Whistleblower

[Ohio]

Drake, what are your qualifications as an expert in this field? Are you SHRM certified?

i have not seen attempts by you to find common ground on this thread. Rather you constantly defend your favorite ministry, and denigrate those who have been victimized by it, while playing your beloved word games with all the posters here.

In a ministry such as Living Stream, do you really see much difference between sexual abuse by management and criminal behavior? Do you really feel that sexual activities at the workplace between managers and female volunteers are merely immoral and consensual, without criminality. If so, your standards for LSM don't even rise to the level of Hollywood sleaze.

[Drake]

Originally Posted by Ohio

Drake, what are your qualifications as an expert in this field? Are you SHRM certified?

i have not seen attempts by you to find common ground on this thread. Rather you constantly defend your favorite ministry, and denigrate those who have been victimized by it, while playing your beloved word games with all the posters here.

In a ministry such as Living Stream, do you really see much difference between sexual abuse by management and criminal behavior? Do you really feel that sexual activities at the workplace between managers and female volunteers are merely immoral and consensual, without criminality. If so, your standards for LSM don't even rise to the level of Hollywood sleaze.

No, I am not certified and I dont claim to be. How about you? Nell? Ever actually advised a victim or a perpetrator in determining legal or workplace action? Didn’t think so.

I’m not defending any crime that may have been committed. Am I not the one who is advocating calling the proper authorities? Or do you think you are the proper authority? If so, what makes you, Nell, or anyone else in this forum a proper authority to deal with this matter? You can report to the proper authorities if you think a crime has been committed. I say do it if you want to help victims.

Yes, there is a difference between adultery, fornication, and something forced in the workplace, at home, or anywhere. They are all immoral, but they are not all crimes. You do understand the difference don’t you? This forum is not the place to report criminal activity IF your objective is to help victims. If you really want to help victims then take some action with authorities who can actually do something about it. Otherwise, it is just tabloid type sleaze, since you brought up sleaze.

Drake

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by Drake

I’m not defending any crime that may have been committed. Am I not the one who is advocating calling the proper authorities?

No, I must have missed that.

You have critiqued John Ingalls for not calling the authorities, but not Witness Lee who had promised to "take care of things."

And you like to play word games with words like "crime."

Originally Posted by Drake

This forum is not the place to report criminal activity IF your objective is to help victims.

The reason we are discussing the matter here is that all other avenues of reporting have been removed in the LC, and the victims are just left with their guilt and shame.

Why is it that the LSM/LC's have become like the RCC's. Do you think the strong authoritative structure might be the answer, since both adhere to the "deputy authority" heresies?

[Drake]

Originally Posted by Ohio

No, I must have missed that.

You have critiqued John Ingalls for not calling the authorities, but not Witness Lee who had promised to "take care of things."

And you like to play word games with words like "crime."

The reason we are discussing the matter here is that all other avenues of reporting have been removed in the LC, and the victims are just left with their guilt and shame.

If you missed it it is because you are acting reflexively.. knee jerk reaction. “It’s coming from Drake.. Attack! Attack!”

The one avenue for criminal activity is to call the cops. The law is for the lawless. By your calling everything immoral a crime then you befuddle any actual crime. If you or anyone accuse someone or a group of continued criminal activity then you need to take action.... this forum is not the place to resolve criminal activity.

However, I think a rational person knows that engaging authorities for merely something immoral and not criminal is a fools errand. That is why, I suspect, no one here will do it in this case. Rather, it is convenient to slander a group of christians whom you dislike with a broad brush of ongoing criminal activity. It is serious enough that incidents of immorality have taken place but it is also immoral to make false accusations and there is a point that it becomes criminal too. You should understand that I am trying to help here by moderating this discussion.

Drake

[Steel]

Originally Posted by Drake

If a brother is offended he should do everything possible to be reconciled with his brother on the way, before death takes one and no reconciliation is possible in this age.

Actually... If a born again believer in Christ Jesus has fallen into holding to offended feelings... Then this one needs to... FIRST... Turn to the Lord by turning to their regenerated spirit... Then... Abiding in the Lord by abiding in their regenerated spirit... They... Following the Lord... Do what it is the Lord leads.

This is not a matter of "...right or worng..."... But one of living in, and living out the life of Christ. . . . When we as born again believers place our reasoning of what scripture says before the actual leading of the Lord... Then we are simply entering into the way that leads to folly religion.

And I experienced, and spoke against, this very thing at yesterday's morning Lord's Day meeting of the saints in the district I meet in.

Originally Posted by Drake

If attempts are made then it is on the one who rejects ... then the offended brother can leave it in the Lords righteous and capable hand.

And right there in your above speaking we can see the folly of religious thinking being exposed... My brother, Drake... Nothing is every out of "...the Lords righteous and capable hand." . . . Believers in Him simply need to be those that express this reality... Meaning... Express that nothing is every out of "...the Lords righteous and capable hand."

And we can only express this reality when we believe this reality... And any believer in Christ who thinks to themselves that "... then the offended brother can leave it in the Lords righteous and capable hand..." is exposing that they are not holding to this reality... Exposing that they do not hold to the reality that there is nothing that is not already in "...the Lords righteous and capable hand...".

And this is why believers in Christ continue on in their offended feelings/offences... They simply are not holding to Christ.

Originally Posted by Drake

Expressing discontent against another brother day in and day out on a forum like this is not leaving it in the Lords righteous and capable hands.

Absolutely... As can be any type of speaking that comes out of our old fallen natural man... And to do so day in day out is just a normal expression of those abiding in and expressing their fallen natural man.

Originally Posted by Drake

The other brother may be wrong but now you are too.

Drake

And what are you... Right?

Romans 14:1... "Now him who is weak in faith receive, but not for the purpose of passing judgment on his considerations."

[Nell]

Originally Posted by Drake

No, I am not certified and I dont claim to be. How about you? Nell? Ever actually advised a victim or a perpetrator in determining legal or workplace action? Didn’t think so.

I’m not defending any crime that may have been committed. Am I not the one who is advocating calling the proper authorities? Or do you think you are the proper authority? If so, what makes you, Nell, or anyone else in this forum a proper authority to deal with this matter. This forum is not the place to report criminal activity IF your objective is to help victims. If you really want to help victims then take some action with authorities who can actually do something about it. Otherwise, it is just tabloid type sleaze, since you brought up sleaze.

Drake

Please note the title of this thread: Whistleblower. The objective of this thread is to blow the whistle on unrighteousness behavior in the church. You are the one trying to make it something never intended.

Perhaps I will send this link to the Dallas Morning News, the Fort Worth Star Telegram, the Houston Chronicle, the Austin Statesman, the Los Angeles Times...any one else you want to include? I will include the LSM and let them know that you insisted on reporting crimes. Of course the statute has run on the older ones and possibly the ones posted on this forum. We’ll see.

Nell

[Drake]

Originally Posted by Nell

Please note the title of this thread: Whistleblower. The objective of this thread is to blow the whistle on unrighteousness behavior in the church. You are the one trying to make it something never intended.

Perhaps I will send this link to the Dallas Morning News, the Fort Worth Star Telegram, the Houston Chronicle, the Austin Statesman, the Los Angeles Times...any one else you want to include? I will include the LSM and let them know that you insisted on reporting crimes. Of course the statute has run on the older ones and possibly the ones posted on this forum. We’ll see.

Nell

You mean you never meant to allege criminal activity?

If you are doing it because criminal activity is happening then what choice do you have?

Drake