Jesus Christ = “The tree of Life”, where is that in the Bible???

[Paul Vusik]

As all you know, or at least the people that at one time where a part of TLR, that there is a very high emphasis put on the ideology of “we must choose to eat of the tree of life”, and don’t be like Adam and Eve and choose the wrong thing.

However, unless I’m mistaken, there isn’t a single verse of scripture that equates Jesus Christ to the tree of life, nether calls Him the tree of life. I don’t care about symbolism or typology, nether do I care about some interpretation that says so. As far as I know and doing some studies on the matter, there is only 12 times that the tree of life is mentioned in the Bible, and not one of those referring to Christ!

The reason I’m posting this is to find out if anyone here can or had done some studies about it and has some input.

Just a side note, I’m not interested in any recovery bible verses, or footnotes, or quotes. I have a very strong suspicion where all this comes from, but was hoping to get some feedback first to see if it connects the dots.

Thanks.

[Trapped]

Originally Posted by Paul Vusik

As all you know, or at least the people that at one time where a part of TLR, that there is a very high emphasis put on the ideology of “we must choose to eat of the tree of life”, and don’t be like Adam and Eve and choose the wrong thing.

However, unless I’m mistaken, there isn’t a single verse of scripture that equates Jesus Christ to the tree of life, nether calls Him the tree of life. I don’t care about symbolism or typology, nether do I care about some interpretation that says so. As far as I know and doing some studies on the matter, there is only 12 times that the tree of life is mentioned in the Bible, and not one of those referring to Christ!

The reason I’m posting this is to find out if anyone here can or had done some studies about it and has some input.

Just a side note, I’m not interested in any recovery bible verses, or footnotes, or quotes. I have a very strong suspicion where all this comes from, but was hoping to get some feedback first to see if it connects the dots.

Thanks.

I 100% agree with you here, and I came to the same conclusion after some study too.

Jesus says He's the water of life and He says He's the bread of life. Any instance of Jesus claiming to be the tree of life is conspicuously absent.

I know you don't want the LC quotes, but I'll just say that as far as I know, the way they came up with this was to say "Jesus calls Himself the vine, and the tree of life is said to be on both sides of the river, so the tree of life must be a vine, therefore, Jesus is the tree of life." Pretty bad.

The other slightly stronger connection might be to say "the tree of life granted eternal life, and Jesus is 'the life', therefore, Jesus is our metaphorical tree of life." But again, I see absolutely no reading that forces that conclusion.

What I DO see is that Jesus does not symbolize the tree of life, but is our way BACK to the tree of life. The tree of life was guarded by cherubim and flaming swords so it could not be accessed after Adam's transgression. Jesus' death opens the way for us to have access to it again, which we see in Revelation.

One thing I am curious about is that Jesus was granted by the Father to "have life in Himself". I am unclear whether that is related to the TOL or not...I don't think it is. But since Jesus is our brother/pattern/forerunner, does this mean we also will "have life in ourself" in the same way the Father granted to Jesus? I don't know.

Trapped

[Timotheist]

Originally Posted by Trapped

One thing I am curious about is that Jesus was granted by the Father to "have life in Himself". I am unclear whether that is related to the TOL or not...I don't think it is. But since Jesus is our brother/pattern/forerunner, does this mean we also will "have life in ourself" in the same way the Father granted to Jesus? I don't know.

Trapped

If I ever experience living water flowing from my innermost being, I will be able to answer that question.

[Zezima]

Genesis 3:22 “…lest he reach out his hand and take also of the tree of life and eat, and live forever”

John 6:54 “whoever feeds on my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life”
John 6:51 “I am the living bread, if anyone eats of this bread he will live forever”

These are the closest, but it’s not a direct statement.

