My poor analogy for the assembly

YP0534 · 08-06-2008, 11:26 AM

In the entire world, there is only one McDonald's corporation. This is the universal aspect of McDonald's. Universal. Corporate.

At the same time, there are thousands and thousands of local McDonald's retaurants, probably one very near to you. Each of them is locally owned and operated.

Now, it is true that all of the McDonald's restaurants originated in a single McDonald's restaurant long ago. In a sense, when you go into any McDonald's, you are going into the one unique original McDonald's. They still sell the same hamburger and cheeseburger as they always did.

But there are a couple of things to recognize about the arrangement of McDonald's.

First of all, there is no such thing as a universal McDonald's restaurant. The very concept is nonsensical.

Secondly, if you want a hamburger, even if you can find the McDonald's corporation, they don't have any hamburgers there. If you want a hamburger, you must go to your local restaurant.

I understand that the analogy is not quite right in some of the implied details but I'm only making a point in it.

The reason the assembly is so important is that it is practical. Obviously, the Body is something universal but when we try to take something that is inherently local and make it into a universal meaning, we're missing the point of it's being local in the first place. The very God of the universe is to be found on display in the assemblies of the saints. If you take those verses that say "assembly" and "universalize" them, you miss the whole point of the thing being something about practical assembling and deprive yourself of the light on God's purpose among us in our meetings.

We don't want to ignore that the Lord, as the Head, has His Body. Far from it! Instead, we want to put the full emphasis on the fact the assembly IS His Body, the fullness of the One who fills all in all.

I hope this could help you.

Grace be with your spirit.

countmeworthy · 08-06-2008, 06:28 PM

Interesting analogy. I think this applies to many of the religious organizations out there...RCC..the Baptists, Methodists, Presbyterians, AOGs, etc... not just the LC.

I like 'assemblying' together in large groups for the following reasons:

1) Praise & Worship of our KING

2) Praying together..AS the Holy Spirit leads..for where 2 or more are gathered, there HE is in our midst. I believe there is power in prayer.

3) For conferences on a particular subject matter.

Most of us on this board & others like this SHOULD be teaching & bringing the up the younger ones in Christ. We ought to be praying for the Lord to bring us together with like minded Christians & brethren who are truly strong in the Word, the Faith & are filled with the Love of God and the Power of the Holy Spirit. We should be encouraging each other, learning from one another through our studying the Word together and in our alone time with our Precious LORD Jesus.

YP0534 · 08-07-2008, 04:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by countmeworthy

Interesting analogy. I think this applies to many of the religious organizations out there...RCC..the Baptists, Methodists, Presbyterians, AOGs, etc... not just the LC.

Well, I think you missed my point completely, so maybe I didn't make it as well as I thought I did.

Yes, in the world there are so many religious denominations, including the Local Church, and they do indeed all have organizational structures that follow that of business corporations because they are in fact worldly institutions.

What I was attempting to illustrate, though, is the relationship between the genuine Body of Christ and the saints meeting in a practical way as the assembly, specifically in a distinguishing way so that the Body was seen as plainly different from a religious denomination.

The key distinction between a religious organization and the Body of Christ is that there are always "heads" of religious organizations but there is only one Head in the Body of Christ, which is Christ Himself.

The saints assembling and displaying Christ in reality under His unique headship is the reason that we say that the assembly is His Body. But if you try to build up the Body you simply could not do it. You would only build yet another denomination, built once again on the concept of "universal church." Instead, we should simply focus on building ourselves together in Christ with the saints we meet wherever we are. Then the building of the Body will happen spontaneously as a consequence.

countmeworthy · 08-07-2008, 07:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by YP0534

Well, I think you missed my point completely, so maybe I didn't make it as well as I thought I did.

What I was attempting to illustrate, though, is the relationship between the genuine Body of Christ and the saints meeting in a practical way as the assembly, specifically in a distinguishing way so that the Body was seen as plainly different from a religious denomination.

......there is only one Head in the Body of Christ, which is Christ Himself.

I don't think I was as far off as you think I was YP0534.

I assemble with members of the Body of Christ all the time. I hang out with them at home, in the car, at their homes. Sometimes I meet brethren in Christ whom I have never met at grocery stores..and we hit it off, fellowship some, pray some. Some ...actually most, I have not run into again.

I don't follow a forumla although I sometimes go 'to church' for a service.

These types of 'meetings' are a practical way for me/us to assemble.

Am I on the right tract with your thread now?

YP0534 · 08-07-2008, 07:12 AM

Oh, yes.
I thought you were thinking my analogy was about the religious denominations.
I guess I misunderstood you!

Guest1 · 08-06-2008, 06:34 PM

and also the 'universal' should not be made local.. i know you said that very concept is nonsensical. but some still try and all christains are local not just those that "take the ground" i even hate using that terminology.. sorry..

