Finally I decided to not join Full time training.

[Truthseeker]

Few months ago, I wrote some tread concerning pressure on full time training by some LCers. I have some trouble with its dress code because I have my preference style of dressing. In disguise of one new man, dress code (which asks everyone to dress the same ) is unbiblical and pro-conformity. They said I could wear my favorite dresses at weekend (where there is no training). First, I decided to join FTTM because of some spirits which pressed meto do so. But in my inner life, it notified me that somethingis weird and abnormal. Some things isn't of divine life and nature but of human effort and regulations. Lastly, one day before my departure to FTTM center, I decided to not go to that legalistic training. This is my final solution now.

By Truthseeker- "Lastly, one day before my departure to FTTM center, I decided to not go to that legalistic training. "

What is FTTM?

[UntoHim]

I believe Truthseeker is referring to Full Time Training Malaysia FTTMY.Org or maybe Full Time Training Malabon Philippines FTTMALABON.Org
-

[aron]

Key words: "pressure" and "conform". It is a human effort, with a human result.

It is the off-shoot of a focus on things other than Jesus Christ. Believe me, learning of him is a full-time, life-long affair, and serving Him as Master, King, Teacher and Lord is an unfolding joy.

Instead here we see a spirit sent in to spy out our liberty in Christ Jesus, and to bring us into slavery again.

[awareness]

It's clear to me that the FTT is a indoctrination into their mind control.

[Truthseeker]

Full-time training of middle aged

[aron]

Originally Posted by aron

Key words: "pressure" and "conform". . . here we see a spirit sent in to spy out our liberty in Christ Jesus, and to bring us into slavery again. cf Galatians 2:4

An emphasis on things other than Jesus the crucified and resurrected Lord and Savior isn't a necessary addition to our gospel and our faith but a distraction from it.

Teaching that's focused on the Body is a distraction from Christ. The Body exists only as much as it's focused on (connected to) its Head, which is Christ. No more and no less - as soon as it's consideration becomes Itself, the enemy comes in. The house-of-mirrors game begins. The Body quickly becomes Abomination and Desolation. The Fall re-asserts itself.

The Bride only should see the Husband; as soon as the Bride begins to regard Herself, "Here I sit a Queen" she's bound for Satan's Land of Delusion. See the Harlot in Revelation 17 - full of "High Peak" claims. Zero reality.

The Church begins to teach its members to "see the Church" instead of it's Shepherd and Savior, and the Church begins to decay. Note the RCC and Anglicans both used such ideational strongholds as fulcrums to leverage the lives and thoughts and purses of so many.

This supposed Recovery which promotes its own teachings and supposed High Peak Truths, is merely fronting an all-too-human ministry, which is a front for an all-too-human minister, who's fronting a fallen spirit that wants to spy out our liberty in Christ Jesus and bring us back into subjection again.

So we're duped to focus on "the ground" or "the oneness" instead of Jesus Christ, and what comes along with this? Ancillary teachings sprout like "one unique ministry per age" and "one deputy God" and "handing over". Comes with the territory (pun intended). And when the self-appointed Guru siphons off church funds for his own children, some of whom are arguably rather unspiritual, we'll shrug and say, "Hey, nobody's perfect." And when the promoted High Peak Teaching, say "God's Economy", necessitates panning scripture as fallen human concepts in order to cohere, or conversely sees the OT prophet typifying "NT believers enjoying Grace", while ignoring the clear NT exegetical precedent of the Obedient Son of Man restoring humanity, we have a big hole in the interpreted scripture where Jesus should be. Jesus should be our unwavering focus but He's nowhere in sight here - either "NT believers enjoying grace" or "merely David's mixed sentiments".

And we're supposed to conform to that?

Btw, I looked in the RecV and found the footnote in Revelation 1:20 saying the local assemblies have to be "absolutely identical" with "no differences whatever" . . what's it based on? The footnote says it's because the seven lampstands are "absolutely identical". Really? Where does scripture say that? Did you ever see a calyx? Or a pomegranite? Or nets of lilies? Do you think the two pillars Jachin and Boaz were "absolutely identical"? Or the twelve oxen holding Solomon's Sea of Bronze? Everything of life has variation. Did the Four Living Creatures look identical? Even, "star differs from star in glory". The only thing is, here on earth, when we Christians talk of differerentiation and variation, with the fall in Genesis 3 in mind, we'd wisely take the least place; Jesus taught this, repeatedly. But instead we see teachings come forth as props and levers for ones with ambition, eager to be Spiritual Giants, and to be First in the Church.

And we're supposed to be subject to this fiasco? To submit?

The Full Time Training is a trap made by those who want to be great in this age. The more people they can put under them, the better they feel about themselves. But they will not be great in the next age. Jesus made this abundantly clear - this is the way of the gentiles, not the Way to the kingdom of God. They'll get their biography read into the Congressional Record, they'll get a big Tombstone. They have their reward.

The Full Time Training says that the biblical truth is, Women Can't Teach. Yet this position ignores that the movement itself was founded by Margaret Barber teaching Watchman Nee. She had no "head covering". . . not to mention Madame Guyon, Jessie Penn-Lewis, Peace Wang, Dora Yu, Ruth Lee, Mary MacDonald, and so forth - "close co-workers" and "fellow builders" all. This ministry of the Kingdom of Self teaches out of both sides of its mouth, and we're supposed to ignore these glaring discrepancies? "Just be simple" was the song we used to sing - yeah, it takes a lot of training to get that simple. A lot of training in yielding to continued pressure. Training in thought-suppression. Training in brainlessness.

