[countmeworthy]

Originally Posted by Sons to Glory!

Regarding whether someone is saved . . . if by "saved" I take that to mean they have been reborn with the divine life coming into them as a seed and taking root.

If they are reborn with this life, then they can't be "unborn," can they?

If they are truly born again, they can't be 'unborn' or lose their salvation. True. I think they can lose their rewards because Revelation 2 and 3 cautions the church not to lose their crowns. There are rebukes and compliments.

But there are a lot of Christians who call themselves Christians and were never/are not born again. I recently met a really neat, intelligent God loving guy who visited my bible study group because he could play or toot the shofar really, really well. He used to go the church, the bible study leaders go to.. In fact he was raised in the church. He also was a member of the orchestra at John Hagee's church. He was a very good trumpet player which is why he could toot the shofar awesomely. He went to Israel with Hagee and his group a few times and loved it so much, he converted to JUDAISM! He denies Jesus is the Messiah but is a very good 'Jew'. Loves the Jewish religion and studies the OT with his rabbi.

He has remained friends with the people of his former 'church'. So was he ever saved? My friends who invited him say he went through the motions but never experienced true salvation. Who knows but GOD.

Hey, I managed to do some of my worst things after receiving the new life! It was in there, but deeply suppressed - even to the point I wasn't aware of it at all. But that is the power of the indestructible resurrection life! It will eventually even crack the hard concrete to spring up.

Me too! I truly experienced the scripture God will never leave you or forsake you. I am also convinced we cannot lose our salvation if we indeed are truly washed in Blood of Jesus and born again. He drew me back to Himself.

So we might even find, in that day, that certain ones we thought could never have been Christians (i.e., truly born again) actually had Christ's life buried deep within them. Could it be possible that Hitler or Stalin or Machiavelli received Christ at an early age and then they suppressed that life so much the world could never believe it was there? Yes, I doubt it too, but we may be surprised in that day to see some pretty nefarious individuals being severely rebuked as unfaithful and unprofitable servants of Christ. (for them, maybe it would be 1000 years in outer darkness - who knows!?)

We never know who truly repented on their death bed do we?

And that is the purpose of the Bema - to give deserved rewards for what we've done (works the Father prepared for us) with this grace and divine life in us. Some have done much in being faithful (in a few things to further the kingdom) and some not so much. So your analogy of the school might be good - as you graduate to the next grade level, you go to a different room. (however, it seems the level is dependent upon what we do in this life, not the next)

Exactly!! It's not a punishment. God knows each and everyone of us. He is compassionate, merciful and understanding.

BTW - The world translated in the KJV as"mansions" is probably better rendered "abode" or "room" or "dwelling place." Therefore, "In My Father's house are many rooms (or abodes)" is the way most translations have it.

So what is the difference between a mansion, a room or abode? It seems people will go into separate compartments. I have never quite understood that passage.

According to our human view it does seem like Christ's body is divided. But recently a brother said something like this to me, "Look, you are going on what you see. Do you think that God doesn't have control of this apparent mess called the Church? It's not like when Christ returns then all of a sudden His body parts miraculously fly together as one body. His body IS one, but the enemy blinds us to seeing that. We need to take it in faith and not believe the lie." Pretty impossible in ourselves - to be sure!

God surely is in control. The church in God's Eyes may not be divided but just looking at the mess Lee created in the LC and LSM, it sure looks like a divisive bunch! To not want to fellowship because people have left the LC surely has brought about division but it has been a historical problem throughout church history. Even the Catholic church excommunicated people.

Just an observation on my part..not hung up on who's who in the Kingdom of God.