YP0534 · 08-07-2008, 05:07 AM

Quote:

and also the 'universal' should not be made local.. i know you said that very concept is nonsensical. but some still try and all christains are local not just those that "take the ground" i even hate using that terminology.. sorry..

My whole point is that universal should not be and in reality could never be made local.

This is the first big problem with my analogy, the implication that such a thing could happen. Obviously, if McDonald's Corporation wants to introduce a new kind of sandwich in all of its local restaurants, it can do that. And they will prescribe precisely the new way of making sandwiches after coming up with the correct formula in a laboratory test kitchen. But the Body of Christ is not this way and I think most believers understand this, even if you and I know of some Christians who think taking orders from a central headquarters is the right way to follow God. Their error originates in believing in a "unversal church" which has a human leadership that can wield the authority of the Head.

I agree. There is nothing to do called "taking the ground." If you try it, you will only succeed in taking something away from yourself. Such language is erroneous, nonsensical and divisive.

aron · 08-07-2008, 10:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by YP0534

Kat, my whole point is that universal should not be and in reality could never be made local.

This is the first big problem with my analogy, the implication that such a thing could happen. Obviously, if McDonald's Corporation wants to introduce a new kind of sandwich in all of its local restaurants, it can do that. And they will prescribe precisely the new way of making sandwiches after coming up with the correct formula in a laboratory test kitchen. But the Body of Christ is not this way and I think most believers understand this, even if you and I know of some Christians who think taking orders from a central headquarters is the right way to follow God. Their error originates in believing in a "unversal church" which has a human leadership that can wield the authority of the Head.

Our "local" is always "universal" to God, because God is the one who fills all in all. God sees all.

And God's "universal" is always "local" for us, because we always have some "neighbor" near us, be it sinner or saint. We have a "square inch" portion of the God-who-fills-all-in-all, carefully bounded in by God with a "neighbor" on each side.

The "fruit" of the universal church idea is clearly evidenced when we give ourselves to "the cause", meanwhile despising the person God has placed next to us.

Remember the environmental bumper sticker slogan -- "Act locally, think globally"? I rephrase it as "When I act locally, God can act globally". Because God needs to act in my "local" sphere to be the "One who fills all in all". God needs my square inch to be who He is destined to be.

When I try to act "globally" I step out of my allotted portion. When I try to act "globally" I have to ignore, or trample over, the person next to me.

Guest1 · 08-07-2008, 08:47 PM

i have to say a big AMEN.. to all posts herein ..whew

Paul Cox · 08-12-2008, 06:44 PM

Universal/Local:

I was talking to a brother from a country in Africa one day. He told me how that when the "ground" was taken in a certain locality, many local tribes people attended the meeting. It wasn't long before they all pealed off. Why? They just wanted to wear their local tribal garments, and they wanted to sing (and oh, how they can sing) in their local dialect.

Instead, what seemed to be happening is that they were expected to conform to a certain attire (dark pants, and white shirt) and they were being led to worship in a certain way (clinched fist, with a "Praise the Lord" to the top of the lungs, prayreading, calling, you know). Well, if that was Christ manifest in His Body, then he totally failed in reaching the locals. But, of course, He would never fail.

Someone told me once that the Lord makes Himself perfectly comfortable in every culture. To me, that is the real practical side of the true teaching of "locality." If it doesn't accomplish reaching locals right where they are, then all it is is a worldwide chain, only looking for those who can be comfortable with the charter mandated ways of the chain.

The Living Stream Church (please suffer me to use this name, I believe it with my whole heart) is a world wide chain, of restaurants, if you will, that is only looking for diners who can be comfortable with what is uniquely on their menu, and served in it’s unique manner.

Here is another example. It has been my experience that Christians from India, especially those who were under Bagh Singh (sp?) feel very strongly about kneeling when they pray. For those of us with a L. C. background, could we comfortably kneel with those saints to pray?

But you know, even McDonalds is starting to wise up. In China, for example, many of their restaurants are starting to offer the local cuisine. Maybe there is hope yet for McLSM.

