The Church in Indianapolis?

seeking1 · 08-18-2011, 03:22 PM

I stumbled on a site the other day www.jesuslifetogether.com/. At a glance it looked and sounded pretty good. After doing a little more digging I found that this site is operated by a goup that calls themselves "The Church in Indianapolis", their leader is a man named Mike Peters. Although I don't see any direct connection to Witness Lee, I do see some eerie paralells with this group and the groups associated w/ Lee, e.g., ground of locality doctrine, pecking order, charismatic leader (apostle), booklets, and a host of damaged, disenfranchised ex-members. So, I was wondering if anyone had any added insight on this group?

08-18-2011, 04:27 PM

Yes, I am familiar with them. Ran into them a number of times over the years. Your initial concern is spot-on. Things you'll find there: the superiority of their group's revelation, condemnation of fallen Christianity (that means whoever is not among them), lots of unwritten rules, "organic" style talk, a clear clear clear leader, and last but not least, people who have gotten out of it and are glad to have done so.

Makes you wonder why we can't just believe in an awesome Jesus and accept being the plain New Testament church, regardless of its size, how it looks, how it conducts its services, etc. People are so bent on having an awesome church blueprint instead, and marginalizing Jesus into a cheerleader for that blueprint.

aron · 08-18-2011, 07:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mordecai

People are so bent on having an awesome church blueprint ...and marginalizing Jesus into a cheerleader for that blueprint.

Too true, in my observation and experience. Perhaps the joy of salvation begins to wane, after the first bliss, and we begin to pine for something more.

So we begin to fit Jesus into our plans. My strong sense is that "Christ and the church" is to leave your first love. And certainly "the ministry", "God's recovery", "God's present move", "the Body", etc continue this trend away from the original path.

seeking1 · 08-18-2011, 07:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mordecai

Yes, I am familiar with them. Ran into them a number of times over the years. Your initial concern is spot-on. Things you'll find there: the superiority of their group's revelation, condemnation of fallen Christianity (that means whoever is not among them), lots of unwritten rules, "organic" style talk, a clear clear clear leader, and last but not least, people who have gotten out of it and are glad to have done so.

Makes you wonder why we can't just believe in an awesome Jesus and accept being the plain New Testament church, regardless of its size, how it looks, how it conducts its services, etc. People are so bent on having an awesome church blueprint instead, and marginalizing Jesus into a cheerleader for that blueprint.

Wow! It's amazing how subtle deceit can be. Even the video on the site just seemed wholesome and genuine. Thanks for the heads up, and for saving me from investing anymore time in vetting their material.

seeking1 · 08-27-2011, 07:33 AM

Dear P.S.,
Thank you for the excerpt. I must say that I also didn’t find anything subtle or deceitful about it. However, one could pull a thousand others like it out of the LSM, Mormon, and Jehovah Witness materials. Excerpts aren’t the issue here. Now, I’ll admit I made my judgements based on some initial “scratch the surface” reading and research but, what I found wasn’t reassuring. So, based on that AND comments found on this forum it would be WISE to ask “ If it looks,walks and quacks like a duck, do you really need to spend more time find out if it’s a duck?”. We all know the answer to that question. You brought out that the “main” difference between LSM and the CII was that they didn’t charge for their material but, would you care to address any of the concerns that I brought up like: their super apostle?, abuse of authority?, use of tier system?, all the damaged ex-members?
As for the litmus test, only the Lord knows. The heart is deceitful above all things, and it is exceedingly corrupt, who can know it?

09-26-2011, 04:03 PM

Yes, they get very defensive if you say, sniff, or suspect anything negative. Then they judge YOUR heart. I'm thinking the Priestly Scribe already assumes you won't pass THEIR litmus test. Pretty presumptuous to say that THEIR excerpt is a litmus test for ALL our hearts, making them the judge of us all.

Great response, seeking1

09-28-2011, 09:59 AM

btw, having been in the CII group and knowing how they operate, there is MUCH in the above excerpt that IS SUBTLE.

Just in the first few lines alone it's an attempt to make you fearful if you don't allow the leadership to point things out in your life, mostly non-moral things that have nothing to do with scripture, but the bait has already been taken, so the person in bondage and deception, confused and fearful will surrender their entire will to the authority of Mike Peters and his lieutenants.

"And the way satan does stuff…it’s always with mirrors where he tricks, deceives, justifies, and accuses others in order to justify self. And you are very susceptible to that if you don’t live exactly the way Jesus said to live here and embrace Truth the way Jesus said to embrace it..." This quote above is full of subtleties if you are in bondage to their authority. You are fearful of being deceived by Satan if you don't do things the way "Jesus" says. Only the thing is, it's not Jesus, it's the wishes of Mike Peters and those that think like he has trained them to think. Also, many people there are filled with doubts and questions so if you even begin to express them, you are guilty of the other things in the excerpt:

"If there are any “soft” spots in your heart for anything that you are holding onto, that you are lingering in, that you’re justifying yourself in or comparing to others in—then satan will find you out. And the storms will come and they will show what you’re worth. And it will always be “somebody else’s” fault because satan will make sure that you can feel that way about it. He will send you a great number of teachers to tell you what your itching ears want to hear. And, in fact, Paul said that if you don’t love the Truth—if you don’t agape the Truth, but you prefer the other stuff—that God Himself will send you a powerful delusion so that you will believe the lie."

