Quote:
Originally Posted by Ohio
Definitely deteriorated over time. Initially many elders were true shepherds who put their church first, only to be targeted and coerced by headquarters as not sufficiently "one with the ministry." All sorts of tactics were used to force compliance or be expelled.
|
At any rate, spiritual authority in the "local churches" warrants scrutiny. Angelica has shaken things up with much passion, according to her convictions. She has had much appreciation for Watchman Nee up to this time; and only yesterday learned of his dramatic changes taken in 1948. Thus, her reaction.
She says, "Feel free to use anything I say if you think it will help. We are all those "three blind men with the elephant." One of us feels the trunk; one of us feels the tail; another feels the leg; then we try to figure out what this entity is about."
And I agree.
From Angelica
"I was pretty certain "Spiritual Authority" was written at that time [1948]. It has the seeds of that error----which I don't see in Nee's earlier writings. I do see some Chinese culture in all of Nee's work. However, I really appreciate his earlier ministry. And I think "Concerning Our Missions"/"The Normal Christian Church is, possibly his best, most classic---and unique---work. I also fully appreciate "The Spiritual Man" and all the volumes of "Twelve Baskets Full." I think those are my favorites (pretty much in that order).
This insanity of "the Jerusalem principle" is not at all worthy of the man he was in his earlier years. I had that same thing happen regarding another brother. When I came out of the LC, a brother gave me some 6 tape messages on the matter of authority. They were absolutely AMAZING messages!!!! I wish I could listen to them again today!
Those messages were chock full of scriptures describing the 7 "levels" of authority. Wow! They made EVERYTHING clear to me! I memorized the general information, but would LOVE to hear them today for so many of the details!
What Mahoney said was that 1. God, 2. Christ, 3.the Holy Spirit and 4. the Word of God were all levels of authority that had to be obeyed absolutely. Under them is 5. conscience---which also needs to be obeyed absolutely. Under conscience (on a level parallel with one another) are delegated and functional authority---both of which can demand only qualified obedience (under the other "levels' of authority. Mahoney used the verse in Romans about "Let every soul be subject to the HIGHER authorities." To Mahoney, that indicated there are various levels of authority (which also supports the idea of conscientious objector, because conscience, the Holy Spirit, the Word of God, etc. are all "higher" levels of authority than either delegated or functional authority).
And, since conscience can be faulty because it is educable, if the Holy Spirit, God, or the Word of God command something the conscience doesn't confirm, we must go with the Word of God. (For instance, the African headhunter may be trained that if he doesn't secure enough heads per day he doesn't feel as if he is being a "good" headhunter. But the Bible tells us not to murder.) It is doubtful that that particular conflict would occur under most ordinary circumstances. However, the conflict of delegated authority (particularly in governments and families) conflicting with the Word of God, conscience, the Holy Spirit and/or God is very common!
The last two levels (which are actually two different kinds of authority which are on the same level) are delegated authority (such as government and responsible members of the family) and functional authority (authority due to gift, ability or attribute, such a an athlete, an artist, a doctor, a musician, a lawyer, any sort of minister or spiritual authority, etc.)
We had always been taught that spiritual authority is a from of "delegated authority." But it isn't. Delegated authority is assigned to an agent in the absence of the initial one who possessed that authority. But God is Emmanuel; He is WITH us! He never went anywhere. Also, delegated authority rests in that agent regardless of that agent's condition. (A police officer, president, father, mother, mayor, etc. has authority by virtue of his position, regardless of his particular condition. He may be a good or bad agent, but he is still that agent, regardless. His authority is posited in him upon delegation.
Functional authority, on the other hand, is FULLY contingent upon the gift, ability, or attribute of the possessor. If a man is more spiritual than others in his assembly, he has more spiritual authority. If he sins grievously, he may lose his authority and be less spiritual than others. A doctor can be disbarred; a very poor athlete or musician loses his authority in the sphere in which he is to manifest the authority of his gift or skill. So, it is with spiritual authority.
