms out of the window one night after lights out to the boys who were in accomodation across the driveway. The next morning, the serving ones gave us obvious looks of disapproving disgust as word went around that some bad sisters had been hanging their bodies out of the window. I never attended another training or summer school.
I feel that the teenage years are some of the most critical in forming how one will view the world for the rest of their adult lives, particularly how they will interact with the opposite sex. They completely mess up this stage of development which is why so many adults in the church life are incapable of interacting with the opposite sex normally. If you resign your free will/critical thinking over to the church/eldership at 15 years old because you believe they know what you need more than you know what you need for yourself, then your mental development also stops at age 15. Thats why theres so many grown adults in the LR with the mentality of someone in their late teens/early 20's. Also, if you're an obedient CK who looks away from the opposite sex all throughout your teens/college years/FTT then you're probably about ready to accept any mediocre pairing suggested to you.

I think that it is in the churches best interest to control the aspect of love as much as possible because love can be messy. People break up, people change and grow. If people were allowed to date or choose partners of their own free will and then broke up, then at least one half of the couple is very likely to stop meeting. And you all know how they need those numbers. They want to avoid that whole messy stage and keep the courting/engagement phase as short as possible so people don't actually have time to realise they're not a good match. Then before they know it they're stuck in a mediocre marriage and dependant on the church/eldership for advice to get them through. Then they have that whole teaching about the wife being the husbands cross, the children being the wife's cross and imply that hardships are normal/to be expected, you just need to continue to put the church and christ first and then he will take care of your family. Yes problems are to be expected but not the kind of problems that arise from being in a weird, match made, loveless marriage in the first place with no strong foundation to build from. Then the church just becomes a form of escape for these couples. One less time during the week where they have to interact with each other. I think it particularly becomes a form of escape for brothers in positions of eldership or responsibility as I have seen the effects their lack of presence has had on their families and children. But no, they believe that so long as they continue to put the church first, their relationships/family will be taken care of.

[jigsaw44]

That makes sense on why the LC would like to control people's relationship in order to maintain steady numbers and suppress the possibility of sour relations resulting in people leaving. It fulfills their interest but the individual stands screwed of any power over his or her life. To be honest it takes a certain kind of person to fully conform to the nonsense of the LC. The idea of dealing with all this crap to remain in the same church that does not allow friendship, screws over marriages, pulls people from family on holidays, destroys the life of children over the odious legalism parenting advice of a man who had two wicked kids, one a swindler and the other a ravaging lustful sexual predator. The list goes on and on but it's just so unfortunate to see people's lives being degraded over a lie that is the local churches. The LC is largely living on a lie at this point, their perceived self worth is based on a lie. I'll make another thread about this at some point.

[jigsaw44]

The sad part is when the cycle continues, just imagine these miserable couples raising kids and just constantly thinking of their kids having a high chance of having the same fate as them. Just thinking about it seems so desolate, happy kid then turns into a teenager and the madness begins, they hit adult life and might feel something call love, that taken away and replaced with something empty and fake. Time goes on and the highlights of the relationship are bedtime activities..... Then wake up in the morning and realize you don't love, like, or really care about the person who shares the same ring as you. That's a novel right there honestly , a sad young adult audience novel.

[Curious]

Thankyou, NZexCK, for your insight.

Sheesh, that's alot to take in. Well, they certainly make you pay for the privilege of looking down your nose at the rest of Christianity! What an awful price though.

The theme of this thread is another area that has probably developed since the time of the main posters on this forum. In that regard its so good to have CK's, exCK's and younger generation posters like jigsaw44 posting. It's great to have you all here, opening more cans-of-worms to investigate the contents!!