[Sons to Glory!]

What's in scripture is the standard we must go by, and it certainly does outline the gifts (pastors, teachers, etc.) that have been given to the body for its edification . . . as we've been discussing. But then the system of Catholicism came in for a thousand years. Are y-all trying to say that the system we have now (which in many places is akin to the pastor as CEO) hasn't taken ANY "leaven" from the Romish system?

It was stated that I "continue to cast aspersions upon . . . other believers," but that's not what I'm hoping to convey - it's about the system . . . which again I think has been, to some degree or another, carried over from Catholicism. And yes, I know, there are some in the RCC who are following the Lord wonderfully! For instance, I often listen to a RCC "father" on radio who is wonderful (until he goes into Mary-land nonsense), and some of the best gospel preaching I've heard came from a RCC priest presiding over a funeral I attended. But, from what I've seen, while there are some there following the Lord with some level of freshness, I think this is the exception and not the rule there. So no, I don't think the RCC system neither promotes or allows for the genuine growth in Christ in the vast majority of their members.

And for those that have studied ancient church history (I've read a few sources), you may have read that those (pre reformation) outside the RCC's influence often apparently had a pretty basic, non regimented and open format to their gatherings. Yes they probably did have the different gifts mentioned, such as pastors, elders, teachers, deacons, etc., but from what I've read, it wasn't nearly so formal and with big titles/positions like the RCC and which carryover, at least to some measure, toward that predominate system we have in Christendom today.