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Timelord · 02-13-2010, 06:17 PM

OBW

Somehow you missed that teaching on the God-men. T. Neil Duddy put out his book against Lee called “The God-men” in 1977, and an updated edition in 1981. The LC sued the author of that book around that time. Lee must have used the terminology if in no other way than in self defense around the time that the suit was taking place. Maybe other doctrines were more important to you and to the LC at the time you were in the LC. It is almost considered a believe or leave doctrine now because the whole purpose of being in the LC is to become an overcomer, which is also equated with becoming a God-man.

Oregon

“Grace and peace be multiplied unto you through the knowledge of God, and of Jesus our Lord, According as his divine power hath given unto us all things that pertain unto life and godliness, through the knowledge of him that hath called us to glory and virtue: Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust.” (2 Pet 1:2-4).

The idea of Deification is based primarily on these verses. According to Lee, being partakers of the divine nature equaled becoming a God-man. It is the same as the doctrine of Perfectionism that was taught by John Wesley in the 1800’s. We can get to the point that we are perfect or divine in this life. The mistake seems to be that it is thought that “Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is” (1 John 3:2), is something for this life instead of being something of the future. And instead of “And every man that hath this hope in him purifieth himself, even as he is pure” (1 John 3:3), Lee emphasized just turning to our spirit to attain the goal of becoming a God-man. He was constantly trying to make things simple, and coming up with simplistic opinions that required a lot of words to explain and through the many words became very complex.

According to John, we go through the process of purification now because we have a future hope that we will be like God and see him as he is. According to Peter we shall be partakers of the divine nature in the future. Lee thought that it is something that can be accomplished in the present.

In the beginning we were created in the image and likeness of God (Gen 1:26-27). Then the fall ruined that image and likeness (Gen 3). In the future we have the hope that the image and likeness will be fully restored. But it is not restored by our actions of purification or by simply turning to the spirit. Purification is because of a future hope and because of a present desire to be a present testimony for God and Jesus Christ.

There are two creations. In the first creation is a loss. In the second creation what was lost is regained, “Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation; old things have passed away; behold, all things have become new” (2 Corinthians 5:17). There is only one way that the lost image and likeness can be regained, and that is in Christ who is the image (Col 1:15). And the image is not something that we can individually attain. It is something that we eventually attain together as the Body of Christ (Col 3:10). Jesus became in the likeness of men so that in him we might be renewed in the image of God. We don’t become God-men. The only God-man is Jesus Christ. The culmination of being in Christ is to be partakers of the divine nature and to be like God or in the likeness of God and to see God as he is. That does not even make us God-men in the future. It only means that we are in the God-man through whom is the restoration of being in the likeness and image of God.

The whole idea of Christian Mysticism as practiced in the Eastern Orthodox Church and in the Roman Catholic Church and in the Holiness denominations and in the LC is wrong for one simple reason. They are trying to attain something in the present that is meant for the future. In this era, we practice purification by walking according to the Spirit, in order that our minds may be renewed. We can study the Bible all day long, but if we are not walking according to the Spirit, all we will attain will be personal opinions, opinions that will not result in a renewing of our minds. We will be only conformed to our personal opinions. This is what Rom 8 and Gal 5 and Col 3 is all about. There is only one alternative to walking according to the Spirit. And that is walking according to the flesh. Walking according to the Spirit culminates in fruit that is related to life. Walking according to the flesh culminates in works that is related to death. And it is our choice as to which we do and which we have.

I think that it was John MacArthur who answered the question, How do I live the Christian life, with this answer, “walk according to the Spirit and do what you want”. He meant, of course, that if we are walking according to the Spirit, we will want to do what God would want us to do, to live how God would want us to live. And when we are doing what God wants us to do and living in the way that God wants us to live, we are living the Christian life. That no longer applies if we fall into walking according to the flesh. And from personal experience, the difference is pronounced and very noticeable no matter how we might try to fool ourselves or others. Once I walked according to the Spirit, I had no trouble telling when I was I slipping into walking according to the flesh.