The messages were given by a Ralph Mahoney. I had never heard of him before those messages. However, eventually I went to a charismatic church pastored by some brothers who knew Ralph Mahoney. When I brought up his name, they actually invited him to speak. His speaking was absolute pablum. No content and worthless! I was SOOO disappointed!
I signed up for his magazine. It, too, was worthless. I have no idea how a brother could at one time give such AMAZING, revelatory, insightful and scriptural messages and later be so superficial. And not just superficial, but I was pretty certain "Spiritual Authority" was written at that time. It has the seeds of that error----which I don't see in Nee's earlier writings. I do see some Chinese culture in all of Nee's work. However, I really appreciate his earlier ministry. And I think "Concerning Our Missions"/"The Normal Christian Church is, possibly his best, most classic---and unique---work. I also fully appreciate "The Spiritual Man" and all the volumes of "Twelve Baskets Full." I think those are my favorites (pretty much in that order).
This insanity of "the Jerusalem principle" is not at all worthy of the man he was in his earlier years. I had that same thing happen regarding another brother. When I came out of the LC, a brother gave me some 6 tape messages on the matter of authority. They were absolutely AMAZING messages!!!! I wish I could listen to them again today!
Those messages were chock full of scriptures describing the 7 "levels" of authority. Wow! They made EVERYTHING clear to me! I memorized the general information, but would LOVE to hear them today for so many of the details!
What Mahoney said was that 1. God, 2. Christ, 3.the Holy Spirit and 4. the Word of God were all levels of authority that had to be obeyed absolutely. Under them is 5. conscience---which also needs to be obeyed absolutely. Under conscience (on a level parallel with one another) are delegated and functional authority---both of which can demand only qualified obedience (under the other "levels' of authority. Mahoney used the verse in Romans about "Let every soul be subject to the HIGHER authorities." To Mahoney, that indicated there are various levels of authority (which also supports the idea of conscientious objector, because conscience, the Holy Spirit, the Word of God, etc. are all "higher" levels of authority than either delegated or functional authority).
And, since conscience can be faulty because it is educable, if the Holy Spirit, God, or the Word of God command something the conscience doesn't confirm, we must go with the Word of God. (For instance, the African headhunter may be trained that if he doesn't secure enough heads per day he doesn't feel as if he is being a "good" headhunter. But the Bible tells us not to murder.) It is doubtful that that particular conflict would occur under most ordinary circumstances. However, the conflict of delegated authority (particularly in governments and families) conflicting with the Word of God, conscience, the Holy Spirit and/or God is very common!
The last two levels (which are actually two different kinds of authority which are on the same level) are delegated authority (such as government and responsible members of the family) and functional authority (authority due to gift, ability or attribute, such a an athlete, an artist, a doctor, a musician, a lawyer, any sort of minister or spiritual authority, etc.)
We had always been taught that spiritual authority is a from of "delegated authority." But it isn't. Delegated authority is assigned to an agent in the absence of the initial one who possessed that authority. But God is Emmanuel; He is WITH us! He never went anywhere. Also, delegated authority rests in that agent regardless of that agent's condition. (A police officer, president, father, mother, mayor, etc. has authority by virtue of his position, regardless of his particular condition. He may be a good or bad agent, but he is still that agent, regardless. His authority is posited in him upon delegation.
Functional authority, on the other hand, is FULLY contingent upon the gift, ability, or attribute of the possessor. If a man is more spiritual than others in his assembly, he has more spiritual authority. If he sins grievously, he may lose his authority and be less spiritual than others. A doctor can be disbarred; a very poor athlete or musician loses his authority in the sphere in which he is to manifest the authority of his gift or skill. So, it is with spiritual authority.
The messages were given by a Ralph Mahoney. I had never heard of him before those messages. However, eventually I went to a charismatic church pastored by some brothers who knew Ralph Mahoney. When I brought up his name, they actually invited him to speak. His speaking was absolute pablum. No content and worthless! I was SOOO disappointed!
I signed up for his magazine. It, too, was worthless. I have no idea how a brother could at one time give such AMAZING, revelatory, insightful and scriptural messages and later be so superficial. And not just superficial, but charismaniac! That remains a complete mystery to me today!