Wake-up Letter to Minoru

Indiana · 11-15-2019, 01:53 PM

Excerpt
You have “the truth of the full gospel of God;” and you want people to hear it,
but you don’t care for the truth regarding Daystar’s devastation; the factors of
further decline; and the full picture and understanding of division.

www.MinoruChen.com

Ohio · 11-15-2019, 06:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Indiana

www.MinoruChen.com

Someone once said that if you google up your own name, you might be surprised at what you find.

UntoHim · 11-16-2019, 10:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Curious

For those floundering, their helplessness is compounded from multiple directions. Trying to live up to being "God in life and nature" but actually being under-resourced to even function normally is not an equation that can add to a good result. This from persons born-in, second generation LCers! They are supposed to be flagships for the cause, evidence of it’s ‘reality’!....yet another source of pressure to be a living example of a schema that just doesn’t work, because it’s not actually truth.

I brought this great post over to this thread because I believe that it hits upon the real reason why there is such a "low grade depression" among many Local Churchers - young, old and everywhere in between.

The problem is not Daystar. The problem is not opposition on the Internet. The problem is certainly not the saints "not getting into the ministry enough". Local Churchers are swimming in a vast sea of 25-50 year old messages from a guy who's been dead for over 22 years. The problem is that Local Churchers are starving. As Curious has aptly stated, LC members are "actually under-resourced". If Witness Lee's ministry was actually part of the New Testament ministry it would be doing what the New Testament ministry does - Feed, give life, be a light unto our path, show us the way of mercy, grace and peace. It would also reprove, rebuke and correct. And yes, it would bring us "the full Gospel of God". It is now painfully obvious that Witness Lee's ministry does none of these.

Maybe Lee's ministry did actually function partially under the New Testament ministry back in the good old days of Elden Hall. I think there is a lot of evidence that there was a certain blessing poured out by God himself to his seeking ones in America and some other places. And this blessing was not created by Witness Lee or his ministry, but rather despite him and his well-meaning, fanatical followers. Church history is replete with such movements that had a wonderful and blessed beginning, only to become sick and lifeless for lack of following the real source of God's blessing - God himself, his Word and obedience to his Holy Spirit. All these have been replaced by a man and his so-called "ministry of the age".

Minoru and others have called for revival in the Local Churches for decades. And Witness Lee called for revival for decades before him. The problem is that they are calling for a revival back to a time and place that we cannot not go back to anymore than we can go back to the time and place of Jesus and the original apostles. But we can partake in and participate in their ministry, which has been preserved for us in the pages of the holy Scriptures. We also have the promise of the Spirit of power, grace and truth. It is only the Word and only the Spirit of the living God which can bring revival.
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Freedom · 11-18-2019, 05:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by UntoHim

Minoru and others have called for revival in the Local Churches for decades. And Witness Lee called for revival for decades before him. The problem is that they are calling for a revival back to a time and place that we cannot not go back to anymore than we can go back to the time and place of Jesus and the original apostles. But we can partake in and participate in their ministry, which has been preserved for us in the pages of the holy Scriptures. We also have the promise of the Spirit of power, grace and truth. It is only the Word and only the Spirit of the living God which can bring revival.

The LC is a system that has failed its members. And I think that includes members from just about every demographic, including longtime members, church kids, and even newcomers. Like Curious stated, it might be expected that success with the church kids would be evidence that the LC was something special. Quite to the contrary, church kid retention rate is something that they might want to take an honest look at.

I remember seeing a video a while back where Minoru went into some of the statistics related to the churches in southern California. It was eye-opening to say the least and it got me thinking as to why Minoru and the other blendeds just don't seem to get it.

They have the information in front of them. They have the numbers. They see that a problem exists, but they can't (or aren't willing to) pinpoint it to its origin. For example, Minoru was around in the late 80's when LC members left in their masses, and he had somewhat of a hand in that. Later on the blendeds go quarantine churches/leaders in an entire region of the U.S. and they think nothing of it. Then they wonder why their numbers are down.

Sons to Glory! · 11-19-2019, 09:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Freedom

They have the information in front of them. They have the numbers. They see that a problem exists, but they can't (or aren't willing to) pinpoint it to its origin. For example, Minoru was around in the late 80's when LC members left in their masses, and he had somewhat of a hand in that. Later on the blendeds go quarantine churches/leaders in an entire region of the U.S. and they think nothing of it. Then they wonder why their numbers are down.

I would caution regarding using numbers alone as an indicator of whether the Lord is with a group. The Lord and His life are attractive, but numbers of people don't always make a good indicator. (e.g., the RCC has over a billion)

12-01-2019, 11:59 PM

There is a sense, among us who are still meeting, that the Lord is bringing us on to a more advanced level of “enjoyment”. That letter is not far fetched from what’s to come in the LC in the coming years. Just wait and see. There is going to be a big “release” in the coming years. I’ve left for some time, and have come back recently. - a young working saint.

