Quote:
Originally Posted by Ohio
Read the Genesis message about Lot!... Message #54 or so.... Lee condemns all those meeting in so-called "free group" house churches as the incestuous children of Lot conceived in caves outside of Sodom and Gomorrah... Steel, did you read that message in Genesis?
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I have... But just went and quickly read through it again.
Here we go...
First... Context...
"In this message we must see the portrait of a most ugly thing—incest. Genesis 19:30-38, probably the first recorded case of incest in human history, is part of the section on living in fellowship with God. As we consider this matter, we must cover six points: the family, the father, the mother, the daughters, the seed, and the far-reaching and unsearchable mercy of God. . . . Although the record concerning Lot and his daughters in Genesis 19:30-38 is a negative seed, concerning such an ugly thing as incest, it serves the positive purpose of giving us a strong, sobering warning." - Life-Study of Genesis, chap. 54, pg. 1
So the context for this chapter is...
A... What scripture reveals in Genesis 19:30-38 regarding the matter of "...incest..."
B... How this "...iincest..." as revealed in Genesis 19:30-38 relates to the family, the father, the mother, the daughters, the seed, and the far-reaching and unsearchable mercy of God."
C... How being clear on this matter "...serves the positive purpose of giving us a strong, sobering warning."
Good...
Nothing condemning anything or anyone, just a calling of "...incest.." as "...ugly..."... And nothing, in my eyes, unscriptural.
Then comes this...
"The leader of any group needs help. The proper helper in a family is the wife, and in the Bible a wife is called a helpmeet. In figure, the wife in a family signifies a helper in life. This concept is according to the principles of the Bible." - Life-Study of Genesis, chap. 54, pg. 1
Again... Nothing condemning and nothing, in my eyes, unscriptural.
Then comes this...
"As we shall see, at a certain point, Lot's family group lost its function in life because the wife became a pillar of salt. She should have been salty and maintained a good flavor, but due to her worldliness she lost the function in life. In figure, becoming a pillar of salt indicates the loss of the function in life. Although there was a group with a leader, there was no wife with the function in life, only a pillar of shame. This is true of many Christian groups today. Although these groups have leaders, they do not have the proper wife with the genuine function in life." - Life-Study of Genesis, chap. 54, pg. 1
Here is the first reference to "...Christian groups..." . . . But notice that it the phrase is "...many Christian groups..." and not "...all Christian groups..." or even just a generalizing of "...Christian groups...".
Again, that's "...many...", not "...all...".
And the specific context related to this reference of "...many Christian groups..." is that of Lot losing the help/function of his wife/helper because she turned into a pillar of salt by good (meaning, she was dead and unable to function as a help to Lot).
And what the ministry speaking regarding "...many Christian groups..." is saying, is this...
"...Although these groups have leaders, they do not have the proper wife with the genuine function in life."
And further into the ministry speaking in this chapter, on page 4 of the chapter, we read more about this matter of Lot's wife and his lose of her function/life...
"We have seen that the mother, who, as the wife, should have been the helper in life, became a pillar of salt because of her worldliness ([Gen.] 19:26). When Lot's family came into the cave, there was no function of life, for there was no function of the proper wife. As a result, they turned to incest, using such a sinful thing to replace the lost function of life. This is also the situation among many so-called Christian groups. They have lost the function of the Body of Christ, the proper function of life, and use worldly methods to fill the gap. Like Lot's group, they cannot produce the proper "Isaac" for the fulfilling of God's purpose. Because they use incest to secure seed, they produce "Moabites" and "Ammonites."..." - Life-Study of Genesis, chap. 54, pg. 4
Now the above is certainly strong, condemning speaking...
But is it untrue?
Are there not many groups of believers in Christ that "...use worldly methods to fill the gap..." that they have lost regarding the proper function of the Body of Christ... That being the function of life?
Surely you know this to be true, Ohio.
And is the way this fallenness takes place not properly presented in the above ministry speaking?
Isn't turning to the way of the world to produce something not akin to participating in incest to produce offspring?
No doubt it sounds very harsh...
But it's right there in scripture.
And here's what the ministry says regarding the relationship between the incest that took place between Lot and his daughters, and "...many Christian groups..."...
"We have seen that the leader was drugged and befuddled and that the function of life was lost. But the daughters, the members of this free group, still wanted to bear fruit and have the increase. Although they had neither the proper leadership nor the function of life, they had an evil way of acquiring the seed. The same is true among many free groups today. In order to bear fruit, we should live by Christ, live out Christ, pray, and help people to receive the living word of God so that they might be reborn. This is the way to bring forth the proper fruit to be the "Isaac" for the fulfilling of God's purpose. But look at today's situation: some groups use rock music, dancing, drama, movies, and games to satisfy their desire of securing the increase. In the eyes of God, this is spiritual incest. The free groups adopt these methods because the wife, being worldly, has lost her function. In the churches we need the function of life to produce seed. Once people have lost the proper wife with the function in life, they use ugly and worldly means for securing the increase. This is the way of "incest" which brings forth "Moabites" and "Ammonites."..." - Life-Study of Genesis, chap. 54, pg. 4
Again...
Is the above not scriptural?
Sure, Paul says in 1 Corinthains 9:22... "To the weak I became weak that I might gain the weak. To all men I have become all things that I might by all means save some."
And again, in 1 Corinthians 10:33... "Even as I also aplease all men in all things, not seeking my own advantage but that of the many, that they may be saved."
And we read in Romans 15:2... "Let each of us please his neighbor with a view to what is good for building up."