Arthur M. Casci Testimony

[leastofthese]

Originally Posted by kumbaya

I don't know if I've ever read someone's writings that seem so contradicting. Everything gets so convoluted it's hard to even point out his errors in doctrine bc somewhere else, he seems to prove himself wrong.

Lee contradicting statement and talking in circles is precisely what allows those fallen to the teachings of Witness Lee to justify their found position. I remember sitting in a meeting when a sister began to bemoan the LSM way of speaking - that weird, yet ever present tonality - during a prophecy. She said at first it bothered her, then laid out how she had justified it being OK, in her opinion.

I was reading this recently, reminds me of many LSM church members - Self-justification has costs and benefits. By itself, it’s not necessarily a bad thing. It lets us sleep at night. Without it, we would prolong the awful pangs of embarrassment. We would torture ourselves with regret over the road not taken or over how badly we navigated the road we did take. We would agonize in the aftermath of almost every decision: Did we do the right thing, marry the right person, buy the right house, choose the best car, enter the right career? Yet, mindless self-justifcation, like quicksand, can draw us deeper into disaster. It blocks our ability to even see our errors, let alone correct them. It distorts reality, keeps us from getting all the information we need and assessing issues clearly.

That inability (or unwillingness) to see errors is a glaring issue within the LSM churches. Like the author says, it can draw us deeper into disaster... It draws many of those within the LSM churches to the creature, rather than the creator.

[aron]

Originally Posted by leastofthese

That inability (or unwillingness) to see errors is a glaring issue within the LSM churches. Like the author says, it can draw us deeper into disaster... It draws many of those within the LSM churches to the creature, rather than the creator.

THe problem with the LSM programme is not in the ingrained Asian culture. It's that the culture is sold as heavenly culture, and not in need of any correction.

So the ingrained cultural biases are not critically examined, and their erroneous effects are free to ripple through the network. The butterfly flapping its wings one place creates a tornado somewhere else. And everyone wonders where the tornado came from.

Interesting that when Hank Haanegraff went to China on the LSM dime he noted two strong tendencies to the believers: ignorance and zeal. See his notes in the "We were wrong" issue. Not too different from what Arthur M Casci summarised.

[kumbaya]

Originally Posted by aron

THe problem with the LSM programme is not in the ingrained Asian culture. It's that the culture is sold as heavenly culture, and not in need of any correction.

So the ingrained cultural biases are not critically examined, and their erroneous effects are free to ripple through the network. The butterfly flapping its wings one place creates a tornado somewhere else. And everyone wonders where the tornado came from.

Interesting that when Hank Haanegraff went to China on the LSM dime he noted two strong tendencies to the believers: ignorance and zeal. See his notes in the "We were wrong" issue. Not too different from what Arthur M Casci summarised.

Interesting. I’ve wondered how much Hank Hanegraff profited from his “closer look” at the local church.

[Bradley]

Originally Posted by kumbaya

Interesting. I’ve wondered how much Hank Hanegraff profited from his “closer look” at the local church.

Haha one time in Shanghai the brothers invited me to this fancy hotel for a lunch with HH. He struck me as unpleasant, aloof and totally unapproachable. Anyway there were about 20 brothers there and we had fellowship about stuff - one of the brothers owned the hotel, so because of his riches he was kind of a leading one, even though he hadn't been solid for very long.

Anyway they were totally wining and dining him. Lavish af.

[aron]

Originally Posted by Bradley

. . . .one of the brothers owned the hotel, so because of his riches he was kind of a leading one, even though he hadn't been solid for very long.

Bradley,

Have you ever heard the term 'guanxi network'? That's what this looks like. We are told that God is not a respected of persons (i.e. money, authority, position, status) but the guanxi network very much recognises and uses these things - they are intrinsic to the process of network building.

[TLFisher]

Originally Posted by aron

Bradley,

Have you ever heard the term 'guanxi network'? That's what this looks like. We are told that God is not a respected of persons (i.e. money, authority, position, status) but the guanxi network very much recognises and uses these things - they are intrinsic to the process of network building.

Isn't that very much related to "good material" trainees are taught to seek out. Not only finding ones who have "vision for the ministry" but are also having high income potential.

[kumbaya]

Originally Posted by leastofthese

Lee contradicting statement and talking in circles is precisely what allows those fallen to the teachings of Witness Lee to justify their found position. I remember sitting in a meeting when a sister began to bemoan the LSM way of speaking - that weird, yet ever present tonality - during a prophecy. She said at first it bothered her, then laid out how she had justified it being OK, in her opinion.

I was reading this recently, reminds me of many LSM church members - Self-justification has costs and benefits. By itself, it’s not necessarily a bad thing. It lets us sleep at night. Without it, we would prolong the awful pangs of embarrassment. We would torture ourselves with regret over the road not taken or over how badly we navigated the road we did take. We would agonize in the aftermath of almost every decision: Did we do the right thing, marry the right person, buy the right house, choose the best car, enter the right career? Yet, mindless self-justifcation, like quicksand, can draw us deeper into disaster. It blocks our ability to even see our errors, let alone correct them. It distorts reality, keeps us from getting all the information we need and assessing issues clearly.

That inability (or unwillingness) to see errors is a glaring issue within the LSM churches. Like the author says, it can draw us deeper into disaster... It draws many of those within the LSM churches to the creature, rather than the creator.

Scarily accurate. I experienced this yesterday with trying to talk to a family member still in the church. It’s a real thing.