[Paul Vusik]

My point is precisely that, which is that nowhere in the Bible you will find that equation. Jesus was in the world for long enough time to where He had hundreds of opportunities to compare Himself to “the tree of life”. He didn’t, nether did any of the apostles in any of the gospels or the epistles. Did He not know of the tree of life? Absolutely He did! So why would He not say so if He was it? Because He knew it wasn’t so!
I point this out, because these man have built a slew of teachings based on the foundation that doesn’t exist in the Bible. Never mentioned, never associated with it. I want to look at these verses carefully and see exactly what God said in Genesis 3:22-24;
22*And the Lord God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever:
23*Therefore the Lord God sent him forth from the garden of Eden, to till the ground from whence he was taken.
24*So he drove out the man; and he placed at the east of the garden of Eden Cherubims, and a flaming sword which turned every way, to keep the way of the tree of life.

God didn’t say in any of the statements that man would be redeemed from the fall of the sin by eating of “the tree of life”, did He? He didn’t say that if they eat of the tree of life that they would be reconnected back to their original state, did He? No He didn’t! It’s as clear as it gets, He didn’t want man to live forever in the fallen state of sin, and that’s why He put the angel there to guard the tree. Did He had a plan then? Did He know that it was going to happen? Of course He did, and making sure that man would only be redeemed through the completed work of Christ, He had mercy and grace then, by shortening the live span of man to make sure that the work of redemption would be done through His Son!

These man that take this and make the whole Gospel message out of it, and present it to people as a truth are total frauds! They offer people life forever through the tree of life, using the name of Jesus as a cover! It’s not in the Bible for a reason, but it’s offered by other god, that’s promoted and worshiped by the same people that crucified Him in the first place!

[Timotheist]

Originally Posted by Paul Vusik

These man that take this and make the whole Gospel message out of it, and present it to people as a truth are total frauds! They offer people life forever through the tree of life, using the name of Jesus as a cover! It’s not in the Bible for a reason, but it’s offered by other god, that’s promoted and worshiped by the same people that crucified Him in the first place!

Paul, I am trying my hardest to get into this thread of yours. If nothing else, I enjoy reading other people's perspectives.

If I step back and take a big picture view, I care not whether my eternal life is obtained from a "tree","water", or "bread", so long as I get it.

So please help me understand better your main point, and it particular, your last statement that I quoted in boldface.

Yours,

[Zezima]

Originally Posted by Paul Vusik

My point is precisely that, which is that nowhere in the Bible you will find that equation. Jesus was in the world for long enough time to where He had hundreds of opportunities to compare Himself to “the tree of life”. He didn’t, nether did any of the apostles in any of the gospels or the epistles. Did He not know of the tree of life? Absolutely He did! So why would He not say so if He was it? Because He knew it wasn’t so!

Is there a Bible verse that says Jesus didn’t know he was the tree of life?

[Nell]

This might help…

Originally Posted by Paul Vusik

As all you know, or at least the people that at one time where a part of TLR, that there is a very high emphasis put on the ideology of “we must choose to eat of the tree of life”, and don’t be like Adam and Eve and choose the wrong thing.

However, unless I’m mistaken, there isn’t a single verse of scripture that equates Jesus Christ to the tree of life, nether calls Him the tree of life. I don’t care about symbolism or typology, nether do I care about some interpretation that says so. As far as I know and doing some studies on the matter, there is only 12 times that the tree of life is mentioned in the Bible, and not one of those referring to Christ!

The reason I’m posting this is to find out if anyone here can or had done some studies about it and has some input.

Just a side note, I’m not interested in any recovery bible verses, or footnotes, or quotes. I have a very strong suspicion where all this comes from, but was hoping to get some feedback first to see if it connects the dots.

Thanks.

[ACuriousFellow]

Originally Posted by Paul Vusik

As all you know, or at least the people that at one time where a part of TLR, that there is a very high emphasis put on the ideology of “we must choose to eat of the tree of life”, and don’t be like Adam and Eve and choose the wrong thing.