OBW · 12-02-2019, 04:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by UntoHim

Minoru and others have called for revival in the Local Churches for decades.

There it is . . . MTLCGA! Make the Local Churches Great Again!

And like the other "great again" slogan, the unanswered question is when you (me, whoever) thinks that was. If it ever was. Typically it is presumed to be some time before most can remember.

Truthseeker · 12-02-2019, 11:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OBW

There it is . . . MTLCGA! Make the Local Churches Great Again!

And like the other "great again" slogan, the unanswered question is when you (me, whoever) thinks that was. If it ever was. Typically it is presumed to be some time before most can remember.

So, it becomes Babylone the Great instead.

aron · 12-03-2019, 03:32 AM

The last sentence of the post being considered says, "I've left for some time, and have come back recently. - a young working saint."

The person left for some time - now, we don't know this person's circumstances but most leave with disillusionment. What was promised never got delivered. So they go out, seeking the temporary comforts and distractions of the world.

So why do they return, to what didn't work the first time? Why re-imbibe the failed promises of old? I believe it is this: they want something "more", and know it's somehow connected to the God of the Bible, and remain convinced that LSM has the "proper interpretation" of that promise.

The perceived alternative is what many young people on this forum write of - giving up on God altogether. The assumption in both cases is that God is accessed only through LSM interpretation of scripture. Either it must be embraced in toto, or 'God' rejected altogether.

But many of us who've gone on to read the Bible apart from it's current pen-builders (we have God in our theological box) have come to see that these are false alternatives.

Boxjobox · 12-02-2019, 09:52 AM

I would say this is a big part of the problem, and I don't know if it's been discussed: WL made such a big thing, and rightly so, about not having a church "name", but just The Church, the church in xxx city, you call yourself Mrs. Jones but you're married to Mr. Smith, etc. Yet he had no problem brand naming his "ministry". Instead of being part of "the ministry", he made a divisive decision to create his own brand name, made a business of LSM, and sold it to "the church", and in fact insisted that no one not under his brand and control had any part in "the recovery". This whole process still exists today. How is God supposed to honor such a divisive organization/business. Seems like the way of recovery would be for those involved in LSM to repent of their divisiveness and that the local assemblies turn back to scripture and to the Holy Spirit.

11-15-2019, 01:53 PM	#1
Indiana Member Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 713	Wake-up Letter to Minoru Excerpt You have “the truth of the full gospel of God;” and you want people to hear it, but you don’t care for the truth regarding Daystar’s devastation; the factors of further decline; and the full picture and understanding of division. www.MinoruChen.com

12-01-2019, 11:59 PM	#6
Unregistered Guest Posts: n/a	Re: Wake-up Letter to Minoru There is a sense, among us who are still meeting, that the Lord is bringing us on to a more advanced level of “enjoyment”. That letter is not far fetched from what’s to come in the LC in the coming years. Just wait and see. There is going to be a big “release” in the coming years. I’ve left for some time, and have come back recently. - a young working saint.

12-03-2019, 03:32 AM	#9
aron Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Natal Transvaal Posts: 5,631	Re: Wake-up Letter to Minoru The last sentence of the post being considered says, "I've left for some time, and have come back recently. - a young working saint." The person left for some time - now, we don't know this person's circumstances but most leave with disillusionment. What was promised never got delivered. So they go out, seeking the temporary comforts and distractions of the world. So why do they return, to what didn't work the first time? Why re-imbibe the failed promises of old? I believe it is this: they want something "more", and know it's somehow connected to the God of the Bible, and remain convinced that LSM has the "proper interpretation" of that promise. The perceived alternative is what many young people on this forum write of - giving up on God altogether. The assumption in both cases is that God is accessed only through LSM interpretation of scripture. Either it must be embraced in toto, or 'God' rejected altogether. But many of us who've gone on to read the Bible apart from it's current pen-builders (we have God in our theological box) have come to see that these are false alternatives. __________________ "Freedom is free. It's slavery that's so horribly expensive" - Colonel Templeton, ret., of the 12th Scottish Highlanders, the 'Black Fusiliers'

12-02-2019, 09:52 AM	#10
Boxjobox Moderated Member Join Date: Feb 2015 Posts: 829	Re: Wake-up Letter to Minoru I would say this is a big part of the problem, and I don't know if it's been discussed: WL made such a big thing, and rightly so, about not having a church "name", but just The Church, the church in xxx city, you call yourself Mrs. Jones but you're married to Mr. Smith, etc. Yet he had no problem brand naming his "ministry". Instead of being part of "the ministry", he made a divisive decision to create his own brand name, made a business of LSM, and sold it to "the church", and in fact insisted that no one not under his brand and control had any part in "the recovery". This whole process still exists today. How is God supposed to honor such a divisive organization/business. Seems like the way of recovery would be for those involved in LSM to repent of their divisiveness and that the local assemblies turn back to scripture and to the Holy Spirit.