In the LC, the partaking of the divine nature (2 Pet 1:4) has become a present emphasis to the detriment of the previous verses (2 Pet 1:2-3). We have all things that we need through the knowledge of the one who has called us. We are given promises in the present that we might be partakers in the future. We are put into Christ and we walk according to the Spirit. In that state we grow in the knowledge of God and of Jesus Christ so that we might be a testimony of the God and Jesus Christ that we know in the present.

2 Peter begins “Grace and peace be multiplied unto you through the knowledge of God, and of Jesus our Lord” and ends “But grow in grace, and in the knowledge of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ. To him be glory both now and for ever. Amen.” Why is Jesus mentioned without mentioning God in the last verse? Because the whole purpose of God is in Christ.

“That in the dispensation of the fulness of times he might gather together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven, and which are on earth; even in him… For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them… According to the eternal purpose which he purposed in Christ Jesus our Lord” (Eph 1:10, 2:10, 3:11).

“Jesus said "I am the vine and you are the branches..........abide in me and I in you." If the branch does not abide in the vine it becomes withered and is good to be burned. That is my experience. I'm not becoming God......I am just me......the fallen sinner in need of God constantly. I only exibit a change in my life and being as long as I abide in him. If I cease.....I wither away and am just my old self again. I believe this is what is taught in the NT and is real to me. The "becoming God" thing has never been real to me and I don't believe it is what the NT teaches.”

God has used your experience to teach you well. Whether or not I was more fortunate, I learned this same teaching from teaching I received outside of the LC. So when I heard the teaching in the LC, I was able to understand it for what it was. A mistaken understanding of our present purpose on the earth, a mistaken understanding that crops up constantly. It seems that we are always in a hurry to experience things before it is time. We are to simply abide in Christ and walk according to the Spirit and put away the things of the flesh so that we can be the intended testimony in this life. That is truly simple. It is the simplicity that is in Christ. But we are always trying to add our own stuff to that and make it hard.

