Narrow view of the church by Local Church

[jesusislord]

It's ridiculous they still hold the false view of one church one city. They are dividing themselves from 99% of the member of the body practically. When they talk about the feelings of the members and the reality of the body of Christ, why they don't see the rest 99% of the member?

Is the Lord happy of this stand? Will they go back to the bible and look at others theologian view regarding this matter? All the negative things could have been avoided if they have fellowship more with other groups. Now they're even more closed to themselves with one stream of divine flow. It is so hard to make sense of it, why the Lc people don't see the problem with that. I remember brother Nee recognize the breathens as the pararrel work of God back in the days, but why it has became one divine stream and the stream have to be with the Lc? (less than one percent of the entire Christian in the world)

[byHismercy]

Originally Posted by jesusislord

It's ridiculous they still hold the false view of one church one city. They are dividing themselves from 99% of the member of the body practically. When they talk about the feelings of the members and the reality of the body of Christ, why they don't see the rest 99% of the member?

Is the Lord happy of this stand? Will they go back to the bible and look at others theologian view regarding this matter? All the negative things could have been avoided if they have fellowship more with other groups. Now they're even more closed to themselves with one stream of divine flow. It is so hard to make sense of it, why the Lc people don't see the problem with that. I remember brother Nee recognize the breathens as the pararrel work of God back in the days, but why it has became one divine stream and the stream have to be with the Lc? (less than one percent of the entire Christian in the world)

I don't think the Lord is happy with the division caused.
We have

One Father
One Lord Jesus
One Spirit
One faith
One baptism
One hope of His calling
One body

To discard the members who cannot toe the LSM line......if they can't see their sin now, He will be faithful to reveal it to them someday. If in anything you are otherwise minded.......

[Ohio]

The doctrine of "one church one city" is not about oneness but power.

Initially we could not know this fact because we believed that the proponents of this new teaching were godly and spiritual men. But like everything else in our Christian walk, time is needed for testing. (I Thess 5, Rom 12)

The actions of LSM have proven, beyond the shadow of a doubt, that my statement above is true. As I always say about politicians, "pay no attention to what they say, but what they do."

Originally Posted by Ohio

The doctrine of "one church one city" is not about oneness but power.

Initially we could not know this fact because we believed that the proponents of this new teaching were godly and spiritual men. But like everything else in our Christian walk, time is needed for testing. (I Thess 5, Rom 12)

The actions of LSM have proven, beyond the shadow of a doubt, that my statement above is true. As I always say about politicians, "pay no attention to what they say, but what they do."

Can you explain further? The members are so supportive of the doctrine where most of the Christians don't buy or see. But I do hope one day they will wake up and repent, they are digging a rabbit hole when they don't learn from the rest of the body.

[Hannah]

From the time of Jesus' death until the start of the local churches it was all just degraded christianity, standing on nothing. Thank goodness for the LC because now we can be the right kind of Christians from the right kind of church the Bible talks about.

Oh wait....

It's really kind of mind boggling and once you are out, or on your way out, you wonder how you held tight to some of these beliefs that now seem ludicrous. It's a bit jarring.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by Unregistered

Can you explain further? The members are so supportive of the doctrine where most of the Christians don't buy or see. But I do hope one day they will wake up and repent, they are digging a rabbit hole when they don't learn from the rest of the body.

Consider the primary addendum to their "one church one city" policy -- that only the apostles (i.e. The Anaheim leadership) can appoint elders in all the LC's.

They read the Bible like no other Christians on earth -- all through the lens of LSM's teachings. Not just are they controlled by the teachers in Anaheim -- the Mother of all LC's -- but all other teachers are just too "degraded" to even listen too.

Originally Posted by Ohio

Consider the primary addendum to their "one church one city" policy -- that only the apostles (i.e. The Anaheim leadership) can appoint elders in all the LC's.

They read the Bible like no other Christians on earth -- all through the lens of LSM's teachings. Not just are they controlled by the teachers in Anaheim -- the Mother of all LC's -- but all other teachers are just too "degraded" to even listen too.

This is a much larger issue! Sounds like they have no way to turn back says if they hold on the wrong teaching. When they're not open to other groups they can't be corrected.

[aron]

Originally Posted by jesusislord

It's ridiculous they still hold the false view of one church one city. They are dividing themselves from 99% of the member of the body practically. When they talk about the feelings of the members and the reality of the body of Christ, why they don't see the rest 99% of the member?

Is the Lord happy of this stand? Will they go back to the bible and look at others theologian view regarding this matter? All the negative things could have been avoided if they have fellowship more with other groups. Now they're even more closed to themselves with one stream of divine flow. It is so hard to make sense of it, why the Lc people don't see the problem with that. I remember brother Nee recognize the breathens as the pararrel work of God back in the days, but why it has became one divine stream and the stream have to be with the Lc? (less than one percent of the entire Christian in the world)

Two points can be made here, one's a bit of a larger issue but still relevant, and the second's more specific to the LC as I experienced it.

