Quote:
Originally Posted by Ohio
What a cheap cop out in order to keep your heretical beliefs intact. Why not dig a little, "ye search the scriptures", as the Lord instructs us.
Let's talk about Jesus and His glory. On the road to Emmaus, Jesus told them, "ought not Christ to have suffered and enter into His glory?" So Jesus explained in His prayer to the Father, that He would be glorified after He suffered. Mentioned in this conversation was "all the things that had just occurred." -- the trial, passion, death, and resurrection of Jesus.
Philippians 2 speaks about Jesus "subsisting in the form of God did not regard equality with God a thing to be grasped." Here is the glory Jesus had with the Father before the world was. Jesus is plainly portrayed by Apostle Paul in this chapter as the eternal God.
I've talked to JW's before. They all are as stubborn as you. Their Bibles have hundreds of missing and distorted scriptures to suit their false teachings.
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Sure, let’s not just dig a little, but a little more-look at 10 versions of the Phil.2 quote and you get some pretty diverse and differing translations.
I think I have adequately shown that Paul’s mind is that there is but one God, the Father; something you say you believe because it is scripture, yet it is not your thinking, in that you also have a God Jesus, whom you refer to as God the son, so somewhere there 1 count not one ,but two. If, and you should, read through Phil. carefully , you will discover that Paul refers to God as the Father, but in no way to a second one, God the son. Look how Paul opens this epistle, and how he prays to God, and how he refers to Jesus the Lord and Christ. In fact, in this section of Phil 2 5-11 after talking of Jesus’ suffering and death, says that God highly exalted him and GAVE him a name above every name...
Look at Phil 4.19-20 And my God shall supply every need of yours according to his riches in glory in Christ Jesus. 20Now unto our God and Father be the glory for ever and ever. Amen. The Philippians are not to confuse Jesus with God , but hold to one God, the Father.
Philippians is about the fellowship of the gospel. As I pointed out numerous times, there is not a gospel preached, and Paul tells us the gospel he preaches, which contains reference to Jesus being God. I think they all understood the greatness of Jesus , and how God was with him, and how they could see God in the face of Christ- the form of God. Yet Paul in his speaking did not say Jesus is God. That would be contrary to everything we know he taught.
Another problem arises if you think about it- you want to tell me that John has Jesus proclaiming that he is God-Yahweh in the John gospel. How do you reconcile that with the humble Jesus here in Phil. that did not snatch such an opportunity to make some kind of equality?
Yes, the resurrected Christ was crowned with glory and honor- read through Ephesians to appreciate what the God and Father of Jesus did by, with and through Christ. This is the whole point of the scriptures!
I would only be counted as heretical by those who hold fast to the 4th century decree on tritheism. In the foundational church, I would be a typical believer in the gospel. Ohio, you run by a different gospel and cannot reconcile that gospel with the one preached in Acts, and by Paul.
Since were were chosen before the foundation of the world, does that make us eternal and God? I don’t claim to know about heavenly things-don’t know about angels, 24 elders, 4 living creatures, seraphim and cherubim, principalities, powers, spirits, etc. But I do know that one day, that holy thing was born, was baptized and anointed with the Spirit of God, ministered, and taught, was crucified, that God raised him from the dead, that he is both Lord and Christ and the highest name in creation, and that in him I have forgiveness of sins, and the hope of eternal life, and one day he will return to judge the living and the dead. And that when all things are finally put in subjection to him, then he will be subject to the one who put all under him so that God will be all in all.
Not too shabby, if I do say so myself