Roger

08-06-2008, 11:26 AM	#1
YP0534 Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 688	My poor analogy for the assembly In the entire world, there is only one McDonald's corporation. This is the universal aspect of McDonald's. Universal. Corporate. At the same time, there are thousands and thousands of local McDonald's retaurants, probably one very near to you. Each of them is locally owned and operated. Now, it is true that all of the McDonald's restaurants originated in a single McDonald's restaurant long ago. In a sense, when you go into any McDonald's, you are going into the one unique original McDonald's. They still sell the same hamburger and cheeseburger as they always did. But there are a couple of things to recognize about the arrangement of McDonald's. First of all, there is no such thing as a universal McDonald's restaurant. The very concept is nonsensical. Secondly, if you want a hamburger, even if you can find the McDonald's corporation, they don't have any hamburgers there. If you want a hamburger, you must go to your local restaurant. I understand that the analogy is not quite right in some of the implied details but I'm only making a point in it. The reason the assembly is so important is that it is practical. Obviously, the Body is something universal but when we try to take something that is inherently local and make it into a universal meaning, we're missing the point of it's being local in the first place. The very God of the universe is to be found on display in the assemblies of the saints. If you take those verses that say "assembly" and "universalize" them, you miss the whole point of the thing being something about practical assembling and deprive yourself of the light on God's purpose among us in our meetings. We don't want to ignore that the Lord, as the Head, has His Body. Far from it! Instead, we want to put the full emphasis on the fact the assembly IS His Body, the fullness of the One who fills all in all. I hope this could help you. Grace be with your spirit. __________________ Let each walk as the Lord has distributed to each, as God has called each, and in this manner I instruct all the assemblies. 1 Cor. 7:17 Last edited by YP0534; 08-06-2008 at 11:51 AM.

08-06-2008, 06:28 PM	#2
countmeworthy Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: in Spirit & in Truth Posts: 1,376	Interesting analogy. I think this applies to many of the religious organizations out there...RCC..the Baptists, Methodists, Presbyterians, AOGs, etc... not just the LC. I like 'assemblying' together in large groups for the following reasons: 1) Praise & Worship of our KING 2) Praying together..AS the Holy Spirit leads..for where 2 or more are gathered, there HE is in our midst. I believe there is power in prayer. 3) For conferences on a particular subject matter. Most of us on this board & others like this SHOULD be teaching & bringing the up the younger ones in Christ. We ought to be praying for the Lord to bring us together with like minded Christians & brethren who are truly strong in the Word, the Faith & are filled with the Love of God and the Power of the Holy Spirit. We should be encouraging each other, learning from one another through our studying the Word together and in our alone time with our Precious LORD Jesus. __________________ Watch ye therefore, and pray always, that ye may be *accounted worthy to escape all these things that shall come to pass,* and to stand before the Son of man. (Luke 21:36)

08-07-2008, 07:12 AM	#5
YP0534 Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 688	Oh, yes. I thought you were thinking my analogy was about the religious denominations. I guess I misunderstood you! __________________ Let each walk as the Lord has distributed to each, as God has called each, and in this manner I instruct all the assemblies. 1 Cor. 7:17

08-06-2008, 06:34 PM	#6
Guest1 Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 43	and also the 'universal' should not be made local.. i know you said that very concept is nonsensical. but some still try and all christains are local not just those that "take the ground" i even hate using that terminology.. sorry.. __________________ Colossians 1:14 In Whom We have Redemption through His Blood, even the forgiveness of sins: Last edited by Guest1; 08-06-2008 at 06:45 PM. Reason: add

08-07-2008, 08:47 PM	#9
Guest1 Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 43	i have to say a big AMEN.. to all posts herein ..whew __________________ Colossians 1:14 In Whom We have Redemption through His Blood, even the forgiveness of sins:

08-12-2008, 06:44 PM	#10
Paul Cox Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 181	Universal/Local: I was talking to a brother from a country in Africa one day. He told me how that when the "ground" was taken in a certain locality, many local tribes people attended the meeting. It wasn't long before they all pealed off. Why? They just wanted to wear their local tribal garments, and they wanted to sing (and oh, how they can sing) in their local dialect. Instead, what seemed to be happening is that they were expected to conform to a certain attire (dark pants, and white shirt) and they were being led to worship in a certain way (clinched fist, with a "Praise the Lord" to the top of the lungs, prayreading, calling, you know). Well, if that was Christ manifest in His Body, then he totally failed in reaching the locals. But, of course, He would never fail. Someone told me once that the Lord makes Himself perfectly comfortable in every culture. To me, that is the real practical side of the true teaching of "locality." If it doesn't accomplish reaching locals right where they are, then all it is is a worldwide chain, only looking for those who can be comfortable with the charter mandated ways of the chain. The Living Stream Church (please suffer me to use this name, I believe it with my whole heart) is a world wide chain, of restaurants, if you will, that is only looking for diners who can be comfortable with what is uniquely on their menu, and served in it’s unique manner. Here is another example. It has been my experience that Christians from India, especially those who were under Bagh Singh (sp?) feel very strongly about kneeling when they pray. For those of us with a L. C. background, could we comfortably kneel with those saints to pray? But you know, even McDonalds is starting to wise up. In China, for example, many of their restaurants are starting to offer the local cuisine. Maybe there is hope yet for McLSM. Roger