First, any fellowship that bases itself on dividing from others will again be divided as its members eventually follow suit. Each fresh "revelation" or "truth" leads to a fresh division, or multiple divisions. It goes all the way back, that I can see. There was the "robber council" of Chalcedon where several church polities split off (Syrian, Armenian, Egyptian, Ethiopian etc), then the "Great Schism" of the East/West split, then the Anglicans, Protestants, Wesleyans, Baptists, Congregationalists etc etc. We've all read the histories, I'm sure. Each group finds some reason to leave the others, only to find their own members use the same reasoning to leave them. So it has been with The Little Flock/Lord's recovery, then with the splits of Titus Chu, Dong Yu Lan, who themselves get defections, etc.

In this, I see the "Lord's recovery" as merely a continuation of a long process of alienation and separation, often with acrimony (churches in the GLA area suing each other for possession of the physical assets, broadsides sent out by each party [DYL v/v LSM] charging the other with nefarious and egregious spiritual sins). So, nothing new under the sun, there.

The second thing, more to the point of the post quoted above, is "taking the stand" or "taking the ground" for all the members of the faith in that particular city, whilst not having anything to do with any of them! Does anyone recall this? I remember it slowly dawning on me that our "taking the ground" meant to be cloistered off in one building, putting our chairs in a circle and reading the writings of one ministry in Anaheim California. Everyone else in our town was off limits. No Christian was worthy of our time. If they had a "name" they were Babylon and to be shunned. If they didn't have a name they were a "free group" and needed to get on board with the One Body of Christ (us). Nobody, and I mean nobody, out there in our city got fellowship from us. You had to come in our circle and sit in our chairs in our building, and say, "Amen" when we read a footnote from the RecV.

Any attempt to reach out and acknowledge other believers was condemned by RK as "Building bridges to Babylon". I don't remember the date of that speech but I heard it, once. Of all the divisions, or sects, that have arisen over the past 2,000 years, the Local Church is one of the most divisive, adversarial, and sectarian that I can think of. Certainly in the top 10%. A "narrow view" indeed.

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by aron

Any attempt to reach out and acknowledge other believers was condemned by RK as "Building bridges to Babylon". I don't remember the date of that speech but I heard it, once. Of all the divisions, or sects, that have arisen over the past 2,000 years, the Local Church is one of the most divisive, adversarial, and sectarian that I can think of. Certainly in the top 10%. A "narrow view" indeed.

The higher the doctrine seems to reach for believers to cling onto, the bigger the snare it becomes. The one-church-one-city idea sounds so good and biblical, so surely it must be the way to oneness. But this forgets THE key thing - there is only one Way. Besides HIM there is no oneness, and no teaching, regardless of how good it seems, can ever replace Him.

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

I was listening to Steve Gregg on the radio today (ever listen to him?

I listen to Steve Gregg's "The Narrow Path" Q&A radio show often … he was very helpful in opening my eyes to the nonsense taught in the local churches. One day he gave an answer to a question regarding what is a type or shadow? He said "A shadow is not the reality of a thing … a shadow is in a sense darkness (the absence of light). Consider this if the physical ground of locality (the city - like Jerusalem) is just a type or shadow the local church members are taking a stand in darkness. 1 John 1:5 states … God is light and in him is no darkness at all. How can you Abide in the Vine if you are taking a stand on/in darkness. James 1:17 when talking about God the Father says … with whom is no variableness, neither shadow of turning. For a Christian to take a stand on a shadow (i.e. the physical city) while simultaneously criticizing another Christian for taking a stand on a shadow (i.e. Sabbath day) is the HIGH PEAK OF HYPOCRISY. I took the picture posted here to a meeting one day and some of the local church members understood my point … some of the others saw it and had fire and brimstone coming out of their ears and nostrils. It appears that a picture is truly worth a thousand words …

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by KL.

I listen to Steve Gregg's "The Narrow Path" Q&A radio show often … he was very helpful in opening my eyes to the nonsense taught in the local churches. One day he gave an answer to a question regarding what is a type or shadow? He said "A shadow is not the reality of a thing … a shadow is in a sense darkness (the absence of light). Consider this if the physical ground of locality (the city - like Jerusalem) is just a type or shadow the local church members are taking a stand in darkness. 1 John 1:5 states … God is light and in him is no darkness at all. How can you Abide in the Vine if you are taking a stand on/in darkness. James 1:17 when talking about God the Father says … with whom is no variableness, neither shadow of turning. For a Christian to take a stand on a shadow (i.e. the physical city) while simultaneously criticizing another Christian for taking a stand on a shadow (i.e. Sabbath day) is the HIGH PEAK OF HYPOCRISY. I took the picture posted here to a meeting one day and some of the local church members understood my point … some of the others saw it and had fire and brimstone coming out of their ears and nostrils. It appears that a picture is truly worth a thousand words …

Now that is an interesting way of looking at it! "Taking a stand on the shadow" and therefore not in the reality is, in effect, standing in darkness. Good illustrative picture too - thanks for sharing!