Timelord

02-13-2010, 06:17 PM	#5
Timelord Member Join Date: Feb 2010 Posts: 10	Re: God became man that man might become God OBW Somehow you missed that teaching on the God-men. T. Neil Duddy put out his book against Lee called “The God-men” in 1977, and an updated edition in 1981. The LC sued the author of that book around that time. Lee must have used the terminology if in no other way than in self defense around the time that the suit was taking place. Maybe other doctrines were more important to you and to the LC at the time you were in the LC. It is almost considered a believe or leave doctrine now because the whole purpose of being in the LC is to become an overcomer, which is also equated with becoming a God-man. Oregon “Grace and peace be multiplied unto you through the knowledge of God, and of Jesus our Lord, According as his divine power hath given unto us all things that pertain unto life and godliness, through the knowledge of him that hath called us to glory and virtue: Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust.” (2 Pet 1:2-4). The idea of Deification is based primarily on these verses. According to Lee, being partakers of the divine nature equaled becoming a God-man. It is the same as the doctrine of Perfectionism that was taught by John Wesley in the 1800’s. We can get to the point that we are perfect or divine in this life. The mistake seems to be that it is thought that “Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is” (1 John 3:2), is something for this life instead of being something of the future. And instead of “And every man that hath this hope in him purifieth himself, even as he is pure” (1 John 3:3), Lee emphasized just turning to our spirit to attain the goal of becoming a God-man. He was constantly trying to make things simple, and coming up with simplistic opinions that required a lot of words to explain and through the many words became very complex. According to John, we go through the process of purification now because we have a future hope that we will be like God and see him as he is. According to Peter we shall be partakers of the divine nature in the future. Lee thought that it is something that can be accomplished in the present. In the beginning we were created in the image and likeness of God (Gen 1:26-27). Then the fall ruined that image and likeness (Gen 3). In the future we have the hope that the image and likeness will be fully restored. But it is not restored by our actions of purification or by simply turning to the spirit. Purification is because of a future hope and because of a present desire to be a present testimony for God and Jesus Christ. There are two creations. In the first creation is a loss. In the second creation what was lost is regained, “Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation; old things have passed away; behold, all things have become new” (2 Corinthians 5:17). There is only one way that the lost image and likeness can be regained, and that is in Christ who is the image (Col 1:15). And the image is not something that we can individually attain. It is something that we eventually attain together as the Body of Christ (Col 3:10). Jesus became in the likeness of men so that in him we might be renewed in the image of God. We don’t become God-men. The only God-man is Jesus Christ. The culmination of being in Christ is to be partakers of the divine nature and to be like God or in the likeness of God and to see God as he is. That does not even make us God-men in the future. It only means that we are in the God-man through whom is the restoration of being in the likeness and image of God. The whole idea of Christian Mysticism as practiced in the Eastern Orthodox Church and in the Roman Catholic Church and in the Holiness denominations and in the LC is wrong for one simple reason. They are trying to attain something in the present that is meant for the future. In this era, we practice purification by walking according to the Spirit, in order that our minds may be renewed. We can study the Bible all day long, but if we are not walking according to the Spirit, all we will attain will be personal opinions, opinions that will not result in a renewing of our minds. We will be only conformed to our personal opinions. This is what Rom 8 and Gal 5 and Col 3 is all about. There is only one alternative to walking according to the Spirit. And that is walking according to the flesh. Walking according to the Spirit culminates in fruit that is related to life. Walking according to the flesh culminates in works that is related to death. And it is our choice as to which we do and which we have. I think that it was John MacArthur who answered the question, How do I live the Christian life, with this answer, “walk according to the Spirit and do what you want”. He meant, of course, that if we are walking according to the Spirit, we will want to do what God would want us to do, to live how God would want us to live. And when we are doing what God wants us to do and living in the way that God wants us to live, we are living the Christian life. That no longer applies if we fall into walking according to the flesh. And from personal experience, the difference is pronounced and very noticeable no matter how we might try to fool ourselves or others. Once I walked according to the Spirit, I had no trouble telling when I was I slipping into walking according to the flesh. In the LC, the partaking of the divine nature (2 Pet 1:4) has become a present emphasis to the detriment of the previous verses (2 Pet 1:2-3). We have all things that we need through the knowledge of the one who has called us. We are given promises in the present that we might be partakers in the future. We are put into Christ and we walk according to the Spirit. In that state we grow in the knowledge of God and of Jesus Christ so that we might be a testimony of the God and Jesus Christ that we know in the present. 2 Peter begins “Grace and peace be multiplied unto you through the knowledge of God, and of Jesus our Lord” and ends “But grow in grace, and in the knowledge of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ. To him be glory both now and for ever. Amen.” Why is Jesus mentioned without mentioning God in the last verse? Because the whole purpose of God is in Christ. “That in the dispensation of the fulness of times he might gather together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven, and which are on earth; even in him… For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them… According to the eternal purpose which he purposed in Christ Jesus our Lord” (Eph 1:10, 2:10, 3:11). “Jesus said "I am the vine and you are the branches..........abide in me and I in you." If the branch does not abide in the vine it becomes withered and is good to be burned. That is my experience. I'm not becoming God......I am just me......the fallen sinner in need of God constantly. I only exibit a change in my life and being as long as I abide in him. If I cease.....I wither away and am just my old self again. I believe this is what is taught in the NT and is real to me. The "becoming God" thing has never been real to me and I don't believe it is what the NT teaches.” God has used your experience to teach you well. Whether or not I was more fortunate, I learned this same teaching from teaching I received outside of the LC. So when I heard the teaching in the LC, I was able to understand it for what it was. A mistaken understanding of our present purpose on the earth, a mistaken understanding that crops up constantly. It seems that we are always in a hurry to experience things before it is time. We are to simply abide in Christ and walk according to the Spirit and put away the things of the flesh so that we can be the intended testimony in this life. That is truly simple. It is the simplicity that is in Christ. But we are always trying to add our own stuff to that and make it hard. Timelord