What's it like in ex-LSM controlled local churches?

[HERn]

Thought I would start a new thread on what's it like to be in a fellowship that is no longer under the control of LSM and the being blended brothers? My conversation with StG on another thread prompted me. I wonder how many ex-LSM local churches there are?

[TLFisher]

Originally Posted by HERn

Thought I would start a new thread on what's it like to be in a fellowship that is no longer under the control of LSM and the being blended brothers? My conversation with StG on another thread prompted me. I wonder how many ex-LSM local churches there are?

• the church formerly known as The Church in Rosemead
• The Church in Moses Lake
• Westminster Church Assembly
• many Great Lake area churches that parted with LSM
• a church in Accra, Ghana were Ransford Ackah met prior to his passing
• a church in Scottsdale, Arizona

I had only met with Westminster Church Assembly once in 2010. Format reminded me of pre-1987 local churches.

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by Terry

• the church formerly known as The Church in Rosemead
• The Church in Moses Lake
• Westminster Church Assembly
• many Great Lake area churches that parted with LSM
• a church in Accra, Ghana were Ransford Ackah met prior to his passing
• a church in Scottsdale, Arizona

I had only met with Westminster Church Assembly once in 2010. Format reminded me of pre-1987 local churches.

Add to that Durham, NC.

I am aware of "cross-pollination" with many of these gatherings, which is always good!

What can I say about Scottsdale ekklesia other than:
"This is my rest forever - here will I dwell,
for the Lord has chosen Zion,
He has required it for His habitation.
He will abundantly bless her provision,
He will will satisfy her poor with bread.
He will clothe her priest with salvation,
and her saints shall shout aloud for joy!"

Okay, that just came out . . . but much truth there! The gatherings are open and any can testify of their own experience of Christ. What can I say - This is quite good. 5-6 brothers rotate giving a message on Sunday, which is also really good (I truly don't have a favorite - they're all good.)

There are three brothers taking the lead. Each one of them is just sweet. (yes, I'm saying that about another brother . . .) I've said it several times on here that I've never experienced excessive overt authority in 20+ years here, or even covert authority. Everyone is free to pursue the Lord and know His Anointing within.

Several who have visited here have called our little group, "The Singing Church" - we do enjoy our singing! Songs are culled from all over the place. Usually there is just a guitar and a piano. The songs always have a lot of meaning, and there are often testimonies relating the experience of Christ from the songs.

Various smaller groups meet throughout the week. I participate with a handful of bros on Tuesday evenings, where we fellowship anything concerning us, then pray for one another and then go out to eat. There's a larger brother breakfast each Thursday morning, with no agenda, which attracts ones from various other groups. But boy, we're almost always amazed how the Spirit flows and speaks there among all of us!

So that's the 30,000' view of Scottsdale Church (I think that's the "official" name). I am brought to tears thinking how faithful the Lord has been to bring me here - and keep me here for over 20 years! I can't take credit - He is my one boast! THANK YOU JESUS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Jo S]

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

What can I say about Scottsdale ekklesia other than:
...

StG, I'm curious. Do you guys over there in Scottsdale still retain doctrines of Nee and Lee?

[Sons to Glory!]

Originally Posted by Jo S

StG, I'm curious. Do you guys over there in Scottsdale still retain doctrines of Nee and Lee?

I thought I'd addressed that already.

So I would say some of us are still "recovering" from The Recovery, but not really sure exactly how to answer this. Concerning having WL doctrines, not actively doing this at all. (the phrase comes up sometimes about "not throwing the baby out with the bathwater," so everyone's pretty aware of the WL errors) Nee's "The Normal Christian Life" comes up very occasionally, but as far as any set "doctrines" I'd have to say no.

I don't know if this will help answer the question, but some saints here recently started a lending library in one of the property buildings. It already has hundreds of donated books from all over the Christian spectrum. Last I saw there were just a couple WL books (forget the titles) and perhaps 3-4 Nee books.