If you know anything about mind control, you will see the subtleties there. It's an attempt to squelch free thinking and any resistance toward the questionable demands made on you.

Can you see it now?

08-18-2011, 03:22 PM	#1
seeking1 Member Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: Ohio Posts: 33	The Church in Indianapolis? I stumbled on a site the other day www.jesuslifetogether.com/. At a glance it looked and sounded pretty good. After doing a little more digging I found that this site is operated by a goup that calls themselves "The Church in Indianapolis", their leader is a man named Mike Peters. Although I don't see any direct connection to Witness Lee, I do see some eerie paralells with this group and the groups associated w/ Lee, e.g., ground of locality doctrine, pecking order, charismatic leader (apostle), booklets, and a host of damaged, disenfranchised ex-members. So, I was wondering if anyone had any added insight on this group?

08-18-2011, 04:27 PM	#2
Mordecai Guest Posts: n/a	Re: The Church in Indianapolis? Yes, I am familiar with them. Ran into them a number of times over the years. Your initial concern is spot-on. Things you'll find there: the superiority of their group's revelation, condemnation of fallen Christianity (that means whoever is not among them), lots of unwritten rules, "organic" style talk, a clear clear clear leader, and last but not least, people who have gotten out of it and are glad to have done so. Makes you wonder why we can't just believe in an awesome Jesus and accept being the plain New Testament church, regardless of its size, how it looks, how it conducts its services, etc. People are so bent on having an awesome church blueprint instead, and marginalizing Jesus into a cheerleader for that blueprint.

08-27-2011, 07:33 AM	#5
seeking1 Member Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: Ohio Posts: 33	Re: The Church in Indianapolis? Dear P.S., Thank you for the excerpt. I must say that I also didn’t find anything subtle or deceitful about it. However, one could pull a thousand others like it out of the LSM, Mormon, and Jehovah Witness materials. Excerpts aren’t the issue here. Now, I’ll admit I made my judgements based on some initial “scratch the surface” reading and research but, what I found wasn’t reassuring. So, based on that AND comments found on this forum it would be WISE to ask “ If it looks,walks and quacks like a duck, do you really need to spend more time find out if it’s a duck?”. We all know the answer to that question. You brought out that the “main” difference between LSM and the CII was that they didn’t charge for their material but, would you care to address any of the concerns that I brought up like: their super apostle?, abuse of authority?, use of tier system?, all the damaged ex-members? As for the litmus test, only the Lord knows. The heart is deceitful above all things, and it is exceedingly corrupt, who can know it?

09-26-2011, 04:03 PM	#6
Unregistered Guest Posts: n/a	Re: The Church in Indianapolis? Yes, they get very defensive if you say, sniff, or suspect anything negative. Then they judge YOUR heart. I'm thinking the Priestly Scribe already assumes you won't pass THEIR litmus test. Pretty presumptuous to say that THEIR excerpt is a litmus test for ALL our hearts, making them the judge of us all. Great response, seeking1

09-28-2011, 09:59 AM	#7
Unregistered Guest Posts: n/a	Re: The Church in Indianapolis? btw, having been in the CII group and knowing how they operate, there is MUCH in the above excerpt that IS SUBTLE. Just in the first few lines alone it's an attempt to make you fearful if you don't allow the leadership to point things out in your life, mostly non-moral things that have nothing to do with scripture, but the bait has already been taken, so the person in bondage and deception, confused and fearful will surrender their entire will to the authority of Mike Peters and his lieutenants. "And the way satan does stuff…it’s always with mirrors where he tricks, deceives, justifies, and accuses others in order to justify self. And you are very susceptible to that if you don’t live exactly the way Jesus said to live here and embrace Truth the way Jesus said to embrace it..." This quote above is full of subtleties if you are in bondage to their authority. You are fearful of being deceived by Satan if you don't do things the way "Jesus" says. Only the thing is, it's not Jesus, it's the wishes of Mike Peters and those that think like he has trained them to think. Also, many people there are filled with doubts and questions so if you even begin to express them, you are guilty of the other things in the excerpt: "If there are any “soft” spots in your heart for anything that you are holding onto, that you are lingering in, that you’re justifying yourself in or comparing to others in—then satan will find you out. And the storms will come and they will show what you’re worth. And it will always be “somebody else’s” fault because satan will make sure that you can feel that way about it. He will send you a great number of teachers to tell you what your itching ears want to hear. And, in fact, Paul said that if you don’t love the Truth—if you don’t agape the Truth, but you prefer the other stuff—that God Himself will send you a powerful delusion so that you will believe the lie." If you know anything about mind control, you will see the subtleties there. It's an attempt to squelch free thinking and any resistance toward the questionable demands made on you. Can you see it now?