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Old 12-16-2017, 12:52 PM   #88
Join Date: Dec 2017
Posts: 247
Default Re: First Post kumbaya

Originally Posted by Drake View Post
Ohio>”For example, we both know that LSM did not exact a tax on all LCers based on our 1040. Neither was tithing a legalistic practice.

BUT ... we both know that agents at LSM pressured every LC elder and worker to buy books, send their members to the "Feasts," send their young people to the FTTA, etc. Leaders who were not so "compliant," were occasionally made public spectacles. That doesn't have to happen very often to make a lasting impression. After an event like that, occasional reminders suffice, and LSM can return to their regularly scheduled program about the "liberty of the Spirit" which supposedly only we enjoyed.”


I rarely respond to your posts because of their oft vitriolic character. However, your post below was a reasoned response so I’ll give it go.

First, if you and others would respond to absurd statements like the alleged tithing of 10% income to LSM then I wouldn’t feel compelled to do it. Since, fellow posters rarely step up to challenge those absurdities, then I do. That may give the impression that I avoid a central argument in preference for a selected argument and thereby i get accused of “dishonesty”. Fact is, honesty cannot be had in a conversation while absurd allegations are used as part of someone’s argument. Absurdities distract from what could be a reasonable conversation with differences because they impose upon others the assumption that the absurdity is valid. So, as long as a poster insists on absurdities I am content to expose the absurdity, not because I am dishonest, but because no reasonable conversation can be had while the absurdity stands.

Now, to your point quoted above. I feel zero pressure to buy books... they are mostly available online. Perhaps decades ago before the internet provided fluid access to the ministry or before the books were available through Amazon then there was an interest in making sure the local churches had access to all up to date speaking and were on the same page. I understand that because the ministry is not a free for all. For me, it is not a question of liberty of the Spirit as we all can read whatever we want as individuals. It is, as with any ministry, your purpose, your mission, and your calling.

Allow me this example. I like C.S. Lewis. I read a lot of him. I like the parallels in the Chronicles of Narnia in much the same way as I like those in Bunyan’s Pilgrims Progress and Holy War. No one tells me what I can and cannot read personally. I have all the freedom in the world, restricted only by the Spirit, to follow my conscience in what I ingest. However, the freedoms I enjoy as an individual do not transfer to the meetings of the church, else there would be complete and utter chaos. There would be disorder and punching the air. I do not impose my individual liberty in the Spirit onto the rest of the brothers and sisters in the meetings of the church. I do not have the liberty before the Lord to occupy others time by reading the Voyage of the Dawn Treader in the meetings. Why? Simply, because that is not how the Lord is building up the Body of Christ in that setting. You will say, that is an extreme example because no one is advocating reading Narnia in the meetings. Okay, but that is not any different than reading G.H. Lang in the meetings..... a point of contention in the history of the local churches that is counter to the vision, mission, and special calling of those in the local churches. Those localities that are contentious about that can do their own thing and have for that and other reasons.

Therefore, Brother Ohio, everything you describe are perfectly consistent with those following a mission, not seeking mammon. Be it the ministry that builds up the Body of Christ, FTT, encouragement to attend conferences, feasts, trainings, all those to my reckoning are part of the reason why LSM even exists. If not for that then they are just another Christian publisher.

Thanks for the conversation.

You really jumped on my mis-speaking.

Fair enough.

I admit, I was ASSUMING that the saints tithe 10%. I said that bc I really do think the saints (as a whole) in the LC are pure hearted. Maybe they have a child-like quality due to unspoken pressure of reducing critical thinking and maybe the LC attracts only certain personalities now that have a tendency to not question the direction they're given but either way, I truly believe there are genuine and faithful believers in the LC.

My problem is with LSM and the blending brothers. Those are the wolves, the saints (in my opinion) innocent sheep. Nothing wrong with being called that. The Lord is our SHEPHARD. There's a reason for the parable of the wolf in sheep's clothing. Because it happens.

So, I retract my statement that the saints give 10% of their income their whole lives.

I was assuming, given my high opinion of their genuineness and sincere Christian lifestyle, that they would follow this practice without question.

Maybe they do, maybe they don't. But I know the hearts of many people in the LC and it is genuinely generous.

So, my problem is the exploitation from LSM with dealing with people who I believe are generous in their tithing.

But you're right, I don't KNOW that the saints tithe 10%. I only assumed.

Whatever tithes are given though, LSM does receive part of it from my understanding based on things I've read/heard.

If you have proof otherwise, please let me know.
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