Below is copied from the SC website, and this probably constitutes as much of an "official" statement that I could come up with from here:

What We Believe

1. The Bible is the complete divine revelation of God, inspired by the Holy Spirit. God is both One and Triune.
2. The Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit simultaneously coexist and mutually indwell one another from eternity to eternity.
3. The Son of God became incarnate as the man, Jesus of Nazareth, born of a virgin, that He might be our Redeemer, Savior and Lord.
4. This Jesus is a genuine and complete man, Who was born without sin and lived a sinless life on earth, fully dependent upon God the Father, to make Him known to all mankind.
5. Jesus died on the cross as a sacrifice for our sins and shed His blood for the accomplishment of our redemption. Eternal salvation is based on faith in Him alone and is not based on any good work of our own.
6. Jesus Christ, after being buried for three days, resurrected bodily from the dead and ascended to the heavens, where He is both Lord and Christ, seated at the right hand of the throne of God.
7. After Christ's ascension, He poured out the Holy Spirit and baptized into one Body, those who have believed in Him.
8. The Holy Spirit is operating to convict sinners, to regenerate believers in Christ, to baptize them with power for service, and to indwell them for Christ to be their life, in order to build them up as the Body of Christ, the Church.
9. All genuinely born-again believers are members of Christ's one Body and fellowship is to be enjoyed with one another irrespective of differences.
10. At the end of the age, Christ will come back to rapture those who have believed in Him, to execute His judgments, to set up His millennial kingdom, and to ultimately usher in a new heaven and a new earth for eternity.

Whatest thou thinkest - are we overly tainted with TLR?

[Jo S]

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

Whatest thou thinkest - are we overly tainted with TLR?

Before I give you an answer, can I ask if active members of Titus Chu fellowship with your location?

[stillseekingtruth]

Originally Posted by HERn

Thought I would start a new thread on what's it like to be in a fellowship that is no longer under the control of LSM and the being blended brothers? My conversation with StG on another thread prompted me. I wonder how many ex-LSM local churches there are?

In the GLA, it resembled those churches that appeal to young people. There was 'rock' type music and it got realy crazy. At one conferences, the young people swarmed the door to get to the front row. There was a play where they ahd somone act like a "Santa Claus" Jesus. Everytime the 'believer' needed something, this "Jesus" would walk by and give it to him. What a crock .God gives and God takes away. He knows for what we have need, not what we want.

They gave a message about endurnce. The brothers chose about 5 brothers from different localities to stand in a bucket of ice water. Whoever endured to the end won an x-box or whatever the lastest game console was. I have 2 problems with that: 1. They chose all brothers (statiscally who plays video games more?) and 2. Why would you give away something so worldy to represent endurance in Christ? We need to forsake all for Christ. It was a mess of confusion. A young sister told me about her abusive mother, how she ws dragged across the floor by her hair and beaten on a regular basis. The brothers blew it off as Chinese culture.

They had something called Mountain Top and Ignite. It was basicallly rock concerts and soulish 'fun' in the name of spirituality. They did that thing where they had a 'contemporary service' and then the more up-to-date exciting service. I was in the midst of being black-balled at the time. I remember also, TC was mocking the SSOT calling it the Summer School of What what. He called us second generation, lazy, lousy, and sloppy. He also called for new songs to be written. That was about the time I wsn't allowed to meet with the Chinese speaking saints without permisson. I'm not Chinese, but I wanted to learn the language. I was assigned where to go and I couldn't deviate without a letter. There was a lot of overt control. I was also in meetings where we would read books from mainstream Christiantiy about how to gain young people by methods and ways. I spoke up and was quickly shut down.

[Hannah]

Originally Posted by stillseekingtruth

In the GLA, it resembled those churches that appeal to young people. There was 'rock' type music and it got realy crazy. At one conferences, the young people swarmed the door to get to the front row. There was a play where they ahd somone act like a "Santa Claus" Jesus. Everytime the 'believer' needed something, this "Jesus" would walk by and give it to him. What a crock .God gives and God takes away. He knows for what we have need, not what we want.

They gave a message about endurnce. The brothers chose about 5 brothers from different localities to stand in a bucket of ice water. Whoever endured to the end won an x-box or whatever the lastest game console was. I have 2 problems with that: 1. They chose all brothers (statiscally who plays video games more?) and 2. Why would you give away something so worldy to represent endurance in Christ? We need to forsake all for Christ. It was a mess of confusion. A young sister told me about her abusive mother, how she ws dragged across the floor by her hair and beaten on a regular basis. The brothers blew it off as Chinese culture.

They had something called Mountain Top and Ignite. It was basicallly rock concerts and soulish 'fun' in the name of spirituality. They did that thing where they had a 'contemporary service' and then the more up-to-date exciting service. I was in the midst of being black-balled at the time. I remember also, TC was mocking the SSOT calling it the Summer School of What what. He called us second generation, lazy, lousy, and sloppy. He also called for new songs to be written. That was about the time I wsn't allowed to meet with the Chinese speaking saints without permisson. I'm not Chinese, but I wanted to learn the language. I was assigned where to go and I couldn't deviate without a letter. There was a lot of overt control. I was also in meetings where we would read books from mainstream Christiantiy about how to gain young people by methods and ways. I spoke up and was quickly shut down.