However, unless I’m mistaken, there isn’t a single verse of scripture that equates Jesus Christ to the tree of life, nether calls Him the tree of life. I don’t care about symbolism or typology, nether do I care about some interpretation that says so. As far as I know and doing some studies on the matter, there is only 12 times that the tree of life is mentioned in the Bible, and not one of those referring to Christ!

The reason I’m posting this is to find out if anyone here can or had done some studies about it and has some input.

Just a side note, I’m not interested in any recovery bible verses, or footnotes, or quotes. I have a very strong suspicion where all this comes from, but was hoping to get some feedback first to see if it connects the dots.

Thanks.

I’ve found, to my great frustration, that Witness Lee proposes many things that, on the surface, may sound very “Christian” but are rather really odd when you dig deeper. Is it really so radical to compare Jesus to the Tree of Life? The man in whom is eternal life? The man who said “eat me and live forever”? The man who said “my words are life” and that he is life? I would say that it is not so radical. The Tree of Life offered eternal life to man, and now Jesus does. It’s not the craziest thing I’ve heard.

No, my problem is with Lee’s extreme view on the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil and his portrayal of all pursuit of knowledge being somehow inherently bad. This idea of “eating Christ” which is derived from biblical scriptures and the idea of avoiding “good and evil” because it’s on the “wrong tree” has several dangerous pitfalls that can be damaging to interpersonal relationships within The Lord’s Recovery and to the congregation at large which consumes many of Lee’s teachings. All critical thought is shut down, especially any thoughts that are critical of Lee, the elders, or the teachings of The Lord's Recovery which come from their own little "Watchtower" known as Living Stream Ministry. This teaching, along with their "Minister/Ministry of the Age" doctrines, is rooted in a desire for complete and total thought control which discourages the saints from really and truly meditating over and studying the scriptures and, subsequently, the teachings that are being given to them on a nearly daily basis by this denomination.

You want to talk about doctrines and scriptural analysis? Nope! That’s knowledge, and knowledge brings death! Let’s just “eat Christ”! You have genuine questions and misgivings about the “Ministry” and want to talk about it? Nah, brother, just focus on “eating Christ”! You want to critique one of the teachings/ideas found in the morning revival? Nope! That’s death! We’re just here to “eat” and “enjoy Christ”! You have a problem with the way certain brothers/elders handle church matters or a certain word they gave to the congregation? Nope! That’s death, so stop talking about it! Why focus on trash when you can focus on the good stuff? Just “eat Christ”! Even if you’re right, it’s just “true trash” that will upset people and potentially cause division! Would you really just want to be right at the cost of causing divisions? That’s not very Christ-like! Don’t be a divider! Don’t let all those questions get in the way of the “fellowship”! Don’t let the Devil take a hold of you! Just “eat Christ”! Oh, this sister wrote and published an open letter where she poured out her heart to the brothers and sisters in The Lord’s Recovery about her struggles and concerns? Nope! That’s just an attack from Satan and it brings death! Don’t even read her letter unless you want to touch death! Stay away! Just “enjoy Christ” with the brothers and sisters! Just “eat Christ” with the saints! Such a constant stream of thought-stopping language instills in the saints a deep-seated fear of examining the teachings being given to them, making them vulnerable to further spiritual abuse by their brothers, sisters, and leaders.

What completely infuriating and utterly thorough nonsense is Lee’s concept of “eating Christ” and his false dichotomy of “life vs knowledge.” When I hear most Christians talk about Jesus being the Tree of Life, I know they simply mean he is where we get eternal life, but when I hear the saints in The Lord’s Recovery talk about Jesus being the Tree of Life and “eating Christ”, I am well aware of all the hidden meanings that such seemingly innocuous words entail, and it makes me sick to my stomach. I’ve said it elsewhere and I’ll say it here: there is no set of doctrines that piss me off more than Lee’s tainted teachings regarding “knowledge” and “the dead letter” which stem from his perverted presentation of the concepts of “life” and “death.”