InconvenientRuth

[InconvenientRuth]

Dear Brothers and Sisters,
For about 7 years, I have been struggling through (at times) intense disorientation and cognitive dissonance... trying to save a very precious marriage while being shunned by my husband who was fully functioning as an elder, church board member, FTTA trainer, and speaker at international conferences... while not even obeying the law related to his treatment of me. Through that experience, and my repeated unavailing attempts to appeal to my in-laws and then to other leading ones, I began to face the fact that the treatment I was experiencing was very culty.

Working through that paradigm shift has required that I read and study a lot, and get godly therapy and fellowship from MANY "outsiders" - but the most help has come from ones like you who have spoken about your experiences and healing.

I actually read quite a bit from this forum years ago, and it was helpful. I have been hesitant to join because I work online and don't love screentime. I am also averse to "us" versus "them" mentalities - a characteristic that drove me away from an environment that was steeped in senses of superiority and exclusivity... We are all truly one Body and members one of another...

But I have experienced and witnessed in Christ's Body what would in physical terms be called an autoimmune disease - the body attacking itself... and it has made all of us, I believe, sick. And an important part of healing is expressing the symptoms and getting the flow of life to the wounded areas. So I am opening in this forum for that.

I just posted a new video. I think it is still uploading. It addresses a very deep concern I have, based partly on fellowship with some of you, as well as my own experience and observations. The topic is hard to adequately address, but here is my feeble attempt: https://youtu.be/c4fSkv5y_3s.

Much love to each of you. May we be prepared as His bride, adorned with the righteousnesses of the saints.

Ruth Wise

[Recovering]

Welcome @InconvenientRuth! I'm encouraged to see you here and have been following your video series on YouTube. My heart has been breaking for the things you have had to endure. Thank you for exercising your courage to speak up. It should be evident to anyone who watches them with an ounce of openness that you are speaking truth in love, even though that truth is hard to hear (and surely it is hard to speak). We are praying for you and praying that your words would wake others up, either to have courage to make their own exit, or to repent and start to right the wrongs they have caused.

[InconvenientRuth]

Thank you, @Recovering. And I love your username; both transitive and intransitive... recovering personally and recovering others/truth... Thanks for your prayers. I just recorded a very sensitive video, that is currently uploading... https://youtu.be/MwM_3GHTKgg.

[GraceAlone]

We're glad you're here, Ruth! I so appreciate all the work you've been putting into your videos. That takes so much courage given the way the LC leadership habitually responds to anyone publicly speaking uncomfortable truths, even when done in loving and winsome ways. I'm sorry that your revelations have come at such a personal cost, though.

[InconvenientRuth]

Just posted this video… spoken with all my heart… https://youtu.be/fxKVwg733Mk?si=m-kap_SLxliQzzfW

[PeterG]

Dear Ruth,

You've already made a lot of videos, always with pretty similar content. I asked myself: what exactly needs to happen for her to find peace? Do you have the answer to that?

“Know who you are under.” Watchman Nee said this to very young, inexperienced co-workers. It doesn't mean, “You're under this person or that person:” It means, “KNOW who you're under.”

This can sometimes be quite difficult. Watchman Nee explains that it has to be people who know the will of God...

But one thing is for sure: you are “under” the endless love and sovereignty of our God. Isn't it so? I wish you to enjoy it today, tomorrow, with all your heart and whatever happens.

Originally Posted by PeterG

Dear Ruth,

You've already made a lot of videos, always with pretty similar content. I asked myself: what exactly needs to happen for her to find peace? Do you have the answer to that?

“Know who you are under.” Watchman Nee said this to very young, inexperienced co-workers. It doesn't mean, “You're under this person or that person:” It means, “KNOW who you're under.”

This can sometimes be quite difficult. Watchman Nee explains that it has to be people who know the will of God...

But one thing is for sure: you are “under” the endless love and sovereignty of our God. Isn't it so? I wish you to enjoy it today, tomorrow, with all your heart and whatever happens.

What needs to happen for Ruth and those like her is that they need to be heard by their brothers and sisters. She is still under great oppression from the enemy through the actions of the leading ones in The Lord’s Recovery. It is a present, ongoing experience, not just a past one. She has also realized that there are many like her who have suffered in the same way, and she feels burdened to speak up not only for herself but for them.

True, everlasting peace cannot be had until this situation is remedied and until the Lord returns. He can be our peace, in a sense, like Paul experienced, but we must not ignore the fact that in his humanity Paul more often than not was suffering and experienced great sorrow.The joy of the Lord shone through in his experiences, but those negative experiences were consistent and intense. So great was it that Paul declared that he would prefer to go with the Lord rather than stay on the earth and suffer. The only reason he endeavored in this life was for the sake of the next generation of saints.

Ruth is offloading 30 years of suffering that she has held inside of her soul. It’s going to be quite a process.

[PeterG]

Hi Unregistered Guest,

I am new to this forum myself. And what really impresses me is how the members have worked through their own stories of suffering with the same organization and have succeeded in finishing them. I'm sure that if Ruth wants to continue posting herself, she will benefit greatly.

[Nell]

Originally Posted by Unregistered

What needs to happen for Ruth and those like her is that they need to be heard by their brothers and sisters. She is still under great oppression from the enemy through the actions of the leading ones in The Lord’s Recovery. It is a present, ongoing experience, not just a past one. She has also realized that there are many like her who have suffered in the same way, and she feels burdened to speak up not only for herself but for them.