It's clear you didnt personally like what was done in the GLA. Your description sounds like how most people in the local church talk negatively about any other church or denomination.

[stillseekingtruth]

Originally Posted by Hannah

It's clear you didnt personally like what was done in the GLA. Your description sounds like how most people in the local church talk negatively about any other church or denomination.

That’s because it was how they talked about it. The denomination I’m in doesn’t promote such things as rock concerts or ‘worldly’ means to gain people.either way, I don’t care much how other people worship or what they do in their meetings. I just want to be where the Lord wants. To be honest, I have a very bitter taste in my mouth about ‘church.’

[Hannah]

Originally Posted by stillseekingtruth

That’s because it was how they talked about it. The denomination I’m in doesn’t promote such things as rock concerts or ‘worldly’ means to gain people.either way, I don’t care much how other people worship or what they do in their meetings. I just want to be where the Lord wants. To be honest, I have a very bitter taste in my mouth about ‘church.’

I understand and know bitterness. My heart is with yours.

Churches use all kinds of methods. Sometimes they miss the mark and other times it's just right. Then of course our own preference comes into play nd that's OK too, IMHO.

Jesus was radical in his day too.

I was raised in the GLA, cleveland specifically. I rememeber the remarks TC made about the YP. I was a YP in Anaheim, also, and heard similar negative remarks about both the YP and the serving ones in Cleveland. I know several who took the lead with MT Top and Ignite were desperate for the YP because they were leaving in droves, ,not just leaving church but also a faith. The standard LsM approved SSOT for many was not leading us to christ. There were so dynamic salvation those summers and real experiences of christ and for some church kids it was the first of their lives. The first summer of the gospel odyssey 80 people got saved. An excited young college brother shared that at the summer training and he was told it didnt matter because they didnt join the local church. YP who didnt care much about God became interested and began seeking, some for the first time. It was in part because of these "worldly" practices.

Personally, I didnt really want much to do with it, for a myriad of reasons, one being that I was heading out the local church door.

Ultimately we each have to follow where there is life and peace.
In love,

Hannah

[stillseekingtruth]

Originally Posted by Hannah

I understand and know bitterness. My heart is with yours.

Churches use all kinds of methods. Sometimes they miss the mark and other times it's just right. Then of course our own preference comes into play nd that's OK too, IMHO.

Jesus was radical in his day too.

I was raised in the GLA, cleveland specifically. I rememeber the remarks TC made about the YP. I was a YP in Anaheim, also, and heard similar negative remarks about both the YP and the serving ones in Cleveland. I know several who took the lead with MT Top and Ignite were desperate for the YP because they were leaving in droves, ,not just leaving church but also a faith. The standard LsM approved SSOT for many was not leading us to christ. There were so dynamic salvation those summers and real experiences of christ and for some church kids it was the first of their lives. The first summer of the gospel odyssey 80 people got saved. An excited young college brother shared that at the summer training and he was told it didnt matter because they didnt join the local church. YP who didnt care much about God became interested and began seeking, some for the first time. It was in part because of these "worldly" practices.

Personally, I didnt really want much to do with it, for a myriad of reasons, one being that I was heading out the local church door.

Ultimately we each have to follow where there is life and peace.
In love,

Hannah

Thank you, Hannah for the response. I, also, was in the Cleveland area. That is sad, sad, sad the LSM brother discouraged the young serving one. There was always something more you should’ve/could’ve done. Unless the new one fully subscribed to coming to the meetings you didn’t do a good enough job at ‘converting’ them.

I wonder if the YP were leaving the faith because of all the confusion. On one side you had someone whispering in your ear to follow LSM and the other to follow TC or branch out and start your own thing. It’s impossible to serve LSM and TC. It was shocking when ones got rid of their LSM life studies and what not. The LSM Brothers would say that at the end times people will have a voracious appetite for the ministry so if we didn’t want it and it ended it up in the thrift stores someone would come and devour it because, as we all know, Lee’s ministry is the highest peak truth and blah blah blah. Ridiculous.

[Raptor]

Originally Posted by Hannah

It's clear you didnt personally like what was done in the GLA. Your description sounds like how most people in the local church talk negatively about any other church or denomination.

I heard a story about how some people in a tribe in Africa were saved by the preaching of missionaries. Soon after in one of the worship services the missionaries had some kind of music band playing along for the service. None of the newly saved people sang or wanted to participate. After, the missionaries asked them why they did not join in. The new ones asked the missionaries in return, why do you call the demons with your music and drums like we used to do before we got saved?....The tribe was not in the local church.