Galatians 2:5 "to them we did not yield in submission even for a moment, so that the truth of the gospel might be preserved for you"

[aron]

Post #8, put more simply, is this: the Church, the Building, the Bride, and the Body have a reality that is derivative of and relational to the One Who Is. Pursuing them as ontological entities in their own right is to chase ghosts and vapours. Same with "enjoying grace" or "oneness" or any such. One may experience such blessings but only if one forgets them completely and dedicates all one's attention on Jesus Christ.

[Drake]

Originally Posted by Truthseeker

Few months ago, I wrote some tread concerning pressure on full time training by some LCers. I have some trouble with its dress code because I have my preference style of dressing. In disguise of one new man, dress code (which asks everyone to dress the same ) is unbiblical and pro-conformity. They said I could wear my favorite dresses at weekend (where there is no training). First, I decided to join FTTM because of some spirits which pressed meto do so. But in my inner life, it notified me that somethingis weird and abnormal. Some things isn't of divine life and nature but of human effort and regulations. Lastly, one day before my departure to FTTM center, I decided to not go to that legalistic training. This is my final solution now.

Based on your considerations above I believe your decision is best for all concerned.

Drake

[leastofthese]

Originally Posted by Drake

Based on your considerations above I believe your decision is best for all concerned.

Drake

What about Truthseekers comments make you say that? Why would it be best for them not to go? Why is it better for the FTTM that they don’t attend?

[Drake]

Originally Posted by leastofthese

What about Truthseekers comments make you say that? Why would it be best for them not to go? Why is it better for the FTTM that they don’t attend?

LofT,

It’s obvious. If not to you, then tell us why you think it would be better for her to go in spite of her misgivings.

Drake

[leastofthese]

Originally Posted by Drake

LofT,

It’s obvious. If not to you, then tell us why you think it would be better for her to go in spite of her misgivings.

Drake

What is obvious Drake?

*edit* I think you know that I wouldn’t suggest that anyone attend the FTT and be subjected to the teaching of Witness Lee and the culture of the LSM. So I guess that is how I’d answer your question - er - request.

[Trapped]

While the FTT in question here is not the FTTA, I do feel like I need to mention that the FTT itself (at least the FTTA, from which I assume most of the practices and rules of the other FTT's are derived) is very clear that not everyone should go (https://www.ftta.org/prospective-tra...ung-people.php)

I know there may be pressure from saints or elders or whoever, I understand and do not deny that that exists in some places. But the FTTA website, for example, is very clear that people should not go to "fix up" your spiritual life, or because your parents or serving ones want you to go, or because other people you want to hang out with are going.

It clearly states, without judgment, that the full-time training is not for everybody. To me, another way of saying "don't go just because your parents or serving ones want you to" is "if YOU don't want to go, don't go!", or "only go if you WANT to go!"

I say this never having gone myself and also having gone through the time of feeling pressured to go, and even having "consecrated" myself to go as a young person from the co-workers having the young people stand up and make a show of being committed to go (my memory fails me but I think it was possibly during a "young adults" time in the semi-annual trainings years ago). I felt bad for years that I didn't make good on my consecration until I realized that I didn't know at the time what I was consecrating myself to as an impressionable young person, and it wasn't the Lord asking me to consecrate myself.

I have plenty of issues with many of the things the training does (rules, regulations, atmosphere, curriculum of Nee/Lee only, I could say many things) and claims (producing normal functioning members, constituting with the truth). But just like any other institution, it can run how it wants to run, within the law, and the rules and regulations are admittedly very clear going in. Additionally, the doors are pretty wide open to attend short-term so you know what you are getting into, and doing so is encouraged, at least where I've been, even many states away from California.

If you don't want to go, or more importantly don't feel led of the Lord to go, don't go. And be at peace.

High school and college students are under constant pressure to get trained by the LC. Here is one example:

Every summer, the college training provides a rich opportunity for the Lord to gain more ground in our students, including those who just graduated from high school. These trainings have greatly influenced our students’ personal pursuit, church life, and involvement with the gospel work on their campuses. Please pray that the Lord would overcome all obstacles and release our college saints to attend this special time of training. This year’s college training is July 13-19 at Camp Penuel. The topic will be “A New Heart and a New Spirit.”

http://www.collegetraining.org

The Summer School of Truth ( Topic: Church -- The Vision and Building Up of the Church) will be from August 2-12 at Camp Penuel in Kingston, NY.

High school trainings and college trainings are all pushing them toward the FTT. In the LC they are not subtle about it either. And then their parents and grandparents are also putting pressure on them.

[awareness]

Originally Posted by Unregistered

High school and college students are under constant pressure to get trained by the LC. Here is one example:



High school trainings and college trainings are all pushing them toward the FTT. In the LC they are not subtle about it either. And then their parents and grandparents are also putting pressure on them.

For the low basement bargain price of $375.00. Only $405 if late. Sign up now, and we'll thrown in a free Witness Lee sticker.

Oh for the days when it was free. I remember eventually a "donation" of fif'ty bucks. Little did I know that, it wasn't free. It cost someone big money. Where that came from is the question. They certainly knew how to get lots of free labor. Everybody chipped in.

Back in the day when Lee wasn't "all that." ... when some free-wheeling early ones caught on to the one-church-one-city NT model ... but didn't hook their wagon to Lee ... but their fruit meant they had to still be accepted. Those were the days. The Jesus movement days. The fruit was easy pickin's back then. I think I was low hangin'.

For some obsessive neurotic reason, perchance, I like to keep up with the LC, to see what's changed down thru the years. Now, thanks to this thread, I see that they've progressed to Events, and FTT's.

That certainly wasn't what "The Recovery" meant to me. Now I must ask, recovery to what?!? Was that what the early Christian church was doing, back in the original one-church-one-city days ; Nee's and Lee's foundational model of The Recovery?

I smell something that doesn't match up to scripture. How much cognitive dissonance does it take?