True, everlasting peace cannot be had until this situation is remedied and until the Lord returns. He can be our peace, in a sense, like Paul experienced, but we must not ignore the fact that in his humanity Paul more often than not was suffering and experienced great sorrow.The joy of the Lord shone through in his experiences, but those negative experiences were consistent and intense. So great was it that Paul declared that he would prefer to go with the Lord rather than stay on the earth and suffer. The only reason he endeavored in this life was for the sake of the next generation of saints.

Ruth is offloading 30 years of suffering that she has held inside of her soul. It’s going to be quite a process.

What Ruth, and those like her need, is to hear and follow the voice of the Lord. We suffered for years listening to men tell us what to do, what to say, and who to say it to. The result was, in order to stay out of trouble, we had to learn how to follow the men “over us” instead of listening to the voice of our good shepherd.

Of course we need to be heard. But I/we learned early that in the Local Church leadership, no one is listening. Many have tried to “fellowship with the brothers”. The result is we are branded as “negative” and are forever shunned and talked about behind our backs. When we finally “left the church” we got criticized for that too.

As we all are, we are posting on this forum to speak for ourselves and not continue to be told what to do. Perhaps the greatest need of all believers is to hear His voice in our lives and follow Him.

John 10:27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:

Nell

Originally Posted by Nell

What Ruth, and those like her need, is to hear and follow the voice of the Lord. We suffered for years listening to men tell us what to do, what to say, and who to say it to. The result was, in order to stay out of trouble, we had to learn how to follow the men “over us” instead of listening to the voice of our good shepherd.

Of course we need to be heard. But I/we learned early that in the Local Church leadership, no one is listening. Many have tried to “fellowship with the brothers”. The result is we are branded as “negative” and are forever shunned and talked about behind our backs. When we finally “left the church” we got criticized for that too.

As we all are, we are posting on this forum to speak for ourselves and not continue to be told what to do. Perhaps the greatest need of all believers is to hear His voice in our lives and follow Him.

John 10:27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:

Nell

Thank you for supporting my point. For too long, sisters in the churches, particularly the Local Church, have been treated as second-class members. Rather than being treated as weaker vessels, they are treated as inferior vessels. This should not be so.

Surely we must follow the leading of the Lord, and surely the assemblies in The Lord’s Recovery need to learn to listen to and consider what these sisters have to say. I have known too many sisters who have been embittered by exactly what you have laid out here. This should not be so.

Until the assemblies ****** and begin treating their members more graciously, we cannot reasonably expect any modicum of peace to befall the brothers and sisters who have been mistreated, shunned, and shamed for sharing their experiences. Those who have been called to tend to God’s sheep must do as they’ve been commanded by the Lord. (***** edited by Nell)

John 21:15-17

15 When they had finished eating, Jesus said to Simon Peter, “Simon son of John, do you love me more than these?” “Yes, Lord,” he said, “you know that I love you.”

Jesus said, “Feed my lambs.”

16 Again Jesus said, “Simon son of John, do you love me?” He answered, “Yes, Lord, you know that I love you.”

Jesus said, “Take care of my sheep.”

17 The third time he said to him, “Simon son of John, do you love me?” Peter was hurt because Jesus asked him the third time, “Do you love me?” He said, “Lord, you know all things; you know that I love you.”

Jesus said, “Feed my sheep.”

[InconvenientRuth]

Yes, @Nell... I really reached out to relevant individuals, then relevant groups of individuals, to no avail, for several years. Eventually, we have to cry out for help somewhat indiscriminately, which I started to do in 2021... and have started doing again recently, after being threatened to take my book off Amazon and take my blog down, and having done so for a couple of years, with no increase in any care for me or my now-adult children who need fellow sheep, shepherding, and healing. It is, at times, a matter of life or death to not be/feel isolated amidst such wounding treatment in one's church family.

But I am so thankful that I am at peace and have joy.
I want any vestiges of evil to be exposed by the light!!

[InconvenientRuth]

Hi! Finally reading a few posts tonight... I don't keep up with social media very well. But I appreciate this fellowship.

I am actually at peace inwardly. I treat a lot of videos like perhaps it may be the only one someone watches, so I mention some relevant context... but perhaps they are too repetitive.

I am doing my best to speak "truth to power" (an expression for courageously confronting an authority, calling out injustices on their watch, and demanding change - Dictionary.com) because there has been extensive abuse of power in what is called "THE church" but has not been a healthy place for the sheep. And if we don't speak the truth, many more may be stumbed. And even ONE stumbling is very serious. I have seen too many stumbled already.

[Truthinlove]

Ruth, my wife and I want to thank you very much for your videos of testimonials and your song. No one can write this without real experience.

Nell referenced John Ingall's book which is shockingly true. I encourage anyone to read it. Below is a link that abuse is still occurring in the local churches.

https://www.mylocalchurchexperience.com/our-experiences
Jo Casteel and Andrea McArdle

Los Angeles Times, Saturday, January 7, 1989, Leaders Son Excommunicated
Crisis Threatens Future of Little-Known Church (by Russel Chandler)

Here is something that we found on the internet (LA Times Archives). In his book John Ingalls did not mention by name who was excommunicated by the membership. John was a real hero! I believe he had integrity. The news investigator Russel Chandler did good journalism by asking the leadership and its members what happened. By that we have confirmation of what happened. DCP cannot erase everything, see the attached LA Times article.

[PriestlyScribe]

Originally Posted by Truthinlove

...Nell referenced John Ingall's book which is shockingly true. I encourage anyone to read it.

FYI: The digital version of John Ingalls' book, (4F) NEWSPAPER ARTICLES APPEAR January 1989, contains a link to the complete LA Times article.

Please share that online resource freely with others.

P.S.

[Truthinlove]

Hi PriestlyScribe,
I didn't know there was a third electronic edition. I look forward to reading it. Thank you very much.