Relationship

[gr8ful]

Originally Posted by DP0902

Thank you for sharing that with me. Yes, their questions are invading someone's personal life. Do you have any idea what will happen to FTT students once they had graduated from their training?

Hi. I went to the Full Time Training in Anaheim (FTTA) in the 1990s and have known people who have been before and since then. First of all, the "Consecration #7" issue (no boy/girl relationships) is serious enough that people discovered to have violated it have been removed from the training (and then invited to return to their church to pursue the relationship).

Secondly, after the FTTA, or actually towards the END of FTTA, the attention shifts strongly towards getting the trainees married. When I was there, and have heard this from others, too, we had several "4th term brother" and "4th term sister" meetings where the harsh restriction from having male-female relationships is lifted and the soon-to-be-graduated trainees are encouraged to pursue a spouse.

Unsurprisingly, the entire fellowship on finding a spouse is centered on finding someone of the same vision of God's Economy -- someone who can join to give their lives full-time to "Christ and the Church." The "trainees" are held in a high esteem (well, in SoCal, anyway) and the thought of "losing" a trainee to a non-Recovered spouse isn't pleasantly accepted as "God's Perfect Will."

I do know faithful members in the Local Churches who are married to someone met outside of the Lord's Recovery (and some who since marriage stopped meeting), but these are considered sub-par pairings -- as in, "oh, that's a shame." The couple isn't shunned, per se, but there's a definite "oh, we should do something to help our young people find a spouse in the church!" when such relationships happen. Also, I've been in prayer meetings where strong prayers were made for the non-meeting partner to be "gained" for God's Economy, and those prayers followed up with invitations to the couple to "come for dinner." I don't know if the effort to "gain" the non-meeting spouse ever subsides. It may, but it remains a sticky issue for a long time in the minds of everyone in the church around that couple -- especially if one spouse is intending to be a serving one.

More to the issue at heart, though, is a concern on how this "hiding the heart" is affecting your boyfriend in the FTT. Knowing that he's not respecting the sworn consecration and also can't openly be in such an important life-relationship might result in guilt, shame, and other painful feelings. One the one hand, hiding such a fact from the Training is hardly a great way to start one's "Service to the Lord," but on the other, feeling that he has to chose between the Lord and you...that's not a great way to start a life-relationship with someone. It's a shame that the pressure to conform to the "call" to attend the FTT is so strong one would be in such a situation to put God against love.

That may seem like a strong paragraph, but having been in the FTT, and having seen colleagues struggling with this very issue still lingers with me so many years later. One trainee had an emotional breakdown over his relationship with his fiancée, which he had to hide while he was in the training. I cannot imagine the stress this must have caused.

The official line from the FTT is along the lines of "we encourage health relationships and want to see brothers and sisters marry; however, just for the period of the two year FTT, we want trainees to be focused on the Lord and to set aside such plans until after the training. If one cannot put pursuing a spouse aside, we free them from the training so they can pursue such a relationship with a clear conscience." As if the incessant "Go to the training!" calls at every major LSM conference/training isn't putting enormous pressure on young people scared they won't measure up to be overcomers....

Hello, I am a former member and I remember watching a training/conference video at the meeting hall when I believe Ed Marks gave this example regarding marrying an outsider/non-LC member, he said "Stand on a chair. Now try to lift someone up. That's what it will be like if you marry someone who's not in the Church-life. It'll be easier for them to bring you down than for you to lift them up to the church-life." I'm paraphrasing but that's exactly what he meant. However, I have personally known LC members that were courting non LC members that were meeting and actually got baptized in the LC. They stopped meeting not too long after the wedding.

[Nell]

Originally Posted by gr8ful

Hi. I went to the Full Time Training in Anaheim (FTTA) in the 1990s and have known people who have been before and since then. First of all, the "Consecration #7" issue (no boy/girl relationships) is serious enough that people discovered to have violated it have been removed from the training (and then invited to return to their church to pursue the relationship).
…
As if the incessant "Go to the training!" calls at every major LSM conference/training isn't putting enormous pressure on young people scared they won't measure up to be overcomers....

Gr8ful,

I never really thought it was helpful to call the Local Church of Witness Lee a cult. But after reading this, what else…?

I can only think of two bits of advice.
RUN! Run away as fast as you can. Don’t look back.
PRAY! Pray for God to rescue anyone you love from this toxic place!

DP0902, I’m so sorry for the situation you and your friend face.

Nell

[Zezima]

Why don’t you meet with the LR?

[gr8ful]

Originally Posted by Zezima

Why don’t you meet with the LR?

To whom are you asking this question? I'll assume it's to me, since it's not clear .

I don't meet for a simple reason: I changed.

It wasn't until a few years after leaving I realized TLR (i.e., the LSM-lead Local Churches) were more than just a conservative Evangelical organization and had the definite marks of a sociological cult (doctrine aside, it's cultic in the way it functions as a society). And only recently have I realized that I wasn't "lead by the Lord" to meet with the LC as a college student, but rather was groomed and recruited by older adults specifically on the campus pursuing a method of recruiting vulnerable college freshmen to their group.

[Zezima]

Originally Posted by gr8ful

To whom are you asking this question? I'll assume it's to me, since it's not clear .

I don't meet for a simple reason: I changed.

It wasn't until a few years after leaving I realized TLR (i.e., the LSM-lead Local Churches) were more than just a conservative Evangelical organization and had the definite marks of a sociological cult (doctrine aside, it's cultic in the way it functions as a society). And only recently have I realized that I wasn't "lead by the Lord" to meet with the LC as a college student, but rather was groomed and recruited by older adults specifically on the campus pursuing a method of recruiting vulnerable college freshmen to their group.

Thanks for the reply but I meant the op.

There were a few unregistered on this post. I on response 6 and 9. Ron actually shared on marriage in message 11 I think. He said a wife be like Abigail who was a warrior wife. They say the church, but later on the overcomers will be the wife of Christ.

For your situation I mentioned that they want the men to take the lead. Ron said in marriage a brother should have decernment on whether to marry a sister. And, it depends on if the woman will come the way of Christ and the church. Basically into the Lord's recovery. And if not, he should drop her.

So basically, it's up to how serious he will take this. There could be a problem or none. Be at peace but it's up to how he will react. He could just possibly fine someone at the training. I'm just saying. I wouldn't put it past him. I know young people. Mainly after the training that got married quickly to other people in the church because they thought they were the certain age or getting to old and not married which others deem strange and weird.