The Gospel of my salvation ...

[tentmaker]

This would be my very first post to the board. I have watched from afar since (pretty much) the beginning of its formation, but have felt not to participate until this morning (although I have thought about doing it for quite some time now). I meet with the church and have done so for 40 years. I'm a brother who grew up in southern California. Although I've been around for a while my thoughts and considerations on some of these matters that you all discuss here might surprise you - but then again perhaps not.

Finding a suitable username seemed a small challenge. I chose the user name "tentmaker_21", based upon Acts 18:3: "and because he (Paul) was of the same craft, he lodged with them and worked; for by their occupation they were tentmakers", " i.e. tentmaker" = my aim for what I 'm doing here, and "_21" based upon this being the 21st century version of. Of course I'm not a real tentmaker (know nothing about it actually). Figuratively, I'm of the same craft as you (and still not very good at it) and desire to lodge and work with you all in various discussions, if you know what I mean. I'm retired now, but by trade held the job of mechanical engineer and did design work with prominent U.S. companies for a good part of my working life (45 years). I was very fortunate to say the least, and I am very grateful to the Lord for this.

Anyways - I'm happy to finally join you! All I can say at the moment is "Christ is Victor", no matter what my/your situation is today or will be tomorrow …

[tentmaker]

2) As I said, I meet with the church. I have been reading the posts on this website pretty much since day one of its creation. I also read Jim Moran's writings when he was active and still alive, back in the 90's, so I am not new to this sort of thing. Up to now I have not joined for two reasons, the main one being I just didn’t have the time and the second being the occasional infighting and arguing amongst yourselves (or that’s how I took it) that caused me to back way off. There are times when I said enough is enough and didn’t look in here for a period(s) of time. There are many dear ones who post here but a couple of you brothers seem downright determined to blow some away who don't somehow share your viewpoint, particularly the sisters. Or so it seems to me. I joined now because it seems to have settled down a bit and many of the issues you discuss are quite relevant to today's situation. I appreciate the honest, heartfelt and revealing writings of the many of you, the older brother Lisbon in particular (and many, many others also - just saying, please don't be offended).

[UntoHim]

Originally Posted by tentmaker_21

There are many dear ones who post here but a couple of you brothers seem downright determined to blow some away who don't somehow share your viewpoint, particularly the sisters. Or so it seems to me. I joined now because it seems to have settled down a bit and many of the issues you discuss are quite relevant to today's situation. I appreciate the honest, heartfelt and revealing writings of the many of you, the older brother Lisbon in particular (and many, many others also - just saying, please don't be offended).

Thank you so much for this constructive criticism. Many of us have been hashing out these matters online for over a decade now. I think sometimes we forget there REALLY ARE people out their lurking and reading. No doubt many of our "honest, heartfelt and revealing writings" come out pretty ruff and tumble at times. As you probably have noticed, the forum is mainly populated by former LC members, and is sorely in need of brothers and sisters such as yourself to come and give their points of view. So welcome! Thanks again for taking the time to register and post, and we look forward to your valuable contributions.

-

[tentmaker]

UntoHim ... You're welcome and Thank You. Thank you for all your labors in keeping this board active and monitored. It is appreciated very much.

5) a little more for today ...
* I saw the Max R thing unfold in 1978. It bothered me greatly with all the goofiness going on. That was a strange time and caused us to reconsider. But the leading ones stood up to act appropriately and little damage was done to me. Some, of who I thought were strong brothers left though, never to come back so that I am aware of.

I saw the "new way" develop in the mid 80's and participated to some extent in it. The book "Words of Training For The New Way" came out in 1987. It was based on a series of messages Bro Lee gave in Taiwan. That book really bothered me as there are things written in there that are questionable, yet there was/is no one to question about it, if you know what I mean. You just kept and keep your mouth shut. That was a strange time for me as the so-called fermentation was taking place and there was not a clear sky above anyone, or so it seemed. I was there during the Thanksgiving Conference in 1988 in Pasadena. I do remember Francis Ball closing one meeting stating that "he would rather be an ostrich with his head in the sand". (We had Francis at our home for dinner one night before that meeting but nothing like that was ever discussed). I did not know what he was talking about, having his head in the sand. I was not made aware of the turmoil that was going on then as I was working quite a bit then and was not into the main stream of fellowship so I missed out on a lot of that, and glad I did actually. I just dove into my work. Looks like one could get all the details of that period of time on this website … lol.

Regarding your website here, if I were to speak the things I want to say I'd need at least an hour to just get started. I have a lot to say but will stop here and would consider this a brief introduction ….

