The Apostolic Mob Of The Lord's Recovery - The Usurpation Of God's Throne

[PeterG]

Originally Posted by Nell

Did God initiate a "recovery"? Again, this is a man-made opinion. Did anything of the work of God ever need to be "recovered"?

Yes, of course things had to be recovered. Especially the gospel. Was what God did through Luther merely "man-made"??

[Nell]

Originally Posted by PeterG

Yes, of course things had to be recovered. Especially the gospel. Was what God did through Luther merely "man-made"??

It is called the “Protestant Reformation”. By definition, if God did it, it was not man made.

I see your point, but does anyone seriously believe Witness Lee “recovered” anything of the caliber of salvation through faith alone? Witness Lee’s “ministry” was so complicated, wordy and “Leeized” he was likely the only one who could comprehend it because he made it up through personal interpretation of scripture and called it “recovered.”

I’m saying that Church History has been defined by what men say it is rather than defined by God.

Nell

[PeterG]

Originally Posted by Nell

It is called the “Protestant Reformation”. By definition, if God did it, it was not man made.

I see your point, but does anyone seriously believe Witness Lee “recovered” anything of the caliber of salvation through faith alone? Witness Lee’s “ministry” was so complicated, wordy and “Leeized” he was likely the only one who could comprehend it because he made it up through personal interpretation of scripture and called it “recovered.”

I’m saying that Church History has been defined by what men say it is rather than defined by God.

Nell

Yes, church history is full of man-made nonsense. And I include the confused teachings of Witness Lee in this. But nevertheless, after salvation through faith alone, God also showed us baptism, holiness, spiritual gifts, and the universal priesthood anew. And in my opinion, he also showed us in the last century that he doesn't want denominations. Once they are abolished, we will be able to enjoy the New Testament conditions again. However, I am aware how much this contradicts evangelical thinking and that it may take a long time. But I am optimistic that the time will come when people will also view denominations as man-made nonsense, just as they once did with the sale of indulgences.

[Nell]

Originally Posted by PeterG

Yes, church history is full of man-made nonsense. And I include the confused teachings of Witness Lee in this. But nevertheless, after salvation through faith alone, God also showed us baptism, holiness, spiritual gifts, and the universal priesthood anew. And in my opinion, he also showed us in the last century that he doesn't want denominations. Once they are abolished, we will be able to enjoy the New Testament conditions again. However, I am aware how much this contradicts evangelical thinking and that it may take a long time. But I am optimistic that the time will come when people will also view denominations as man-made nonsense, just as they once did with the sale of indulgences.

You think denominations will someday be abolished? Where do these verses fit in?

Rev. 3: 14 And unto the angel of the church of the Laodiceans write; These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of God;
15 I know thy works, that thou art neither cold nor hot: I would thou wert cold or hot.
16 So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth.
17 Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked:
18 I counsel thee to buy of me gold tried in the fire, that thou mayest be rich; and white raiment, that thou mayest be clothed, and that the shame of thy nakedness do not appear; and anoint thine eyes with eyesalve, that thou mayest see.
19 As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous therefore, and repent.

Nell

[PeterG]

Originally Posted by Nell

You think denominations will someday be abolished? Where do these verses fit in?

Rev. 3: 14 And unto the angel of the church of the Laodiceans write; These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of God;
15 I know thy works, that thou art neither cold nor hot: I would thou wert cold or hot.
16 So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth.
17 Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked:
18 I counsel thee to buy of me gold tried in the fire, that thou mayest be rich; and white raiment, that thou mayest be clothed, and that the shame of thy nakedness do not appear; and anoint thine eyes with eyesalve, that thou mayest see.
19 As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous therefore, and repent.

Nell

I think the last epistle describes almost perfectly the era the of evangelical churches, including the so-called "local churches". In some way, they are the worst of all because they were rich in knowledge, even regarding the final step God wants to take with his people. As God's "little flock," they should have patiently taught the denominations about God's problem with them. They should have worked to overcome the problem, receiving people according to God's Son. Instead of this they messed it up. They became a denomination themselves, and a particularly cultic one.

[John1613]

So true! This is astonishingly sad. How can this dear group of believers behave this way? So many things they teach and say that do not exhibit the Lord's Body in any shape or way. How tragic.

I pray that the LC leadership and LSM repent! The church so needs to gather like this, and as the brother said, "they messed it up."

[Nell]

Originally Posted by PeterG

I think the last epistle describes almost perfectly the era the of evangelical churches, including the so-called "local churches". In some way, they are the worst of all because they were rich in knowledge, even regarding the final step God wants to take with his people. As God's "little flock," they should have patiently taught the denominations about God's problem with them. They should have worked to overcome the problem, receiving people according to God's Son. Instead of this they messed it up. They became a denomination themselves, and a particularly cultic one.

Do you think the "era of the evangelical churches" have anything to do with the fulfillment of end times prophecies?

[PeterG]

Originally Posted by Nell

Do you think the "era of the evangelical churches" have anything to do with the fulfillment of end times prophecies?

I see parallels to Laodicea.