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by KL.

One day he gave an answer to a question regarding what is a type or shadow? He said "A shadow is not the reality of a thing … a shadow is in a sense darkness (the absence of light). Consider this if the physical ground of locality (the city - like Jerusalem) is just a type or shadow the local church members are taking a stand in darkness. 1 John 1:5 states … God is light and in him is no darkness at all. How can you Abide in the Vine if you are taking a stand on/in darkness. James 1:17 when talking about God the Father says … with whom is no variableness, neither shadow of turning. For a Christian to take a stand on a shadow (i.e. the physical city) while simultaneously criticizing another Christian for taking a stand on a shadow (i.e. Sabbath day) is the HIGH PEAK OF HYPOCRISY. I took the picture posted here to a meeting one day and some of the local church members understood my point … some of the others saw it and had fire and brimstone coming out of their ears and nostrils. It appears that a picture is truly worth a thousand words …

Great points KL, and btw, Welcome to the LCD Forum.

Please consider registering. Your inputs are valuable to the discussion. We have no great teachers here, rather the truth is made known, "here a little, there a little," (Isa 28.10) as we expose all the leaven of the Recovery.

You have just connected these verses for me Col 2.16-17 and John 4.21-23. Jesus and Paul both faced the same battle which could be summarized as the great transition from SHADOWS to REALITY. Jesus told the Samaritan woman that the hour is coming when the true worshipers will not worship in a physical place, neither the "right" mountain, nor the right city, nor the right temple/building. Jesus basically defined all true worship -- if you can see it, touch it, or go to it, then it's not real worship -- because real worship and real oneness is in the Spirit.

Apostle Paul went further in Colossians saying that all these things, including feasts and celebrations, are just shadows of things to come. They are not the real thing. Only Christ is the reality, or body, of these shadows.

For the LC's to use city boundaries or fellowship with the LSM Blendeds as their ground of oneness is the same in principle as using the Sabbath to unify us. Instead of uniting us in oneness, both simply divide the body of Christ further.

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by Ohio

Great points KL, and btw, Welcome to the LCD Forum.

Please consider registering. Your inputs are valuable to the discussion. We have no great teachers here, rather the truth is made known, "here a little, there a little," (Isa 28.10) as we expose all the leaven of the Recovery.

You have just connected these verses for me Col 2.16-17 and John 4.21-23. Jesus and Paul both faced the same battle which could be summarized as the great transition from SHADOWS to REALITY. Jesus told the Samaritan woman that the hour is coming when the true worshipers will not worship in a physical place, neither the "right" mountain, nor the right city, nor the right temple/building. Jesus basically defined all true worship -- if you can see it, touch it, or go to it, then it's not real worship -- because real worship and real oneness is in the Spirit.

Apostle Paul went further in Colossians saying that all these things, including feasts and celebrations, are just shadows of things to come. They are not the real thing. Only Christ is the reality, or body, of these shadows.

For the LC's to use city boundaries or fellowship with the LSM Blendeds as their ground of oneness is the same in principle as using the Sabbath to unify us. Instead of uniting us in oneness, both simply divide the body of Christ further.

Well put!

And interesting that you would allude to the 7 Day Adventists and their insistence on adhering to the sabbath shadow. It seems I've heard about them in various ways the last few days (in fellowship, on here and also on the radio). The SDA and the LC have much in common. They both live in the shadow (as KL points out); they adhere to and elevate a dead, so-called prophet; they separate themselves (elitism) from other believers based on their shadow-based doctrine; I think the SDA has a strong, central command & control; many are leaving because of these things, etc.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

Well put!

And interesting that you would allude to the 7 Day Adventists and their insistence on adhering to the sabbath shadow. It seems I've heard about them in various ways the last few days (in fellowship, on here and also on the radio). The SDA and the LC have much in common. They both live in the shadow (as KL points out); they adhere to and elevate a dead, so-called prophet; they separate themselves (elitism) from other believers based on their shadow-based doctrine; I think the SDA has a strong, central command & control; many are leaving because of these things, etc.

Yes, they have their verses. I know of one former LC brother who is now an SDA minister. "Let each be persuaded in their own minds." (Rom 14.5) It's truly incredible when I consider all the diverse directions that ex-LCers have gone!

We must conclude that, in some way, we all have errors in our thinking, our own personal belief system. None of us have a perfect belief system. Loving God and loving our neighbor really saves us from much error. It's so easy to love doctrines, but try to love my neighbors! But doctrines, on the other hand, are so great. They make us feel important, and better than the next guy. And they can puff us up, and sometimes that feels so good!