Take care and stay in his grace ....

Brother G.L.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by tentmaker_21

Up to now I have not joined for two reasons, the main one being I just didn’t have the time and the second being the occasional infighting and arguing amongst yourselves (or that’s how I took it) that caused me to back way off. There are times when I said enough is enough and didn’t look in here for a period(s) of time. There are many dear ones who post here but a couple of you brothers seem downright determined to blow some away who don't somehow share your viewpoint, particularly the sisters. Or so it seems to me.

Welcome to the forum, tentmaker_21!

Guilty as charged! I grew up in a large family with four brothers and sisters, (four of each) so "occasional infighting and arguing" is absolutely "normal" to me. Sorry it turned you off for so long. I've had to apologize many times in my life, so I prolly should do it again.

I too was a M.E. whose first training was Revelations in the summer of '76. I really was carried away in the Spirit, experiencing a miracle of being delivered from cigarettes, and yet to be honest, many unhealthy things were sown into my heart, which I must correctly identify today as leaven.

West of the Missouri? Never heard that expression before! Anyways, I look forward to hearing what you have to say.

[tentmaker]

Regarding the infighting and arguing wasn't thinking of you when I posted that . I hope that when I post in the future one doesn't take something I say that way .... lol.

There is leaven in the church, but it is hidden (Matt 13:33). There is no escaping it because it is not visable. Not much is said about that is there?

What's an M.E mean again? Can't come up with the meaning at the moment. Probably something real easy .....

Yes, west of the Missouri, but don't go to far.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by tentmaker_21

What's an M.E mean again?

Mechanical Engineer

[tentmaker]

Originally Posted by Ohio

Mechanical Engineer

Aaahhh, of course … didn't even consider that … and it's not getting better as I get older ...


As one M.E to another, Thanks for sharing that.

[tentmaker]

About myself … I'm a nobody and would prefer to keep it that way. I met the Lord in the 1950's, when I was a young boy, 5 or 6 years old, in a small trailer park village near the Mexican border where my folks lived (in very hard times). There in the village lived there a dear missionary family who served the Lord in Mexico (White American missionaries from Minnesota). The trailer park was their humble U.S. home. They had a son, Timo (Timmy), who was my age and we played together when they were home in the U.S. At those times, in the evenings, they would gather people together, whosoever would come, around a small clothes line area to sing gospel songs and preach the gospel. They loved and served the Lord Jesus Christ no matter where they were at, in the U.S or Mexico. They lived in the sufferings of Christ and in poverty but the Lord Jesus was first place in their lives and he (the Lord) took good care of them. (I have a couple stories I could pass on – incredible things that happened, but on a small scale - (Zech 4:10)). My recollections of them was that they were happy people even living in such sparse conditions. I’m not sure how many serving ones live this way today (by real faith) but that, at a young age, had some effect on me. They brought me to the Lord with a very simple gospel message of Jesus. Call it the “low gospel” if you will, but it was the gospel of my salvation and I am still very appreciative of it. Their living, which seemed to be by the peace which is way beyond my understanding, continued to have some influence on me into my teenage years, which was a big thing for me looking back (in the 60's) and, like I said, do very much appreciate it. Eventually Timo's dad married my wife and I (in the 70's) and he was my best man at our wedding - long time ago now … lol. Although his dear folks have passed, Timo, whom I still speak with, serves the Lord to this day in similar manner as his folks (to the calling to which he was called), but is not and has never been (and probably never will be) associated with WL/LSM.

[tentmaker]

4) For me and the LC, we (my wife and I) came in around the time of the Revelation training, in 1976, so I am beginning the 4th decade. Time flies. Back then I/we were seeking Christ and desiring to know him, his word and his purpose with those who were of the same mind. The meetings back in those days were very dynamic (versus being very static to which we were in at the other place at the time). If you got to the meeting hall 15-20 minutes early you sat in the way back of the building. I am sure many of you remember those days. It seems quite opposite today. My wife and I came out of a well known "denomination" and it took us a while to understand and accept this way, the whole LC meeting style. What attracted us was the Word of God and how it was opened up (particularly the book of Genesis), how it was appreciated and discussed amongst all who were there, which was mostly young people, our age or a bit older. The enjoyment of the Lord was real and operating. The attendees generally controlled a good portion of the flow of the meetings and the elders (in the locality we lived in anyways) were true overseers, i.e. not showing how big their muscles and fists were when they were offended by some little thing, but if something was not right they handled it with grace in a spirit of meekness. At least in our place. They seemed real shepherds, not the CEO, CFO, COO, etc. mindset of some of the leaders in some of the localities today.