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Originally Posted by Trapped
aron, would you be able to point more specifically to what part(s) of the video you are referring to? I'm trying to find it but am having trouble finding it and following your train of thought too.
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In the first 45 seconds of the video it quotes 1 Cor 14:34, which says "be in submission" and 1 Timothy 2:11,12 it says "full submission". Yet the parts in question are bolded in red and the "submission" part is never mentioned. Yet the word submission is not a new teaching of Paul, and is shared by Peter, as I showed.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trapped
Ephesians 5 speaks of wives submitting to their husbands, yes. It also speaks of husbands sacrificing themselves by laying down their life for their wife. Submission for one, sacrifice for the other!
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Yes there is reciprocity but the unequal temporal power structure is retained. Slaves are to obey masters and masters should be kind to slaves, but they are still masters and slaves. Wives still need to obey, submit.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nell
Aron, my post #14 offers another perspective, quoting K. Bushnell.
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I took this position here on this forum some time back. I said that Paul was making concessions to the age, that others would not be stumbled by the liberty that Christians enjoyed. Current social conventions needed to be acknowledged, until the Lord returns.
Paul said, "Therefore, if what I eat causes my brother or sister to fall into sin, I will never eat meat again, so that I will not cause them to fall." It's not about eating or abstaining, but not stumbling others.
Secondly, Paul said, "There is no slave nor free" then said, "Slave obey your master". He wasn't contradicting himself. One was a statement of fact. The second was a concession to temporary order. Paul's word to women was the same. They were his equals, his peers. Yet because of the time - remember that women were "chattel" then, with no human rights - he was advising them not to stumble others with their newfound place in the Kingdom of God.
Yet this was not the argument of the video. I was critiquing the presentation, and its lack of support.